     MAD MAC | Unrecorded Date
Where are all my Friends and adversaries on the net. I was asking OPSODOS a little while ago. This thing is becomoing BORING!!!! Sam, Somali, Hebel, Trouble, are you guys still alive or what? Now I'll start the conversation with my latest, greatest idea (actually it's an old idea). How 'bout a Somali confederation? Instead of a strong central government we have strong regional governments. These governments would be responsible for taxation, basic education, police, courts. National government would have a weak central government with a weak chief executive and most powers vested in parliament. That would mean no one man in Somalia would have a lot of power. It would also allow maximum autonomy to local governments so each clan could have it's own say in things while still belonging to a greater Somalia. The National government would also be respoinsible for defense and foreign affairs. What do you guys think? |
| JUXA | Unrecorded Date
How can a national government be responsible for defence when it is that weak?
I would vote for a powerful cenrtal government with powerful regional governments. Canada which is one of the leading democratic countries is now studying the systems of Israel, Germany and (I am not sure but either of Brazil/Argentine) to improve its constitution. This Canadian sytem works but it has many flaws. For instance if province x elects candidates from y party but party z gets the majority then province ex will not have representatives in the government. Also, Ontario has the majority population and because of that most government officials are from this province. The elected official cares for the ppl who elected him/her more than any other ppl so many trade contracts with forieng countries end up in Ontario.
I think Somalia needs Islam based yet democratic system where, unlike pakistan and other third world countries the military has no business in how the gornment is run. We also do not need a kingdom or one man show. Look @ Syria, if this guy dies his son will takeover. even in Somalia, If Aidid was the ruler of Somalia when he died, his son would be wisked from America to run the country! We need a system (constitution) not individuals. |
| Anonymous | Unrecorded Date
Juxa, you seem to be confused. You have to calm down and make choices. If you want a Sharia state you have models like the Saudi kingdom, Afganistan, Pakitsan.... but if you want a democratic secular state you also have models Canada, Israel, Brazil, Argentina. Don't mix up things, specially Sharia and democracy |
| MAD MAC | Unrecorded Date
I agree with everything except your very beginning thesis. You can't have strong central and regional governments. Perhaps we're using different definitions of strong. What I mean is that most of the authority for taxation, education, policing and legal affairs should be vested in the Regional governments. The National Government should be responsible for Defense and international affairs. So unlike a National government that has authority over a lot of different things I think the national governments scope should be small. The objective is to ensure that the "president" doesn't have enough power to abuse it. the power is difused amonsgt the a parliament and regions to ensure no one can steal the national treasury. |
| MAD MAC | Unrecorded Date
Anonymous
You can have Sharia LAW without necessarily governance. That is, the laws governing individual action can be dictated by Sharia while the Koran is used to guide the construction of the constitution. Democracy and Sharia can live side by side. Sharia doesn't mean, at least in my Kufaar understanding, that the form of government must be dictatorial. A dictatorial government style will never work in Somalia, since everyone is a member of a clan and is therefore suspect by everyone who is not of his clan. Does that make sense Abowe? |
| CiiseRooti | Unrecorded Date
So let's skip to da political, part of da discusions,
Mac
Let me ask ya dis, what do ya think about Communism?
CiiseRooti |
| Sam | Unrecorded Date
I can see the "experts" are burning their brains out.. Mad Mac there you go again putting the cart before the horse.
Somalia does not need to borrow from alien systems of governance. its situation is unique and it needs a system that is home grown,, based on religious and cultural methods of resource distribution.
Democracy should not be glorified as a it is the answer to all the ills of the World. In many cases this system is often rife with inequality and injustice. Its hypocracy in disguise.
The only system that has a chance to thrive is one that is based on distributive justice.
In a democrasy the "Majority" which is often a small segment of the society who have the resources and excesses to take part in this circus, are the ones that dictate to others.
In this so called democracy circus where "the winner takes it all", the ones that benefit the most are the "Special Interest" groups. In the western countries this special interest groups are the big corporations and the upper and middle classes.
In countries such as Somalia where classes are not well defined, the special interest groups are the clans. Therefore, individuals who have their own agenda, and their own self interest in mind, use their respective clans as a tool to gain power. This explains why every group wants it Own clown to be in controll. Its a circus that has no end.
Thats why we need a system based on distributive Justice, whereby each group no matter how small or big is accorded their share of resources, and power should also be distributed in that manner.
True peace is not the mere absence of tension its the presence of justice,,..
No Justice.......No Peace |
| hebel | Unrecorded Date
sheesh I hate this man. |
| Anonymous | Unrecorded Date
Sam, nice essay )): Forget about democracy and majority rule, let's have an Itihad Emir who will punish and reward whomever he wants i.e. will distribute justice!!
Man you are pathetic..is all i can say. |
| MAD MAC | Unrecorded Date
Sam
I'm not actually picking a model for what kind of democracy. I favor the US kind, but not necessarily in Somalia. And of course we have to be careful about what Thomas Jefferson called the "tyrany of the majority." But having read your critique on democracy I am reminded of Winston Churchills quote "democracy is a terrible form of government. It's just better than all the other choices." But what I don't understand is what is "Distributive Justtice" How does such a form of government work? I've never heard of it. Can you explain the mechanics of it to me? Obviously democracy is an umbrella and there are different types, like there are different types of Moslems or different types of Christains. What are the tenets of such a government and are there any examples, current or historical that I can reference?
Ciiserooti
I think communism is a hopelessly flawed system of government - or more properly a hopelessly flawed economic theory since it's not really neccessarily a system of government. You could have a communist democracy or a communist theocracy. The problem with communism and socialism is they kill individual initiative. They don't reward it. As a result individual motivation goes down. In general I think less government is better. There are minimum things that are neccessary for a state to function but small is good. The more people can live without regulation the better. |
| Mooryaanka. | Unrecorded Date
To the "Anony".
I think Mad Mac the gaalka has more
respect to your people than your envy
soul does. If you are not a muslim why not
stay where you belong. You already have
what you wanted. a free access to all the
evil you can do. And then hypocricy is always
in disguise isn't it. |
| salmaan. | Unrecorded Date
Sam.
Don't be discouraged by the underdogs of a system that they themselves can't fathom what it stands for. The rule of the majority is really the surface cry of the democratic system but in reality money, power and prestige rules. How many lobbies do we have in the united states?. They rule and they don't represent anyone except outside interests and inside greed ridden individuals. That is why they need A FUND RAISING REFORMS before the whole system turns out to be FOR SALE(it already is).It is just a bogus system that brings excruciating pians and ills to the poor and to the disadvantaged.
Anonymous.
May allah save your soul. I have nothing else to say to you except that you are DIXIRI. |
| Ma Dawg | Unrecorded Date
Mad Mac.
where the parties at in your city, maybe coming for a short vac |
| MAD MAC | Unrecorded Date
Ma Dawg
Actually Sarajevo is a rocking city and fairly inexpensive. BUT, I'm not allowed out of the compound much. And we lock down at night and I can't get out at all then. But if you let me ask the local hires I'll get back with you tomorrow if you're serious.
Salmaan
You know it's no secret that there are flaws in the US system of government. I personnaly think it's a better system of representative government than parliamentary democracy but that's certainly debatable. And I certainly don't think the Somalis should copy it. But this discussion isn't about the US form of government. Not much you or I can do about that. But as for Somalia. which is wide open right now, but what do you propose? And Sam, what was this other system you were talking about? How does Distributive Justice work? Who decides what is just and what is not? What are the mechanics of this form of government? |
| Ma Dawg | Unrecorded Date
Mad Mac
Yeah Bro I am serious, you got any Somali UN personnel working in Sarajevo? when do they let you out for little bit of RR |
| MAD MAC | Unrecorded Date
OK, I'll talk to my friends here today. The UNHCR is working here. OHR is working here as well. Are you looking for employment with the UN or looking for friends (there were two Somalis working here a couple of years ago on my last tour here but now I don't know if there are any). Anyway, I'll drop something here on the Sarajevo night life scene as soon as I can. The old sniper alley has a lot of good clubs and cafes - or so I've heard, but beyond that I couldn't say right now. |
| Michigan | Unrecorded Date
NO it was Hebel and Michigan who shot them. and Kuusey nah cut them with knives. |
| MAD MAC | Unrecorded Date
Ma Dawg
Oh and no R&R for me until probably July. And then I'm flying back to Germany to see my girlfriend.
Michigan
What are you talking about? Are you another weirdo on the net? |
| Sam | Unrecorded Date
Mad"
Distributive justice is based on a system that calls for the fairness and equality in sharing the resources.
If you have not heard of it maybe its beacause of your alleged proffession. The millitary is suppose to preserve the status quo' you do what you are told, you dont ask "why" you just do it. Thats your job. Let others do the thinking, you just carry out the dirty part of the job.
Here is food for thought.....
America is the richest country in the World,,,, yet according to UNICEF, there are 13.5 Million children in America who live in Poverty.
Where is the distributive Justice ???
They spend Billions of dollars sending people to MARS... to see if there was life there once... yet they dont care about the children lives here on Earth., in their own country.
In Nigeria, Oil worth billions of dollars is being exported from the Ogoni Land, by Multinational Corporations such as Shell. While the people of Ogoni live in absolute porverty. They dont have basic needs such as water and Hospitals, the natives of this land have been neglected and many who dare speak out have been murdered.
In Sudan the same thing is going on..
where is the distributive justice ??
In Somalia, the Italians grow bananas for export while children are starving. The best land has been grabbed by Multinationals who cater for the west......
In south Africa, the black Majortiy live in poverty while diamond and Gold is harvested from their land....
Conflict is always over resources, when you have a system that is unjust and there is no justice peace will always be compromised.
Everyone should get their piece of the pie,, that what distributive justice is all about.
No justice No Peace. |
| Anonymous | Unrecorded Date
Somalia is in so deep sh.. that every country look at it and thank god for their status quo however bad!. Here we have a good-for-nothing somali who is pondering and angry about the poverty in America, Nigeria and Sudan. what an irony. |
| MAD MAC | Unrecorded Date
Sam - MA Dawg I wrote you at the bottom
I am reminded of a book written by P.J. O'Rourke. And I quote:
"I went to a government class. There a student commented on how unfair it is that presidents of large corporations make huge amounts of money while the workers make hardly any. Doubtless this is unfair. But corporations have Shareholders, boards of directors, customers and workers who are free to fire, sell, boycott or strike if they don't like the corporate pay structure. From whom would these individual freedoms be taken away and to whoom would the collective power of deciding what's fair be given. The young man wasn't sure. 'But it's unfair' he said."
So my question stands. Your complaint is the same complaint postulated by Karl Marx. Not an invalid complaint but as history teaches us his solution was a little off the mark.
One last point, for what it's worth. The definition of living in povety in America is somethwat out of whack. Four out of every 5 household in America listed as living in poverty have TVs, VCRs, stereos and automobiles. If a child is going hungary it's because the parents are really tending to it, because there are sufficient social welfare systems in place to provide sustenance. I'd just keeo that in mind. I'm not saying everything in America is just - no two things born on this earth ever had an equal chance at anything. I'm just saying that sometimes statistics can be somewhat deceiving. However, it's really not germain to the discussion. So just ignore this last paragraph for the sake of our discussion.
Ma Dawg
OK Abowe, the best place for a foreigner to go here(this is not always an open-minded society) is the Internet Cafe (sometimes called THE BAR). If you are driving from Ilidza or the airport it's on the left hand side about four hundred meters before you reach the presidency. The Irish Pub down by the stadium is also suppose to be pretty good. Lastly, you might try senators on sniper alley. Has a reputation as a rockin' place but also known for a lot of criminal activity. Hope that helps. |
| MAD MAC | Unrecorded Date
Sam, Ma Dawg, Hebel
Where the hell are you guys? Did the Mooryan finally get you or are on vacation or something? |
| Alela | Unrecorded Date
ANYBODY THERE???
WHERE IS EVERYBODY?
I GUESS I AM HERE AT THE WRONG TIME HUH??? |
| MAD MAC | Unrecorded Date
I'm still here. I think everyone else died in a tragic accident or something. |
| Alela | Unrecorded Date
HI MAD MAC
ARE U THERE? |
| Alela | Unrecorded Date
??? |
| MAD MAC | Unrecorded Date
I'm still here Sahib |
| Alela | Unrecorded Date
MAD MAC
Sahib WE allways mised by hours
when I am here U are not and tha same for U!! he he he he |
| Alela | Unrecorded Date
Only 28 minutes different huh
cool getting closer @lol he he he |
| MAD MAC | Unrecorded Date
The problem is no one else is here and there's no one to argue with. How boring. At this point I'd be happy to have OPSODOS on the net insulting me. Speaking of which, do you know what the hell OPSODOS means? |
| Alela | Unrecorded Date
No what is it???? |
| MAD MAC | Unrecorded Date
I don't know and she won't tell me. Like it's classified or something. I was hoping it was Somali or at least something Somalis would recognize. Guess not. |
| Alela | Unrecorded Date
I have never heard before!!!!!!!!
but any other words that U need to know
feel free to ask me. |
| T-GIRL | Unrecorded Date
DID ANY 1 CALL 4 TROUBLE???????? |
| MAD MAC | Unrecorded Date
Yep. We were wondering where you be at. What's your latest obsession anyway? |
| Abdi Warsame | Unrecorded Date
Mad MAC what was the "we" about.Did you forget that you told us again and again that you are American? You are just a sick puppy who desperately needs help. |
| Troubled..mind | Unrecorded Date
Who the hell uses puppy as a obscene word.
Damn Abdi Peaceless go get your style back.... If ya had any. |
| MAD MAC | Thursday, June 15, 2000 - 01:55 am
A sick puppy who desperately needs help. Perhaps. And your point is? |
