European Slavery in Northern Africa--response to Kamaal

[LionHeart-112]

Not only are you distorting history (once again) but you are also putting words in my mouth. I never said or believed that Arabs were God's chosen people.

Why do you have the need to lie to prove a point? Are you so brainwashed that you can't even see facts straight? Or are u just a dummy?

[Ducaale004]

Peace, i am too tired to stay. I will respond to DD's and others in shallah. In the meantime, DD, you can reply to my last post.

Peace.

[michael_ital]

So why don't all you lunkheads do the math, and realize that with all that you've posted, you've just unwittingly stated that EVERY race, creed, culture, etc's contributions have resulted in us homo sapiens being where we are at today??

[LionHeart-112]

Ducaale..take care bro and have a great Iftaar. Don't even bother replying to the likes of this Waxash.

[dhuusa_deer]

[quote="Ducaale004"]Whether you accuse Arabs of involvement or the masterminders of African enslavement is not the real matter. [quote]

I only brought that up cause some, like in this thread, seem to suggest that slavery was exclusive to white man while there is more ample evidence showing otherwise.

I disagree with you about breeding of blacks. It wasn't man driven but mother nature -- Natural evolution. As you correctly pointed many slaves who ported slave ships on the african side of the atlantic ocean didn't survive the trip to America. Those that did had selective advantage. They were better fit and hence able to survive the arduous trips. Those that didn't were physically unfit.

The survivors weren't only physically better fit but they also carried the genes encoding their suprior physical fitness. They passed those advantageous genes to their offsprings, who passed to their offsprings and so on. That is why african americans are exceptional at physical sports today.

It is true that white slave traders tended to favour slaves of desired physique for obvious reasons. But they were clueless as what that meant for the offsprings the slaves several generations down the line. That thought didn't cross their mind cause they were primarily preoccupied with getting abled bodies that can survive the trip. Period.

[dhuusa_deer]

[quote="michael_ital"]So why don't all you lunkheads do the math, and realize that with all that you've posted, you've just unwittingly stated that EVERY race, creed, culture, etc's contributions have resulted in us homo sapiens being where we are at today??[/quote]

Good question. That is my view. Others disagree.

[LionHeart-112]

[quote="michael_ital"]So why don't all you lunkheads do the math, and realize that with all that you've posted, you've just unwittingly stated that EVERY race, creed, culture, etc's contributions have resulted in us homo sapiens being where we are at today??[/quote]

We do realise that. But what's bugging every is the white man's desire to monopolize everything from art to technology and take credit for all of civilization's achievements. If white people realised that there are other people on this planet besides them and treated every1 equally, we wouldn't the problems we have today.

DD--You have no view of your own. You follow whom you think hates arabs. go to hell,dumbass.

[optimist_1]

Arabs suffered big time the most under Abraha era he almost destroyed the Ka'ba the today Habesha used to raid Arabs too and enslaved.

It would have continued untill they tried to destrot the Ka'ba

Allah sends bird with stones how truly humiliating for humans

[optimist_1]

[quote="dhuusa_deer"][quote="Ducaale004"]I was surfing the net and i found out that Kamal was downplaying the ugly history of slavery as a history , the effect of which can be used againt whites who enslaved blacks.[/quote]

European were introduced AND encouraged in black slave trading by your beloved arabs and muslim brothers. Who while trying to defend themselves in Arabia -- from God knows who -- charged across northern africa, through the sahara desert and to West Africa.

That is one hell of defense strategy -- defending inside your own half![/quote]

You are Arab salax what the hell what did your dad do to you?

[Ducaale004]

[quote="dhuusa_deer"][quote="Ducaale004"]
I disagree with you about breeding of blacks. It wasn't man driven but mother nature -- Natural evolution. As you correctly pointed many slaves who ported slave ships on the african side of the atlantic ocean didn't survive the trip to America. Those that did had selective advantage. They were better fit and hence able to survive the arduous trips. Those that didn't were physically unfit.

.[/quote]


Dhuusadheer, man you are so obsessed with evolution, yet your knowledge about it isn't that complex. There is a logical flaw as well as misapprehension on your side about your explanation on the natarual selection that had an advantage on the ones that survived the journey.


Natural selection had nothing to with what the Blacks encountered and can't be used as a justification to condone that wrongful act. It was very immoral , dehumanizing to benefit from human cargo. Most of the human cargo died because of a catastrophic condition they lived in for the days and months that the journey continued on the Atlantic ocean . They were piled up and compressed like sacks of rice are piled up inside a store sxb. How would a human being survive that. The only people that survived were the ones on top.

If you reread what i said earlier
"For instance, one slave merchant would purchase 150, 000 heads of slaves, he would calculate the risk and returns of his shipping the slaves to the "new world". He would say like , if 100 ,000 of them perish in the sea because of hunger, disease, suffocation, and 50 thousands of them survived, you would make more money. "



Now let us go back to your favorite subject: Natural Selection as you put it .




I am sure you have read of the potential causes of MICROEVOLUTION.


There are several types of microevoluton. Among them are Genetic drift, bottleneck effect, Gene flow, Mutation, etc.


The reduction of black slaves to a considerable size today in America was as a result of the BOTTLENECK EFFECT--a genetic drift that results from catastrophic events such as draught, disease, flood, or earthquakes. You would probably say that this microevolution will have a latter effect of the population from retaining its genetic makeup, but i will tell you again, blacks would have been a majority today if it weren't for their enslavement. Almost a half of their pop perished in the sea because of the suffocation and disease.



Hence, i braught up the idea of microevolution in correlation to slavery to rectify your mistake that only those who were physically fit survived and the rest perished.---Wrong. a great deal of the slaves perished were the ones on the bottom of the dungeon.

[dhuusa_deer]

Ducaale04,

I'm not obsessed with Evolution, Evolution is obsessed with me. Rather, Evolution is obsessed with all of us. You may not know this but Evolution is THE pivotal organising theory of all the life sciences. You can't study biology without discussing evolution's role. You can't not discuss animal physiology without determining the role evolution played. It is central to the classification of species and hugely helpful in preserving dying-out species. Whereever you look in the life sciences, evolution pops up. You can not ignore just like you can't ignore the Newton's Laws in mechanical physics.

You are right in that my knowledge of Evolution is not perfect, no one's knowledge of any subject is. But I never discuss what I don't know. That is easily falsifiable proclamation by presenting a fact contradicting what I presented as 'facts.'

Now to the subject of the thread. You maybe right about living conditions as you have described but I too have read and watched documentries showing the living conditions aboard the slave ships. The gist of what I've read and watched from documentries is that the living conditions on the slave ships were abhorent irrespective where in the ship the slave stayed. The strong almost always had higher chance of survival for the simple -- and self-evident -- reason that their better physical fitness gave them the edge to survive torturous and ardeous demands of the Trans-atlantic trip.

What I don't understand is what gave you the impression I was justifying or condoning the hardishps africans slaves faced? I was simply elucidating the role natural selection played. For the record I'm not justifying or downplaying the Trans-Atlantic slave trade. Not by any stretch.

[dhuusa_deer]

[quote="Ducaale004"]

Hence, i braught up the idea of microevolution in correlation to slavery to rectify your mistake that only those who were physically fit survived and the rest perished.---Wrong. a great deal of the slaves perished were the ones on the bottom of the dungeon.[/quote]

But microevolution is governed by the same principal -- Natural Selection. This is why, to scientist, the distinction between microevolution and macroevolution is meaningless. Macroevolution is the accumalation of many microevolutions.

Anyways, you are right in that had alot of the black slaves survived the trips, they would have out numbered their masters in generation or two since the slave numbers at one point was like 10 slaves for one white owner. Astonishing huh?

[Ducaale004]

Dhusadheer, I have seen it. You don't just argue for the sake of argument and you give credit where it is due.


Do you know Denmark Vesey, the first black man who revolted against slavery. In Charlston, the blacks outnumbered the whites, so they devised a plot to overtake the city and free themselves but before it was carried out, the plot was foiled. Vessey and others implicated in the plot were hanged on the gallows. His revolt became later inspirational to the black history that Slaves weren't docile and submissive to their masters as thought and written by most historians.

[Ducaale004]

[quote="optimist_1"]Arabs suffered big time the most under Abraha era he almost destroyed the Ka'ba the today Habesha used to raid Arabs too and enslaved.

It would have continued untill they tried to destrot the Ka'ba

Allah sends bird with stones how truly humiliating for humans[/quote]


Lol, i have never heard Abyssinia enslaved Arabs. Tell us more?

[DONKEYMAN]