Sectarianism

[jalaaludin5]

When we say Sham has nothing to do with us we are talking about in the contexts its been used to manipulate and hold muslims hostage emotionally. Do you agree with the way its been used today to brainwash teenage girls to join the "Jihad" in Syria?

Maybe you misunderstood the point we are trying make when we say 'Sham doesn't concern us'. And diminishing the plight of Somali to mere Clannism, like its a hey fever, and the problems in Sham, like a internal bleeding, that require our at most attention is disingenuous to say the least.

None of us will never dare to contradict the Qur'an deliberately but at the same time we will not be blindsided with selective quotation and emotional blackmail.
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I don't think the thread was touching upon that, from what I gathered it is about the splitting up of Muslims and Muslim infighting in Sham. I could be wrong and maybe Udun could correct me. I don't agree with young Muslims going there to fight at all. Especially young girls. Muslims in Syria are better equipped with dealing with it just like Somalis are better equipped with dealing with the problems they face and working together to find a solution.

I wasn't reducing the plight of any Muslims. Most Muslim countries are suffering from those ailments that I've mentioned and I focused on Somalis because this is a problem that is facing us and that we need to deal with. As per the hadeeth walaal, if Somalis are suffering the rest of the Ummah should feel it too but as Muslims we have wahn in our hearts which is blinding us.

I wasn't implying that any of you would reject any part of the Qur'an or contradict it. However, it was a reminder for us all. In any case, I apologise for the misunderstanding and if any offence was caused by my words.

Non need to apologise walaal. Just a misunderstanding and I think there maybe two different discussion taking place in this topic and Gegiroor is to blame.
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[gegiroor]

gegiroor

Ina Adeer

To Allah SWT Sham is no more favourable to HIM than Somalia and Somalia is no more favourable to HIM than Nigeria. You have to understand the hadiths you quoted as a historical political context were coined in supporting Muawiyah, his son Yaziid and the Ummuyad dynasty. There was nothing special about Sham than say Somalia or Rohyngia Burma. You posted here hadiths from Mu'waya and others confirmed as Sahih by Sheikh Albani because to you, he is a Salafi infallible human. All the Salafis promote Mu'waiyah and his son Yaziid and forget/deny the violence and hatred expressed towards to Ali RA and his family. Furthermore, you posted ridiculing statements about Sufis because when you hear Sufis, you think about a militia in Somalia that you deem to be your tribal enemies and thus hate the word sufi. What Ummah are we talking about? Unite Somalia first. No pun.

This is incorrect brother. Allah SWT has created the months and He favoured Ramadan; Allah SWT created the days of the week and He favoured Friday; Allah SWT created the nights and He favoured Lailatul Qadr (Night of Power); Allah SWT made the days and He favoured the Day of Arafat.

Allah SWT sent forth Prophets and Messengers and He favoured some over others. Allah SWT made all the languages in the world and He favoured Arabic. In that same respect, Allah SWT made all the lands and He favoured As-Shaam. It is a blessed land and it has been blessed since the time of Ibrahim AS and Isma'eel AS. This is mentioned in the Qur'an itself.

Exalted is He who took His Servant by night from al-Masjid al-Haram to al-Masjid al- Aqsa, whose surroundings We have blessed, to show him of Our signs. Indeed, He is the Hearing, the Seeing. [Surah Isra, Aya 1] The surroundings that is mentioned is Bilad-al-Shaam. The Baitul Maqdis which is mentioned in the Quran is in fact part of Bilad al Sham.

Allah SWT has also created mankind and other creatures and He favoured mankind and has honoured the children of Adam. So yes, the land of Shaam is blessed and favoured. Some of the hadeeths about Shaam are fabricated but the majority are correct and the scholars of Ahlul Sunnah have reached a consensus about it.

Shaam is modern day Palestine, Lebanon, Jordan and Syria. It's not just Syria. Nabi Isa AS will come from Shaam when he returns and he will fight and kill the Dajjal in Shaam. The Prophet SAW had told us there will be many trials and battles in as-Shaam but that as-Shaam will always emerge victorious because there will always be a band of mujahideen fighting for the good and expelling the evil.

Lets not say Shaam has nothing to do with us etc please lets reconsider our words. As the Prophet SAW said: " The ummah is like one body. If one limb, one area, one finger of the whole body is in pain, then the whole body will be in pain because they will not be able to sleep. They will be suffering a fever.”

It is clannism that destroyed our country and led to us being refugees in our thousands in foreign lands. Nationalism, clannism, racism etc are all diseases of the heart. What binds Muslims together is Tawheed and is far more precious and stronger than blood ties or ancestry or nationalism. We will all surely die and be taken to account so ask yourself how do you want to be judged by Allah?

Well said.

I will have to check and see which hadiths which are fabricated. Thank you sister Firefly for this enlightening comment!

[gegiroor]

When we say Sham has nothing to do with us we are talking about in the contexts its been used to manipulate and hold muslims hostage emotionally. Do you agree with the way its been used today to brainwash teenage girls to join the "Jihad" in Syria?

Maybe you misunderstood the point we are trying make when we say 'Sham doesn't concern us'. And diminishing the plight of Somali to mere Clannism, like its a hey fever, and the problems in Sham, like a internal bleeding, that require our at most attention is disingenuous to say the least.

None of us will never dare to contradict the Qur'an deliberately but at the same time we will not be blindsided with selective quotation and emotional blackmail.
-
-
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I don't think the thread was touching upon that, from what I gathered it is about the splitting up of Muslims and Muslim infighting in Sham. I could be wrong and maybe Udun could correct me. I don't agree with young Muslims going there to fight at all. Especially young girls. Muslims in Syria are better equipped with dealing with it just like Somalis are better equipped with dealing with the problems they face and working together to find a solution.

I wasn't reducing the plight of any Muslims. Most Muslim countries are suffering from those ailments that I've mentioned and I focused on Somalis because this is a problem that is facing us and that we need to deal with. As per the hadeeth walaal, if Somalis are suffering the rest of the Ummah should feel it too but as Muslims we have wahn in our hearts which is blinding us.

I wasn't implying that any of you would reject any part of the Qur'an or contradict it. However, it was a reminder for us all. In any case, I apologise for the misunderstanding and if any offence was caused by my words.

Non need to apologise walaal. Just a misunderstanding and I think there maybe two different discussion taking place in this topic and Gegiroor is to blame.
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This thread has nothing to do with people going to Syria nor it is encouraging it. I did not mention anywhere where I encourage young people to go and fight Syria. I opened it for my observation on what is happening within the Muslim world, especially sectarianism that is prevailing in both houses of Islam and manipulations that are coming from many angles. I mentioned preachers declaring their opponents infidels and issuing fatwa where the mainstream Islam scholars did not issue such calls.

With that being said, we should have no illusions about Shaam and its importance in Islam. It is the place where the biggest fitna will be challenged, and it is the place where that evil fitna - the Dajjal's fitna - will be defeated, and the evil system will end. At the same time we should have no illusions the time we're in, and problems Somalis face can't be kept separate from larger problems faced by other Muslims. I will end it here without going into details!

[Based]

How about we check and see how many Somali people have access to clean drinking water?

I'll check for you guys....turns out it's only 29% of the entire country.

61% of Somalis drink from contaminated water sources and die of easily preventable diseases, nearly a quarter of Somali children under the age of 5 die every year because of a lack of clean water, hundreds of thousands literally starve to death every decade or so, yet you're worried about countries that have 10-12X larger GDPs and folks who wouldn't piss on you if you were on fire.

So you know what, fuck Shaam.

edit- lol 71% of Somalis, although it's no laughing matter.

[gegiroor]

How about we check and see how many Somali people have access to clean drinking water?

I'll check for you guys....turns out it's only 29% of the entire country.

61% of Somalis drink from contaminated water sources and die of easily preventable diseases, nearly a quarter of Somali children under the age of 5 die every year because of a lack of clean water, hundreds of thousands literally starve to death every decade or so, yet you're worried about countries that have 10-12X larger GDPs and folks who wouldn't piss on you if you were on fire.

So you know what, fuck Shaam.

Nobody stops of you, me, and Somalis in general from improving the living standards of Somalis. If you're genuinely concerned about it, open a separate thread about it and let us discuss it. This thread was about what is happening in the larger Muslim world, especially the sectarianism that is prevailing there. Seriously, if people want to bring up the Somali issues whenever there is a discussion in the larger Muslim world, I think there is a lack of concern on Somali issues on the part of the people who only bring it up when we discuss on other Muslim issues. If you genuinely concern about Somali issue, let us discuss it day and night as we should have been.

To say that other Muslims don't give a f... about us is the most disingenuous statement that anyone can make. Billions and billions os USD of aid were provided to Somalis and Somalia by the Muslims from the Middle East, and we (Somalis) have always squandered it. Even today, the nations who are footing the bill for the aid that is given to Somalia, Arab and Muslim nations are leading it.

As for Shaam, it is a special place in the heart of Muslims. However, if you aint Muslim, it is understandable that it does not concern you. Therefore, we can agree to disagree. Us (Muslims), we love it, but if the non-Muslims don't care about it, it is their choice

[Machiavelli2]

Soomaalida waxay ku maahmaahdaa, "Ninkii tiisa daryeela ayaa mid kale ku darraa". Bal dadkaan Soomaalida baahan eega ee kooda shaqo leh cunno laba jeer maalintii. Caruur, dumar xaamillo ah iyo waayeel aan raashin lahayn. Bal arkaa dhibka ay ku jirraan, inta yar ee la siiyo waxaa ku masruufaa WFP iyo UNHCR. Sow Muslimiin kula dhashay ma aha, maan ka hadalno? Shaam waxaa dhib, dhac iyo dil ka kiciye Carrab la dhallatey Siiriyiinta iyaagana caawina karaa.

Somalia The African Hell of life Documentary 2015 HD !! 720p

[Based]

Middle Eastern politics should be of no concern to citizens of the world's most spectacularly failed state.

Of course, that's assuming the people in question are smart enough to realize they should probably worry about their own far worse situation before worrying about Amjad beheading Aref because his beard was a few inches short. Judging by the quarter century of anarchy, internecine warfare, and periodic famine, I'm guessing my assumption of intelligence is a tad optimistic.

In that case, carry on.

What can be done about Shaam, brother? What can I do to help? Do you think we should divert the money meant to buy more teknikos to a Save Shaam fund? I know their economy is 10X larger than ours, but surely we can do something to help them out. I mean, so what if half the kids in our country are dying because they're drinking dirty water, Allah has blessed the land of Shaam and its people. He obviously didn't bless Somalia, so who gives a shit. Btw, when the hell are we going to attack those Ximan & Xeeb niggas?

etc. etc.

I'll never forget how we had a Save Somalia rally and maybe two dozen people showed up, while the next week a Save Palestine rally had every 20 something Somali in the city protesting while wearing keffiyehs.

[gegiroor]

gerigoor

Ina Adeer, your heart is in the right place but your mind is somewhere else. You seem to understand very clearly when you stated, "Both groups are using preachers on both sides to declare jihad and recruit fighters from all over the world to fight the Syrian civil war." How do they do this? They do it by presenting dalil (Sunnah & Quraan) picked out of context and tailored to their agenda. How are those hadiths you quoted different when the intent in Sham at that era was Political rather than spiritual. We need not to revisit that painful Islamic era as there are no benefits to be gained from but, if you want to really understand the original fitnah, it started that era which is still raging. Now it is fuelled by a sect who doesn't tolerate mainstream Sunni groups, let alone Shias. If there was something special about Sham, Allah SWT would have mentioned and told us in the Quraan, this kind of mindset is why Muslims ignore the plight of other Muslims like those in CAR, Somalia, Burma ETC. and consider aradul Sham, aradul Arabia to be pure and more blessed than others.

I disagreed with you that there is a particular sect that started in the Syrian civil war. There isn't one particular sect that I know of that started this conflict. Problems in Syria can't be separated from what happened in Afghanistan and Iraq. Wars and destabilization were all imposed on these nations, and in all 3 conflicts, Sunni Muslims in all three countries took the brunt of the atrocities. To be honest with you, it is foreign states who have started this conflict, and manipulate it to the point it is a sectarian civil war now, and that is how they wanted it. Hint: Check what Dr Henry Kissinger said about this conflict.

As for Shaam, Allah (swt) has already told us about the special place that Shaam has on this earth, and if you read sister Firefly's comment, the verse is mentioned there. Nevertheless, I will post it here:

Exalted is He who took His Servant by night from al-Masjid al-Haram to al-Masjid al- Aqsa, whose surroundings We have blessed, to show him of Our signs. Indeed, He is the Hearing, the Seeing. (Noble Quran, Surah Isra, Aya 1)

Discussing Shaam is not about negating problems Muslims face in Somalia, CAR, Burma, etc face. We should be concerned about all Muslims and other suffering human beings wherever they are. That is the responsibility of every Muslim and other human beings as well. The reason why Shaam is a blessed place in Islam is that is the location where Masjid Al-Aqsa is located, and it is the place where the evil system that is led by Dajjal Al-Mesihi (False Messiah) will die. Indeed Dajjal himself will die at gates of Ludd, a city outside of Tel Aviv, Occupied Palestine, at the hands of the True Messiah - the Son of Mary (peace be upon him).

Most of the time, this kind of debates are started by those who claim to be the saved sect and are well known for their lack of self control and aqlaaq and are very quick to judge, defame and insult others who may not share similar ideology with them. Since you like to call for "peace and coexistence" among others, then why cant you chastise your fellow salafis when they trespass and insult others who are their fellow Somalis?

There seems to be rivalries between Sufis and Salafists in many places in the Muslim world, and I am all for promoting dialogue. Too much blood of Muslims have already been spilled. Actually, in Iraq today, Sufi Muslims and Salafi Muslims are allies after both of them found themselves receiving the brunt of the atrocities that came from the Shia sectarian death squads and sectarian militia. I am a believer that no Muslim sect is immune from criticism, including Salafists and Sufis, and therefore, a dialogue and coexistence is needed from all sides.

I will leave responding to the rest of your comment for another day I don't want to touch it today

[gegiroor]

Source: http://allafrica.com/stories/201501190451.html

• • • • • • • • 16 JANUARY 2015

Somalia: Saudi Arabia Donates Medical Aid to Somalia

The Saudi National Campaign for the Relief of Somali People has donated nearly 400 tonnes of medical aid to Somalia's Ministry of Interior for distribution throughout the country, the International Islamic News Agency reported Thursday (January 15th).

The medicine and supplies will be distributed to hospitals in Mogadishu, drought-stricken regions and areas rescently liberated from al-Shabaab.

"Two out of four aircraft arrived in Somalia, transporting medical supplies, which will be distributed to the most vulnerable groups in the country," said Somali Interior Ministry Director General Ismail Jamaali.

So far, 113 tonnes of medicine has been delivered to the ministry, Radio Bar-Kulan reported.

The Saudi National Campaign for the Relief of the Somali People pledged $24 million in aid to Somalia in 2013.

Muslims from Saudi Arabia are sending the aid because the people who need the aid their fellow Somali Muslims from the Somali Republic.

[gegiroor]

http://www.theeastafrican.co.ke/news/Tw ... index.html

Two-thirds of bilateral aid to Somalia govt stolen, diverted

Successive Somali governments have not accounted for nearly $238 million, the bulk of which constituted bilateral assistance, according to an audit report made available exclusively to The EastAfrican.

The report shows that over the period 2000-2011, the first Somali Transitional National Government and the subsequent Transitional Federal Government received bilateral aid totalling $308 million, that was given mainly by Arab countries including Saudi Arabia, Sudan, Libya, Kuwait, Oman, Qatar and the United Arab Emirates. (This figure does not include funds that came through the Arab League. It also does not cover multilateral assistance to Somalia, which is managed entirely by the United Nations Development Programme.)

Only $53 million was raised domestically during this period, mainly through the Mogadishu port and airport.

However, successive governments have only been able to account for $124 million — or one-third — of the total bilateral and domestic funds they received.

The author of the report, Abdirazak Fartaag, who was head of Somalia’s Public Finance Unit in prime minister Omar Abdirashid Sharmarke’s office from May 2009 to September 2010, and prime minister Mohamed Abdullahi Farmaajo’s office from December 2010 to May 2011, claims that various Somali administrations misappropriated and mismanaged millions of dollars in donor assistance and domestic revenue by under-reporting the amounts received and by utilizing funds on personal and other non-government expenses.

The Public Finance Unit was initiated by prime minister Sharmarke in 2009, in order to enhance the financial reporting of the Transitional Federal Government and to co-ordinate the central bank and the auditor general’s and accountant general’s offices. The unit was disbanded by prime minister Farmaajo in May 2011.

Fartaag’s report (which has not yet been released, but was made available to The EastAfrican) comes in the wake of another damning report released by the World Bank in late May, that claims that the TFG did not account for $130 million in revenues and donations it received in 2009 and 2010.

The report’s author, Joakim Gundel, said auditors found that the government had collected at least $94 million in revenue in 2009, but only reported $11 million.

The report states that in 2010, the government collected $70 million in revenues, but reported just $22 million.

A leaked copy of the 2012 report of the Monitoring Group on Somalia and Eritrea — a group mandated by the UN Security Council to monitor arms embargo violations — shows similar gross under-reporting of finances by the Somali government. (The report is expected to be presented to the UN Security Council sometime this month.)

The Group’s own investigations show that an additional $40 million of potential revenue may have gone uncollected or unaccounted for in 2011.

President Sheikh Sharif Ahmed is quoted saying that the money may have never reached Somalia, and was “perhaps in the pockets of other people.”

The report further states that one quarter of the funds that can be accounted for are channelled through the offices of the president, prime minister and speaker of parliament.

In 2011, these three offices spent more than $12.6 million, representing almost 23 per cent of total government expenditure — almost as much as was spent on the TFG security forces ($13.4 million), or the expenditure of all the ministries combined ($15.4 million).

The report further states that the TFG leaders have generally shunned a funding mechanism managed by PricewaterhouseCoopers, that was established with donor support as a confidence-building measure.

[jalaaludin5]

Gegiroor

I never said you encouraged anyone to go to Syria bro.

Me and Machiavelli2 just believe that we should start at home before we go to Sham. And you mentioned the importance of Sham in Quran and Hadith but I never said anything to contradict what's in the Quran. At the same time Putting the plight of Somali before Sham in no way contradict or diminish the importance it has for Muslims.

The importance of Sham is one thing.

And the dire situation of Somali is another.

That's all.

[Machiavelli2]

As for Shaam, Allah (swt) has already told us about the special place that Shaam has on this earth, and if you read sister Firefly's comment, the verse is mentioned there. Nevertheless, I will post it here:

Exalted is He who took His Servant by night from al-Masjid al-Haram to al-Masjid al- Aqsa, whose surroundings We have blessed, to show him of Our signs. Indeed, He is the Hearing, the Seeing. (Noble Quran, Surah Isra, Aya 1)

Yaa saatir, subhaanullah.

Ina Adeer, don't start to invent the meaning of the Ayat to cover the whole of Sham. This Ayat was intended to honour Masjid Al-Aqsa as a Sacred place which is considered a sacred site along with Mecca and Medina. Since the Ayat mentions the surroundings of Masjid Al-Aqsa, it was for the city of Jerusalem and not Lebanon, Syria, Jordan or Palestine. Does it make sense to argue that Allah has blessed the lands of the Maronites and Pagans in Lebanon, the Druze in Golan Heights in Syria and ETC. more than Somalia, Nigeria or Mali because they are situated in Sham? Now, you are starting to interpret the Quraan to fit in your argument. be careful Ina Adeer. Firefly was right to say, Masjid Al-Aqsa was blessed and is considered as a Sacred place because she misunderstood that its surroundings was meant to be the city of Jerusalem. It is wrong to expand this geographical area of Jerusalem to the whole of Sham. To put into context the Hadiths you mentioned in your initial post, then you will understand it was Sunni scholars in support of the Ummuyad Dynasty. These Sunni scholars would have argued Syria or Sham to be blessed in the Quraan. Don't let us resort becoming Somalinet's mufassars of the Holly Quraan.

The point isn't do Saudi Arabia and other Arab and Muslim countries help Somalia, or are Somali leaders corrupt individuals, the point is, do we Somalis have the moral and religious responsibility to concentrate our efforts in establishing peace in our country and combat hunger, diseases, illiteracy, child mortality and millions of problems faced by our people. You can donate to Sham, but my limited amount of zakat is going to Somalis.

Why are you circling around who the protagonists of the war in Syria were? The whole world is aware that Qatar and Saudi Arabia who are both are Salafi States have not only bankrolled this war, but lately, they also convinced the Israelis that jabhatul Nusra will be more understanding to their ambition in the region than the regime of Assad and now, the Israelis are treating their wounded soldiers. Don't circle around the issue because it is no longer a secret.

Wall Street Journal: Israel Caught Red-handed Aiding al-Qaeda in Syria.

http://21stcenturywire.com/2015/04/04/w ... -in-syria/

Did you watch the Video I posted? These are Somali refugees in Dadab.