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     | Friday, November 17, 2000 - 01:44 am ASSALAMU CALAYKUM: IS THE WEST A GOOD PLACE FOR A MUSLIM TO LIVE? WHY AND WHY NOT....... WHAT IS JIHAAD?..............INTEPRETION NOT LITRERAL MEANING....
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| | Friday, November 17, 2000 - 02:18 am "IS THE WEST A GOOD PLACE FOR A MUSLIM TO LIVE? WHY AND WHY NOT" i do not think the west would have been a good place for the muslim had the muslim (you and i) found his home (somalia) free and nice---- but since the muslim (you and i) is in the west, he must make the best out of his stay in the west--- without compromising his religion--by practicing it in the best way he can, don't you think? after all, isn't the west also include the ardul-Allahi waasic? ;-) "WHAT IS JIHAAD?..............INTEPRETION NOT LITRERAL MEANING" i heard that there are two jihads. jihadul nafs and jihadul xarb. do you know which one of these jihadayn is said to be the jihadul akbar? ;-)
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| | Friday, November 17, 2000 - 06:10 am Salaams, Wanaagsane, are u the real one? My Somali cousin..lol, good to see ya...:-) <IS THE WEST A GOOD PLACE FOR A MUSLIM TO LIVE? WHY AND WHY NOT...> The scholars have said that living in the west ranges from halaal, to recommended all the way haraam. If we are able to practise Islaam, like Asad said, and implement all the tenets to its fullest then it is halaal for us to live here. If on the other hand we can't practise our Islaam due to our weaknesses, peer pressure, outside influence..etc, then it becomes haraam for us to live here and we have to make hijra to a place (not necessarily muslim land, could be even the next city) where we can practise islaam better. If we are those that are active in the community, where we are engaged in teaching, calling people to islaam, building masjids, islaamic schools...etc then it becomes recommended... and Wallahu a'lam. My input on Jihaad will come later, insha Allah. Salaams, TLG
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| | Friday, November 17, 2000 - 09:56 am JIHAD IS DERIVED FROM THE WORD MUJAAHADA, SIGNIFYING WARFARE TO ESTABLISH THE RELIGION, AND THAT IS THE LESSER JIHAD.AS FOR THE GREATER JIHAD, IT IS SPIRITUAL WARFARE AGAINST THE NAFS(THE LOWER SELF) AS FAR AS THE HADITH IS CONCERNED, IT IS NOT PERMISSIBLE TO RESIDE IN KUFAAR LAND, AT LEAST, WHO ARE SUSCEPTIBLE TO A FITNAH. SISTER TLG AND BROTHER ASAD HAD GIVEN YOU A VITAL KNOWLEDGE. I RECOMMEND YOU TO TREASURE IT. WHY IT IS NOT GOOD TO LIVE IN THE WEST? I AM SURE YOU HAVE SEEN THE DEVASTATING IMPACT OF ELIAN CULTURE ON OUR PEOPLE.
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| | Friday, November 17, 2000 - 10:33 am To BRO Qoonsade Right but where should we go. I am fed up living here.
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| | Friday, November 17, 2000 - 11:13 am Qoonsade I dislike your username as it suggests perpetual doubt. What exactly you mistrust will have to be seen. I am not "qualified" to answer your question about living in the West, since I believe you were addressing to the true believers of theocratic minutiae. When it comes to Jihad though, it may be worthwhile to remember that the Prophet was instinctly opposed to it from the beginning. He was pressurised by the likes of Hamza, his warrior uncle. There is actually nothing wrong with Self-defense, it is after all, natural. But the idea of waging war in the name of a God, is, to me, abhorent. After all, God "makes" people, and eventually, kills them. If he wants to defeat a particular group of people, surely he can do it by himself without involving his creations in bloody confrontations.
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| | Friday, November 17, 2000 - 12:03 pm Jihad is struggle. Basically all that you do for the sake of allah that requires strength, determination and patience is jihad. There is physical as well as spritual jihad. Physical in that you have to protect yourself against your enemies when they violate you, and spritual in that you have to have taqwa and purify yourself mentally even if it's hard see I can't put it to words it's way too abstract. People often make the mistake of defining jihad as a holy war, taking only the physical aspect of it into consideration like Galool did or should I say Mad Mac.
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| | Friday, November 17, 2000 - 01:17 pm Sweetgirl I am fascinated by this obsession with this Mad-Mac fella. May I assure you that I am not Mad, or Mac, for that matter. It is insulting to believe that anyone who disagrees with you MUST be a foreigner. Surely we are big enough to have opposing opinions, and perhaps more importantly, big enough to respect other people's views even though they are at odds with our own. It will make for a better debate if I accept you as who you claim to be and I do the same. Be sweet.
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| | Friday, November 17, 2000 - 01:24 pm Looooooooool@Galool or My I say Mad_mac,,,,cane clean u chicken!!!!!!!
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| | Friday, November 17, 2000 - 01:32 pm I'm not obsessed with mad mac and it's impossible to be any sweeter.
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| | Friday, November 17, 2000 - 01:34 pm "I am not "qualified" to answer your question about living in the West, since I believe you were addressing to the true believers of theocratic minutiae." lol---->theocratic minutiae. ;-). unlike the heathens, the pagans, the atheists, the irreligious, the true believers hava God as the focal point of their thoughts, interests, and feelings. ;-) "When it comes to Jihad though, it may be worthwhile to remember that the Prophet was instinctly opposed to it from the beginning." that is because the rule of going to jihad did not come down. in fact, the few believers who was with the prophet were told to be patient against the pagan arabs who gave them hard time. instead, the prophet was told to teach towxiid with patient. ;-) "He was pressurised by the likes of Hamza, his warrior uncle." lol--------->pressured by hamza. ;-) "There is actually nothing wrong with Self-defense" really? ;-) "it is after all, natural." you can say that again. ;-) "But the idea of waging war in the name of a God, is, to me, abhorent." to me, when an athiest like you (like the pagan arabs) denies people from worshipping Allah, fighting in the name of Allah desirable and it is after all, natural. ;-) "After all, God "makes" people, and eventually, kills them." against those who try to kill them, right? ;-) "If he wants to defeat a particular group of people, surely he can do it by himself" i'm glad that you acknowledge there is a God (Allah) who can do whatever He wants to. "without involving his creations in bloody confrontations." i thought you said there is actually nothing wrong with Self-defense and fighting to stop the fight. ;-)
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| | Friday, November 17, 2000 - 01:59 pm Asad I will be a happy man if I could one day unravel the mysteries your minimalist opinions. One needs a powerful microscope to pick out what you said from the jungle of pasted quotes. I sussed that you are trying to disagree with me (although you well and truly confused the little beardos, and I don't blame them). But what is it you are ACTUALLY trying to say for Gawd's sake! Sweetgirl Modesty, my dear girl, modesty.
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| | Friday, November 17, 2000 - 03:59 pm wanagsane, Is the west good place for the muslims to live? No it's not. Only a land where Islam is being implemented is good for muslims to live. As muslims we shouldn't be living in a kafir land instead we should be striving to establish an Islamic state. Jihad is the struggle or effort put in making La Illah Il'Allah Mahameden rasullah above all things. Jihad is up holding the word of Allah by ANY MEANS NECESSARY.
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| | Friday, November 17, 2000 - 03:59 pm Asad you are so Adorable...lol.. Galool you are Adorable too...lol, but if you spend half the energy you spend on trying to find faults in God/Religion, you would be a successful man.
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| | Friday, November 17, 2000 - 04:08 pm "Asad I will be a happy man if I could one day unravel the mysteries your minimalist opinions." lol------>your minimalist opinions. ;-) "One needs a powerful microscope to pick out what you said from the jungle of pasted quotes." lol "I sussed that you are trying to disagree with me" lol---->trying. ;-) "although you well and truly confused the little beardos, and I don't blame them" lol "But what is it you are ACTUALLY trying to say for Gawd's sake!" remember, i'm not here to make you happy------understand the mysteries of my minimalist (simple) opinions, right? ;-)
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| | Friday, November 17, 2000 - 04:36 pm Sorry Guys!. It is gonna be long post but beneficial. From scholar's perspective on the subject. Residing in Land of Unbelievers Three Fatawa by Sh. Muhammad Taqi al-Uthmani & Sh. Muhammad ibn Salih al-`Uthaimeen Translated by Kamil Mufti The following are three fatawa from two contemporary scholars on the issue of residing in the land of the unbelievers. The first one is taken from a response written by Muhammad Taqi al-Uthmani for the Majlis of Majma’ al-Fiqh al-Islami, held in Amman, Jordan from 8-13 Safr, 1407 A.H. corresponding to 11-16 October, 1986 in response to one of the 28 questions sent by the Islamic Center of Washington to the Majma’ on issues pertaining to Muslims residing in North America and Eupore. It was published in "Buhuth fi-Qadayaa Fiqhiyya Mu’asara." (p. 328-331) The other two were two questions put to Sh. Muhammad Ibn Salih al-‘Uthaimeen of Saudi Arabia and his response. It was taken from "al-Majmu’ al-Thameen min Fatawa fadilatis-sheikh Muhammad Ibn Salih al-‘Uthaimen." Vol 1, p. 54-61 (Q1) Is it allowed to take the nationaility of America or some European country? Some people who have already taken their nationality or are in the process argue that they are persecuted in their Muslim homelands, imprisoned unfairly, their wealth is seized, and all this forces them to adopt the nationality of non-Muslim countires. Some other Muslims say that when our own Muslim countries do not implement the Islamic punishments (hudud) or Islamic Sharia, then what difference is there between an Muslim and a non-Muslim country? Both are equal in not implementing Islamic laws. On the contrary, when we take the nationality of a non-Muslim country, it preserves our right to live, own wealth, and honor. Moreover, they are safer than Muslim countries. We do not fear imprisonment without a due cause, whereas in a Muslim country we always fear imprisonent. (A) Taking permanent residence in a non-Muslim country, adopting their nationality, and making it one’s country of residence as its citizen is a matter whose ruling (hukm) differs with those who seek citizenship, their motivations, and intentions. For instance: (1) If a Muslim is persecesuted in his homecountry without any crime, imprisoned for no due reason, his wealth seized injustly and he has no way of protecting himself from these injustices except taking residence in a non-Muslim country, then in this case it is permissible for him to take its citizenship without any dislike (kiraha) given he makes sure that he will be able to practise his deen in daily life and is able to guard against the promiscuity and evil widespread over there. The evidence for this is the following: the Companions migrated to Abyssinia after being persecuted by the people of Macca. Abyssinia at the time was led by the unbelievers. And they stayed there, some Companions did not cease to reside after the migration of Allah’s Mesenger to Madina. Abu Musa al-‘Ashari did not return till the expedition of Khaibar, that is in the seventh year after the Hijra. Moreover, it is the right of one’s self (nafs) on a person that he protects it from all forms of injustice (dhulm). If a person can not find protection for himself except in the land of the unbelievers, then there is no obstacle in migrating to it as long as he safeguards his religious obligations and stays away from forbidden abominations. (2) Similarly a person faced by financial hardships who can not find sufficient means of support without which he can not do and he does not find them except in such lands, then it is permissible for him with the conditions mentioned. This is because earning a livelihood is a duty (faridah) after other obligations which the Sharia has not restricted to any one place. Allah says: "He it is, Who has made the earth subservient to you, so walk in the path thereof and eat of His provisions, and to Him will be the Resurrection." 67:15 (3) Similarly, if a person becomes a citizen of a a country to invite its people to Islam or to teach the rulings of the Sharia to the Muslims living in it, then not only is it permissible, but he will be rewarded for it. Many Companions and Tabi’een took residence in the land of the unbelievers for this praiseworthy purpose, and this is counted among their merits. (4) If a person has sufficient financial means at his disposal in his Muslim homeland such that he can spend his life according to the standard of life of other people in his town, but he migrates to the land of the unbelievers to raise his standard of living and to be able to live in luxury, then such is not devoid of dislike (kiraha). He has exposed himself to the evil spread over there without any wordily or religious need sanctioning it. Experience testifies that the religious zeal of those who adopt citizenship for the sake of a luxurious life weakens and they melt infront of the glitter of unbelievers. Abu Daud reports on the authority of Samura ibn Jundub that the Prophet said, "Whoever joins a Mushrik and lives with him is like him." (Abu Daud, at-Tirmidhi) Jabir relates the Prophet said, "I am free of every Muslim who lives among the Musrikeen." We asked, "Why is that, O Messenger of Allah?" He replied, "Their fires should not be visible to one another." (Abu Daud) Imam al-Khattabi writes: "Different scholars have interpreted this hadith in different ways. One is that they are not equal in their hukm (‘ruling’; meaning they both have different rulings pertaining to them). Others say this hadith means Allah has differentiated between Dar al-Islam and Dar al-Kufr, hence it is not allowed for a Muslim to live in the land of the unbelievers since when they will lit their fire, he will be seen to belong to them. It also an evidence that it is disliked (makruh) for a Muslim to goto Dar al-Harb for trade and to stay there for more than four days." (Mu’alim us-Sunnan by al-Khattabi. Kitab al-Jihad) Abu Daud reports in his Marasil from Makhool from the Prophet, "Do not leave your children among the polythiests." This is why some jurists (fuqaha) have mentioned that Muslims living in Dar al-Kufr and increasing their numbers for the sake of making money takes away a person’s ‘adala (uprightness). (Takmila Radd al-Mukhtar I:101) (5) Taking citizenship of foreign lands to earn respect and honor, or to prefer their citizenship over that of Muslim countries, or to resemble them in daily life is absolutely haram. This does not even require evidence! (Q2) And he was asked: What is the ruling (hukm) of travelling (safr) to the land of the unbelievers? And what is the ruling concerning going there for tourism? (A) He answered by stating: Travelling (safr) to the land of the unbelievers is impermissible (la yajooz) unless three conditions are met: (a) That the person has knowledge (‘ilm) to repel doubts (shub-bahaat). (b) That he has deen which will prevent him from falling into lustful desires (shah-a-waat). (c) There is a need to travel. If these conditions are not met he is not allowed to travel to the land of the unbelievers due to the fitna or fear of fitna that exists there and the wasting of wealth that ususally accompanies such visits. As for some (genuine) need like medical treatment or acquiring knowledge that is not found in his land, and he has knowledge (‘ilm) and deen as we have described above, then there is no harm in it. As for travelling for tourism to the land of the unbelievers, then there is no need for that, also, it is possible for him to goto the lands of the Muslims to safeguard the manifest symbols of Islam for his family. Our lands, and all praise is due to Allah, have become tourist attractions where one may possibly go. (Q3) What is the ruling about residing (iqama) in the land of the unbelievers? (A) The Sheikh answered: Residing in the land of the unbelievers is a dangrous matter for the deen of a Muslim as well as his manners and morals. We as well as others have witnessed lot of deviation in those who lived there and came back not being on what they left with. They returned back sinners (fussaq), some even apostated not only from their religion, but from the rest of them as well - refuge is sought with Allah - having become stubbornly resilient, making fun of the deen and its adherents, those who came before and those who came after! Residence in the land of the unbelievers has two necessary conditions to it: (a) The resident is secure about his deen in the sense that he has knowledge (‘ilm), faith (imaan), and a strong resolve such that he can be confident that he will remain firm on his deen, cautious against deviation and misguidance, and he will conceal enmity for the unbelievers and have animosity towards them, far from turning towards and showing affection as turning towards them and loving them goes against Imaan as Allah says: "Thou wilt not find any people who believe in Allah and the Last Day, loving those who resist Allah and His Messenger, even though they were their fathers or their sons, or their brothers, or their kindred. For such He has written Faith in their hearts, and strengthened them with a spirit from Himself. And He will admit them to Gardens beneath which Rivers flow, to dwell therein (for ever). Allah will be well pleased with them, and they with Him. They are the Party of Allah. Truly it is the Party of Allah that will achieve felicity." al-Mujadilah 22 " O ye who believe! take not the Jews and the Christians for your friends and protectors: They are but friends and protectors to each other. And he amongst you that turns to them (for friendship) is of them. Verily Allah guideth not a people unjust. Those in whose hearts is a disease - thou seest how eagerly they run about amongst them, saying: "We do fear lest a change of fortune bring us disaster." Ah! perhaps Allah will give (thee) victory, or a decision according to His will. Then will they repent of the thoughts which they secretly harboured in their hearts." 5: 51, 52 And it is confirmed in an authentic hadith that the Prophet said, "Whoever loves a people will be one of them, and a man will be with the one he loves." Loving the enemies of Allah is one of the greatest dangers for a Muslim since loving them necessitates conforming with and following them, or at least not stopping them, that is why the Prophet said, "A man will be with whom he loves." (b) That he is able to express his deen in the sense that he is able to establish the outward manifest symbols (Sha’a’ir) of Islam without any hindrance so there is no obstacle in establishing the prayer; the Jumu’ah; the congregation (jama’ah) when there is someone with him to establish the congragation (jama’ah) and Jumu’ah; there is no obstacle in (administering) zakat, fasting, Hajj, and other symbols of Islam. If he is unable to do so, he is not allowed to reside and must migrate (hijra). It is stated in al-Mughni (vol. 8, p. 457) under the duscussion of the categories of people with respect to migration (hijra): "One of those who must migrate is one who is unable to show his deen and is not able to establish the obligatory duties (wajibaat) of his deen due to his residence with the unbelievers. On such it is obligatory to migrate as Allah said: "Lo! as for those whom the angels take (in death) while they wrong themselves, (the angels) will ask: In what were ye engaged? They will say: We were oppressed in the land. (The angels) will say: Was not Allah’s earth spacious that ye could have migrated therein? As for such, their habitation will be hell, an evil journey’s end." 4:97 This is a severe threat which points towards obligation (wajub) because establishing an obligation of the deen is obligatory on one who is able to. Migration (hijra) is from the requirements of the obligation and its perfection and if an obligation can not be fulfilled except something, then that thing becomes obligatory as well." After completing these basic conditions, residence in Dar al-Kufr can be divided into the following types: (1) That he resides to give da’wa to Islam and awaken (people) to it. This is a type of Jihad that is a communal obligation (fard kifaya) on the one capable with the condition that he will materialize the da’wa and there is no obstacle in (delivering) it or (others) responding to it. This is because da’wa to Islam is from the obligations of the deen and the way of the messengers. The Prophet has commanded to deliver the message on his behalf in every age and time as he said, "Relate from me even if a single verse.’ (2) That he resides to study the state of the unbelievers and to know what they are upon of corruption (fasad) of creed (aqeeda), false worship, immorality, and confused behavior so he may warn people of the reality of their affairs. This type of residence is also a type of Jihad since it serves as giving a warning against disbelief and the unbelievers which implies inviting to Islam and its guidance. The corruption of disbelief is proof for the vailidity of Islam as they say, ‘things are known by their opposites.’ But he must materialize his intent without incurring greater harm since if he does not materialize his intent by not spreading what they are upon and cautioning against it, then there is no benefit of his residence. If materializing his intent will result in a greater harm like reciprocating their abuse of Islam, the Messenger, and the scholars of Islam because of his action, then he must hold himself back as Allah has said, "Revile not ye those whom they call upon besides Allah, lest they out of spite revile Allah in their ignorance. Thus have We made alluring to each people its own doings. In the end will they return to their Lord, and We shall then tell them the truth of all that they did." al-An’am 108 This residence in the land of the unbelievers is like being the eyes of the Muslims so he may know how the Muslims should plan against their deceptions as the Peophet sent Hudaifa ibn Yamman to the polythiests to obtain information about them. (3) That he resides for some need of a Muslim country and establishing (diplomatic) ties like an embassy staff. Their ruling is the same as for the ones for whom they are staying. Cultural attache may, for instance, stay in order to oversee the affairs of the students and to watch them and to encourage them to practise the deen of Islam and its morals and manners. By his reseidence great benefit might be achieved. (4) That he resides for a specific, permissible need, for instance trade or medical treatment. In this case it is allowed for him to reside as long as may be needed. The scholars have stated the permissiblity of entering the lands of the unbelievers based on some reports from the Companions. (5) That he resides for education. This is similar to residing due to some need as mentioned above, but it is more dangerous and harder on the religion of the resident and his morals. This is because a student is conscious of his low level and the high level of his instructors. This leads to repect of and conviction in their beliefs and ideas. Hence, he may blindly follow them save for those whom Allah protects. Moreover, a student depends on his instructor which leads to affection and a desire to please him in the deviation and misguidance he is upon. Also a student might make friends among his peers, love them, turn towards them, and take from them. Due to the extreme danger of this of this type, we will add some more conditions to the ones already mentioned: (a) The student must be at a very mature mental level which would enable him to distinguish between what is beneficial and what is harmful and be able to foresee distant future. Sending young and immature ones is very dangerous for their deen and morals. Moreover, they also pose a threat to their communities after they return and spew forth the poison they were made to drink from these unbelievers as we have seen and is testified by reality. Many of them return back but not as they left - they come back deviated in their morals and manners. They cause great harm to their societies in these matters as can be seen. Sending them is like putting a sheep infront of a raving predator! (b) The student must have knowledge of the Sharia that would enable him to distinguish between truth and falsehood and fight falsehood with truth perchance he is duped by the falsehood they are upon, imagining it to be truth or is deceived,or is unable to defend it, otherwise he will be left confused following falsehood. A reported suppication states, "O Allah, show me the truth as the truth, and enable me to follow it. O Allah, show me show me falsehood as falsehood and enable me to stay away from it and do not let it confuse me, so I may be misguided." (c) The student has deen that will safeguard and protect him against disbelief and sinfulness. One weak in his deen will not be safe if he resides there, except for whom Allah wills otherwise. This is because onslaugths are strong and the defenses are feeble. Causes of disbelief and sinfulness are many and diverse so if he comes across an occasion with feeble defenses, he might fall into it. (d) There is some need of the knowledge for which he is residing over there, for instance, there is some benefit for the Muslims in him acquiring it. Also, the same education is not available in institutions of his own land. If it is useless type of knowledge or if it is available in Islamic lands, he is not allowed to reside in the land of the unbelievers for it since residing with them poses a danger to the deen and the morals and a waste of wealth without benefit. (6) He resides to live and settle. This case presents more danger than the ones before and leads to greater harm because it involves complete mixing with the unbelievers since they demand nationalistic allegiance and doing so increases the numbers of the unbelievers. His raising family with people of disbelief leads to adopting their morals and habits, maybe even blind imitation in belief (aqeeda) and worship. This is why a hadith mentions that the Prophet said, "Whoever joins a Mushrik and lives with him is like him." Even though it has a weak isnad but it sets a perspective since settling leads to resemblance. Qais ibn Abi Hazim reports on the authority of Jarir ibn Abd-Allah that the Prophet said, ""I am free of every Muslim who lives among the Musrikeen." We asked, "Why is that, O Messenger of Allah?" He replied, "Their fires should not be visible to one another." Reported by Abu Daud and at-Tirmidhi. Most of the the reports are mursal from Qais ibn Abi Hazim from the Prophet. At-Tirmidhi said he heard Muhammad - that is al-Bukhari - saying the correct opinion concerning the hadith of Qais is that it is mursal. How can the soul of a believer feel good about settling in the land of the unbelievers where the symbols of unbelief are dominant, the rule belongs to other than Allah and His Messenger, and he witnesses to that with his eyes and hears with his ears and is pleased with it! Rather he ascribes himself to those lands and settles in them with his family and children and feels content with that as if he was in the land of the Muslims! This is notwithstanding the great danger on him, his family and children regarding their deen and morals. This is what we have reached as far as residing in the lands of the unbelievers is concerned. We ask Allah that He makes it conform to what is right and correct. http://www.islaam.com/articles/residing_in_land_of_unbelievers.htm
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| | Friday, November 17, 2000 - 05:46 pm Former Guest, Salaam. Jazakalaahu khairan for the info. Subhanallah...it is scary and depreasing. What is one to do now?
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| | Saturday, November 18, 2000 - 03:38 am FG& CO Interesting that you are discussing this issue, which normally highlights the hypocrisy of the bearded tribe more than any other. (Ramadan is coming, which means I will not be able to criticize you for a whole month so I better get in there now) There is something cringingly laughable about the sight of Shabta/cayrta-claiming beardo ranting and raving about the evils of the West, and reading the label of every loaf, when he fully well knows where the handout he just received came from, ie taxation on tobaccos, pig products and alcohol. The ingratitude is equally breath-taking. Beardos blow hot and cold about how nasty, horrible, immoral the west is, yet each of them have made a super-human effort to come to the west!, and none I have seen so far have any intention of catching the Ariana to Afghanistan. I am sure the Prophet and his companions were not that rude to their hosts in Medinah and Habashah. The hell'n'heaven club enjoy all the fruits of liberal democracy, including the freedom of speech, and respect of other people's views and lifestyles. Yet they wish to deny those same freedoms in their utopian theocracies. that is what I call HYPOCRISY. And what exactly constitutes an "Islamic" country? Needless to say I disagree with the very concept, as I believe Faiths should be between individuals and their Gods, not a political set-ups. Is a country with 70% muslim population an "Islamic" country? what is the cut-off point? 60%? 50%? 90%? Is staunchly secular Turkey, where only about 30% of the population identify themselves as Muslim, an Islamic country? How about the chauvinist ruled Arak-and-whisky countries of Iraq and Syria? are they "Islamic" too?
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| | Saturday, November 18, 2000 - 04:43 am Galool. lol at your asad comment it was funny, you are quite funny but uhmm forgive me if i pass on the TBG idea of you being adorable.. how bout funny but pigheaded and merticolous narrow minded? you are making smoke bombs all over the page..let me try and clarify..your gorrila lies in the mist. <chuckle chuckle..i know its impolite to laugh at your own jokes espacilly before anyone else even offers a grin..but hey> Okay first of all.. i will deal with the liberal democracy. There is a limted amount of freedom in the west..lets not overstate its amount or i will be forced to retract on my earlier stamenet about me actually liking many things in the west. "liberal democracy" is a world view.. and by its defintion it should be able to overturn itself, abraham linction, govermnet for the people, by the people. howver that is where the model breaks down, we can't vote democratically to have Islam in this country for example.Democracy will cling to power like anything else..the paradigm which supposed to repesent the will of the people, doesn't. Like you asking where there is an Islamic country..(i will attempt to answer that later).. considerthis where is their a democratic country in both form and content..dealing with both substance and shape?. Please explain..i have head this arguement with mad mac.. he backed down..so will you probably .So i will make it consise it casue repeating my self is a drag.. the atheist..or agnonistics..seem to enjoy peddling the same junk. 1.93% of the legaslature in the country me and you live in is derived from interest groups..les than 3 % is inspired..i will leave you to imagine intested in what and in whom. 2. A "liberal democracy" isn't concerned with inequalitys in its socities..which leads me to postulate can you be politically exclued while economically and socailly exculded?..if you are in doubt..look at who is most effective in determing legislature..those with the means..which correltes as money. 3. freedom to and freedom from.. again we been though this..sorry other readers again for repeating this. Certain groups in a socities have more rights than other.. America for example has a police force that protects and serves...protects whites and serves blacks Is respecting someones opionion the same as agreeing with someones opinions.? The reason you get charged with being mad mac so often is that you rehash his tired arguements and you have the complaint that us muslims are so absolutist?..change the record..its scratched, defaced and obsolete about going to the east, do you imagine the hand of the west does not reach the east. Either we have "low intensity democracies".. which function basically as export producing primary product countries and importing markets under the guise of democrcies.. cause the westwill endevour to dicates who is in power where.. CIA operations to remove people in power in Nigaraua, Iran etc.to create these "low intensity democrices"..which by the way have only been in fasiuon for a while, befroe the west preferd imposing authoriatin regimes on the third world. when they can't remove them..they economically sanction them,..the reason why people are not running to Afganisatn..becasue the US imposed sanctions have reduced Afrganistan to one of the hungrset countries in the world. Anyway you imgine the Taliban adminstration to be a Islamic government..i think they sell heroin.? which i think is wrong the heaven and hell club enjoy the fruits of liberal democracy.. should we not?.. should they be cutailed..this is a conetntious issue for you guys it makes me smile. For example in Turkey the government is bent on being western, however the people keep voting for Islamic people, so the government holds confrences more or less entiled "how can we stop these peasants from voting for Islam".. so blinded by "democracy" that they imagine it to be spomething it isn't. They will not allow women who are elected into parliment serve unless they remove their hijaab.whats up with that? again this one guy said "our county is democratic our queen is american" he was refering to jordon. democracy is a systme of governemnet..which bears no resemblance to its orgins..yet retains it emotive contaions.. we have socalist democries..peoples democracies.. liberal democracies..its a buzz word. essentailly teh system in teh west is widely acknowged in acedmic cirlces to be known as a Polyarch.. which is absoulty nothing like a democracy.. i could have quoted you about 6 books already so.. far and about 10 differnt authors on teh subject..but you won't read..if you will let me know and i will list there are no Islamic countries in the world as far as i am aware which freedoms do the muslims which to deny?... the freedom of blashemphy which is inherent to life?.. the freedom of unlawful sex?.. which is a fundemental human right?.lol. i assume you mean me by blowing hot and cold..are there not good aspects to the west and bad aspects. Finally all this civilisation has to offer is in debt to muslims?...so who is the real hypocrites..the real ungraful people.. let me know cousin casue you got me wondering let me tell you something about hosts..host have both guests snd paraistes.. we are truly guests..we observe your laws when you in ours "countrys" the west chooses to upsurp, undermine, kill etc tec. who is the parsisrte i could go on for days. how bout we judge things as they are.. rather than how they dwell in your perverted mind.. a trulty revelotionary concept. waslaam
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| | Saturday, November 18, 2000 - 05:10 am To Galool, It will take me the whole day to give you an anwser though, you did not ask one. But I will try here not more than 3 minu. You are absolutly right the Prophet(SCW) and his Sahaba were not hostile to their hosts. Instead, they spread Islam at the best way they can. My point, The prophet migrated for a reason though not similar to those Muslims leave thier countries nowadays. But you know there are similarities ( if I got wrong I rely my other bro and sis to correct me) The unbeleivers were practisisng in idols and very inhuman acts ( in the case of the Prophets time), and the Muslims nowadays found when they come here very strange. Yes, they want get rid of war, famine, political opression etc. They come here. These rich powerfull countries, advanced technology and the rest of it. Then they look around and get deprssed to found out all these promoted moral decline. So, some of them react and ohter adopt. But there are different ways of experring things and I think that is what you have a problem with, and I do as well. Poeple who do not establish Islam within themselves want talk about Islam'' Practise what you preaching'' I think that is my massage. W And also I ahve a problem with when s.o goes over the top. I see this on the tv when I cannot remember his name the guy who is always on every Tv programm about Islam. Shouting and bousting about that he wants see the Islamic flag flying over the white house. Instead, I would like to see a truly Islamic society. Muslims who under every rule show respect to their governments. As you saying rspect the other poeples lifestyles. Yes, I honestly respect the other cultures but I think what is differet is when you think you are part of the society, the mankind who resides that particular land. Then you start making a good efforts to check '' the balances'' then, you are suddently, labeled as fundamentalist which we know it is means terrorist. I do also think there are some kind of democracy and peace in the West and I respect that. But Fruits of liberals democrats, I am to thick to undesrtand this phrase.Expalin again PLEASE!!!!!1 And lastly, I agree the definition of Islamic countries are not accurate.Indeed, in my opinion it is not right. May we call them the NAME OF THE POELE WHO LIVE THEIR. wE SHOULD CALL them islamic countries when there is an Islamic government. Did not follow what I was trying to say. I will try agian. By the way are going to share Ramadan with us.
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| | Saturday, November 18, 2000 - 07:33 am Common, you are extremely adorable...:-) Arawello, so are you...:-) However, both of your ( yourself and common)postings were hard to follow at times :-( You were probably mad when you wrote them... you guys are letting galool pull your legs? Galool, you are still adorable... I was happy to hear your comment about Ramadhan...you are invited to break fast at my place.
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| | Saturday, November 18, 2000 - 09:06 am "Galool. lol at your asad comment it was funny, you are quite funny" i thought it was funny too, especailly when he pretended not to understand was i was pointing out to him----his hypocrisy. ;-) "Interesting that you are discussing this issue, which normally highlights the hypocrisy of the bearded tribe more than any other." talking about hypocrisy, let's look at the the ultimate hypocrisy of galool. for a guy who says he is an athiest, when he was talking about God he said this: "If he wants to defeat a particular group of people, surely he can do it by himself without involving his creations in bloody confrontations". then, i said to him: "i'm glad that you acknowledge there is a God (Allah) who can do whatever He wants to.". ;-). you see, the etheists (subconsciously) acknowledge that there is a God, but they deny Him (deliberately). sometimes, they can not help but to acknowledge God and His Qualities. when an atheist falls or trips and gets hurt he or she calls----yells: "O God". ;-) "There is something cringingly laughable about the sight of Shabta/cayrta-claiming beardo ranting and raving about the evils of the West and reading the label of every loaf, when he fully well knows where the handout he just received came from, ie taxation on tobaccos, pig products and alcohol. The ingratitude is equally breath-taking." lol----->shabta/cayrta-claiming beardo. ;-). galool, you (as a somali refugee---a beardless athiest) never received shabta/cayrta? ;-). also, as a somali athiest, do you thank the west for giving you the swine for food and drinking alcohol? ;-) "Beardos blow hot and cold about how nasty, horrible, immoral the west is, yet each of them have made a super-human effort to come to the west!" well, hypocracy and compromise are not the same. have you ever heard the somali saying that goes like this: "hadii la dhimanaayana, dhareerka waa la iska duwaa". which means (in this situation) just because you happen to be in america does not mean you have to eat the pork and drink alcohol. you are saying if one does not do this, he or she is a hypocrite (blowing the hot and the cold at the same time) which is not true. when the sahaba went to abasiniya as refugees running from the pagan arabs, they still practiced their religion and never compromised it. ;-). actually, comitting compromise is giving up sometimes a thing you had----in this case, galool seems to have given up his soul to the west. ;-) "I am sure the Prophet and his companions were not that rude to their hosts in Medinah and Habashah." lol----->i'm sure. ;-) "The hell'n'heaven club" lol. by the way, galool, you did not tell me what you think would happen to you when you die-----do you beleive you will come back to the earth as monkey or somethings (reincarnation)? also, as an atheist, what about the other question i asked you? where did you come from as human being (who created you) and who is your ancestors----adam or the ape (chimpanzee) ? ;-) "enjoy all the fruits of liberal democracy, including the freedom of speech, and respect of other people's views and lifestyles." i'm enjoying all these with out compromising the religion. i do not drink or eat the pork, do you, galool? ;-) "Yet they wish to deny those same freedoms in their utopian theocracies." lol----->in their utopian theocracies. ;-) "that is what I call HYPOCRISY." do you think a muslim can practice his belief in the west if he wanted to marry more than one wife and be free, galool? ;-) "And what exactly constitutes an "Islamic" country?" Needless to say I disagree with the very concept" i disagree the concept of christian/jews land too. the whole earth belongs to Allah. ;-) as I believe Faiths should be between individuals and their Gods, not a political set-ups." are you saying the atheists do not have polictical set-ups where they want un-Godly laws on all people? again, there is no comprimise in religion. if the etheists do not want to compromise and obey the believers, why would the believers obey the laws of the un-Godly? this is hypocrisy, double-standard, right? ;-)
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| | Saturday, November 18, 2000 - 05:20 pm Common "democracy is a system of government..which bears no resemblance to its orgins..yet retains it emotive contaions.." This is so very true. Democracy = hypocrisy Galool, You have an Islamic country if the gov'd is implementing Islam to the fullest and the people have enough faith in Islam to view it as a compelete system. It would be impossible for any gov'd to implement Islam if the mentality of the people is such that Islam is seen as just a religion and not a way of life.
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| | Sunday, November 19, 2000 - 02:14 am Common I just had an awful nightmare. Somalia became a theocracy and asad became minister of Revolutionary Islamic Justice. Of course he immediately added a quote unquote to this already cumbersome title, to make it truly Asadian. He then sits at his Holy-Hands-Chopping-Chambers, and starts issuing endless, pointless, unintelligable, Cut'n'Pasted fatwas. Needless to say, a gargantuan boredom of Quranic proportions sets in.The huddled massess make no attempt of escaping with their famished limbs. Instead, they form long ques to the head-lobbing section in a bid to escape this awful drone in their ears. TLG You just made an old man very happy. You invitation is accepted. Asad I have not developed a taste for swine meat. As for Alcohol, I have been having a tipple for 20 years-long before I came to the West. In fact one of my most cherished memories of Home is nursing quality Jowherian Rum'n'Coke in one of the small bars beside Mogadishu's now abandoned Lido beach. Heaven, to me, was to have the warm waters of the Indian Ocean lapping my feet, glass of the dark stuff in my hand, as dusky somali beauties in see-through Diri's bathed on the beach! Hmm memories, memories.
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| | Sunday, November 19, 2000 - 04:32 am TBL <smile> yeah my messages have been known to be messy.. asad refers to it as being emotional.. Galool refers to it as throwing smokebombs.. i try man!.lol i heard this thing about Islamic knowldge coming from both the heart and the mind togther..connected. and i really dig it.. i think you are right it is not wise to write when you are mad .. i am not sure if i was upset..maybe.... re reading it it was quite muddled..but i can't judge my self fairly i understand myself.. i look at it say "what a clever young man..and he is goodlooking "lol. so i can definatly not be trusted. Galool <smile> i think Asad would make a very fair Judge as long as he didn't execute punishment for minor discrepencies.lol. After all he would be commited to the Quran.. i would rather face him in court than someone who imagines it correct that i call him your "worship"..or your "honour".. and gives out capital punishment or life sentences on the whims of his moods or predujices and incoherent mumbo jumbo they call law.. where my skin colour means they can give me longer sentences for the same crime. Did i mention skin colour?.. oh lol forgive me..i am missing your amatuer freudian reasoning for my cacooning myself in Islam :running from the woes of the the racist west.<running as we speak from the taunts of the the guy sitting next to me in computer room> about the beaches weren't there sharks on the beaches in Somalia?.. i heard that Saad Barre put a meat facory on a beach in Berbera somewhere so that the sharks would be attracted by the smell of the blood and eat the northen people?.. is this true.. i wouldn't put it passed the man. I went to Burco recently i was visteing this house where my dad used to live..and i was like walking around.. and the guy i was with was like careful..there is a few landmines still around here. i can't understand the logic of landmines, they are so sad and evil. alysia. <smile> yeah sister unfortunatly people have ripped the heart out of democracy, the worst thing is they act like it is so wonderful. America imprisons more people than Nazi germany.. and that place is what the world aspires too. It was funny.. Fidel castro offered to go and oversee their elections..it was so sweet.. they must be so embarassed as they see themselves as the champions of democracy . <Smile>fidel may have some issue when it comes to running his country..but he says and does cool things sometimes those were all warm smiles my brothers and sisters... one love
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| | Sunday, November 19, 2000 - 05:00 am "Common I just had an awful nightmare. Somalia became a theocracy and asad became minister of Revolutionary Islamic Justice." lol----->awful nightmare. ;-) "Of course he immediately added a quote unquote to this already cumbersome title, to make it truly Asadian." lol---->asadian. ;-) "He then sits at his Holy-Hands-Chopping-Chambers, and starts issuing endless, pointless, unintelligable, Cut'n'Pasted fatwas." lol---->pointless, unintelligable, cut'n'pasted fatwas. ;-) "Needless to say, a gargantuan boredom of Quranic proportions sets in." lol---->boredom of qur'anic. ;-) "The huddled massess make no attempt of escaping with their famished limbs." lol-----famished limbs. ;-) "Instead, they form long ques to the head-lobbing section in a bid to escape this awful drone in their ears." lol---->awful drone in their ears. ;-). let me sum up all these funny lines by our somali athiest. what he is trying to say is that, the truth hurts. i told you that the Qur'an was/is/will be a nightmare for those (like the pagan arabs) trying to distort the truth. ;-) well, since galool knows that the Qur'an is what we believe, he is here to tell us his contempt and hatred of it, but this exemplifies his quandary or predicament: ;-). the Qur'an will not go away. galool can can characterize those who believe the Qur'an as the fools, and him as the intelligent, but this is another instance of the pagans, athiests, jews, christians, hypocrites's, muddled thinking and queer morals. the joke is on them. no matter how galool attacks the Qur'an, confusion and perplexity on his part will come out. he can not hide his beliefs. he is having hard time answering what he believes. he did not tell us what he thinks would happen to him when you dies-----does he beleive he will come back to the earth as a monkey or something (reincarnation)? also, what about the other question i asked him? as an athiest, can he tell us where did he come from (who created him) and who is his ancestor father----adam or the ape (the chimpanzee) ? ;-). instead, he answers this question and says: "Asad I have not developed a taste for swine meat. As for Alcohol, I have been having a tipple for 20 years-long before I came to the West." lol "In fact one of my most cherished memories of Home is nursing quality Jowherian Rum'n'Coke in one of the small bars beside Mogadishu's now abandoned Lido beach. Heaven, to me, was to have the warm waters of the Indian Ocean lapping my feet, glass of the dark stuff in my hand as dusky somali beauties in see-through Diri's bathed on the beach! Hmm memories, memories." speaking of alcoholics in somalia, i remember growing up in mogadishu kids throwing stones at alkuliistayaasha (the darkskinned ones--the somalis). ;-). i used to hear the kids saying while throwing stones at the alcoholics this: 'aalkuliiste, umburiyaako, assasiino". ;-). tell me galool that you not REMEMBER having being stoned by these somali kids---when you were starting to drink. ;-)
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| | Sunday, November 19, 2000 - 05:05 am "Galool <smile> i think Asad would make a very fair Judge as long as he didn't execute punishment for minor discrepencies.lol." lol--->minor discrepencies. ;-) and meantime, i those having nightmares for fear of me pointing out their discrepencies on here is punishment enough. ;-)
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| | Sunday, November 19, 2000 - 05:05 am "Galool <smile> i think Asad would make a very fair Judge as long as he didn't execute punishment for minor discrepencies.lol." lol--->minor discrepencies. ;-) and meantime, i those having nightmares for fear of me pointing out their discrepencies on here is punishment enough. ;-)
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| | Sunday, November 19, 2000 - 06:13 am asad No I don't remember being stoned. That is why I am trying to avoid the Beards coming to power, as they are BIG on stoning people! No Somali, no human being will ever be subjected to such barbaric act if I have anything to do with it. Now to your questions. When you die, nothing happens! You turn into food for the organisms who live in the soil and fertilizer for the land! Sorry for disappointing you, but there will be no Xuur for you! And anyway, what erm... (please ladies don't read this bit)erm ..."tool" will you be using on those 60 Xuur as everything will be turned into compost! Sad, I admit but that is the horrible truth. So I reccommend you learn to seduce girls while you can asad! As where we came from, the simple answer is nobody is quite sure. The scientific theorem that suggest life evolved from micro-organisms in the Primordial soup is as far-fetched as the simplistic religious one which claims that God decided to make man from mud!(so that they can worship him! now what does he need that for? I ask)
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| | Sunday, November 19, 2000 - 07:11 am "asad No I don't remember being stoned." i wonder if the alcaholics remembers what had happen to them (while suffering the effect of a hung-over). are you sure that the kids did say to you once 'alkuliiste umburiyaako assasiino"? ;-) "That is why I am trying to avoid the Beards coming to power, as they are BIG on stoning people! No Somali, no human being will ever be subjected to such barbaric act if I have anything to do with it." i do not think you can avoid these somali kids (these barbaric--bearless kids) if they see you drunk. ;-). "Now to your questions. When you die, nothing happens!" so you are here to eat, drink and have sex, like the animals, right---with no accountiblity, right? "You turn into food for the organisms who live in the soil and fertilizer for the land!" lol----->organisms. ;-) and what would happen to the organisms themselves? ;-) "Sorry for disappointing you, but there will be no Xuur for you!" lol----->disappointing you. ;-) "And anyway, what erm... (please ladies don't read this bit)erm ..."tool" will you be using on those 60 Xuur as everything will be turned into compost!" lol----->will be turned into compost (nourishment) ;-) "Sad, I admit but that is the horrible truth." lol------>i admit that is the horrible "truth". ;-) "So I reccommend you learn to seduce girls while you can asad!" lol----->learn. ;-) "As where we came from, the simple answer is nobody is quite sure." lol----->nobody is quite sure. ;-), but you know for sure the "truth" of what would happen to you, right when you die, right? ;-) "The scientific theorem that suggest life evolved from micro-organisms in the Primordial soup is as far-fetched as the simplistic religious one which claims that God decided to make man from mud!" and what do the scientific theorem say about who created the micro-organisms (themselves)? ;-) and what about them also saying that your ancestor father being the monkey? ;-) "so that they can worship him! now what does he need that for? I ask" well, the fact is that God does not need. God created human being in vain without some wise plan and purpose. this repudiates the atheists like you who think we are here to eat, drink and do anything you want without accountilbity. where is your brain, galool? ;-) what about hiter------did he come here to do what he did and will not have to face justice, right? ;-)
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| | Sunday, November 19, 2000 - 07:17 am "asad No I don't remember being stoned." i wonder if the alcaholics remembers what had happen to them (while suffering the effect of a hung-over). are you sure that the kids did say to you once 'alkuliiste umburiyaako assasiino"? ;-) "That is why I am trying to avoid the Beards coming to power, as they are BIG on stoning people! No Somali, no human being will ever be subjected to such barbaric act if I have anything to do with it." i do not think you can avoid these somali kids (these barbaric--bearless kids) if they see you drunk. ;-). "Now to your questions. When you die, nothing happens!" so you are here to eat, drink and have sex, like the animals, right---with no accountiblity, right? "You turn into food for the organisms who live in the soil and fertilizer for the land!" lol----->organisms. ;-) and what would happen to the organisms themselves? ;-) "Sorry for disappointing you, but there will be no Xuur for you!" lol----->disappointing you. ;-) "And anyway, what erm... (please ladies don't read this bit)erm ..."tool" will you be using on those 60 Xuur as everything will be turned into compost!" lol----->will be turned into compost (nourishment) ;-) "Sad, I admit but that is the horrible truth." lol------>i admit that is the horrible "truth". ;-) "So I reccommend you learn to seduce girls while you can asad!" lol----->learn. ;-) "As where we came from, the simple answer is nobody is quite sure." lol----->nobody is quite sure. ;-), but you know for sure the "truth" of what would happen to you, right when you die, right? ;-) "The scientific theorem that suggest life evolved from micro-organisms in the Primordial soup is as far-fetched as the simplistic religious one which claims that God decided to make man from mud!" and what do the scientific theorem say about who created the micro-organisms (themselves)? ;-) and what about them also saying that your ancestor father being the monkey? ;-) "so that they can worship him! now what does he need that for? I ask" well, the fact is that God does not need. God created not human being in vain---without some wise plan and purpose. this repudiates the atheists like you who think we are here to eat, drink and do anything you want without accountilbity. where is your brain, galool? ;-) what about hiter------did he come here to do what he did and will not have to face justice, right? ;-)
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| | Sunday, November 19, 2000 - 07:21 am <TLG You just made an old man very happy. You invitation is accepted.> Galool, what would you prefer for iftar? cold pizza and coke in the residence or a good home made samosa's, bajias, biriani..etc..I know the home made seems tempting but there is a catch..You can't talk to one of my uncles whos is the mirror image of your thoughts here. He exhausted me , tht is why I don't bother refuting any of your statements here. But I think there is hope for you, atleast you want to fast. <"what a clever young man..and he is goodlooking "lol. so i can definatly not be trusted.> Common...:-) lol@can't be trusted...doh, i was hoping u could be trusted. You are still adorable though...no worries one more thing common, be easy on Galool..."thou shall love thy enemy" Asad: easy with the lols and the smiles :-)...I scrolled all the way down...and what did i get? Galools quoted msg and lols and smiles! salaams.
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| | Sunday, November 19, 2000 - 07:34 am "Asad: easy with the lols and the smiles :-)..I scrolled all the way down...and what did i get?" trauntlabgirl, i think what you also did not get was my other quotes on here where i said this many many times: "i do not listen orders when someone like you tells me what i can or can not do on here (what i can and can not quote or what i can or can not write on here). ;-) "Galools quoted msg and lols and smiles!" lol------>quoted msg and lols and smiles. ;-)
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| | Sunday, November 19, 2000 - 07:52 am TLG I am going to call you TLC. It takes a lot to find crusty old dudus like me and asad "adorable" Now forget the Samosas, can I meet your uncle instead? The superb intelligence you demonstrated on these pages clearly runs in the family. Did you show him these pages? I would love to meet him for a pint after Ramadhan, so that we can explore ways of making asad's ideas intelligible. So long my young beauty.
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| | Sunday, November 19, 2000 - 09:13 am "It takes a lot to find crusty old dudus like me and asad "adorable"" lol-----crusty old dudes. ;-) "The superb intelligence you demonstrated on these pages clearly runs in the family. Did you show him these pages? I would love to meet him for a pint after Ramadhan, so that we can explore ways of making asad's ideas intelligible." lol------->intelligent = atheism. ;-) that is very funny. let's see, atheism (the belief of galool) allows for no one to have a clear, rational mind and to accept the responsibility for their own actions-----accountability. galool says when he dies he will turn into food for the organisms who live in the soil and fertilizer for the land. in other word, all his limbs (his body) will be turned into compost (nourishment for the organisms---other creatures); no soul. ;-). an atheist like galool can not fathom the idea that God created him. this "intelligent) of galool (as illusiveness and intangibility as it is) says that a man like hitler and the children he killed and others who did no wrong will end up the same fate (soulless). ;-). he says he is here to eat, sleep, drink, have sex and die. how intelligent is this and how is this different than being an animal who is here to eat, sleep, drink, have sex? ;-)
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| | Sunday, November 19, 2000 - 10:12 am galool, in your quandary or predicament, i'm here once again to qoute the Qur'an (which you find contempt and hatred ) for you in order to expose the weakness of your intelligent: "And he makes comparisons for Us, and forgets his own (origin and) Creation: he says, 'Who can give life to (dry) bones and decomposed ones (at that)?' Say, 'He will give them life Who created them for the first time! For He fully knows all! - The same Who produces for you fire out of the green tree, when behold! ye kindle therewith (your own fires)! Is not He Who created the heavens and the earth able to create the like thereof?' - Yea, indeed! for He is the Creator Supreme, of skill and knowledge (infinite)!" (36:78-81). the Qur'an very clearly says that the athiests have no sound basis for their denial of life after death. it is based on pure conjecture: "And they say: 'What is there but our life in this world? We shall die and we live, and nothing but time can destroy us.' But of that they have no knowledge: they merely conjecture: And when Our Clear Signs are rehearsed to them, their argument is nothing but this: they say, 'Bring (back) our forefathers, if what ye say is true!'" (45:24-25). surely God will raise all the dead. but God has His own plan of things. a day will come when the whole universe will be destroyed and then again the dead will be resurrected to stand before God. that day will be the beginning of the life that will never end, and that day every person will be rewarded by God according to his or her good or evil deed. the explanation that the Quran gives about the necessity of life after death is what moral consciousness of man demands. actually if there is no life after death, the very belief in God becomes irrelevant or even if one believes in God, that would be an unjust and indifferent God: having once created man not concerned with his fate. surely, God is just; He will punish the tyrants whose crimes are beyond count: having killed hundreds of innocent persons, created great corruptions in the society, enslaved numerous persons to serve their whims etc... man having a very short span of life in this world, and this physical world too being not eternal, punishments or rewards equal to the evil or noble deeds of persons are not possible here. the Qur'an very emphatically states that the Day of Judgement must come and God will decide about the fate of each soul according to his or her record of deeds: "The Unbelievers say, 'Never to us will come the Hour': Say, 'Nay! but most surely, by my Lord, it will come upon you;- by Him Who knows the unseen,- from Whom is not hidden the least little atom in the heavens or on earth: nor is there anything less than that, or greater, but is in the Record Perspicuous: That He may reward those who believe and work deeds of righteousness: for such is Forgiveness and a Sustenance Most Generous.' But those who strive against Our Signs, to frustrate them,- for such will be a Chastisement,- of painful wrath." (34:3-5). the Day of Resurrection will be the Day when God's attributes of Justice and Mercy will be in full manifestation. God will shower His mercy on those who suffered for His sake in the worldly life, believing that an eternal bliss was awaiting them. but those who abused the bounties of God, caring nothing for the life to come, will be in the most miserable state. drawing a comparison between them, the Quran says: "Are (these two) alike?- one to whom We have made a goodly promise, and who is going to reach its (fulfillment), and one to whom We have given the good things of this life, but who, on the Day of Judgment, is to be among those brought up (for punishment)?" (28:61). the Qur'an also states that this worldly life is a preparation for the eternal life after death. But those who deny it become slaves of their passions and desires, make fun of virtuous and God-conscious persons. Such persons realize their folly only at the time of their death and wish to be given a further chance in the world but in vain. their miserable state at the time of death, and the horror of the Day of Judgement, and the eternal bliss guaranteed to the sincere believers are very beautifully mentioned in the following verses of the Holy Qur'an: "Until, when death comes to one of them, he says: 'O my Lord! Send me back (to life),- In order that I may work righteousness in the things I neglected.' - 'By no means! It is but a word he says.'- Before them is a Partition till the Day they are raised up. Then when the Trumpet is blown, there will be no more relationships between them that Day, nor will one ask after another! Then those whose balance (of good deeds) is heavy,- they will be successful: But those whose balance is light, will be those who have lost their souls, in Hell will they abide. The Fire will burn their faces, and they will therein grin, with their lips displaced." (23:99-104). the belief in life after death not only guarantees success in the Hereafter but also makes this world full of peace and happiness by making individuals most responsible and dutiful in their activities. think of the people of Arabia; gambling, wine, tribal feuds, plundering and murdering were their main traits when they had no belief in life after death. but as soon as they accepted the belief in the One God and life after death they became the most disciplined nation of the world. they gave up their vices, helped each other in hours of need, and settled all their disputes on the basis of justice and equality. Similarly the denial of life after death has its consequences not only in the Hereafter but also in this world. When a nation as a whole denies it, all kinds of evils and corruptions become rampant in that society and ultimately it is destroyed. The Quran mentions the terrible end of Àd, Thamüd and the Pharaoh in some detail: "The Thamüd and the Àd people disbelieved in the Day of Noise Calamity! But the Thamüd,- they were destroyed by a terrible Storm of thunder and lightning! And the Àd, they were destroyed by a furious wind, exceedingly violent; He made it rage against them seven nights and eight days in succession: so that thou couldst see the (whole) people lying overthrown in its (path), as if they had been roots of hollow palm- trees tumbled down! then seest thou any of them left surviving? and Pharaoh, and those before him, and the Cities Overthrown, committed habitual Sin. And disobeyed (each) the messenger of their Lord; so He punished them with an abundant Penalty. We, when the water (of Noah's Flood) overflowed beyond its limits, carried you (mankind), in the floating (Ark), That We might make it a Reminder unto you, and that ears (that should hear the tale and) retain its memory should bear its (lessons) in remembrance. then, when one blast is sounded on the Trumpet, And the earth is moved, and its mountains, and they are crushed at one stroke,- On that Day shall the (Great) Event come to pass. And the sky will be rent asunder, for it will that Day be flimsy, And the angels will be on its sides, and eight will, that Day, bear the Throne of thy Lord above them. That Day shall ye be brought to Judgment: not an act of yours that ye hide will be hidden. then he that will be given his Record in his right hand will say: 'Ah here! Read ye my Record! I did really think that my Account would (One Day) reach me!' And he will be in a life of Bliss, In a Garden on high, The Fruits whereof (will hang in bunches) low and near. Eat ye and drink ye, with full satisfaction; because of the (good) that ye sent before you, in the days that are gone! and he that will be given his Record in his left hand, will say: 'Ah! Would that my Record had not been given to me! And that I had never realized how my account (stood)! Ah! Would that (Death) had made an end of me! Of no profit to me has been my wealth! My power has perished from me!'... (The stern command will say): 'Seize ye him, and bind ye him, And burn ye him in the Blazing Fire. Further, insert him in a chain, whereof the length is seventy cubits! This was he that would not believe in Allah the Most High. And would not encourage the feeding of the indigent! So no friend hath he here this Day. Nor hath he any food except the foul pus from the washing of wounds, Which none do eat but those in sin.'" (69:4-39). thus there are very convincing reasons to believe in life after death. Firstly, all the prophets of God have called their people to believe in it. secondly, whenever a human society is built on the basis of this belief, it has been the most ideal and peaceful society, free of social and moral evils. thirdly, history bears witness that whenever this belief is rejected collectively by a group of people in spite of the repeated warning of the prophet, the group as a whole has been punished by God even in this world. fourthly, moral, aesthetic and rational faculties of man endorse the possibility of life after death. fifthly, God's attributes of Justice and Mercy have no meaning if there is no life after death."
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| | Sunday, November 19, 2000 - 11:27 am <Now forget the Samosas, can I meet your uncle instead? The superb intelligence you demonstrated on these pages clearly runs in the family. Did you show him these pages? I would love to meet him for a pint after Ramadhan, so that we can explore ways of making asad's ideas intelligible.> Galool, do I sense an 'I need help with Asad'. Don't forget I'm one of the "beardesses", just a lil nicer coz I've had a lot of expereince with your kind. You are still adorable though...:-) Asad, forget about my earlier comment about the "lols, smiles and galool's quoted msg"....You are truly adorable...:-)
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| | Sunday, November 19, 2000 - 11:57 am TLG You got that one right! Who doesn't need help with asad? Asad did you write that last posting? Can't believe it! a whole three consecutive paragraphs with not a quote in sight (except for Quranic ones) I will get myself a cup of tea and respond.
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| | Sunday, November 19, 2000 - 12:04 pm What a great discussion...I must admit coming here is more enjoyable than running regressions all day long. TLG: asad is Just Adorable...hmmmmmmmm :-)
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| | Sunday, November 19, 2000 - 12:04 pm "Asad, forget about my earlier comment about the "lols, smiles and galool's quoted msg"....You are truly adorable...:-)" lol----->truly adorable. ;-) "Asad did you write that last posting? Can't believe it! a whole three consecutive paragraphs with not a quote in sight (except for Quranic ones)." only the first paragraph; all others (including the Quranic ones) were quotes. ;-). did you see the " "? ;-) "I will get myself a cup of tea and respond." okay. ;-)
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| | Sunday, November 19, 2000 - 12:22 pm "Galool, do I sense an 'I need help with Asad'." "TLG You got that one right! Who doesn't need help with asad?" lol. i did not know that we are here to win or loose something?!!! ;-)
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| | Sunday, November 19, 2000 - 11:08 pm assalamu calaykum! bros and sisters! Thanks for the usefull information and at times opinions on the two questions I posed. Some of you were defensive, others went on the rampage, while most of you discussed this issue in a fashionable manner.. Well done and Allah bless you. BUT REMEMBER YOU HAVE TO HAVE THE JIHAD OF THE SOUL/MIND/BRAIN FIRST....Jihaad is not about taking a gun and firing.....So, let us as somalis start jihad by freeing ourselves from the ills of begging, lying, etc My second question regarded whether the west was a good place to be as a muslim. I got many answers albeit biased and demagogic answers. I have a friend of mine who I consider an authority on islamic social-living as saying that most of these western contries are actually "how a good muslim country should be"......I think it is unislamic and against human hospitality to hear comments about these countries. I think, the term country is a loose term, a political term. If u for instance live in canada, toronto, u r considered a canadian, living in a country called canada. But you might as well live in DIXON-country...an islamic estate...isn't dixon country not a muslim country?...I am sure people pray there and don't consume pork. It is unfortunate that most somalis, when debating such issues and others apply what some might term as "the right eye view"....and they only contribute to a bad image of an otherwise good religion... If only the west would have known of the position of islam on women, war and judgement day in a way that they understand, we would have been not locked upon as a war-mongerers (JIHAD*S DEFINATION according to west). So, i think it is every one's reponsibility to portray islam in a manner that befits the religion. Stop jumping to conclusions about things you don't know. differentiate between opinion and religious script. Don't quote one source, see things in a wider perspective and make sure you understand the society you live in. Thanks again for your opinions.......and I hope i did not make you bored with my commentaries. wa calaykum assalam
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| | Sunday, November 19, 2000 - 11:09 pm assalamu calaykum! bros and sisters! Thanks for the usefull information and at times opinions on the two questions I posed. Some of you were defensive, others went on the rampage, while most of you discussed this issue in a fashionable manner.. Well done and Allah bless you. BUT REMEMBER YOU HAVE TO HAVE THE JIHAD OF THE SOUL/MIND/BRAIN FIRST....Jihaad is not about taking a gun and firing.....So, let us as somalis start jihad by freeing ourselves from the ills of begging, lying, etc My second question regarded whether the west was a good place to be as a muslim. I got many answers albeit biased and demagogic answers. I have a friend of mine who I consider an authority on islamic social-living as saying that most of these western contries are actually "how a good muslim country should be"......I think it is unislamic and against human hospitality to hear comments about these countries. I think, the term country is a loose term, a political term. If u for instance live in canada, toronto, u r considered a canadian, living in a country called canada. But you might as well live in DIXON-country...an islamic estate...isn't dixon country not a muslim country?...I am sure people pray there and don't consume pork. It is unfortunate that most somalis, when debating such issues and others apply what some might term as "the right eye view"....and they only contribute to a bad image of an otherwise good religion... If only the west would have known of the position of islam on women, war and judgement day in a way that they understand, we would have been not looked upon as a war-mongerers (JIHAD*S DEFINATION according to west). So, i think it is every one's reponsibility to portray islam in a manner that befits the religion. Stop jumping to conclusions about things you don't know. differentiate between opinion and religious script. Don't quote one source, see things in a wider perspective and make sure you understand the society you live in. Thanks again for your opinions.......and I hope i did not make you bored with my commentaries. wa calaykum assalam
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| | Monday, November 20, 2000 - 01:22 am <TLG: asad is Just Adorable...hmmmmmmmm :-) > salaam, Hakima sis, why are u such an instigator? :-). Now tht you mention, he is other things too and I would have smoked him if it wasn't for two things: 1. The "beards/beardesses" (Galool, 2000, lest i'm accused of plagiarism) have to stick together 2. He is keeping Galool in check, busy, etc. so, as long as these two parameters stand, i'll "forever hold my peace". Asad: you are still adorable, akhee al azeez :-) Wanaagsane, good to see ya my somali cousin...:-) Salaam.
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| | Monday, November 20, 2000 - 01:46 am lol @ TLG Sis, did i or did i mention that you are a very intelligent and higly diplomatic. Now you are the Adorable :-) peace...
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| | Monday, November 20, 2000 - 03:03 am Oh dear i did not realase you were marking the papers. If I tell boss I got this bad mark he will sack me. You guys at least give me a pass mark! I must go, you see my time does not even allow me to write
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| | Monday, November 20, 2000 - 03:11 am arawelo !! what????????who is marking the papers and what paper??????????????
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| | Monday, November 20, 2000 - 06:16 am Apperantly what is clear from Galols point of view, is total denial of verses in the Holy Koran and countless prophetic traditon that has been mentioned in great details regarding the Jihad. The jihad is obliged on us by the shariah and who rejecs that legal injuction is unbeliever. for that reason I have to declare with confidence and without reservation that Galol has departed from the fold of Islam, by contradicting the Holy koran and the tradition of the prophet(scw). According to the prevailing evidence, Galol has an unbelief tendancy and that is supported by overwhelming prove from the shariah and accepted by all muslims. This confused person should know that leaving Islam is the ugliest form of unbelief and worst. If you carefully observe the last lines of his opening statement you will find that his word imply a total kufr. secondly he offended our prophet by suggesting that he was influenced by his uncle Hamza(RAA) on the Jihad Matters. And we know that the prophet (SAW) is only inpired by the revelation. To prove my point, share with me a verse from Holy koran. Allan Almighty says, "your companion(MOHAMMAD) has niether gone stray nor has erred. Nor does he speak of (his own desire. It is only revelation revealed". to be continued,
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| | Monday, November 20, 2000 - 07:10 am "Now tht you mention, he is other things too and I would have smoked him if it wasn't for two things" i'm not here to be adored or to be affronted; i do not take anything people throw at me serious--the smoking or the smoothing.. i'll still laugh at them. ;-) 1. The "beards/beardesses" (Galool, 2000, lest i'm accused of plagiarism) have to stick together. He is keeping Galool in check, busy, etc."" lol------>stick together. ;-). i do not think it is possible to see who is wearing beard and who is not on here (the faces of people----including the anonymous usernames) i see what is written on here and i'm here to point out discrepencies by anybody and i do not discriminate. ;-) "so, as long as these two parameters stand, i'll "forever hold my peace". till death does apart. ;-) "Asad: you are still adorable, akhee al azeez :-)" lol
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| | Monday, November 20, 2000 - 07:39 am "BUT REMEMBER YOU HAVE TO HAVE THE JIHAD OF THE SOUL/MIND/BRAIN FIRST" that is right. ;-) "Jihaad is not about taking a gun and firing" that is wrong. ;-) taking a gun and firing at the enemy who fights you is part of jihad too. ;-) "So, let us as somalis start jihad by freeing ourselves from the ills of begging, lying, etc" okay. ;-) "My second question regarded whether the west was a good place to be as a muslim. I got many answers albeit biased and demagogic answers." that is very funny.....you asked question and you get answers you do not like; then you call that biased and demagogic answers. ;-). if you do know the answers already, why would you ask the question? ;-) "I have a friend of mine who I consider an authority on islamic social-living" lol------>who i condiser an authority on islamic social-living. ;-) "as saying that most of these western contries are actually "how a good muslim country should be" really. if that is the case, somalia is how a muslim country should be, right? ;-) "I think it is unislamic and against human hospitality to hear comments about these countries." that is funny. do you want people (muslims) to accept everything that is in america and compromise their beliefs? again, have you heard the saying goes like this: 'haddii la dhimanaayo dhareeka waa la iska duwaa'. it is not only the muslims who are complaining about some of the culture trends in america. every group who comes here (from any religion or race) tell what they like here and what they do not like here. just because you come to america does not mean you have to accept and love everything you see. america belongs to Allah. it does not belong to the christian or to the jews. i see the jews and christians opening private religious schools and taking their kids away from public schools. when the muslims do similar things, they are accused of hating the american system. ;-) if someone owns america, it is the native americans who live in refugee camps in america. ;-) "Thanks again for your opinions.......and I hope i did not make you bored with my commentaries." how about if someone returns you the favor and says to you also that your comments were also defensive--albeit biased and demagogic? ;-)
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| | Monday, November 20, 2000 - 07:47 am You know Plato says that the man who is truly most just, will appear unjust will being just..and the most unjust will appear just while being very unjust. just some food for thought folk. To he adorable people.. <smile> you keep on being adorable.. Allah(swt) loves the beauty makers.. now comeone everyone crack a smile for me.... comeone.. you know you can do it ..show those muslim teeth to the world.. there you go wasn't so hard was it..smile at the kuffar.. its an act of charity..but not those fake smiles.. lol.. sometimes the smiles have disappeared of their faces while i am still saying hello and its contagious and i end up doing it too..as muslims lets stay tight like a hug, while they fake like a smile. TGL.. okay i won't be hard on Galool, he can handle himself.. the brother cuts me down to size all the time, he says things like i hang on to the trouser tails of every whitey that joins in Islam, and that i am an emotional cripple and that i make smoke bombs.. chuckle.. he has his fair share of digs, they are pleasantly arranged though.. so it is a pleasure reading them. he is like those people, you meet at government offices, that spend so much time rehresing their "i can't help you attitute" even though they probably can if they listen. Or like my denist in my ghetto area, who acts like a vet and i am an animal by proforming major surgery on me, without previous consultaion..i have to jump out of the chair and say "okay.?.. what are you planning to do with that mean looking thing?".. or like my Doctor in my ghetto area, when i asked her how i got my illness, she was so bored, she looked up at me and said "through contact". Galool is this people man.lol. one love
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| | Monday, November 20, 2000 - 07:52 am Arawelo :-) I wish one day, you will be kind to me and explain what your nick means. "till death does apart" lol-----> death does apart. peace...
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| | Monday, November 20, 2000 - 08:22 am "You know Plato says that the man who is truly most just, will appear unjust will being just..and the most unjust will appear just while being very unjust. just some food for thought folk." lol, i hope he (plato) was not talking about what goes on here (where appearance does not matter because we are not here to win or loose anything) i'm sure you are not here (as i'm not here) to appear what you are not. i mean, i'm not here to be adored and seen as a good judge, are you, common? ;-) "now comeone everyone crack a smile for me.... comeone.. you know you can do it ..show those muslim teeth to the world.. there you go wasn't so hard was it..smile at the kuffar.. its an act of charity..but not those fake smiles.. lol.." this is very funny.....i wonder if one can tell if a smile is a fake or not (what is in the heart of a person).! "sometimes the smiles have disappeared of their faces while i am still saying hello and its contagious and i end up doing it too..as muslims lets stay tight like a hug, while they fake like a smile." lol------->while they fake like a smile. ;-) a wise man once said that DANA (a suspicion) is the twin sister of pretense (fakeness). i mean, are you in the heart of a people and can tell what is fake and what is not fake? ;-)
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| | Monday, November 20, 2000 - 08:23 am Hakimo, It is my real name to be honest with you. You know the other day I found out how to use the chat line. The first pearson who answered asked me whehtre I am going to eat him. I do not know poeple always say s.th about my name. Why do you ask me. Why not take part in the discussion.
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| | Monday, November 20, 2000 - 08:39 am Salaams: <You know Plato says that the man who is truly most just, will appear unjust will being just..and the most unjust will appear just while being very unjust> Common: good to see ya :-), I know assumptions are desliked in Islaam but I'll assume the two men are you and Galool...the former being you and the later being Galool :-) Do you remember the story of the woman who used to harrass (wrong spelling?) the prophet (PBUH)? It is said that all of a sudden, she stopped. Now, you would think that the prophet(Pbuh) would be happy. Instead, he goes to visit her, inquiring about her...'I don't see you anymore and I was wondering if you are well'...to the end of the story. The point being, we have to be nice, merciful and the better ones in this ordeal. I know the other party is not a saint either...lol..galool, u still an adorable oldman Common, so are you:-)minus the old part. <...i do not take anything people throw at me serious--the smoking or the smoothing..> Asad: Is this a go ahead for me to smoke you :-) If so, I'll start with your response to wanaagsane (my somali cousin). Hakima: Do you think Ishould spare him? thanks for the compliment by the way....if u were not an instigator, you would be adorable too :-) <i do not think it is possible to see who is wearing beard and who is not on here> I didn't coin the term, didn't u see the reference? :-) You still adorable akhee :-) Qonsade: wlc back...good to see ya..however, I would sincerely say we should refrain from calling anyone a kaafir. Remember the beleif is affirming the shahada in your heart and testifying it with your mouth. We can't get into galools heart...need I say more? Remember the story where the sahabas (I can't remember who) capture some men... just when they were about to kill them, the men declare the shahada... one sahabi says that they just declared to avoid being killed and therefore they should go ahead and kill them. This reached the prophet peace be upon him where he said " I have not been sent to cut up and open peoples hearts" And as always, allahu a'lam. salaam.
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| | Monday, November 20, 2000 - 08:51 am "<..i do not take anything people throw at me serious--the smoking or the smoothing..> Asad: Is this a go ahead for me to smoke you :-) Hakima: Do you think I should spare him?" yes, as i said, i do not take things seriously that is thrown at me (good or bad). remember, i said "i do not think it is possible to see who is wearing beard and who is not on here (the faces of people----including the anonymous usernames) i see what is written on here and i'm here to point out discrepencies by anybody and i do not discriminate.", so by any means, you can disagree with me and point out what you think is discripency made by me. you can choose to not hold your peace forever. be my guest to smoke me. ;-) "<i do not think it is possible to see who is wearing beard and who is not on here> I didn't coin the term, didn't u see the reference? :-) You still adorable akhee :-)" lol "If so, I'll start with your response to wanaagsane (my somali cousin)." go ahead, then. ;-)
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| | Monday, November 20, 2000 - 09:22 am -------till death does apart--------- "lol-----> death does apart." for good or bad; for better or worst, do you take me as one of your forums commentaries? i do. ;-)
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| | Monday, November 20, 2000 - 09:34 am Dearest Arawelo, Just curious. I have heard several stories of a person called Arawello. I was wondering what you gonna tell me.I don't have that much time...whenever i need something from the net i just see what u guys post. The semeter is about to end...n am trying to meet my deadlines. TLG: Me an instigator!!! Okay girl. Be my guest. Smoke as much as u can my adorable sis. peace...
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| | Monday, November 20, 2000 - 09:36 am lol @ asad. Now my smile was for real..even the guy next to me looked at me LOL PEACE...
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| | Monday, November 20, 2000 - 09:52 am TBG the plato thing.. was a reference to asad.. nothing to do with galool people inculding myself have thought him unjust, so i was flipping the coin, just thinking outloud the rest of the message pertained to galool
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| | Monday, November 20, 2000 - 09:59 am "TBG the plato thing.. was a reference to asad.. nothing to do with galool people inculding myself have thought him unjust, so i was flipping the coin, just thinking outloud" and appropriately retorted to the reference and said while laughing this: "i hope he (plato) was not talking about what goes on here (where appearance does not matter because we are not here to win or loose anything) i'm sure you(common) are not here (as i'm not here) to appear what you are not. i mean, i'm not here to be adored and seen as a good judge, are you, common? ;-) so, i still wonder if one (common) can tell if a smile is fake or not (what is in the heart of a person)? ;-)
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| | Monday, November 20, 2000 - 10:43 am Qoonsade Thanks for shortening your username. Its' still, may I say, menacing. This does not reflect well on your faith. Suspicion is not a good trait. Remember that the Prophet said " Don't suspect each other as some suspicion is Sin". Yet you take "the suspecting one" as your name! You accused me of being a `Kaffir', whatever that means (in apartheid South Africa it meant Black) By doing so you inadvertently played God. May I suggest to you that you have no authority to judge God's creatures. You asserted that the Prophet never erred. I beg to disagree. The Prophet was human, of flesh and blood and he certainly made mistakes as the Quran once clearly mentioned. (Abbasa wa tawallaa, in Jaa'ahul a'amaa..) One of the most endearing things about Islam, to me at least, is the clarity of the Prophet's humanness (unlike Christianity and Judaism where the concept of God and Man often entertwine into a haze of confusion) Your argument seems to be implicitly challenging this, as "to err is Human". Only God never makes mistakes. May I point out to you another mistake which the Prophet made. It is a military and tactical one this time. Just before the battle of uhud, a unit of muslim fighters were left behind a cleft of a mountain to protect an exposed flank. The Prophet said to the fighters " Ihmuu duhuuranaa. Idhaa ra'aytamuuna nihzam falaa tanszaruunaa, wa idhaa ra'aytamouna nighnam falaa tashaarakounaa". For non-Arabic speakers, this roughly translates as "Protect our backs. If you see us being defeated, don't come to our aid, and if you see us looting (winning) you don't share the booty with us". This proved to be disasterous, and the prophet almost lost his life as a result. The unit saw the prophet's troops winning, and then rushed to claim their share of the booty. A pagan group, led by the then non-muslim Khalid bin Waleed, attacked the muslims from the abandoned flank and almost decimated them. I can give you many more such totally human mistakes the prophet have made, but I fear you may not be intellectually in a state to accept them, as you are in eternal "suspicion" of everything. May Allah widen your mind and cleanse it of all "Qoonsi". Common Whatever happened to FG? Has he fallen victim to asadian, you know what(yawn)? Asad Can you cut down on the word "discrepencies"? You so over-used it, it is at serious risk of dying young! And who was talking about winning and losing? I needed assistance in navigating your postings in a bid to fish out your ideas from the sea of quotes, unqoutes, discrepencies, don't-tell-me-what-to-dos and winners and losers!
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| | Monday, November 20, 2000 - 11:29 am "May I point out to you another mistake which the Prophet made. It is a military and tactical one this time. Just before the battle of uhud, a unit of muslim fighters were left behind a cleft of a mountain to protect an exposed flank. The Prophet said to the fighters " Ihmuu duhuuranaa. Idhaa ra'aytamuuna nihzam falaa tanszaruunaa, wa idhaa ra'aytamouna nighnam falaa tashaarakounaa". For non-Arabic speakers, this roughly translates as "Protect our backs. If you see us being defeated, don't come to our aid, and if you see us looting (winning) you don't share the booty with us" This proved to be disasterous, and the prophet almost lost his life as a result. The unit saw the prophet's troops winning, and then rushed to claim their share of the booty. A pagan group, led by the then non-muslim Khalid bin Waleed, attacked the muslims from the abandoned flank and almost decimated them.." this is another galool's funny *his story* or lies about the what had happened and was said to the prophet and by the prophet. ;-) galool says "if you see us looting (winning), yo don't share the booty with us" as if the fight was about not self-defence and protecting the faith, but winning booty. ;-) the fact is that the prophet never claimed to have been a tactical in the military. in fact, the prophet let a sahabi by the name of salaman farsi who was skillfully good at military tactical do the preparations when some of the other sahaabas suggested to the prophet that the muslims should go out of madinah and urged him to accept their point of view. after weighing carefull the pros and cons of the issue, it was decided that the enemy (the pagan arabs) should be resisted outside the city at uhud. the prophet moblized his army. he arranged them into two raws to prepare them for defense and fight. here is what he said to them in arabic "axmaluu duhuranaa fain rayutumunaa nuqtalu falaa tansuruna, ain ra'atumunaa qad qanimnaa falaa-tashri-kunaa" which means "defend out backs; if you see us slain. do not come to assist us; and if you see gaining grounds, do not share us" he also added this: "in ra'aytumuunaa taqtuluunaa taqdifunaa dayru falaatabaraxuu makanakum hadaa xataa ursila ilaykum wain raytumunaa hasamnaa alqawma wa wadanaahum falatabaraxuu xataa ursila ilaykum" which means "if you see us snatched into pieces by births, do not leave this position of yours til i send for you. and if you see that we have defeated the enemy and troden on them do no desert your position till i send for you" later when the enemy (the pagan arabs) attacked the muslims, the muslims were getting the upper hand, but some of the muslims left their position and disobey the prophet's order and thought the war was over in order to get some of the booty (the enemies possessions), the enemy come down from the abadoned position and became winners against the muslims. while the small army of islam were recording the second absolute and clear victory over the pagan arabs, some of the muslims committed a fatal mistake that turned the whole situation upside down. incidently, the prophet got injury and asad (the loin) was killed in this fight. however, the genius of the prophet, his peerless and matchless courage and those who did not disobey him made opt for the second course. then, the muslims maintainted full control over the whole situation on the battlefield. read surah 3:128 and the real history, galool. ;-) later,the prophet said in prayer. "O Allah, forgive my people for they have no knowledge" three times for the mistakes they made in disobeying his orders that made uhad bad. "I can give you many more such totally human mistakes the prophet have made, but I fear you may not be intellectually in a state to accept them, as you are in eternal "suspicion" of everything. May Allah widen your mind and cleanse it of all "Qoonsi". first, the prophet did not make mistake in uhud, socond, when and if the prophet made mistakes, these are not sins. ;-) "Common Whatever happened to FG? Has he fallen victim to asadian, you know what(yawn)?" lol---->you know what(yawn). ;-) "Asad Can you cut down on the word "discrepencies"?" how many times do i have to tell you that i do not listen to orders? ;-) "You so over-used it, it is at serious risk of dying young!" lol "And who was talking about winning and losing? I needed assistance in navigating your postings in a bid to fish out your ideas from the sea of quotes, unqoutes, discrepencies, don't-tell-me-what-to-dos and winners and losers!" lol
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| | Monday, November 20, 2000 - 11:33 am lol @ Galool, yaa ragel maadaama enak tacrif al-louqa al-carabia, limaza qoult ina ana sababtak laamaa katabtou bel-carabi!!! U Double Face. Back to your version of the story telling of the battle of uhud. Dear, Galool, i never recall seeing that comment which you have just referred that our beloved prophet (pbuh). I agree that the battle of uhud was a strong defeat for the muslims and that even the prophet's uncle got killed and the prophet got hurt but certainly the defeat wasn't because of the prophet's military tactics. It was because those fighters (al-rumha) that were supposed to protect the army's back thought the muslims were winning so the left their positions, n when the enemy saw that the al-rumaha were busy collecting the ghanima (booty)...they (the enemy) attacked the muslims and the won the battle. Please, next time when u try to invent new history...know that there are others who very well know their islamic history. Maashi Galool :-) peace...
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| | Monday, November 20, 2000 - 11:39 am hey asad, i have just seen ur post. 10 over 10... abti....i didn't know u had all that knowledge ... :-) peace...
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| | Monday, November 20, 2000 - 12:44 pm hakima, it is funny that you said to galooo "U Double Face.". ;-) i thought i was the only one who noticed this. i know what you mean by "double faced" and the funny thing is that when galool's atheist monotonous didn't get him no where, he turned into a preacher all of a sudden and singing another tune by saying this like these: "May I suggest to you that you have no authority to judge God's creatures"---"Suspicion is not a good trait. Remember that the Prophet said " Don't suspect each other as some suspicion is Sin". Yet you take "the suspecting one" as your name!"---- "Only God never makes mistakes". ;-) "hey asad, i have just seen ur post. 10 over 10... abti....i didn't know u had all that knowledge ... :-)" i'm just pointing out obvoius like you did---the discrepancies made by galool. i do not know that much, but i do know some of the things galool says about islam are distorted *his story* that are known to come out from the likes of him. as if the muslims do not read the real history of islam, here galool comes once a while making himself look bad. ;-). someone has to correct him sooner or later and you did it too. ;-)
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| | Monday, November 20, 2000 - 01:09 pm Asad and Hakima, all I can say is,YOU GUYS ARE EXTREMELY ADORABLE :-) masha allah, may Allah increase you in goodness in this world and in the hereafter. Galool, i'm not given up on you yet, awoow (grandpa, is that how it is written in somali?) you are still adorable...:-)
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| | Monday, November 20, 2000 - 01:14 pm Common, why do u call me TBG?
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| | Monday, November 20, 2000 - 01:51 pm i hate to do mistakes when i m in a rush. I think i said that the prophet's uncle was killed in Uhud. Hamza was killed in battle of al-ahzab. What we learn from Uhud is that muslims should stick together and obey their leader as long as he is a just. In Uhud, Allah could have made the muslims win easily but that was a lesson for them for disobeying the prophet (pbuh). Asad: who is the asad that u were talking about? can u please refresh my memory? TLG: girl stick on something...do u want to smoke me or praise me...(just kidding sis). May Allah guide you to his ultimate truth...amiin :-) Arowello: "he asked whether you gonna eat him" I hope u said yes...lol...ppl like those get into my nerve :-( peace...
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| | Monday, November 20, 2000 - 01:56 pm khalid Bin Waleed---> when he became a muslim, he was nicked Seef Allah al-maaslool---> he was exremely a great muslim warrior. peace...
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| | Monday, November 20, 2000 - 03:55 pm "i hate to do mistakes when i m in a rush. I think i said that the prophet's uncle was killed in Uhud. Hamza was killed in battle of al-ahzab.---Asad: who is the asad that u were talking about? can u please refresh my memory?" hakima, i think you did not rush and did not make mistake. you were right at first when you said it was the prophet's uncle that was killed in uhud. the name asadul-Allah (the lion of Allah) hamza bin abdul-mutalib was the prophet's uncle who was killed on the battlefield of uhad. hamza's assasin, wahshi bin harb, described how he killed hamza. he said: "i was a slave working to jubair bin mutim (a pagan arab), whose paternal uncle tu'aimah bin adi was injured at badar battle. so when quraish marched to uhad, jubair said to me: "if you kill hamza (asad), the uncle of muhammad, stealthily you shall be manumitted. so i marched with the people to uhad (wahshi used to describe himself as "i'm a picaro good at spearing"  so when the two parties fought, i set out seeking hamza. i saw him amidst people. he was like a white and black striped camel, striking severely with his sward and no one could stand on his way. when i was gettting ready and trying to seize the fit opportunity to spear him, hiding sometimes behind a tree or a rock hoping that he might draw nearer and be within rage----at that moment i cought sight of siba'bin'abd'al-uzza going closer toward him. when hamza observed him, he said: "come on!, o son of the 'clitoris cutter'---for his mother used to be a circumciser. then he struck on stong stroke that could hardly miss his head. then i balanced my spear and shook it till i was content with it, then i speared him and it went down into his smomach and issued out between his legs. he attempted moving towards me but he was overcome by his wound. i left him there with a spear in his entrails till he deid. i stayed there and did not go out, fo rhe was the only one i sought. i only killed to free myself. so as soon as i got back to makkah, i became a free man" albukhari 2/583). hamza bin abdul muttalib displayed wonderful feats of gallantry against the overwhelming odds which stood unparalled and created consternation and confusion in the disbelieving hosts. heroes dspersed off his way as if htey had been tree-leaves blown away by stond wind. in additon to his effective contribution to the annihilation of the idolaters who stood in defence of the standard, he was even of much greater effect at fighting against men of bravery and disinguished horsmen. it was Allah's Will tha the be murdered when he was at the top. he was not killed in a face-to-face fight on the battlefield of uhad---in the normal way by which heroes die---but rather assassinated in the dead-dark as was the custom o killing generous and noble men that were impossible to kill in an honourable fight."
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| | Monday, November 20, 2000 - 04:56 pm "What we learn from Uhud is that muslims should stick together and obey their leader as long as he is a just. In Uhud, Allah could have made the muslims win easily but that was a lesson for them for disobeying the prophet (pbuh)." you are right, hakima, the lessons and moralities in uhud is this: "the reverse in uhud resulted from the neglect on the part of the archers of the explicit command of the prophet and leaving the spot which they were ordered to safeguard to the end. in other words, the success of the muslims depends upon their obedience to the prophet. as long as they carry out his behests, Allah will help them in facing all kinds of odds. but when they will set aside his commands in their pursuit of worldly riches, they are bound to come to grief. another releant issue of great significance says that it is customary for the prophets to be tried with different adversities; nevertheless, the final outcome is positively in their favour. should the muslims be victorious all the time, great many pretenders to faith will enter the fold of islam, and consequently the clear line of demarcation between true believers and hypocrites will become blurred. contrarily, if the muslims were to be defeated all the time, the final objective of the ministry of the prophets will not be effected. it is wise then to combine both success and failure so that sifting between true muslims and hypocrites could be realized. in the aftermath of the battle of uhud, the hypocrites disclosed their real intentions in words and in deeds, consequently, the muslims got to realize the existence of those wicked elements working secretly in their own homeland; and of course there would be appropriate measures to be taken in due course of time. a third point in this context refers to purposeful deferment of victory in some areas in order to check the prife of the soul and teach the believers how to observe full patience in times of adversity. trails and tests are provided by Allah in order that the true believers could deservedly occupy their abode in the blessed hereafter. martyrdom, the hightest rands that the true friends of Allah could occupy, is provided by Allah to function as a passport, granted by the Lord, leading to paradise. in brief, fight n the cause of Allah is a golden opportunity for the true believers to have their sins effected, and a divinely-devised event for the disbeleivers and enemies of Allah to face destruction and annihilation in recompense for their dsbelief, tyranny and transgression"
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| | Monday, November 20, 2000 - 06:32 pm Wow...asad...this is the second time i m thanking you. Thank You. I thought the stupid economics that i m putting in my mind deleted the things i cherish the most. peace...
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| | Monday, November 20, 2000 - 10:38 pm assalamu calaykum! Asad: Stop being defensive in your replies.....and stop labeling people atheists. You are doing more harm than good. You accused me of having asked a question, to which i already knew the answer. You are right, I had an opinion about the issue I asked, but i wanted to hear from others. Is that a crime?...For your information, I had a layman opinion but was seeking an expert opinion. why can't you adress an issue without attacking someone, or at least quote the person in a fair way. What makes only your standpoint right?.....Don't defend the undefensables, such as ppl living on social welfare while at the same time talking ill about their host countries. Common and former guest: Splended: Your replies have some factual weights. You quote from the source of knowledge...thank you TLG/hakiima : nice comments, but remember the word adorable is a word of relativness........what is deemed adorable by someone can be deemed sickening by others ...LOL MAY ALLAH BLESS YOU ALL YOU AND HAPPY RAMADAN: p.s I hated to be quoted......Lol
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 12:01 am "Asad: Stop being defensive in your replies" first, you know i'm not going to take orders; second, looks like you are the one who is being defensive here. ;-) "and stop labeling people atheists." you know i do not take orders. do you also know that it is galool who is the one labeled himself to be an atheist here---when he told us that he did not believe the creation of human being by Allah (God)? ;-). galool also told us that when he dies, he will not face judgement (he said he does not believe the creation of hell or heaven). ;-). read again what galool (the atheist) said on this thread for youself on Sunday, November 19, 2000 - 11:13 am. ;-) "You are doing more harm than good." fyi, i'm not here to harm nor help anyone; on here, i can not help anyone. i'm here to point out things that are written by people, just like you are doing. the difference between you and i is that when i point out things, i do not get mad, defensive, and i do not order people as you are doing. ;-) "You accused me of having asked a question, to which i already knew the answer." i did not accuse you of anything. i just returned the favor and said the same things you said about the people on here, but the difference between your comments and mine is that i asked you a question by saying-----how about if someone returns you the favor and says to you also that your comments were also defensive--albeit biased and demagogic? ;-) ;-) "You are right, I had an opinion about the issue I asked, but i wanted to hear from others. Is that a crime?" i did not say you committed a crime. you said you "got many answers albeit biased and demagogic answers.". i said that was very funny.....you asked question and you get answers you did not like; then, you said the answers are "biased and demagogic answers. ;-). then, i asked you a question by saying "if you do know the answers already, why would you ask the question?" ;-) "For your information, I had a layman opinion but was seeking an expert opinion." i think everyone's got an opinion here. if you do not like someone's opinion and then you get defensive, that is your problem. ;-). no one is claiming here to be an expert in their opinion about the question you asked. ;-) "why can't you adress an issue without attacking someone" i did not attack you; i just happened to address the issues in a different way than you address, but you think when i address the issues, i'm attacking you. ;-) "or at least quote the person in a fair way." can you show me where i mis-quoted you or anybody here? ;-) "What makes only your standpoint right?" i did not say my stanpoint is right; however, it is up to you to proof that my standpoint is wrong. ;-) "Don't defend the undefensables, such as ppl living on social welfare while at the same time talking ill about their host countries." i did not defend anybody. i told you that *giving* is better than *receiving*. and fyi, the somalis are not the only ones talking ill about their host countries. everyone who comes to america from any country (be a jew, christian, muslim or whatever) has somethings which he or she likes or dislikes about this country. when the somalis want to preserve their culture and religion (for example) when they want to take out their kids out of public schools and place them in religious private schools (because some of the social ills in some of the public schools), the somalis are looked at as hating america, that is not true. however, when the jews, the christins and other ethnic people do the same things for the same reasons, it is okay. ;-). by the way, wanaagsane, do you know that there are more somalis who *give* (money) than *receive* money to the united states of america (the government)? even some of the tax money the somalis worked hard are *given* to every walfare receiving people living in america, included some of the whites/black americans and others. even some of the money goes to the refugee camps the americans (whites) built for the native american in this country, the real hosts. ;-) "p.s I hated to be quoted" i think you will get used to it. ;-)
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 02:15 am <fyi, i'm not here to harm nor help anyone; > Then why are you here? Remember actions will be judged according to intention. You are still adorable :-)
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 03:05 am <fyi, i'm not here to harm nor help anyone; > "Then why are you here? Remember actions will be judged according to intention. You are still adorable :-)" i think i already said it before many time on here that i'm here to voice my opinion---just like everyone else------so pointing out things does not make me a harmful or helpful person. i mean, my intentions of coming here is not to harm nor please people. i'm not here to win or loose anything either. if people do not want anyone pointing out their discrepancies and it is harmful for them when people point out their mistakes, then that is their problems. ;-). if people find me adorable, that is their choice and if they find me to be harmful, that is their choice too. ;-) i'm not here to be adored nor to be hated. ;-). as they say, "if you can not handle the heat, get out of the kitchen", right? ;-). for me, i can dish out as well as take the humorous jibes as well as insults aimed at me, but i do not resort to insult. though, i laugh at those who think insults will win something. ;-)
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 06:25 am wanaagsane: okay...i'll restrict using that word :-) asad: i was just wondering...if u remember the first division in our islamic history was political when al-khawarij refused to listen the orders of Ali bin Talib against his war with Abu-Sufyan. My question is why muslims drifted from politics to the usage of religion as a means for obtaining and justifying their goals? What i am pointing at is the existence of so many islamic sects...(ex: shic'a, al-ismaciliya...etc). peace...
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 07:34 am <TLG: girl stick on something...do u want to smoke me or praise me...(just kidding sis). May Allah guide you to his ultimate truth...amiin :-) > Hakima, smoke you? never? remember us sisters have to stick together...girl power! By the way, have you visited the islamic poems's folder? Asad, man...i'm disapointed though I know u don't care :-) I was hoping you are atleast here to help. You are still adorable :-)
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 07:37 am <sad: i was just wondering...if u remember the first division in our islamic history was political when al-khawarij refused to listen the orders of Ali bin Talib against his war with Abu-Sufyan.> I thought his war was with Muawiyah...I could be wrong, I learned my Islamic history from Western sources...
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 07:48 am yes, Muwaiya Ibn Abi Sufyan
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 07:54 am TLG: yes, i have seen the poem that u posted. I am looking for one now...i know it is somewhere but the question of my daily life nowadays become Where??? i keep on forgeting things. I think Age is showing its signs...lol peace...
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 08:27 am Okey, ' I am not here to please anyone nor to harm anyone' By Asad. I think that is good and lets take from there. Certainly, I do not have time to be a doplematic. I address my comment to the person I agree or disagree anything else I think it is a bit childess ( no offence). Remember we do not know each other , just show your personalities. ( no offence) Okey I think I addressed some questions to Wanagsane but did not get any reply. Do not worry, I will go over again. Well, I agree we Muslims misrepresent Islam ( we are doing here as well) But do you really think West do not know the fact of Islam. Or there are other factors you need to mention. Then ask why? About Muslim countries : According Today's world politics there are many countries that will fall under the defintion of Islamic countries. But I personally think there are the difference of saying between an Islamic country and a muslim country. A country should be an islamic country when the Islamic Sharia is fully applied , at the best possible. A muslim country, it shpould be where the majority of the poeple are the followers of Islam. In my understanding of the today's muslim world they are muslim countries but not islamic countries. I think unless we differentiate the two meanings we will fall the danger to calling Iraq Islamic country. I think we would like others to understand our points( not necessarily agreeing) so, if may I ask you could you give me an example, what you mean we should make sure the society that we live in understands us. And my big question WHY ASK '' DO WE HAVE SUCH SCHOLARS' explanation my brother, do not leave me wondering what the hell that was meant. My point to Galool. I think you assume we fallow Islam blindness or may be we are Muslim born. I do not have my scarf proberly, but soon Insha Allah will do. But everyway possible I look at Islam satisfies me. If I share with you race and nation please, put the majority first, and see Islam the only possible way they can re-built Somalia. If you stop looking Islam as a religion but as an Idiology, you will find out how it is well suited for a personal development. My point here is, if The Somalis apply Islam within themselves, we will find a health society. I think evrything else follows that. When I read some of your commonts, it reminds me when I went with my cousin a somali conference. I had Hijab. I sit next to two somali ladies who I think were about in thier 40's . I said salaams, the look they gave me was what are you doing here. They were not that many women nayway. A few minutes latter they start il-talking about women and Islam, and how bad it is. They were telling all these to an American guy. They made me I am stupid. I did not say anything. But you know I was thinking these poeple do not know what they are atlking about. First they do not know me, and it was me who was struggling to get my rights in the west without my scarf. ( do not get me wrong I appretiate living here as much as you do! ) but there are many things I am looking for. Do you as a Somaliman ever pose a question and say okey I like that but I do not like that despite of your opinion on Islam. To Hakima, We know the answer, remember the Prophet pbuh told us about it. about the chatline' I longoff' cuz i was not expecting men to be there, it was women's section.
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 08:35 am TLG sorry for rearanging the letters in your name, it was stictly a mistake..no mackeveilli type stuff . peace ja zaku allahu kahr all one love
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 09:19 am "Asad, man...i'm disapointed though I know u don't care :-) I was hoping you are atleast here to help. You are still adorable :-)" welcome to the party---where i am the one who disappointed so many people here. since my intention here is not to hurt or please people, i also do not care because i know i have no contral of how people feel about things that is written on here. unlike the other people, i do not take things here seriously, even if i'm called an adorable person or a harmful person. ;-)
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 09:44 am "My question is why muslims drifted from politics to the usage of religion as a means for obtaining and justifying their goals? What i am pointing at is the existence of so many islamic sects...(ex: shic'a, al-ismaciliya...etc)." al munaafiqiin (the hypocrites) who called themselves muslims were always there, even during the prophet's time. they created and still create divisions between the muslims. if you do not follow the prophet's teaching, you will continue to drift from the right course. like the kufars (pagans, jews, christians) the hypocrites among the muslims will continue to do their things. they will fight you; kill you; trick you; that is why they are even worst than the kufars. but as long as you stick to the teachings of the prophet, you will succeed against them. ;-)
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 09:44 am <When I read some of your commonts, it reminds me when I went with mycousin a somali conference. I had Hijab. I sit next to two somali ladies who I think were about in thier 40's . I said salaams, the look they gave me was what are you doing here. They were not that many women nayway. A few minutes latter they start il-talking about women and Islam, and how bad it is. They were telling all these to an American guy. They made me I am stupid. I did not say anything.> Arawello sis, I totally understand what you are saying. As muslims, we often suffer from an inferiority complex. And this is due to our continuous look on the West as superior to us. We borrow anything and everything from them. Even their prejudices against us!
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 10:08 am asad: 1)are u calling that al-khawarig were munafiqeen? 2)it is not true that u don't care otherwise u wouldn't have been here defending Islam against its enemies. 3)i think u r serious...n it is so clear from the tone of ur writtings. Sometimes, i just can hear your shoutings...lol Common: i noticed the other day that u mentioned Simone de Beauvoir!...is she good as a philosopher? all i know about her is that she was the girlfriend of Satre...n i think he is nuts! TLG: 1)muslims suffer from inferiority complex...hmmm. I think the other way round. 2)What do u think of Muwaiya as a leader? 3)do u know how to read quran in just a minute? Arawello: I think you are toooo nice. Sister i believe whoever looks at me red eyeing...i should give him/her the same favor. But definitely i don't like starting it. Do u understand what i m saying? peace...
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 10:29 am "asad: 1)are u calling that al-khawarig were munafiqeen?" i would not who were the munafiqeen and who were not. only Allah knew what was in their heart. i know that there were always munafiqiin in the muslims that created fights, corruption and divisions between the muslims. ;-) "2)it is not true that u don't care otherwise u wouldn't have been here defending Islam against its enemies." i'm not defending anything. i'm just pointing out discrepencies made by people and voice my opinion. if people hate this or love this, i have no contral of their feelings, because my intentions are not (i'm not here looking for people) to hate me or to love me. whatever their feeling maybe, i do not care. ;-) "3)i think u r serious...n it is so clear from the tone of ur writtings." maybe the tone is serious to you, but do you see the smiles too? ;-) "Sometimes, i just can hear your shoutings...lol" that is because, i'm not. ;-)
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 10:46 am Hakima, No I did not.
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 11:20 am Arawello: You mentioned that u went to this conference n saw those ladies who gave u that look n then started talking bad about the position of women in Islam. Sister, first of all, if i were in your position i would have given them the look: how on earth u r a muslim and u r not dressing ur proper islamic dress (Hijab). I pray from all my heart that all sisters do wear it one day. It is such a precious feelings to feel that u respecting the body that Allah had given you. Secondly, Islam didn't mistreat women in anyway. Islam has given us the Pride that many many communities around the world do not have. It is such an ignorance to claim that. Next, time when u see such empty headed women...please do not hold ur peace...Speak Up:-) Asad: walaahi u r a Big Joker. I hope others have noticed what u sometimes write...lol peace...
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 11:42 am ANY MUSLIM WHO LOOKS DEEPLY GALOL,S WORDS CAN TELL THAT HE IS AN ATHEIST. HOW CAN I TELL? LET US QOUTE ONE OF HIS HIS STATEMENTS: "A GARGANTUAN BOREDOM OF QURANIC PROPORTION SET IN" THIS IS A PLAIN DISBELIEF AND NOBODY CAN DENY IT. IN A SLIGHTLY DIFFERENT APPROACH, HE DENIED VERY CLEARLY THAT ALLAH CREATED HIM. LET US PUT HIS FILTHY WORDS UNDER MAGNIFYING GLASS: "AS WERE I CAME FROM, THE SIMLE ANSWERIS NOBODY IS QIUTE SURE. THE SCIENTIFIC THEOREM THAT SUGGEST LIFE EVOLVED FROM MICRO-ORGANISM IN THE PRIMORDIAL SOUP IS A FARFECHED AS THE SIMPLISTIC RELIGIOUS ONE WHICH CLAIMS THAT GOD DECIDED TO MAKE MEN FROM MUD! (SO THAT THEY CAN WORSHIP HIM ! NOW WHAT DOES HE NEED FOR THAT FOR? I ASK) ABSOLUTELY NO BODY CAN DENY THAT THE ABOVE MENTIONED STATEMENTS IS DISBELIEF(KUFR). AND WE SHOULDN'T BE UNDERESTIMATING THE HOLY KORAN AND THE TRADITION OF HOLY PROPHET. LET US SEE WHAT ALLAH HAS TO SAY ABOUT HOW HE CREATED US. ALLAH SAYS, "HE CREATED MAN(ADAM) FROM SOUNDING CLAY LIKE THE CLAY OF POTTERY. AND THE JIN: HE CREATED FROM A SMOKELESS FLAME OF FIRE".(ARAHMAN 14-15) ALLAH HAS ALREADY TOLD US THAT HE CREATED US TO WORSHIP HIM. WHY? TO SHOW YOU THAT YOU ARE WEAK SLAVE OF ALLAH AND THAT YOU HAVE SUBMIT THE WILL OF ALLAH. I THINK IT IS NECCESSARY TO CLERIFY THAT MY HARSH CONDEMNATION AS WELL AS MY FIRM STAND AGAINST GALOL, IS OUTPOURING RAGE OVER THIS ISSUE. ICTABIRUU, ICTABIRUU YAA ULIL ABSAAR!! IT IS EXTREMELY IMPORTANT FOR ALL OF US TO SHOW A SENSE OF STRENGH AND COMMUNAL CONCERN, WHETHER WE ARE STURGGLING WITH EMOTIONAL ISSUES OR CONFRONTING THE INDIVIDUAL LIKE GALOL WHO HAS SO MANY MISGUIDED AND UNRESEARCHED THOUGHTS, WHILE HIDING BEHIND THE KEYBOARD. FURTHERMORE, I AM URGUING WHAT I BELIEVE TO BE THE WILL OF ALLAH, A FIRM RELIGIOUS CONVICTION AMD THE COMMON GOOD OF THE COMMUNITY(UMMAH). GALOL'S HEART IS THICK AS THE GALOL TREE, AS HIS NAME SIGNIFIES. I SUGGEST THAT, WE SHOULD BE VERY MINDFUL OF THE INTELLECTUAL CAPABILITY OF HIS CONFUSED INDIVIDUAL WHO CAME FORWARD TO OFFEND OUR CREATOR, OUR PROPHET(SCW) AND OUR FAITH. WHY? BECAUSE HE HAS NO ABILITY TO RATIONALLY THINK WITH SIMPLISTIC FACTS. AS THE MATTER OF THE FACT, THIS UBU JAHAL PREACHES UNISLAMIC CONCEPTS THAT CONVINCED ME HE WAS ONE OF THOSE FED LENININS-MARKIXT IDEOLOGY IN HALANE. AND THEN SENT FEW MONTHS TO EASTERN EUROPE IN ORDER TO SERVE FOR BARRE REGIME. AND I MET ALOT OF THEM; THEY SOUNDED LIKE THIS MONK. FOR THAT REASON, HE IS SUFFERING FROM POST COMMUNISM SYNDROME(PCS). AS MUSLIMS WE WILL NEVER PLACE OUR FAITH ABOVE PERSONALITIES AND PARTICULAR BELIEFS OF AN INDIVIDUAL. TO BE CONTINUED
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 11:47 am hakima, You know the time Iam talking about I was starting learning about the Deen. I alweys fasted and prayed but my aunt was not that religious, but she was okey as the rest of somalis. I did not respont to the women cuz I did not feel it was right, since they were not addressing to me. The reason i mentioned was not that i feel bad but to tell how ignorant moslims are, i sit next to them cuz mthey were somalis, i did not have to. ans what disappointed was these two ladies know somalia more than i do, and and it is easier for me to communicate with the westreners than they do. But because i was honoring them, but the way they were taliking was like they were thinking they were better than other somalis. They did not realise that they inheret such exteremely beutiful religion, and that is sad. And i thinkl age makes differ now no -one goes near me!!!!!!!!!! Iam certainly not the one ignorant about Islam and women. I do respect myself darling do not worry about that, but remember the process can take time. I stand up for islam regadless my dress. Salaams
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 11:47 am hakima, You know the time Iam talking about I was starting learning about the Deen. I alweys fasted and prayed but my aunt was not that religious, but she was okey as the rest of somalis. I did not respont to the women cuz I did not feel it was right, since they were not addressing to me. The reason i mentioned was not that i feel bad but to tell how ignorant moslims are, i sit next to them cuz mthey were somalis, i did not have to. ans what disappointed was these two ladies know somalia more than i do, and and it is easier for me to communicate with the westreners than they do. But because i was honoring them, but the way they were taliking was like they were thinking they were better than other somalis. They did not realise that they inheret such exteremely beutiful religion, and that is sad. And i thinkl age makes differ now no -one goes near me!!!!!!!!!! Iam certainly not the one ignorant about Islam and women. I do respect myself darling do not worry about that, but remember the process can take time. I stand up for islam regadless my dress. Salaams
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 11:56 am "Asad: walaahi u r a Big Joker." lol----->a big joker. ;-). do you mean a joker like a clown, a fool-----or a joker like a comedian or a commic? either case, i'm laughing. ;-) "I hope others have noticed what u sometimes write...lol" lol
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 12:08 pm Asad I am pleased to see you are making progress. I mean you are writing whole sentences without a quote. Keep at it you will get there. I see you learnt other things as well. FG's tendency to translate the Quran and the Hadith in the way that suits his opinions. You are wrong in saying the prophet have no interest in tactical warfare. On the contrary he once said "al-harbu khida'ah" War is tactics. And your translation of the order the prophet gave is WRONG! nighnam comes from Ghaneemah which means loot or Booty. It was a common practice of war at that time to have whole tribes join wars just for the booty. You are wrong as you were when you said that that the Prophet was not alive during Museylama's revolt. The mistake the prophet made at Uhud,(which by the way was not a city as you describe) arguably cost his uncle's life. And Wahshiyi was working for Hind-bint uttba, Abu Sufyan's wife who lost members of her family to Hamza and co during Badr. You of course, omitted "Abbasa". I never suggested it was "Sin" I used the word mistake. My posting to Qoonsi fella was written in such a way to make him see things from his perspective. But as we have witnessed many times before, your creative interpreting or processing of information leaves a lot to be desired. Recall the way you interpreted that poor fella's question about Rape Hakima Your insults were in English at the time. You also said that you "hate me and atheists like me, and to go and hang with illeterates". 20 years ago, I would have taken such pique as positive `C'mon boy' signal. But as this is the age of "No means No!" I thought I should leave you alone. As to the double face thing, Please have mercy. The one I have got is ugly enough, Two of them will be quite unbearable. So long.
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 12:17 pm SIS. ARO, WE WILL GO DAR AL ISLAM INSHA ALLAH TO ASAD, AND HAKIMA JAZAKUMULAAHU KHAYRAN FOR NOT TOLERATING THE ATHEIST TO DISTORT GAZWATUL UHUD. SIS. TLBGL HOW CAN I REFRAIN FROM CALLING THIS PERSON KAFIR. IF YOU DON'T BELIEVE ME SISTER, CHECK THE NEAREST ISLAMIC LIBRARY, AND YOU FIND THAT HIS NOT MUSLIM. RIGOURSLY AUTHENTICATED TRADITIONS OF THE PROPHET, HOLY KORAN WE TELL YOU THAT. ALSO THERE IS CONSENSUS AMONG THE SCHOLARS. THE SCHOLARS AGREED THE KUFR IS ACTION AND WORD AND YOU READ WHAT HE POSTED. CHECK THE ISLAMIC FIQI BOOKS LIKE MINHAAJU DAALIBIIN, ROWLATU DAALIBIIN AND SHARXUL MAHDAB LIL IMMMUL XAAFID FIQIIH NAWAWI SHAAFICI. MUQNI LI IBNU QUDAAMA LI IMMAMUL XAAFID FIQIIH LI IBNU QUDAAMA MAQDASI XANBALI AND HIDAAYA (FIQI XANAFI). PLEASE DON,T ADOR THE GUY; WE KICKED HIM OUT FOR HIS CLEVERNESS.
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 01:45 pm <TLG: 1)muslims suffer from inferiority complex...hmmm. I think the other way round. 2)What do u think of Muwaiya as a leader? 3)do u know how to read quran in just a minute?> 1. yes we do...have you ever noticed when you go to the school caferia and you inquire about the food ( i.e what kind of oil they use for frying etc) and your friends (muslims) turn the other way wishing they were never with you? Or when you go to the public washrooms to take wudhu and the same think happens? Or in the middle of an experiment in the lab your tell your supervisor you have to go pray, and your muslims friends tell you, "u know u can pray later"? I could on.... 2. I think he was a great leader.... I'm yet to find an islaamic source that explains clearly the conflict btn him and Ali (ra) 3. NO. but I would love to learn. salaams.
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 01:57 pm "Asad I am pleased to see you are making progress." lol----->progress. ;-) "I mean you are writing whole sentences without a quote. Keep at it you will get there." lol----->you will get there. ;-) where would that be? ;-) "I see you learnt other things as well. FG's tendency to translate the Quran and the Hadith in the way that suits his opinions." unlike, the ways of galool (the atheist), right? ;-) "You are wrong in saying the prophet have no interest in tactical warfare." i did not say he had no interest in tactical warfare, did i? ;-) "On the contrary he once said "al-harbu khida'ah" War is tactics." i told you and pointed out the tactics of the war of uhud which the prophet took after weighting the pros and cons (what his companions suggested), right? ;-) "And your translation of the order the prophet gave is WRONG! nighnam comes from Ghaneemah which means loot or Booty." but you were wrong to say that the war was about the *booty*. you suggested that the prophet did not want his followers share with booty. ;-). "It was a common practice of war at that time to have whole tribes join wars just for the booty." including the hypocrites and the jews tribes, right? ;-) "You are wrong as you were when you said that that the Prophet was not alive during Museylama's revolt." well, the fact is that you lied about museylama's death. we were not talking about his revolt; you said when museylama was killed, the prophet was happy, but when he found out that it was wahshi who killed him, the prophet was unhappy. i corrected you and told you by the time wahshi killed musaylama, the prophet was not alive. ;-) "The mistake the prophet made at Uhud,(which by the way was not a city as you describe) arguably cost his uncle's life." that is very funny. if the prophet's orders were not followed by people, was that his fault? ;-) by the way, uhud is a place away from madina. uhud is the name of a mountain too and it was located a place near madina. uhad was where the camp of the muslims located. the camp of pagan arabs was situated many roads leading to uhad----harrah bin harithah and their farms was away from the camp of the muslims. the hillock of uhud is at the slop of the valley facing madinah. ;-) "And Wahshiyi was working for Hind-bint uttba, Abu Sufyan's wife who lost members of her family to Hamza and co during Badr." that is false (it is your *his story*). wahshi was working for jubair bin mut'im, whose paternal uncle tu'amiha bin'adi was injured at badar battle. "You of course, omitted "Abbasa"." no, i told you that whatever mistake the prophet made was not a sin. ;-) "I never suggested it was "Sin" I used the word mistake." and i never denied the prophet making mistakes in his life. i just corrected you that the prophet did not make mistake at uhud. ;-)
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 02:15 pm "My posting to Qoonsi fella was written in such a way to make him see things from his perspective." that is very funny. ;-) by the way, i also laughed when you tried to explain the "double face" remarks. ;-) "But as we have witnessed many times before, your creative interpreting or processing of information leaves a lot to be desired." lol------>a lot to be desired. ;-) "Recall the way you interpreted that poor fella's question about Rape" i did not interpreted the question; i just aswered the question as was stated. you, on the other hand, was the one doing the interpration and telling us what he or she meant to say. ;-). he or she asked and wrote: "can a man rape his wife". what if someone asks "can a man kill another man?"-----can you interpret this question? ;-)
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 02:16 pm Salam bros and sisters well I wanna say a bit here, I have read all discussion and insha allah it was good comments and well behaved. Although it is becoming 2 mens contents at the last end. I just wanna remind you since Ramadhan is getting close that all the other "Camalaat" is recorded by the Angales but Ramadhan is observed by Your creator (Allah) SWC. nd the proove is where he said " Alsoma lii Wa ana ajzi" HE WTCHES how people treat their fasting and he will reward them. So let's fear allah not only In Shah ru Ramadhan but always but specially in the holy month. salaam
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 02:43 pm <SIS. TLBGL HOW CAN I REFRAIN FROM CALLING THIS PERSON KAFIR. IF YOU DON'T BELIEVE ME SISTER, CHECK THE NEAREST ISLAMIC LIBRARY, AND YOU FIND THAT HIS NOT MUSLIM. RIGOURSLY AUTHENTICATED TRADITIONS OF THE PROPHET, HOLY KORAN WE TELL YOU THAT. ALSO THERE IS CONSENSUS AMONG THE SCHOLARS.> hey bro. salaams...I agree with you but how is this helping him... By us running around and call him a kaafir, is it solving the problem or bringing him any closer to the truth?... I'm not saying his claims should not be refuted, what i'm saying is it should be done in gentle manner. When the prophet peace be upon him was rejected and stoned by the people of taif, and the angels of the mountain appeared to him asking if the inhabitants should be destroyed, what did he say? Being a rookie in the practise of deen, I know my knowledge is limited but i'm sure there are better things to do than running around and calling people names. I think a more appropriate thing is for us to ask Allah to guide him. <PLEASE DON,T ADOR THE GUY; WE KICKED HIM OUT FOR HIS CLEVERNESS.> Have you taken any psychology courses? salaams.
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 02:50 pm Arawello:"i stand up for Islam regardless of my dress" My dearest sister, i know very well that u don't need a reminder that Hijab is a must for muslim women. Please don't try to close ur eyes from that true FACT. Asad: good to see u r laughing...i still can't argue with u...i will defintely be caught in ur everlasting al-maa maa :-) Galool: 'C'mon boy signal'lol saayidi al-fadel...lou inta fahim kida, arguok dacani aqoul laa bena sayeda meen qabilaa abdi-rahman al-waal layzat fee aay zaraf meen al-zarouf beehajah lee mithlak. Secondly, as u said...u have reached all the AGE...i wonder where your reason has gone. How can u believe in the bullshit that u are singing all day. I am pretty sure that what u are saying has no meaning in your subconscious. But why this strange adherence to it. Is someone threating you?? Why would you make a deal with the devil? Did they gave u couple of $ to shut down ur faculty of Judgement? I know that you know where is the truth...please do not be the joke of Iblis...and the burning stone of Juhanama. Caalaa koul shee... anna ashaa'a...waa anataa taashaa'a...waa-allahu yafcaayl maa yaa shaa'a. Anna azfaa leesoqriyaati...it runs fee al-cilaa. TLG: 1)that explanation you gave me...i have no idea about it cuz i didn't see it. I was in some place else (not in the west) for my schooling till i got my BA. 2)you are right many ppl esp Syrians did adore him. Muwaiya was appointed as the governer of Damascus by Uthman Bin Affaan (tribe quresh and they were from the same subclan). The conflict goes back when Uthman was murdered by a group of arabs from different clans. After a period not that long Ali was appointed as the next Caliphate. Clansmen of Uthman demanded from Ali to take revenge for the Murder of Uthman. Ali didn't in what so ever pay attention to them. They (clansmen of Uthamn) took the cloth that Uthman was wearing when he was murdered...Muwaiya seeing the blood of his cousin and seeing that Ali is not judging to what was supposed to, he declared his disobedience to the rule of Ali bin abou-Talim. Ali, in his turn hearing that, collected the army and declared war against Muwaiya. Muwaiya won the battle (they say that he was a great warrior and an expert in the tactics of war). Muwaiya ruled Syria for 20yrs. He was the establisher of the Ummayid Dynasty. Did u know, TLG, that the son of Muwaiya...the stupid Yazid was the one who gave the orders that Ali's son ...the prophet's grandson to be killed. Hussein was murdered in the battle of karbala(his head was cut apart from the rest of the body...ppl say that his body is in Egypt and his head in Iraq..but i m not 100% sure) (if my memory didn't fail me...that is what i remember...but advise u to check for a source) 3)I have heard a story long time ago, that reading three times surah el-ekhlas...'qoul houwaa allah ahad...allah samad..." is the same as if u read the whole quran. The story behind it as i recall was that Uthamn Bin Affan n Ali Bin Talim proposed for the hand of Fatima...the prophet's daughter. The prophet didn't want to reject any one of them so ...he told them whoever reads the quran faster than the other...will be married to Fatima. Fatima over heard the prophet once saying that reading surat al-ikhals three times is like reading the whole quran, she told Ali about it. N Ali went to the prophet...n told him what he read. Ali by that won Fatima. {Sister...the man u gonna marry...made him know the quran very well...n that should be ur mahr...the man who fears Allah...will fear Allah in you...n live happily ever after :-) } peace...
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 03:39 pm i kept referring him as Talim..hmmm sorry Talib
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 04:07 pm Galool: Calaa shaan kida, inta maa radiidsh calaya...lol walaalhi inta cayeel keebeer...moush rageel keebeer...lol I hope u didn't cry :-( I'll introduce you to my father...he'll teach you how to be Mr Cynic 100%. Now, ihnaa moutacadeleen. inta bee ur theory...waa ana bee kouni sacrastic. Bein! peace...
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 04:20 pm Oh he actually speaks arabic, I find that hard to believe any ways in 30 minutes they'll be announcing who's the president while I sit back here and chill.
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 04:28 pm I heard it is a sin to live or be in a non muslim country for more then 2 days...unless of course someone or something is making it difficult for you to go home...is it true?
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 04:33 pm I honestly don't know but on a lighter note do you know what happened to the cat?
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 04:37 pm run out of his/her nine lives i guess...
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 04:40 pm no "curiosity killed the cat" get it you're curios.
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 04:45 pm They'll be announcing who's the president in one minute.
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 04:48 pm Sorry sweet loves false alarm you guys have to wait till nov 26.
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 04:51 pm well then if curiousity killed the cat...the cat still has eight other lives...
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 06:21 pm "Asad: good to see u r laughing...i still can't argue with u...i will defintely be caught in ur everlasting al-maa maa :-)"" maybe the reason you can't argue with me is that i'm impervious (thick-skinned) when people throw at me whatever they throw at me. as i already said, i can dish out as well as take it. if you give me al-maa maa, i return the favor. however, i am impervious to humorous jibes as well as insults aimed at me, but i do not resort to insult. in fact, i laugh at those who think insults will win arguements. ;-)
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| | Tuesday, November 21, 2000 - 07:20 pm Hakima, masha allah sis...i love you for the sake of Allah :-) 1. my bad...i thought most of us did their high school/ undergrad in the west. 2. Almost the same thing as i learned in "Islaam and the mediterrenian soceity" my elective last year... They make me take humanities :-( However, somethings were unclear in that course. For example, it was presented in that course (even from Atabari's account) that some of the sahabas did not want to give allegiance to Ali (ra)... strange! one more thing...is Muawiyah considered a sahabi? 3. I didn't know that is what u meant by reading the quran in one min.... also, i believe (correct me if i'm wrong) reading the last two verses of suratul baqra is equivalent to reading the entire quran. About the marriage material man, lol...thanks for the naseeha yaa ukhti al azeeza...I think it is the best advice i ever got. Hey where do u reside? I would love to correspond via e-mail...do u wanna meet in the chat sometime so that we can exchange e-mails?
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| | Wednesday, November 22, 2000 - 02:15 am asad: that is not the reason, whenever i argue with you...u tend to play with words...up side down...down side up...i end up at the end...forgetting what i was arguing about...lol But...since you are quite harmless (as galool once said)...i enjoy watching ur comments...okay abti... :-) TLG: 1) :-)... but those who don't pay enough respect to their religious rituals...are present everywhere. 2) Muawiya is a sahabi? well, all i know those who were the companions of the prophet were called the sahaba...and those who followed the sahaba were al-tabicoun. {(ask mr asad :-)} 3)i didn't know that...jazak allah for that tip sister. *** sure i can meet u at the chatline...just tell me when and where? :-) peace...
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| | Wednesday, November 22, 2000 - 04:27 am "asad: that is not the reason, whenever i argue with you...u tend to play with words...up side down...down side up...i end up at the end...forgetting what i was arguing about...lol" well, like i said, i'm going to only deal with the hand that is given to me. i do not interpret things that is written on here; i do not go into people's mind and know what they are talking about. i ask questions and point out things. if you want to talk about issues, i'll stick to the issues. on the other hand, if you give me al-maa maa, that is what you will get back at you. in other word, i'll let you eat (choke) your own words----(but i do not exchange insults with no one) ;-) "But...since you are quite harmless (as galool once said)...i enjoy watching ur comments..." i thought he (galool) said i'm to him a some kind of sedative (a narcotic) that puts him to sleep and that he sometimes has nightmares about my pointing out the *discrepancies* made by him and the false *his story*. about islam he heaves on here! also, what about the other people who said they feel sick about when they read my comments and the person who said on this thread that i'm doing more harm than good? ;-) "okay abti... :-)" okay. ;-)
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| | Wednesday, November 22, 2000 - 05:00 am lol....u r funny :-) peace...
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| | Wednesday, November 22, 2000 - 05:18 am hakima, i think i can tell that you are going to miss me when i'm gone from here because of the ramadan. ;-) also, i'm sure that many people here------(those that i put to sleep and have nightmares about my pointing out the *discrepancies* made by them and their false *his story* about islam and those who feel sick about my comments)------- will be very very happy to see me gone. for these people, they have to thank the holy month of ramadan. ;-) i think we have five days to go till ramadan, insha-Allah, right? ;-)
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| | Wednesday, November 22, 2000 - 06:03 am hakima sorry sister paper is driving me wild.. i am experiening the "november" illness i catch it every year, when my work oad piles up before end of term. sister Simmone de beavoiur she was also a philopher, not only sartres girlfriend.lol. but ou know that, she was okay..they went to the same school in france and were in some knd of "intellectual and sexual" heaven togther lol. but what would i know, i think satres was okay.. and you testify he is nuts. i have to go can already see me failing. one love
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| | Wednesday, November 22, 2000 - 06:30 am <Muawiya is a sahabi? well, all i know those who were the companions of the prophet were called the sahaba...and those who followed the sahaba were al-tabicoun. {(ask mr asad :-)}> Hakima: I'm afraid Asad said he is not here to help only to point out discrepancies :-( so, i'm not sure I can ask him, unless ofcourse i start out with a discrepancy in my quesition :-) Can we meet in the cat tonight? I'm not sure what your time zone is...mine is Eastern standard...US/Canada. Let me know. Common: good to see ya :-) Asad, you are still adorable:-) Galool: I'm just curious, most people that reject religion (like my uncle) fill their spiritual vacuum with something, lik Science for example. Since you rejected both Science and religion, what do u fill yours with, if there is one that is? since you denounced both religion and science. Salaam.
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| | Wednesday, November 22, 2000 - 06:40 am According to your words, most of you need to know how to believe in and worship God, instead of knowing what "jihaad" is. Also, know that running comes after walking and walking after creeping! Look these two lines: ------------------------------------------- - - - -- - - - - - - ----- - Can you see or read any thing between or in the lines? What is it?
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| | Wednesday, November 22, 2000 - 06:52 am "Hakima: I'm afraid Asad said he is not here to help only to point out discrepancies :-( so, i'm not sure I can ask him, unless ofcourse i start out with a discrepancy in my quesition :-)" you are right, i do not know that much and can not help you on in this. if you read up there, i already said that----only Allah knows about these people and what was in their heart (who was a hypocrite and who was not). in other word, i'm not here to speculate what i do not know. i mean i'm not an encyclopedia of who is whom-----who is sahabi and who is not. and certianly, i'm not in the heart of a person. ;-) "Asad, you are still adorable:-)" on here and many other places on this forums, i read that i'm many different things to many different people, but i do not take things that are said about me seriously (good or bad). ;-)
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| | Wednesday, November 22, 2000 - 08:08 am Just share this with me; " I was just wondering if you could provide me with some hadith, of the fac t that the propet pbuh is not just a bashr( human) but is also the Nur ( light) of Allah'' Answer The Holy quran , while mentioning the holy prophet says in surah al-ahzab ''O prophet, truly We have sent thee as a Witness, and a bearer of glad tidings, and a Warner, and as a Summoner unto Allah by His command, and a radiant lamp'' the holly prophet pbuh was the nur of Allah as sura- al-shams describes; in that like the moon draws its light from the sun, the holy Propetdrew this light from Allah and transimitted it to the spritually dark world. The holly propet spent each month of his life in the rememberence of Allah and with the Will of Allah. Indeed in that sense he is most certainly was light of Allah, however, the holly Quran tells us, he was only a HUMANBEING, THE MOST PERFECT AND EXCELLENT HUMAN BEING. To Hakima, You are right hijab is a Must. but most important of all is a state of mind.the urge to wear it it has to come from within. I agree with anonymous we all need jihadul nafs. I pray that Allah will strengh our hearts.
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| | Wednesday, November 22, 2000 - 09:22 am Arawello, You are totally right...it should come from within. When i first wore Hijab...i was in the middle school. My father didn't approve of it...and my mother was just neutral...she didn't say that was good or bad. My mother and my three sisters..none of them wear it :-( Common: Lol...we are on the same boat pal...tell me about the end of the term nightmares. :-( TLG: mine is also eastern (us/canada) timing. Meet me round 9pm in the women's corner. Look for an arabic nick. :-) Asad: Man...i miss you already :-) Galool: You accused me of insulting you...though that is not true...my tone sometimes is sharp and rude...i admit that. But for the goodness that I have...this is the zenth time ...I Am Apologizing :-) "see men can't even have that great virtue that we women have..." peace...
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| | Wednesday, November 22, 2000 - 09:30 am FROM ANOTHER PROSPECTIVE, IF ANYONE DOUBTS THE GALOL'S KUFRI TEMPTATIONS LET US SEE HOW HE MOCKS THE LAW OF ALLAH AND THE SUNNAH OF OUR BELOVED PROPHET(SALALAAHU CAYHI WASALAM): "HOLY-HANDS-CHOPPING-CHAMPBERS AND ISSUING ENDLESS, POINLESS UNINTELLIGABLE CUT 'N' PASTED FATWS" I LEFT YOU BRO.,AND SIS. TO JUDGE WHAT THESE WORDS SIGNIFY(WA CIYAADU BILLAAH). IF YOU HA ARE SKEPTICAL AND HASITANT LET US CONSULT WITH BOOK OF ALLAH AND THE SUNNAH OF RASULUL AMIIN(scw): ALLAH SUXAANA WATACAALAA SAYS FII KITAABIHIL MUXKIMIL CAZIIZ, "AND(AS FOR) THE MALE THIEF AND THE FEMALE THIEF, CUT OFF(FROM THE WRIST JOINT THEIR (RIGHT) HANDS AS A RECOMPENSE FOR THAT WHICH THEY COMMITTED, A PANISHMENT BY WAY OF EXAMPLE FROM ALLAH. AND ALLAH IS ALL-POWERFUL, ALL-WISE" NARRATED A,ISHA(RADIYALAAHU CANHAA): ALLAH,S PROPHET(SAW) SAID, "A THIEF'S HAND SHOULD BE CUTT OFF ONLY FOR A QUARTER OF A DINAR AND UPWARD" (BUKHARI AND MUSLIM)BUKHARI,S WORDING IS, "ATHIEF,S HAND CUTS OFF FOR A OFF A DINAR AND UPWORDS". IMAAM AHMED,S VERSION IMN MUSNAD "CUTT OF THEIF,S HAND FOR A QUARTER OF A DINAR,BUT DO NOT FOR WHAT IS LESS THAN THAT" NARRATED ABDULLAHI IBN OMAR(RAA): "THE PROPHET (SAW) HAD (A THIEFS HAND) CUT OFF FOR ASHIELD WORTH THREE DIRHAMS". (BUKHARI AND MUSLIM) NARRATED ABU HURAIRA(RAA): ALLAH,S MASSENGER(SAW) SAID, ALLAH CURSE A THIEF WHO STEALS A STEEL HELMET AND HAS HIS HAND CUTT OFF, AND STEALS A ROPE AND HAS HIS HAND CUTT OFF" (BUKHARI AND MUSLIM) THERE ARE MANY HADITHS, BUT MY INTENTION IS TO SHOW THAT WE ARE FULLY COMMITTED TO COMPLYING WITH OUR DIIN, NO MATTER WHO DISAGREES WITH US. IN OTHER WORDS, GALOL HAS TO KNOW THAT THE BEARDED TRIBE WILL CARRY OUT THE IMPLEMENTATION OF THE LAW OF ALLAH IN OUR ORPHANED LAND, WHETHER YOU LIKE IT OR NOT. THEIR STRUGGLE TO IMPLEMENT ISLAMIC SYSTEM INTO THE HEARTS OF SOMALI PEOPLE FRUITFULL AND THEIR SUCRIFICE WILL REACH ITS FULL POTENTIAL. IN REALITY, THAT STRUGGLE WILL BRING SOMALIA OUT OF CHOAS AND ANARCHY. I SEE THE LIGHT OF THE DIIN AT THE END OF THE TUNNEL. AS I TOLD YOU BEFORE MY ISLAMIC KNOWLEDGE IS IN EMPRYONIC STAGE, BUT I SRIVE TO FOLLOW MY DIIN BECUASE ALLAH SAYS IN HOLY KORAN, "THIS DAY I HAVE PERFECTED YOUR DEEN FOR YOU AND I COMPLETED MY FAVOUR UPON YOU AND I CHOSEN ISLAAM AS YOUR DEEN".(MAAIDAH 5:3) IF ALLAH PERMITS I,LL CONTINUE FROM WERE I LEFT. TO MY SISTER TLG. WALLAHI, INII LA UXUBIKI YAA IKHWATII FILAAH, WA ADCUU LAKI AN TAKUUNA MACA LADIINA ANCAMALAAH FI DUNYAA WAL AAKHIRAH. IN FACT, NOBODY IS PERFECT, BUT THIS ABU JAHAL HAS TO SAY THE SHAHAADAH, ACCORDING TO WHAT HE HAS WRITTEN. HE TRIED TO MAKE US BELIEVE THAT CARES ABOUT RAMADAAN,WHILE CROSSING THE BOUNDARIES OF ALLAH. SHARE WITH ME SISTER WHAT THE OUR BELOVED PROPHET(SCW) HAS TO SAY SUCH ABOUT PEOPLE: PROPHET SAID, "HOW MANY FASTING PEOPLE OBTAIN NOTHING FROM THEIR FASTING EXCEPT HUNGER AND THIRST. AND HOW MANY PEOPLE WHO STAY UP AT NIGHT (PRAYING), OBTAIN NOTHING FROM THEIR BEING AWAKE, EXCEPT SLEEPLESSNESS AND TIREDNESS". (SAHEEH: RELATED BY IMAAM AHMED(2/441 AND IBN MAAJAH(1/539)-FROM IBN UMAR(RADIYALAHU CANHU). SIS., TLGL I TOOK PSCHOLOGY, BUT HAD ALOT OF TROUBLE WITH MY INSRUCTOR; SHE LIKED WHEN I WASN'T AROUND IN THE CLASS. BY THE WAY, MUCAAWIYA BIN ABU SUFYAAN WAS GREAT SAHABI. HE WAS THE KAATIB OF WAXYU RASUULULAAH AND ONE OF THE GREAT KHALIFS OF ISLAM. ASSAAMU CALAYKUM.
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| | Wednesday, November 22, 2000 - 10:58 am Arrawelo I am starting to appreciate your contributions. Hmm. I hope this does not cause you any problems. Asad Since we are going to break for Ramadan, may I say that you are the archetypal Somali. Where does all this insecurity come from? There is nothing wrong with teaching others what you know, learning from others what you don't, or accepting and giving advice. Your shrieking rejection of what you call "orders" reveals a lot more about you than you care to admit. My TLC Life is interesting. By the way I do not reject Science, in fact I applaud(as any reasonable human being
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| | Wednesday, November 22, 2000 - 11:02 am Arrawelo I am starting to appreciate your contributions. Hmm. I hope this does not cause you any problems. Asad Since we are going to break for Ramadan, may I say that you are the archetypal Somali. Where does all this insecurity come from? There is nothing wrong with teaching others what you know, learning from others what you don't, or accepting and giving advice. Your shrieking rejection of what you call "orders" reveals a lot more about you than you care to admit. My TLC Life is interesting. By the way I do not reject Science, in fact I applaud(as any reasonable human being
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| | Wednesday, November 22, 2000 - 11:16 am Sorry Guys, it seems I sent above message twice. Also half of it is gone! The gist of it was I do not agree with all of Science and Scientists. Afterall they gave us the Nuclear Bomb. Also, and this is for TLC(G) only, that my hobbies include Chess, reading, boxing, swimming, football, debating and writing short stories(very badly) How about you young one? are you happy being a "beardess"? Part of my disagreement with politicized Islam is its' attitude towards women. I hate to see the better-looking half of humanity covered-up, hidden and humiliated. I will say a lot about this topic after Ramadan.
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| | Wednesday, November 22, 2000 - 11:28 am Qoonsade How much will a half-Dinar be worth today?
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| | Wednesday, November 22, 2000 - 12:06 pm "Asad Since we are going to break for Ramadan, may I say that you are the archetypal Somali." lol------>archetypal. is something wrong with being a typical somali? ;-) "Where does all this insecurity come from?" lol------->insecurity. ;-) "There is nothing wrong with teaching others what you know" i didn't say there is something wrong with teaching, did i? i point out what i know, but i'm not here to teach. ;-). i correct you lies. ;-) "learning from others what you don't" that is why i ask questions here. ;-) "or accepting and giving advice." giving and taking advice is different than giving orders and receiving censorship. ;-) "Your shrieking rejection of what you call "orders" reveals a lot more about you than you care to admit." i do not yell, i reject the screaming by people like you and saying to me stop this, stop that, don't do this, do this-----as if this place is theirs----maybe you guys are the insecure ones trying to force people to change to what you want them to be. if someone disagrees with you, you think the world is coming to and end. ;-)
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| | Wednesday, November 22, 2000 - 01:00 pm <The gist of it was I do not agree with all of Science and Scientists. Afterall they gave us the Nuclear Bomb. Also, and this is for TLC(G) only, that my hobbies include Chess, reading, boxing, swimming, football, debating and writing short stories(very badly)> Galool: how are you awoow (grandpa)? Ok, have you come up with something better than what religion or Science advocate about the origin of man? hey, have you heard of the gambler's theory? Chess! I play that too. Looks like we have something in common awoow. <How about you young one? are you happy being a "beardess"? Part of my disagreement with politicized Islam is its' attitude towards women. I hate to see the better-looking half of humanity covered-up, hidden and humiliated.> Are you kidding me? I have never been happier despite disaproval from family members. I've been a "hooded girl" for a year and half now and it has only made my road to success wider. Infact, you should see me in the lab with my Yamaka (Jew) supervisor, athiest colleague and others... the only thing we are missing in that environment is a devout Christian. You should see our discussions from religion to politics to sceince.. Infact, I came to realize that most Westerners respect you better when you are firm on your beleives. They can't help adoring me :-) smart, beautiful, God fearing. what else can anyone ask in life? BTW, your comment about hijab tells me to sense a problem with women telling you: "DEAL WITH MY MIND, NOT WITH MY BODY"? <I will say a lot about this topic after Ramadan.> By the way, why are u starving yourselve during Ramadhan. Surely if it is for health reasons, it can be done in other months. Besides, why associate with the bearded tribe that you so much deslike? This is their most sacred month. If I deslike something, like the pagan celebrations of halloween, valentines etc, I dissocaite myself fast and far. Until next time, ask God for guidance oldman...after all, you might not have that much time left. Now, I leave you with this quote: "show me a worm that understands the existence of man, and I will show a man that understands the existence of God"
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| | Wednesday, November 22, 2000 - 01:04 pm Hakima, I will see you at 9 pm in women's corner...I'll be using the same nick the rest can come and say hello too:-) salaams.
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| | Wednesday, November 22, 2000 - 01:08 pm <WALLAHI, INII LA UXUBIKI YAA IKHWATII FILAAH,..> Qoonsade, I know my arabic is even more rusty than my somali but is the above a typo? Help me out yaa akhee al azeez...i'm confufed :-)
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| | Wednesday, November 22, 2000 - 10:39 pm TLG: <love you for the sake of Allah.> Common, Asad, FG, TLG, Arawello, Wanangsaane... and all the others...Jazaak Allahu Kheer in this world and pray for you all the Jannah. To: Asad,if u decide to come back after ramadan...to the forums...i hope u won't say to ppl "I don't care"  !! As for me, i m finishing school...after couple of weeks...n finally will be facing real life. I hope i like it...i know nothing but the world of books...books :-( Goodbye my friends :-) salaam alaykum waa rahmatu-allhi waa barakatu.
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| | Thursday, November 23, 2000 - 01:09 am assalamu calaykum: My dear somali and muslim sister: We shall miss you!!! and this forums will miss you!! I wish you all the luck.....
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| | Thursday, November 23, 2000 - 06:47 am "To: Asad,if u decide to come back after ramadan...to the forums...i hope u won't say to ppl "I don't care" " hakima, don't take it personal when i say i do not care. when/if i came back to the forums to disagree/agree with people, i would still not care/mind/be concerned/worry/think about/heed/be effected/be bothered about----whatever people throw at me---insults or praises. ;-). i'm going to still agree/disagree and point out things whether they like it or not. i was not here to be hated/adored and i'm not going to come back to to have different feeling--one way or another. i had no or will have no contral of how people felt or will feel about when i point out of things on here. i can only control my feeling towards what it is said on here. ;-) unlike the most people who come here (online), i know the difference between via posting messages as anonymous and communicating via the telephone or in person. i just think that it's possible for me to adore/hate someone online. in other words, what i'm saying is that communicating online (on this forums) is less personable. to me, this allows communication without a true sense of connection. ;-). when i say i do not care, i mean it is not my fault that one gets nightmares for fear of i pointing out his or her *discrepancies*. ;-).
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| | Thursday, November 23, 2000 - 06:53 am "To: Asad,if u decide to come back after ramadan...to the forums...i hope u won't say to ppl "I don't care" " hakima, don't take it personal when i say i do not care. when/if i came back to the forums to disagree/agree with people, i would still not care/mind/be concerned/worry/think about/heed/be effected/be bothered about----whatever people throw at me---insults or praises. ;-). i'm going to still agree/disagree and point out things whether they like it or not. i was not here to be hated/adored and i'm not going to come back to to have different feeling--one way or another. i had no or will have no contral of how people felt or will feel about when i point out of things on here. i can only control my feeling towards what it is said on here. ;-) unlike the most people who come here (online), i know the difference between via posting messages as anonymous and communicating via the telephone or in person. i just think that it's NOT possible for me to adore/hate someone online. in other words, what i'm saying is that communicating online (on this forums) is less personable. to me, this place allows communication without a true sense of connection. ;-). when i say i do not care, i mean it is not my fault that one gets nightmares for fear of i pointing out his or her *discrepancies*. ;-).
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| | Thursday, November 23, 2000 - 09:30 am "HOW MUCH WILL A HALF DINNER BE WORTH TODAY" GALOOL,IT IS A GESTURE OF SOMEONE WHO IS DESPERATE. TO GET TO THE POINT, IT IS A FULL PORTRAIT OF A MAN IN DEEP CRISIS, BUT I DON'T HAVE WHAT IT TAKES TO INCREASE YOUR LEVEL OF CONFORT. AS FAR AS I KNOW, IMAN, WARIS DARIE AND NURADIN FARAH WILL BE DELIGHTED TO HEAR FROM YOU. AND TRUST ME, YOU HAVE MANY THINGS IN COMMON. YOU UTTERED SEVERAL TIMES THAT MY NICK NAME SIGNIFIES A PERPETUAL SKEPTISM; YOU WERE RIGHT, BECAUSE I HAD DOUBTS ABOUT YOU, BUT KNOW, THANK GOD, I KNOW WHO YOU ARE. ALLOW ME TO INTRODUCE YOU TO MR. QOONSADE: HIS NAME MOXAMED-QANI XASAN XUSEEN(FAQIIR ILLLAAHI); HE IS A MEMBER OF BEARED TRIBE. IN BRIEF, I WILL REMIND YOU AND MY SELF FOLLOWING TRADITIONS OF OUR BELOVED PROPHET(SCW): ON THE AUTHORITY OF ABU SA'ID ALKHUDRI(MAY ALLAH BE PLEASED WITH HIM) WHO SAID "I HEARD THE MESSENGER OF ALLAH(MAY THE BLESSINGS AND PEACE OF ALLAH BE UPON HIM) SAY: "WHO SOEVER OF YOU SEES AN EVIL ACTION, LET HIM CHANGE IT WITH HIS HAND; AND IF HE IS NOT ABLE TO DO SO, THEN WITH HIS TONGUE; AND IF HE IS NOT ABLE SO, THEN WITH HIS HEART, AND IT IS THE WEAKEST OF THE FAITH".(SAHIH MUSLIM) THOUGH OUR HANDS MAY BE RESTRICTED DUE TO SECULAR LAW BUT WE CERTAINLY ALL HAVE OTHER MEANS TO REFUTE ANYONE WHO IS DISTORTING THE FUNDAMENTALS OF OUR OUR FAITH. AS INDICATED BY THE PROPHET,S TRADITIONS AND MANY VERSES IN THE HOLY KORAN, COMMANDING THE RIGHT AND FORBIDING THE WRONG IS COMMUNAL OBLIGATION. TRLG, SISTER HAKIMA,MAY ALLAH GIVE HER WISDOM HAS EXPLAINED TO YOU MY DU,AA, AND I AM SURE THE FOLLOWING HADITH WILL SUM UP THE BENEFITS OF LOVING FOR THE SAKE OF ALLAH: ON AUTHORITY OF ABU HURAIRA(RAA) WHO SAID: THE MESSENGER OF ALLAH(MAY PEACE BE UPON HIM) SAID: ALLAH SAYS ON THE DAY OF RESURRECTION: "WHERE ARE THOSE WHO HAVE MUTUAL LOVE FOR MY GLORY,S SAKE? I SHALL SHELTER THEM IN MAY SHADOW WHEN THERE IS NO OTHER SHADOW BUT MINE".(SAHIH MUSLIM) RAMADAAN KARIM ASSALAAMU CALAYKUM WA RAXMATULAAHI WA BARAKAATU
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| | Thursday, November 23, 2000 - 02:39 pm To All I am now taking a break for Ramadan. May I wish all of you Ramadan Kareem. Try not to over- indulge on those Zohour gourmets. Again, Ramadan Kareem.
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| | Thursday, November 23, 2000 - 11:20 pm assalamu calaykum: Brothers and sisters who contributed to this discussions, I wish you all and other somalis, muslims a happy ramadan. I am off to africa, see you around when I come back. Ramadaan kariim
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| | Friday, November 24, 2000 - 05:07 am To: All my Muslim Br/sis We are Muslims so let's try Never cheat or tell a lie Nor to backbite or be rude Or not show our gratitude We are Muslims so let's aim Never hurt or harm or pain Nor to show-off or mislead Or do any unfair deed We are Muslims, try we should Dig out wrong and plant the good To please Allaah a whole lot better Let us start with kinder character.
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| | Friday, November 24, 2000 - 07:57 am Ramadan Kareem to all of you, It seems everyone gone, we have two more days. Anyway, brother Qoonsade Iman and Waris just became famous cuz of their modelling jobs so I do not think we should mention them in our discussion here. As for Nural Din Farah, he is among those so-called Somali educated poeple that disappoints me. I only wish he and others should re-unterprete the westren sources that they get their informations. I will say more about them after Ramadan Insha Allah, all I can say now is poeple like him did not win in my heart to bless their education, and I am sure there are other poeple like my age who look up to them but got nothing but disappointment. To all of you Rmadan Mubark. Salams
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| | Friday, November 24, 2000 - 03:47 pm Asalaamu alaikum: Looks like everyone is busy preparing for Ramadhan or the December exams. Anway, I would also like to take this opportunity to say to everyone RAMADHAN MUBARAK. May Allah make us those that benefit from it. salaam.
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| | Friday, November 24, 2000 - 04:35 pm As I was reading through the comments people posted, I noticed someone say the reason why the West targets muslims is because it needed a new enemy since the end of the cold war. Yes this is partly true but let's not forget the kafirs were always enemies of Islam. The west targets Islam because Islam is against EVERYTHING they stand for. They wanted to be the super power of the world and they couldn't do that unless they prevented the system of Islam from emerging. So they decided to wage a war against us but they didn't wage a physical war, they waged a mental war. They tried to twist the words of Allah, trained muslim scholars, introduced new concepts to our religion and divided us into sects. In the end they achieved what they wanted. They convinced us that their man-made system(democracy/communism or whatever) was better than the perfect system of Allah ("This day I have PERFECTED your religion for you" ). They made sure we never recovered by placing agents in muslim countries as leaders to further oppress the ummah. They've labeled those who call for the rivival of Islam as "fundamentalists" (as if being a fundamentalist is a bad thing) and associated with them a negative image so muslims will be too affraid to associate with them (may Allah give us the courage to speak the truth under any circumstance). Today everywhere you look we're being oppressed as a result of the kafir's brainwashing. We've been led astray from Islam to the point where it is necessary to re teach islam to the masses. Muslims love their flag more than they love Islam. I can assure you if Somalia was invaded every single somali person would be on the front lines willing to die defending it, but when Islam is under attack we sit here and make excuses as to why we can't do anything. Allah tells us: "Ye are the best of peoples, evolved for mankind, enjoining what is right, forbidding what is wrong, and believing in Allah" (3:110 ). We're meant to be the best of the best not some helpless little creatures with kufaristic mentality. So let's undo the damage and start acting like MUSLIMS. May Allah guide us to the straight path, unite our hearts and break down the barriers that keep us divided. "And verily this Ummah of yours is a One Ummah, and I am your Lord, therefore serve Me." (23:52)
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| | Wednesday, November 29, 2000 - 12:55 pm I think if you want the answer just go to the mosque and ask people! I'm only 12 and I will even do that. It is obviuos that some answering that question has know knowledge of the Holy Quran. Bye to my fellow somali nationlist!
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| | Wednesday, November 29, 2000 - 07:23 pm Salam All This really sounds like a great but long discusion. Inshallah i will get around reading all of the post. salamzzzzz all 
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| | Friday, December 01, 2000 - 02:36 pm Qalool may Allah help you, you accused the prophet (pbuh) making a sin or a mistake. With your lack of Islam knowledge I don't blame you for not knowing the truth, I blame your stupidiness. Qoonsnade picked that name for your info. because is suspicious of the people who are being controlled by Satan. Why should you have the privlidge of judging people, for example why you judging Qoonsade by his name, when you said ''why you are judging Allah's creation?'' to Qoonsade. Qoonsade as the knowledge of not judging the creation of Allah unlike you , that you doubted that the prophet (pbuh) doesn't make no mistakes. You have ' tried' to prove that, but with the knowledge of our sisters and brothers they proved you wrong. You are a hypercrite Qalool you speak from Allah's words of not to judge people that it is Allah's duty witch is true. But in another hand you said the Holy Quran said that the prophet (pbuh) made mistakes in his life time. What you just said proves that you are judging Allah's words and the Satan is working on your mind. You my man are a kufar you judge Allah's words and accuse the prophet (pbuh) of making mistakes in his life. So Qalool we are clearly the creatures of Allah (muslims) that you should not take andvantage of the religion. On the day of judgement aren't we the umah of the prophet(pbuh) the first people to enter heaven, and who is going to take us there ,prophet Muhammed (pbuh) the one you accused to make mistakes! So Mac Salam by fellow 'pure' Muslims. And for your info. Qalool I'm really 12.
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| | Friday, December 01, 2000 - 02:49 pm wowwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww 12yr. old I loved ur post mashallah i never knew 12yr. old think like that but you have proved me Wrong mashalah i hope u keep up wat u are doing. SAlamzzzzzzzzzzzzz
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| | Saturday, December 02, 2000 - 08:36 am HI QOONSADE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!! HI QOONSADE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!! HI QOONSADE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!! HI QOONSADE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!! HI QOONSADE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!! HI QOONSADE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!! HI QOONSADE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!! HI QOONSADE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!! HI QOONSADE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!! HI QOONSADE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!! HI QOONSADE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!
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| | Saturday, December 23, 2000 - 07:41 am I AM A MUSLIM I AM A MUSLIM AND GOD I PRAISE FOR ALL HIS BLESSINGS MY VOICE I RAISE IN ONE GOD I BELIEVE NO EQUAL HAS HE LORD OF THE UNIVERSE COMPASSIONATE TO ME MUHAMMAD THE PROPHET TAUGHT ME THE WAY TO BE HONEST AND TRUTHFUL THROUGHOUT EVERY DAY THE HOLY QU'RAN TO LIFE IS MY GUIDE IT'S TEACHING I FOLLOW BY IT I ABIDE ISLAM MY RELIGION PREACHES GOOD DEEDS MERCY AND KINDNESS TO THE RIGHT PATH IT LEADS UPON ALL HUMANITY GOD SHOWERS HIS GRACE REGARDLESS OF COLOR NATIONALITY OR RACE THROUGH WORKING TOGETHER OUR HOPES INCREASE TO LIVE IN A WORLD FULLOF LOVE AND PEACE I AM A MUSLIM AND GOD I PRAISE FOR ALL HIS BLESSING MY VOICE I RAISE
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