The 4.5 State

[Salah Al-Din]

Salah

It's not Somalia, it's the UN that controls the game and the path to ictiraf

And we're prepared to continue to assert our sovereignty until such a time, other nation states including the UN recognize it.

It is not rocket science really.

[SultanOrder]

Salah

It's not Somalia, it's the UN that controls the game and the path to ictiraf

Fah they are still recognizing a non entity (Somalia) which I deny exists but a new state, that of the 4.5. The 4.5 is clearly a UN state, and it lays claims to Somaliland's sovereignty. And they think that this same UN is going to recognize them.

My Somaliland friends the UN is a fake politic body. It is really the United States, and the other four permanent body members. These same powers deny you, and support your enemies the 4.5 state in the tune of Billions of dollars each year. Your guy's dream is as real as the Palestinians believing the United States is on their side.

[FAH1223]

Salah

It's not Somalia, it's the UN that controls the game and the path to ictiraf

Fah they are still recognizing a non entity (Somalia) which I deny exists but a new state, that of the 4.5. The 4.5 is clearly a UN state, and it lays claims to Somaliland's sovereignty. And they think that this same UN is going to recognize them.

My Somaliland friends the UN is a fake politic body. It is really the United States, and the other four permanent body members. These same powers deny you, and support your enemies the 4.5 state in the tune of Billions of dollars each year. Your guy's dream is as real as the Palestinians believing the United States is on their side.

Niggas don't know. They got their anger directed at fellow skinnies who are just puppets

[Salah Al-Din]

Salah

It's not Somalia, it's the UN that controls the game and the path to ictiraf

Fah they are still recognizing a non entity (Somalia) which I deny exists but a new state, that of the 4.5. The 4.5 is clearly a UN state, and it lays claims to Somaliland's sovereignty. And they think that this same UN is going to recognize them.

My Somaliland friends the UN is a fake politic body. It is really the United States, and the other four permanent body members. These same powers deny you, and support your enemies the 4.5 state in the tune of Billions of dollars each year. Your guy's dream is as real as the Palestinians believing the United States is on their side.

We don't bank our existence on outside forces. We believe in ourselves and the power of Allah SWT.

What is with all this doom and gloom? Nothing happens except by the will of Allah.

Despite the odds since 1960 till now, Somaliland has managed to rise like a phoenix. It can only get better Insha Allah.

[Salah Al-Din]

Salah

It's not Somalia, it's the UN that controls the game and the path to ictiraf

Fah they are still recognizing a non entity (Somalia) which I deny exists but a new state, that of the 4.5. The 4.5 is clearly a UN state, and it lays claims to Somaliland's sovereignty. And they think that this same UN is going to recognize them.

My Somaliland friends the UN is a fake politic body. It is really the United States, and the other four permanent body members. These same powers deny you, and support your enemies the 4.5 state in the tune of Billions of dollars each year. Your guy's dream is as real as the Palestinians believing the United States is on their side.

Niggas don't know. They got their anger directed at fellow skinnies who are just puppets

Why would Somaliland be angry if I believe it has come a long way and is poised to reach even greater heights? Insha Allah

[SultanOrder]

Everything I said has gone straight over your head. You are not interested in a discussion but rather imposing your simplestic logic on us.

Sxb, we will see. Somaliland will march on, if you become a UN trusteeship all the best. But know this, YOUR ON YOUR OWN...

The 4.5 state is a UN trusteeship since the first day. It has a UN army, it has UN leaders, it has UN funding.

I'm telling you that I consider supporting Somaliland as the manifestation of Somali nationality. I believe that it is the only legitimate and real authority in the former Somali state, and the only representation of the right to self-determination of the Somali people. It is the daughter of the dream of the Somali people to have a Greater Somalia. And I want Somaliland to succeed, Allah dhowr Somaliland

[Khalid Ali]

Perfect u have some points but the problem is the UN is not the problem they play a role in ur problems but not in ours. See ur dealing with major problems since the fate of ur country is in the hands of the UN and the african union. We can break it if ur leaders are up 2 it but they are not up to it they want to waste our time and continue their own misery. We have nothing to do with the 4.5 state it doesnt represent us our elders do not support it nor our people. But ur people support and think its fine ur leaders are running for the top seat under mahiga.We have problems on our place on the international stage.We operate as a defacto state for now 21 years but we control our fate and that of our childeren. Its ur leaders who are not ready to discuss anything as for the cold war yes ur right they claim our country thus it will create hostility not so sure if it will go to war maybe not. But it sure will not create healthy relationsship between our two countries. But even the ic knows thats why they forced the so called TFG to talk about Somaliland about how to clarify their future relations this was never done before the first phase of these talks already started with not result i wonder what will happen next.

[Cirwaaq]

My uncle is not going to be president so i am going to throw a tantrum moment!

The Truth will out on the 20 AUG 2012 then some will

Others will...

See you there

[SultanOrder]

Perfect u have some points but the problem is the UN is not the problem they play a role in ur problems but not in ours. See ur dealing with major problems since the fate of ur country is in the hands of the UN and the african union. We can break it if ur leaders are up 2 it but they are not up to it they want to waste our time and continue their own misery. We have nothing to do with the 4.5 state it doesnt represent us our elders do not support it nor our people. But ur people support and think its fine ur leaders are running for the top seat under mahiga.We have problems on our place on the international stage.We operate as a defacto state for now 21 years but we control our fate and that of our childeren. Its ur leaders who are not ready to discuss anything as for the cold war yes ur right they claim our country thus it will create hostility not so sure if it will go to war maybe not. But it sure will not create healthy relationsship between our two countries. But even the ic knows thats why they forced the so called TFG to talk about Somaliland about how to clarify their future relations this was never done before the first phase of these talks already started with not result i wonder what will happen next.

khalid, the UN is your problem too, it recognizes the 4.5 state and it's constitution, while denying you guys as a member state. As a tribal entity my clan has to ensure that it get's interests as oppossed to the interests of other tribes. We know that the 4.5 state is a reality to reckoned with and therefore will deal with it as such. We are a pragmatic people and since we are short of our own state politic, we will engage it. We know it is better to work within the beast, instead of against it, and we hopefully will get something out of it.
My friend where we differ is this foolish notion that the IC has the best interests of Somaliland, they allowed you to be internationally connected to a non-existent state, and now they cemented it by their constitution. Khalidoow, we both know that the 4.5 state is as much in your hands as is mine, this whole thing is a cover up, to look like we are in charge, but in reality we are not.

[SultanOrder]

My uncle is not going to be president so i am going to throw a tantrum moment!

The Truth will out on the 20 AUG 2012 then some will

Others will...

See you there

If Marexaan gets the seat, that is just the icing on the cake. If we don't get president, or prime ministership, we will have key positions among the ministers. We have one of the largest voting blocks among the sub clans in the new parliament. We have the key top general positions, and they also work for our clan interests We have a dynamic clan that has relationships in Galguduud, to Koonfur. We as Marexaan are not resting our hopes on one man's dreams. We have outside powers such as IGAD that is backing and actively supporting the establishment of the Jubbaland State, handing us the keys to Kismaayo post-Shabab. We have an independent militia constantly working for our interests headed by Aw-Libaax. With the creation of the federal state we will have further representation as a clan entity in the upper Parliament. So what tantrums are being thrown? In this illegitimate 4.5 state a we are favored.

Oh and I want to give a warm thanks to the people for their moral support for one of our son's or as you say my uncle, even if their voices aren't heard it's the thought that counts. That is the icing on top.

[COOL-MAN]

You were making alot if sense untill u jotted down the last post and went on mareexan this mareexan that. Not that i have illwill towards mareexan. God forbid no, it's just that u want greedily all the good things/posts/oppotunies to go to mareexan and yet wonder why qalid looks at you witha suspicious eye. EC knows this weaknes in us all and have exploited it to the max.

[gurey25]

Perfect order you made allot of sense in your first post but then you start behaving like a crab again in a bucket, instinctively trying to pull his mates down.
We are not in the same situation, maybe you have a perverse wish that everyone was in the same boat but im sorry it is not reality.

This great UN conspiracy you say and their 4.5 state project is just bullshit.
You have too much respect for the UN, while we see it as only 5% better and more serious than the arab league.

The UN runs somalia, it runs the AU project but it is only a subcontractor for the US, EU who hold the reigns right now with Turkey and china on the sidelines attemtping to
stit things up.

As somalilanders we dont really care for the UN bureaucracy and they do not care for us.
The UN bureaucracy is filled with those from the third world countries that are anti-secessionist and they hate somaliland more than any darood i have ever run into, even on this forum.
All this hate is ineffective and they have little influence in Somalilland, while they run your country.
We have always had a bad relationship with them, how many UN officials were unceremoniously tossed back on the plane , or held in an airport hanger until their next flight after unttering undiplomatic words about somaliland.
even the weak UDUB regime of riyale managed to insult them and do the same.

They still came back and opened offices in hargiesa and they still have plans to move allot of their somali operations to hargiesa because of cost.
Today mahiga behaves diplomatically and humbly when he visits.

There is a difference between the UN bureaucracy and those who control the UN and we have excellent relations with the US and EU, and they both do not care about your sacred Somali unity, its all in your head.

Everyone is waiting for a Somali government, the world is serious, you will get a much deeper invasion of the international community into somalias daily life and you will continue to be a protectorate for a while longer.
They just require some sort of image of legitimacy, of respectibilty.
This is why they are going for TFG 2.0, followed by provincial elections and political parties within the next few years.

Somali unity, somaliweyne is not their concern,
it is yours.

please stop imagining your wants and desires into the heads of other.

[abdikarim86]

^

Summed it up nicely.
These people imagine us to be like them.

[Salah Al-Din]

please stop imagining your wants and desires into the heads of other.

gurey25,

Even if it was true that the whole world is against us; so what! Like you mentioned countless UN representatives have been given persona non grata over the years. lol It is like marching to your own tune is something alien? The only time Somaliland says "Sami3naa waa Adee3naa" is for the command of Allah SWT. Being subservient is missing in our national moral fabric. We are a nation with deep egalitarian roots.

[gurey25]

please stop imagining your wants and desires into the heads of other.

gurey25,

Even if it was true that the whole world is against us; so what! Like you mentioned countless UN representatives have been given persona non grata over the years. lol It is like marching to your own tune is something alien? The only time Somaliland says "Sami3naa waa Adee3naa" is for the command of Allah SWT. Being subservient is missing in our national moral fabric. We are a nation with deep egalitarian roots.

whats even funnier is the knee jerk accusation that we are controlled by Ethiopia.
i mean the pot calling the kettle black...

Ethiopia does not have a say in our internal affairs, but it had allot of control over policy in somalia, well untill the rest of the world started paying attention and edged the Ethiopians out and since melez went awol.

but still its another case of projecting their insecurities on us.