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...SALLI; a Qur`anic perspective!

SomaliNet Forum (Archive): Islam (Religion): Archive (Before Feb 2000): ...SALLI; a Qur`anic perspective!
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Ahmad

Unrecorded Date
Asalama alaykum Muslims,

NOTE: Due to the people's dumping this discussion into others, it is called for its own one.


The word *SALLI* has been a word that trickly used for idol-worship. AS everything
else, the word is a good thing...but it has been turned into ONE thing in Islam. In this
article, i’m here to show the sincere Muslim what this word really means. I will put all
the places in the Qur`an where the word appears in its origional form - and from there
it’ll be, perhaps, clear to us..of what this multi-used...but
ONE-thing-for-used-by-muslims word really means. Please, for once -- open your ears
and heart and mind...and reason with God and His Holy Words:

-- “It is He who does *SALLI* on you(O you Believers)...and so His Angels, to bring
you out of darkness into light...and He is full of Mercy to the Believers.” 33.43

YUSUF ALI: He it is Who sends blessings on you, as do His angels, that He may
bring you out from the depths of Darkness into Light: and He is Full of Mercy to the
Believers.

SHAKIR: He it is Who sends His blessings on you, and (so do) His angels, that He
may bring you forth out of utter darkness into the light; and He is Merciful to the
believers.


-- “God and His Angels *SALLI* on the Prophet, O you who believe, *SALL* on him
and *SALLIMUU TASLIIMAA*” 33.56

YUSUF ALI: Allah and His angels send blessings on the Prophet: O ye that believe!
Send ye blessings on him, and salute him with all respect.

SHAKIR: Surely Allah and His angels bless the Prophet; O you who believe! call for
(Divine) blessings on him and salute him with a (becoming) salutation.

-- “Take from their wealth a charity to purify them and sanctify them. AND *SALLI*
for them(O you Prophet)..for your *SALLI* re-assures them. God is the Hearer, the
Knowing.” 9.103

YUSUF ALI: Of their wealth, take alms, that so thou mightest purify and sanctify
them; and pray on their behalf. Verily thy prayers are a source of security for them:
And Allah is One Who heareth and knoweth.

SHAKIR: Take alms out of their property, you would cleanse them and purify them
thereby, and pray for them; surely your prayer is a relief to them; and Allah is Hearing,
Knowing.

God, the Almighty, did *SALLI* for the Believers and so did His Angels. And He did
*SALLI* for the Prophet...and so did His Angels -- and God asked the Believers to do
the same for the Prophet Muhammad! And, then, God asks the Prophet to *SALL* for
the Believers -- and says...that his *SALLI* is a re-assurement for them.

I will quote a Submitter who did a good job in identifying this word. His name is A.
Muhammad. This article is based on his work -- May God bless those who point out
the correct things of the “corrupted” things. He says;

[To wiggle out of this tricky situation the interpreters have fabricated a ridiculous
excuse. They claim that the word ‘Sallawat’ has no less than five different meanings!!

1- First they will say that when God does the ‘Sallat’ to the prophet it means honoring
exclusively.

2- When God does the ‘Sallat’ to the believers it means granting them His mercy.

3- When the angels do the ‘Sallat’ to the prophet it means constantly praising him.

4- When the angels do the ‘Sallat’ to the believers, or when the prophet does it for the
believers, it is in the sense of imploring God’s mercy for them.

5- When the believers do the ‘Sallat’ to the prophet it is a sign of loving him and
following him.

If the word (Sallat) in the Quran can have all these meanings then the Quran is indeed
a collection of ambiguous puzzles!

To believe that God may say one simple word and imply five different meanings is to
imply that the Quran is vague and crooked! The important fact is that after all that,
and as it turns out, none of these five meanings is correct! To verify that let us study
the use of the word ‘Sallat’ in the Quran. Immediately we find that the word ‘Sallat’
has been mentioned in the Quran in two different context :

a- The ‘Sallat’ for Allah, which is an act of worship, as used in the following verse :

"I am God; there is no other God beside Me, Thus you shall worship me and observe
the ‘Sallat’ to commemorate Me."

b- The ‘Sallat’ of the prophet on the believers or of the believers on the prophet as
mentioned in previous verses.

The difference between the two uses of the same word all depends on the letter or the
word that comes immediately after the word ‘Sallat’.

The word ‘Sallat’ is either followed by the Arabic letter ‘L’ which means (to, for) as
in:

"……..observe the ‘Sallat’ to commemorate Me." (Sura 20, verse 14)

This first use, means the act of prayer, which is done exclusively for God.

The word ‘Sallat’ can also be followed by the Arabic word ‘Ala’ which means (on) as
in all the previous verses.

Now, if ‘Sallat for’ means the act of worship of God, what is the meaning of the word
‘Sallat on’ as the one done for the prophet or the believers?
Before we analyze this second meaning, which has been the cause of all the
corruption, we must first clarify a vital point. Consider the following example:
A father tells his son:

‘Like I wash my face, you too wash your face.’
The logic of this simple sentence suggests that since the father does one thing and asks
the son to do it as well, then it implies that the same action done by the father is done
by the son. It is not logical to assume that the father means to say:

‘When I wash my face I mean to wipe my face with water but when you wash your
face my son it means you should wash your feet!!’
Going back to (Sura 33, verse 56), and since the two verbs (Yossalloon and Salloo)
are used in the same verse, without any insinuation of a change in meaning, then by
logic they must have the same meaning.
Consequently, when God informs us that He and the angels (Yossalloon ala al Nabi),

then in the same sentence commands us to do the same, we must understand that it is
of the same meaning.

Here we reach the heart of the matter. What is the meaning of (Sallat ala al Nabi) that
can be done by God and by the believers equally? The same thing that is done by God
must be done by the believers, as per the previous example.

First, and to give the interpreters the benefit of the doubt, let us look at the five
different meanings they have suggested for the word ‘Sallat ala al Nabi’ and try to find
out if any of these meanings can possibly be done by God and also by the believers :

1- God bestowing honor on His servant:

This can be done by God to any of His servants, but it is not in the authority of any
human to honor another human on behalf of God.

2- To grant mercy:

Again this may only be done by God to any of His servants, all humans are themselves
in need of God’s mercy, they do not have it within them to grant one another God’s
mercy.

3- To constantly praise:

God is too exalted ( Al Moutaali ) and proud ( Al Moutakaber) than to constantly sing
the praises of any of those He has created. On the other hand, the Quran teaches the
believers that the only one worthy of constant praise is God.

4- To implore God’s mercy:

This may be done by believers but it does not make sense for God to implore Himself.

5- As a sign of following someone:

Again may not be done by God be exalted. He does not follow anyone.

From this brief analysis it is clear that some of these interpretations may be done by
God, while others may be done by human beings but there is not one interpretation
that could apply to God and human beings equally. What then is the correct meaning
of these words?

The only meaning for the words ‘Sallat ala al Nabi’ that is found in the Quran and that
can apply to God, His angels and to the believers alike is to ‘support the prophet’. God
and His angels indeed support the prophet and by the same token God commands the
believers to support His prophet. This correct meaning is confirmed by Quranic verses
:

1- God supports His prophet :

"We have bestowed upon you (O Muhammad) a great victory, whereby God forgives
your past sins, as well as future sins, and perfects His blessings on you, and guides you
in a straight path. Additionally, God will support you with an unwavering support."

2- The angels commanded by God to support the prophet :

"Your Lord supports you with three thousand angels, sent down (to support you)."

3- Believers commanded to support the prophet of God :

"(You shall give) to the needy who immigrated. They were evicted from their homes
and deprived of their properties, because they sought God’s grace and pleasure, and
because they supported God and His messenger. They are the sincere ones."

"If you fail to support him (the prophet), God has already supported him. Thus when
the disbelievers chased, him and he was one of two in the cave, he said to his friend,
‘Do not worry, God is with us’, God then sent contentment and security upon him, and
supported him with invisible soldiers."

"Those who believe in him (the prophet), respect him, SUPPORT HIM and follow the
light (the Quran) that was sent down with him are the truly successful ones."

It is clear from these verses that God commands believers to do three things regarding
His prophet :

1- To believe in him.

2- To support him.

3- To obey and follow his message (the Quran).
Thus the correct meaning of the words ‘Sallat ala al Nabi’ is to support the prophet.
Since the prophet is now dead and no longer with us then it is not possible to support
him personally. The support now is directed to his message which is the Quran.
With that correct meaning of the word, it is right to think that when God ‘Yessallee
ala al Momeneen’ it means He supports them and guides them out of the darkness.

This meaning is indeed confirmed in the verse :

"He is the one who ‘Yessallee alaikom’ (supports you), together with His angels, to
lead you out of the darkness into the light."

Similarly when God and His angels ‘Yessalloo ala al Nabi’ it is in the sense that He
supports the prophet together with His angels. God does not go around repeating the
words ‘Sallee ala al Nabi’, ‘Sallee ala al Nabi’ !!!

Similarly when the prophet ‘Yessalle ala al Momeneen’ (believers), as God
commanded him in (Sura 9, verse 103), it is in the sense, that is he is to support them.
Obviously God’s command to His prophet in this verse does not mean that the prophet
should go around saying ‘Sallee ala Zeid’, ‘Sallee ala Ali’, ‘Sallee ala Belal’ !!
It is important here to inspect some of the ‘hadith’ that are related to the ‘Sallat ala al
Nabi’ and verify their agreement with the Quran.
One of the very famous ‘hadith’ goes that the prophet said that whoever does not
‘Yessallee ala al Nabi’ will not attain the prophet’s ‘Shafa’a’ (intercession) on
judgment day. Various other ‘hadith’ indicate that the prophet emphasised his wish
that the believers should say these words for him. Here we must wonder, did the
prophet really ask this of the believers? And if not why? As stressed earlier in this
book, the verification of any concept, saying or ritual must be based on whether this
concept is in agreement with the Quran or not.
To verify these ‘hadith’ let us first read the following verses :

"Do not ask them for a return, you simply deliver this reminder for all the people."

"I have not asked you for any return. My return comes only from God. I have been
commanded to be a submitter."

"Say I do not ask you for any return"

These verses assert the fact that the prophet never asked the believers for anything in
return for delivering God’s message to them. It is indeed far more respectful to think
of the prophet as he who’s mission was much more noble than to go around saying do
this for me or do that (e.g. if you do not visit my grave I will not intercede for you, and
if you do not ‘Tessallo alaya’ I will not do that for you ......etc.)

Another of the cherished ‘hadith’ implies that the prophet instructed Muslims to say a
specific prayer for him. The words of this prayer are as follows :

‘Aaty (grant) Sayedna (our Master/Lord) Muhammad the way, the virtue and the
highest degree and deliver him to the praise worthy status that You promised him,
You do not break Your promises.’

This simple everyday prayer contains various violations of the teachings of the Quran:

1- To believe that the prophet has asked the believers to do something for him is in
violation of the previous Quranic verses that command the prophet to ask for no return
whatsoever from the believers. The only return he will receive will be from God.

2- It is indeed wrong in the sight of God to call anyone our Lord except He.

"Or have they set up other Lords besides Him, God is the only Lord and Master"

3- The one who uses such a prayer is the one who either never read the Quran or has
read it but does not really believe it! This is because Sura 48 confirms that God has
informed the prophet that He has forgiven him all his sins, past and future :

"We have bestowed upon you (O Muhammad) a great victory, whereby God forgives
your past, as well as future sins."

What this great sign of mercy from God to his prophet means is that Muhammad is
secured the highest reward in the hereafter (since he is forgiven all his sins). As a
result, no prayer could elevate his position any higher (since there is none better than
he who has been forgiven all sins in advance!).

4- The words ‘you do not break your promises’, are to say the least insulting to God.
The utterance of these words can only mean that whoever speaks them is not really
sure if God will keep His promise and that a small reminder will come handy !!
Instead, when a true believer reads in the Quran that God has forgiven the prophet all
his sins, will consider the matter a closed one. He will not need to remind God of His
promises.

If this is the correct meaning of the words ‘Sallat ala al Nabi’, then what is the
meaning of the word ‘Tasslleem’ as in ‘Wa sallemoo tasleema’ (Sura 33, verse 56)?
Sadly, the corrupted interpreters have found another corrupted meaning to these words
as well. They claim that these words are a command from God to salute the prophet
and send him our greetings! This is based on their false interpretation of the word
‘Tasleema’ to mean greetings!

This is contrary to the meaning of the word in the Quran as will be demonstrated, but
before doing that we must consider all similar words to ‘Tasleem’ that are used in the
Quran.

1- Islam: Which means submission to the will of God as in:

"The only religion approved by God is Islam"

"Anyone who adopts other than Islam as his religion, it will not be accepted from him,
and in the Hereafter he will be with the losers.’

2- Salam: Which means greetings as in:

"Do not say to the one who offers you Salam (greetings), ‘You are not a believer....."

3- Salm: Which is the opposite of war as in:

"If they are inclined towards Salm (peace), then so shall you and put your trust in God.
He is the Hearer, the Omniscient."

4- Saleem: Which means without defects as in:

"That is the day when neither money nor children will be of any use, only the ones
who come to God with a heart that is Saleem (without defects, pure) (will be saved)."

5- Istisllam: Which means surrender as in:

"Stop them and ask them, ‘How come you do not help one another?’ On that day they
will be Mostaslemoon (in total surrender)."

6- Soullaman : Which means a ladder as in:

"And if their rejection gets to be too much for you, you should know that even if you
dug a tunnel through the earth, or climbed a Soullama (ladder) into the sky, and
produced a miracle for them (they still would not believe)...."

7- Tasleem: Which means recognition and acceptance.
As in the subject of this search (33:56)
It is noteworthy to mention that the word ‘Taslleem’ is found in only three verses in
the Quran, and in all three verses it means to recognize and endorse:

"Never indeed, by your Lord; they are not believers until they come to you to judge in
their disputes, then have no objection to your judgment and ‘Yessallemoo Taslleema’
(totally accepting and endorsing it)."

"When the believers saw the parties ( ready to attack ), they said, ‘This is what God
and His messenger had promised us, indeed God and His messenger have been
truthful. All this strengthened their Iman and Taslleem (faith and recognition).”

"God and His angels ‘Yessalloo ala al Nabi’ (support him). O you who believe you
shall ‘Salloo alayhee’ (support him) and Sallemoo Taslleema , ( fully recognize him
and accept him as the messenger of God)."
A very simple and effective way of proving that the word ‘Tasslleem’ means
recognition and not greetings as the corrupters would have us believe, is to substitute
each of these two words, first (recognition), then (greetings) in place of the word
‘Tasslleem’ in each of the previous verses and see which one of the two words make
more sense.

Let us start with the word greetings:

- ".........they are not believers until they come to you to judge in their disputes, then
have no objection to your judgment and greetings" !!

- ".....indeed God and His messenger have been truthful. All this strengthened their
Iman and greetings" !!!!!
It is obvious that the substitution of the word greetings in these verses makes no sense
whatsoever. However if we insert the word recognition in place of ‘Tasslleem’ all
three verses will make perfect sense.
The correct meaning of verse 56 of Sura 33 is thus:

"God and His angels support the prophet, O you who believe you too shall support him
and fully recognize and accept him (as the prophet of God)."

Indeed it makes perfect sense that God should command the believers to support His
prophet and totally accept him rather than to be primarily concerned in people going
around saying (Sallee ala al Nabi) without understanding what it really means and
sending our greeting to the prophet who is dead and can no longer hear us, (see Sura
35, verse 14).

However, the corrupters have come up with the most absurd scenario to justify the
need to constantly greet the prophet. They claim that the prophet is alive in his grave,
that he can see us when we visit his grave, that he hears us when we greet him and
actually replies to our greetings!! (I had a somali imam tell me that if you send ten
“salams” on the prophet, he will send 100 on you -- and if you send 100 on him, he
will send 1000 on you!!! The prophet, in other words, inter-acts with us -- even when
he is no longer alive in this world. WHAT AN IDOL-WORSHIP!!!)

This absurd fabrication is once again in contradiction to various Quranic verses.

FIRST

Indeed the prophet is alive, however he is definitely not in his grave but up somewhere
in the kingdom of God. This is confirmed by various verses that indicate that the
righteous are not dead but are alive and prosperous in God’s Kingdom.

SECOND

The prophet does not return the greetings simply because the Quran affirms that those
who died cannot hear us, and thus cannot respond to us:

"Those you call on other than Him (your Lord) do not possess as much as a seed’s
shell. If you call on them they cannot hear you. Even if they heard you they cannot
respond to you...."

The Quran states that a barrier separates the dead from the living :

"A barrier will separate them from this world till the day they are resurrected."
For all that, the correct meaning of (Sura 33, verse 56) is:

"God and His angels support the prophet, O you who believe, you too shall support
him and fully recognize and accept him (as the prophet of God)."

This accurate and precise meaning is asserted and authenticated in the following
verse:

"Those who believe in him (the prophet), and respect him, and support him, and
follow the light (the Quran) that was brought down with him, those are the truly
successful ones."

This verse includes all that God commanded us to do for the prophet :

1- To believe in him, which corresponds to (Sallemoo Tasleema) in 33:56

2- To support him which correspond to (Salloo Alayhee) in the same verse.

3- To obey him (to follow the message that was revealed to him, which is the Quran).
This is what God commands any people to do for their prophet, whether they are the
people of Moses, Jesus or Muhammad.
The importance of this last verse is profound since it exposes the corrupted
interpretation of three prime concepts :

1- ‘Sallemmo Tasllemma’ is a command from God to the believers to recognize and
believe in His prophet, it is not a command from God for them to send him
greetings!!!

2- ‘Salloo Alayhee’ is a command from God to the believers to support His prophet, it
is not a command to the believers to go around like parrots repeating ‘Salli ala al
Nabi’ without even knowing what it means!

3- To obey the prophet is a command from God to the believers to follow the light
(Quran) that He has revealed to His prophet (7:157), it is not a command to follow that
which is falsely attributed to the prophet, and called his Sunna, and which was never
mentioned in the Quran, not even once!
The only Sunna authorized in the Quran is the Sunna of God.]


I clap for this guy -- because he touches the Truth. “ALLAHU WA MALAA`IKITIHI
YUSALLUUNA CALAA NABIYI” I sure hope nobody believes God goes around
ALL day -- saying “*Allahuma* salli calaa Muxammadan wa calaa aali Muxammadan kamaa sallayta Ibraahiima wa calaa aali Ibraahiima...blah blah blah” -- this would make God a worshiper of
Muhammad himself. God supported the Prophet -- whenever he needed Him...the
Angels physically participated -- and thus they too supported him...even when God
ordered them. I always thought this verse meant that God and His Angels always say;
“Allahuma salli calaa muxammadan wa calaa aali muxammadan -- kama salayta calaa
ibraahiima -- wa calaa aala ibraahima inaka xamiidul majiid” this is RIDICULEOUS
-- since God cannot pray to another God. This is GOOD -- when the Prophet was alive
to be done by the BELIEVERS...for it says; “O God, SUPPORT Muhammad and the
family of Muhammad -- as you supported the Abraham and the Family of Abraham...”
The intrepretors of YUSUF ALI and SHAKIR(along many others) tafsiir this word as
“BLESS”. Nothing can be more ridiculeous than that. PLEASE NOTE -- that this
thing we’re asked is ALSO done by God and His Angels. DO you believe God and His
Angels pray for the Prophet to be Blessed??? I could understand the Angels -- but who
is GOD “praying to bless”.

They translate it as “GOD AND HIS ANGELS SEND BLESSING ON THE
PROPHET” -- this is RUDE and evil...since “BLESSING” is an acting of
authority...which CANNOT be done by anyone except God. You can’t go around
blessing people -- yes...you CAN ask for blessings...but you can’t bless them -- none
can EXCEPT God. Angels do not possess such powers. And Angels might’ve asked
Blessings from God -- but who did God asks blessings from??? Another god beside
him? The “SON” perhaps??? Cursed are the idol-worshipper!!!

This even gets more interesting WHEN the Believers get “SALLI” -- God
asks...blessings for the Belivers along with the Angels??? Because we established --
that Angels cannot send “Blessings” along with God. OH, MY GOD! Truly, Man is
ungrateful being!


Peace - Ahmad!

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umar

Unrecorded Date
Ahmed said:
"The word *SALLI* has been a word that trickly used for idol-worship."

Here you go again with the "idol-worship" antics from Ahmed.

The only "idol-worship" we see on here is the rhetoric that Ahmed worships(his idol-talk).

Ahmed said:
"I will quote a Submitter who did a good job in identifying this word. His name is A.
Muhammad. This article is based on his work -- May God bless those who point out
the correct things of the “corrupted” things."

Ahmed is here using with one of his masquerading tricks. What we have on here is a one submitter by the name of Ahmed sending *SALI* blessings on another submitter by the name of A. Muhammad.

Ahmed is here making DUCA for one of his fellow submitters. He says "May God bless those who point out the correct things of the “corrupted” things."!


"Innal-Allahu wa malaa`ikitihi yusalluuna cala Nabiyi...Yaa ayuhal ladiina aaminuu...SALUU calayhim wa SALIMUU tasliimaa"---"Verily Allah and His angles send their blessings upon the prophet. O you who believe! send your blessings also upon him and salute him with a goodly salutation".

ALAAHUMA SALI CALAA MUXAMADAN WA CALAA AALI MUXAMADAN KAMAA SALAYTA CALAA IBRAAHIIMA WA CALAA AALI IBRAAHIIMA INAKA XAMIIDU MAJIID. ALAAHUMA BAARIK CALAA MUXAMADAN WA CALAA MUXAMADAN KAMAA BARAAKTA CALAA IBRAAHIIMA WA CALAA IBRAAHIIMA INAKA XAMIIDU MAJIID----O Allah! send your blessings(and the Holy Words of Yours) upon Muhammad and the family of Muhammad, as You have send blessings upon Ibrahiim and the family of Ibraahim. You are worthy of all praise, All Glorious. O Allah! bless Muhammad and the family of Muhammad as You have already blessed Ibraahim and the family of Ibraahim. You are worthy of all praise, All Glorious.--WA INAKA LA CALAA KHULIQIN CADIIM--An verily, you(O Muhammad) are of a high and noble disposition"

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Ahmad

Unrecorded Date
Asalama Alaykum Muslims!

Umar,

human weakness! you concentrate on "me" and "who"...you miss the message, entirely.

lets try this again. you think it's "blessing"???

THIS is what it says; "allahu wa malaa`ikitihi yusalluuna cala nabiyi" "god and his angels *blah*" now, this is something that god and the angels participate in doing together. blessing cannot be that. blessing ONLY comes from god. you cannot bless anyone. IF it was "blessing" god would say; "god blesses his messenger and the angels ASK blessings for him...so you guys ask blessings for him, as well" see? hehehe!

it is idol-worship to make "salli" exclusively to the prophet.

answer this for me, god asks the prophet himself to make "salli" for the believers -- do you believe that muhammad sends blessings to us today? this will be all i will need to know, surely! trust me, i have seen people who worship other gods, LITERALLY, it will not be a surprise thing to see people who worship other gods, inobviously.

i once watched a christian video -- there was a church in the video. it had two phrases in the two wall-sides; "hear, o israel, our lord god is one." and the other side said; "in the father, and the son, and the holy ghost" this is a perfect example how human beings try to do worship while trying to "protect" against it.

as for me praying for A. Mohamaed, of course, he deserved it -- he did a good job...explaining what is what. and no, there is nothing wrong with praying for others -- it's the way you pray for them, that is.


peace - adam!

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umar

Unrecorded Date
Ahmed said:
"human weakness! you concentrate on "me" and "who"...you miss the message, entirely."

Well, it is Ahmed who does not see his own "idol-worship"


Ahmed said:
"lets try this again. you think it's "blessing"??? THIS is what it says; "allahu wa malaa`ikitihi yusalluuna cala nabiyi" "god and his angels *blah*"

"blah" = "yahaa ayuha ladiina aamanuu SALUU calayhim, was SALAAMINUU TASLIIMA" = O you who believe! send your blessings also upon him and salute him with a goodly salutation". Allah and the angles SEND THEIR BLESSINGS UPON MUHAMMAD AND WE SEND OUR BLESSINGS UPON MUHAMMAD.

Ahmed said:
"now, this is something that god and the angels participate in doing together. blessing cannot be that. blessing ONLY comes from god. you cannot bless anyone."

Well, no. Allah SENDS HIS BLESSING UPON THE PROPHET and ANGLES DO THE SAME THINGS AND WE ARE ASKED TO DO THE SAME THINGS ALSO.

Sending blessings means passing on glad tidings upon Muhammad. Allah sends glad tiding to whomsoever He wants to. The angles and us also wish many happy returns to our messenger and ask for Allah to shower His blessings upon Muhammad.


Ahmed said:
"blessing ONLY comes from god."

Well, yes but we also bless *things* and *human *beings* by asking Allah to accept it in the name of Him and in His permission.


Ahmed said:
"you cannot bless anyone."

And did not Ahmed send *SALI* to his fellow submitter--- when he said this: "May God bless those who point out the correct things of the “corrupted” things"?

Ahmed said:
"IF it was "blessing" god would say; "god blesses his messenger and the angels ASK blessings for him...so you guys ask blessings for him, as well" see? hehehe!"

Well, the verse says INA-ALLAH WA MALAA'IKATUHU YU *SALUUNA CALA NABIYI*, no the way Allah said it---"allahu wa malaa`ikitihi yusalluuna cala nabiyi".

And yes, Allah BLESSES. And angels us BLESS in the name of Him(Allah).


Ahmed said:
"it is idol-worship to make "salli" exclusively to the prophet."

Well, we send "salli" to other prophets too and we even send "salli" to anything good that comes from Ahmed.

You see, I bless(cleanse, disinfect, sanitize, decontaminate, clean, purify) the food I eat in the name of Allah(BISMI-ALLAH). Then, does Ahmed think that I'm worshipping the food also?

Ahmed said:
"answer this for me, god asks the prophet himself to make "salli" for the believers -- do you believe that muhammad sends blessings to us today?"

Well, Allah asked(not asks) the prophet to make "salli" for the believers when he was alive(not when Muhammad died). So, how can a dead person send blessings after he died? !

Ahmed said:
"this will be all i will need to know"

Ahmed got it or did he?

Ahmed said:
"trust me, i have seen people who worship other gods, LITERALLY, it will not be a surprise thing to see people who worship other gods, inobviously."

Yes, it is Ahmed who does not see his own hypocrisy and his own idol-worship when he send *SALLI* to his fellow submitter, but does not want us to send *SALLI* to our messenger!!

Ahmed said:
"as for me praying for A. Mohamaed, of course, he deserved it -- he did a good job...explaining what is what."

Our last messenger/prophet Muhammad did better than the Muhammad Ahmed worships.

Ahmed said:
"and no, there is nothing wrong with praying for others -- it's the way you pray for them, that is."

Hypocrisy is cheap.

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umar

Unrecorded Date
Correction:

Well, the verse says INA-ALLAH WA MALAA'IKATUHU YU *SALUUNA CALA NABIYI*, not the way Ahmed said it---"allahu wa malaa`ikitihi yusalluuna cala nabiyi". And yes, Allah BLESSES. And angels and us also BLESS in the name of Him(Allah).


Ahmed said:
"it is idol-worship to make "salli" exclusively to the prophet."

Well, we send "salli" to other prophets too and we even send "salli" to anything good that comes from Allah. You see, I bless(cleanse, disinfect, sanitize, decontaminate, clean, purify) the food I eat in the name of Allah(BISMI-ALLAH). Then, does Ahmed think that I'm worshipping the food also?

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Ahmad

Unrecorded Date
asalama alaykum muslims,

umar,

don't be brainless. god asks "blessings" from who??? i mean, i understand angels ask from god...and humans would ask from god. but who would god ask from?????

according to some muslims, when prophet muhammad was asked how do we do that. he told them a prayer...which starts with; "O god send your blessings on muhammad...blah blah blah" now, that is fine -- i see that as a prayer for the prophet. but this means, god and angels do the same?...so god says; "allahuma salli calaa muxammad" -- which "allah" "god" is god asking this from????

god and the angels sent "salli" to the prophet. but also -- not that, but god asks muslims to send "salli" to the prophet. god then asks muhammad to send "salli" to the muslims. god and the angels then send "salli" to the prophet.

someone who has brains will reason with the following;

[1- God bestowing honor on His servant:

This can be done by God to any of His servants, but it is not in the authority of any
human to honor another human on behalf of God.

2- To grant mercy:

Again this may only be done by God to any of His servants, all humans are themselves
in need of God’s mercy, they do not have it within them to grant one another God’s
mercy.

3- To constantly praise:

God is too exalted ( Al Moutaali ) and proud ( Al Moutakaber) than to constantly sing
the praises of any of those He has created. On the other hand, the Quran teaches the
believers that the only one worthy of constant praise is God.

4- To implore God’s mercy:

This may be done by believers but it does not make sense for God to implore Himself.

5- As a sign of following someone:

Again may not be done by God be exalted. He does not follow anyone.]

yu tell me!!!


you said;

[Ahmed said:
"blessing ONLY comes from god."

Well, yes but we also bless *things* and *human *beings* by asking Allah to accept it in the name of Him and in His permission.]

that wasn't what i said. nobody but god can do a direct blessing to anything. we don't bless things...we ask for it for others.


you said;

[And did not Ahmed send *SALI* to his fellow submitter--- when he said this: "May God bless those who point out the correct things of the “corrupted” things"?]

he's not my *fellow* anything. we meet in god and in islam -- as sunnis, shias, wahabias, etc -- and it's YOU who are going around with nonsense. however, i did not send "salli" to this guy. i asked GOD to bless those who point out the correct things. I asked god to bless those -- not to send "salli". also -- notice, i didn't say; " i bless those who point out" i asked GOD to do it. hahah!


you said;

[Ahmed said:
"it is idol-worship to make "salli" exclusively to the prophet."

Well, we send "salli" to other prophets too and we even send "salli" to anything good that comes from Ahmed.

You see, I bless(cleanse, disinfect, sanitize, decontaminate, clean, purify) the food I eat in the name of Allah(BISMI-ALLAH). Then, does Ahmed think that I'm worshipping the food also?]

LIAR! you don't send *salli* to other prophets -- oh...what a liar. you only say about other prophets "calayhi salaam" which means "peace be upon him" please, tell me the last thing you said..."o god, send your blessings on Noah and abraham and moses and aaron and jesus"???? lying gets nobody nowhere, dear!


you said;

[Ahmed said:
"answer this for me, god asks the prophet himself to make "salli" for the believers -- do you believe that muhammad sends blessings to us today?"

Well, Allah asked(not asks) the prophet to make "salli" for the believers when he was alive(not when Muhammad died). So, how can a dead person send blessings after he died? !]

similar, if it's *blessing* -- then why bother when muhammad is no longer here? do you have a doubt that muhammad may go to hell? i don't. so why are you "praying" for him? do you think he may be in trouble for anything? did god not forgive his past and future sins? do you see how ridiculeous this is? you're finally showing some brains, brother! ;)


You said;
[Yes, it is Ahmed who does not see his own hypocrisy and his own idol-worship when he send *SALLI* to his fellow submitter, but does not want us to send *SALLI* to our messenger!!]

ah, but ahmad doesn't believe "blessing" is a salli! also, ahmad doesn't think muhammad needs any blessing -- he thinks muhammad ALREADY resides in paradise and with his lord in happiness...forever.

you said;

[Well, the verse says INA-ALLAH WA MALAA'IKATUHU YU *SALUUNA CALA NABIYI*, not the way Ahmed said it---"allahu wa malaa`ikitihi yusalluuna cala nabiyi". And yes, Allah BLESSES. And angels and us also BLESS in the name of Him(Allah).]

aren't we having trouble with what version of quran we have -- egyptian, saudi, iran, lebanon?

however...it's actually; "WA MALAA`IKATAHU" not "TUHU"...and it is "INA-ALLAHA"...not "ina allah"...and it's "CALAL-NABIYI" not "cala nabiyi"...but all make perfect sense.

the point is...god did not say; "Allah blesses...and angels bless in HIM....so you guys bless him in Him, also" he said; "GOD AND THE ANGELS"(THUS...God and Angels both did) you see what i mean???

you said;

[Ahmed said:
"it is idol-worship to make "salli" exclusively to the prophet."

Well, we send "salli" to other prophets too and we even send "salli" to anything good that comes from Allah. You see, I bless(cleanse, disinfect, sanitize, decontaminate, clean, purify) the food I eat in the name of Allah(BISMI-ALLAH). Then, does Ahmed think that I'm worshipping the food also?]

Once again, LIAR! u don't say; "o god bless my food" remember, that is "how" the prophet said he wanted to be *blessed* "Allahuma salli calaa muxammad, wa calaa aali muxammad"...etc etc! Gotcha! saying "bis-millah" just means you start with the name of God. do you do salli on the "food" then?

RE-read the article of A. Mohamed...where he relates other stuff that was used "SALLI" for...that have nothing to do with sending "blessings".


peace - ahmad!

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