Some days.......

[zulaika]

how many suicidal folks are willing to hold their breath till the end?? a true testament to one's will to "die" can be judged on this alone, ask em' to just hold their breath and go....not a rope to hang themselves, not a moving subway, not a bullet...but just hold their breath. everything about the naf will fight this at all costs...... this is why death comes and not chosen.

Lol, what kinda nonsense is this?

its not nonsense

[Alphanumeric]

how many suicidal folks are willing to hold their breath till the end?? a true testament to one's will to "die" can be judged on this alone, ask em' to just hold their breath and go....not a rope to hang themselves, not a moving subway, not a bullet...but just hold their breath. everything about the naf will fight this at all costs...... this is why death comes and not chosen.

Lol, what kinda nonsense is this?

its not nonsense

Sorry, but what you said is pointless. It's simple biology. You can hold your breath till you pass out. That means nothing. People often try that just to see if they'll die.

[ElfRuler]

Not really much of a suicidal thought person. But I guess feeling helplessness, frustration, or pain can sometimes distort our ability to achieve or/and understand our purpose as a human being.


Death to me means nothing more than standing in front of God, and I honestly don't have much hasnat to offer. So I'm thankful for whatever time I'm given.


I'm not completely certain about the DNR. As long as I'm not brain dead I would like to be resuscitate. I can not make that decision for someone else thou. But you will never know what you will do until you find yourself in that situation.

[zulaika]

you can die due to lack of oxygen to the brain.. i've seen this myself, very ugly,. and its not pointless to point out the systemic reflex the body employs to prevent this..it is both biological and psychological.

[OhCashoIsOnYou]

Wow friends, I cannot believe I am witnessing possible friends discussing pulling the plug on their uncertain life, I knew this forum was a safe haven for demons but I honestly underestimated their type grip even among gentle souls. Ending it all is a demonic thought that grew from a demonically inspired action and resulted in that seed being planted. I urge all friends to preach the power of good and resist the temptation fruit that life throws us occasionally. We all have the potential of leading a friendly life without a wicked thought penetrating our head.

Please dont be scared to contact me with questions

[Anarchist]

I often wonder if followers of religions vs atheists/agnostics find death easier to accept? Or if it is vice versa?

Also, how can people who commit suicide be considered "cowards" when they have done probably the most courageous thing i.e. ending their own lives?

[SultanOrder]

I often wonder if followers of religions vs atheists/agnostics find death easier to accept? Or if it is vice versa?

Also, how can people who commit suicide be considered "cowards" when they have done probably the most courageous thing i.e. ending their own lives?

I don't think it's either or, I believe that everyone deals with life and death differently, and from both sides you can find similar reactions.

[Anarchist]

@P.O. - I know death in general, whether our own or that if those close to us is very difficult to accept, but what logic is there for someone who's vehemently opposed to God's creation & reckoning to fear it or find it difficult to accept? But, then I guess a nonbeliever knows the end is the end and an empty one at that, nothing beyond this world to look forward to? I would think an atheist would have a harder time accepting it compared to even a devout Christian.

Would it even be suicide if it weren't for religious connotations? How many of us would have gone through with it if there was no religious ruling against it? And how would our society deal with suicide, mercy killings and abortions if they were not considered sinful acts?

[Alphanumeric]

Zulaika,

Yes, of course you can die from lack of oxygen. The natural reaction to asphyxiation is biological. What does that have to do with anything?

I often wonder if followers of religions vs atheists/agnostics find death easier to accept? Or if it is vice versa?

Also, how can people who commit suicide be considered "cowards" when they have done probably the most courageous thing i.e. ending their own lives?

I think accepting death is usually a personal issue, but it seems religion pushes its acceptance much harder, i.e. "you don't choose when you die".

I guess people call them "cowards" because they've opted not to address the problems they're facing by choosing the "easy way out". Sometimes though, the problems aren't something solvable and have very little to do with their doings.

Questioning the moral depravity of suicide is something I've found myself reading after asking Google some midnight questions lol.

[ElfRuler]

I often wonder if followers of religions vs atheists/agnostics find death easier to accept? Or if it is vice versa?

Also, how can people who commit suicide be considered "cowards" when they have done probably the most courageous thing i.e. ending their own lives?

I think death is difficult for everyone. Regardless of our prior conflicting perceptions, when it comes it terrifies everyone equally. As someone who works with patients you probably know more than I. If they were not faced with any worldly challenge or trail and they killed themselves then maybe they did something courageous. But till this day I have yet to hear about a person who committed suicide that did not had any physiological, mental, economic, or social problem.


I could be wrong, but I always assumed that they gave up after rationalizing the thought that whatever they are facing now is worse than death. I would hate to be the causation of my own death.


P.S. this topic is deep.

[Anarchist]

@Alpha - We often use comfort words & phrases to make sense of how shitty life in general can be. Referring to people who commit suicide as cowards to me is just people trying to feel better about their life choices than those who opted out. Not sure when it became an act of courage to live through very horrific stuff, day in & day out without end in sight, as opposed to a simple sayonara!

Would everyone buckle & opt for it provided they were all put in the same situation? If No, then does that mean people who are easily susceptible to suicide are weaker individuals than those who choose to "toughen it out!" And just who decides who's weaker anyway? lol.

[Alphanumeric]

@P.O. - I know death in general, whether our own or that if those close to us is very difficult to accept, but what logic is there for someone who's vehemently opposed to God's creation & reckoning to fear it or find it difficult to accept? But, then I guess a nonbeliever knows the end is the end and an empty one at that, nothing beyond this world to look forward to? I would think an atheist would have a harder time accepting it compared to even a devout Christian.

Would it even be suicide if it weren't for religious connotations? How many of us would have gone through with it if there was no religious ruling against it? And how would our society deal with suicide, mercy killings and abortions if they were not considered sinful acts?

Yes, I also think an Atheist would have a harder time accepting death than a devout Christian, Muslim, or any religious person. But, philosophically speaking, I think Atheism is a halfway ideology where Nihilism is its conclusion. I think it's harder to debate whether or not that individual would find death more difficult.

Suicide is viewed as it is because of religion. Ceremonial burials of a suicide are either withheld or glorified. I think it's interesting the various perspectives you'll find on suicide. It being haram or referred to in the Qur'an might be a reason holding some back, but familial expectations are usually what keeps people grounded. It's difficult to say what would happen if the latter were removed.

Mercy killings and abortions are a different matter.

@Alpha - We often use comfort words & phrases to make sense of how shitty life in general can be. Referring to people who commit suicide as cowards to me is just people trying to feel better about their life choices than those who opted out. Not sure when it became an act of courage to live through very horrific stuff, day in & day out without end in sight, as opposed to a simple sayonara!

Would everyone buckle & opt for it provided they were all put in the same situation? If No, then does that mean people who are easily susceptible to suicide are weaker individuals than those who choose to "toughen it out!" And just who decides who's weaker anyway? lol.

You pretty much answered your own questions. They're viewed as weak because they didn't "toughen up".

I think what's very interesting though is the reaction to suicide. It seems as if the judgments handed out are from people who've had those thoughts in passing. I wonder how many people have considered offing.

[Anarchist]

@ElfRuler - If we're to follow your logic, what then of instances when the act of suicide is revered? Such as is common in many Eastern cultures and specially in Japan? You've probably heard of the Kamikaze and their idol like status among Japanese society during the war? These were sane, capable individuals who made the realization somewhere along the way that their death probably served a greater good that their living could not.

What about expressions like "Life is a gift!"? How so? Who decided that? Is it a gift to someone who's never taken a breath without a machine? Or who's looking at being a vegetable for whatever that's left on his clock?

[Anarchist]

@Alpha - Thank you for your interesting analysis. I agree with the bit about Nihilism vs atheism.

Why do you think most people (specially Somalis) approach this issue with a sort of denial? Are we to believe that the majority of people out there have not at one point or another wondered if leaving it all behind was any better? Or is it fear of being stigmatized, mostly self-denial that cause it? Why the unwillingness and even avoidance to thoughts like "I know suicide is forbidden & possibly even futile, but I wonder what if it made no difference whether I jumped my car in to the river under this bridge or not? What if nothing happened or what if something better than this shitty existence happened?"

Why do we limit ourselves to questions?

[Alphanumeric]

@Alpha - Thank you for your interesting analysis. I agree with the bit about Nihilism vs atheism.

Why do you think most people (specially Somalis) approach this issue with a sort of denial? Are we to believe that the majority of people out there have not at one point or another wondered if leaving it all behind was any better? Or is it fear of being stigmatized, mostly self-denial that cause it? Why the unwillingness and even avoidance to thoughts like "I know suicide is forbidden & possibly even futile, but I wonder what if it made no difference whether I jumped my car in to the river under this bridge or not? What if nothing happened or what if something better than this shitty existence happened?"

Why do we limit ourselves to questions?

To Somalis (and I think most Muslims), suicide is the worst possible sin to commit, since it's irreversible and guaranteed Hell. Not allowing those thoughts to persist and even denying their existence is a cultural expectation. The dismissive reaction that the suicide was "crazy", that she "needed attention" or he "didn't truly believe" is the easiest way to deal with the problem. I bet there were a few folks who've read this thread and even dashed out a couple "istaghfurallahs". Whether the problem is mental illness or a rational conclusion on the meaninglessness of it all, Somalis are quick to drop the "haraam" bomb on any questions that are raised. "Unwillingness" and "avoidance" are understatements; it is culturally responsible to stamp out any thoughts counter to the norm.

Questions are haraam lol.