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     | Unrecorded Date Asalama Alaykum Muslims! Due to its lengthy discussion, it called for another part...since it takes a while to down-load all the discussions...and we're all here against the clock -- in this day and age! I will re-post the last post...by Umar in today, and my response will be just under it. [By umar on Wednesday, March 1, 2000 - 12:11 am: Ahmed said "You see -- even the words of God...you have to "object". ; "HE FOUND YOU ERRING...AND GUIDED YOU TO THE TRUTH"(93.7)" Surely, there was a TIME when Muhammad was erring...and God guided him. Now, we both now "children" do NOT err -- and they're born in the state of Islam...and pure. SO, when was Muhammad erring and God guided him? YOU tell me!" Well, Ahmed is here once again mis-interpreting Allah's Words. Ahmed wants us to believe that Muhammad believed the idols as gods and used to worship them. But these verses do not say what Ahmed is suggesting; it is all in the head of Ahmed. The mufasiriin of the Quran say that these verses in surah Dhuxa were revealed when the Arab pagans started to mock Muhammad as one forsaken by his Lord. In his early messengerhood, there was a period during which the Muhammad received no Revelation. Then, Allah after swearing said this to His messenger: "Thy Lord has not forsaken thee, nor is He displeased, And the Hereafter is indeed better unto thee than the present life. And verily, your Lord will give you(all i.e. good) so that you shall be well-pleased. Did He not find you an orphan and gave you a refuge? And He found you wondering/unaware(of the Quran, its legal laws, and prophethood, etc) and guided you? And He found you poor, and made you rich(self-sufficient with self-contentment etc). Therefore, treat not the orphan with oppression, And repulse not the beggar; And proclaim the Grace of your Lord.." Our messenger Muhammad was in the environment of idolatry, but he did NOT became a pagan and he did not WORSHIP IDOLS. As the verses of Allah show Muhammad(as a child---and before he was a prophet) was in all kinds of situation, but Allah sheltered him when Muhammad was an orphan; Allah made him rich when Muhammad was poor; Allah guided him when Muhammad was in the midst of worst idolatry environment. Allah Himself says in another verse that he made Muhammad KHULIQIN CADIIM---WA-INAKA CALAA KHULIQIN CADIIM--"And verily you are of a high and noble disposition" 68-4. The whole life of Muhammad was a wonderful moral character. History books also say this: "struggling to find his way--in search of the true light, the character of Muhammad even in his youth was exemplary and exceptional in the most tempting environment in Makkah. It is quite in keeping with the character of Muhammad that he should have shrunk from the coarse and licentious practices of his youthful friends. Endowed with a refined mind and delicate taste, reserved and meditative, he shunned the idol devotions of his people. The fair character of Muhammad and honorable bearing of the unobtrusive youth won the approbation of everyone; he lived much within himself, and the pondering of his heart no doubt supplied occupation for leisure hours spent by others of a lower stamp in rude sports and profligacy." Ahmed said "You said; [Ibraahim and Muhammad DID NOT WORSHIP IDOLS as Ahmed believes.] No, Muhammad and Abraham did NOT worship Idols -- after God had guided them. " No, Allah was always guiding Ibraahim and Muhammad before and after they became messengers of Allah. Ahmed said "Nor was their mistakes before their Messengership valid after they were chosen as Messengers." Again, there is no evidence that Ibraahim and Muhammad worshipped idols ever, even before they were not chosen as messengers. Ahmed said "You said; [Ahmed said "You know, Umar -- when Muhammad is asked to say; "I'm nothing but a messenger" I feel like he's talking to some of today's muslims who think he was just a little bit more than that -- say...oh -- a divine. ;)" Well, we call and say about our messenger Muhammad---*the holy prophet Muhammad*, just like other prophets of Allah---like Ibrahim.] REALLY??? give me JUST one reference where ANY prophet except Muhammad is said "Sallalahu calayhi wasalam" or "the holy prophet". Well, I heard and read many many times where Muslims like me calling and saying all the prophets as "holy prophets of Allah". And we say "Sallalahu calayhi wasalam" when the name of our messenger Muhammad is said and it is being commanded by Allah that we should sent specail solutations to our messenger Muhammad. It is in the Quran. SALUU CALAYIM WA SALIMUU TASLIIMA. Allah is mentioning other prophets and saying them: SALAAMU CALAA Ibraahim, CALAA MUUSAA and other prophets as well. We also say CALYHUMA SALAAM when other propphets's names are mentioned. Ahmed said "Please tell me ANOTHER Messenger whom his tomb HAJJ is made to every year? Please tell me another Messenger whose tomb is made a HARAM(A SACRED PLACE TO EMMIGRATE)??? " Well, there is nothing wrong visiting the tomb of our messenger. Where did Ahmed find that the Quran forbids the act of visiting the grave of the prophet? Ahmed said "God's curse is upon the conjectures. It is a true FACT that Muhammad is made the "devault" Prophet in this Religion!" It is a "true FACT" that Ahmed is desplying his hypocricy every time he writes on here. He makes up his own religion along with submitters. But hypocrites hide their own wrong doings. Ahmed refuses to tell us how he performs his prayers. !! He says it is in the Quran, but he can't produce it! The hypocrite’s *curse* is in the lowest depth of hell, even lower then the unbelievers. They are worst than open kaafirs. After refusing to answer the question that was put to him about the prayers being in the Quran, Ahmed said this: "NOW, where in (even hadiths) do you see that Muhammad was told to tell the WORLD to pray *this* way." Would Ahmed believe the many hadeeths that tell us our messenger taught how to worship Allah in SALAAT? As I said before, Allah told us that there is an excellent example for us in our messenger Muhammad who was to teach people the Quran and Xikma(WA YUCALI-MUHUL-KITAABA WAL XIKMA). What is XIKMA? It is the sunnah given to our prophet and it includes the sunnah of prayers. We follow the way our prophet performed the salaat. Ahmed, however, follows something else which is not in the Quran, but he REFUSED to tell us how and where is it in the QURAN!!! What a hypocrite and a lair!] My response: Asalama Alaykum Muslims! Umar, It’s all in my head???? Really??? Are you wishful thinking, Bro? You can trust me when I tell you -- my head is as clear as crystal ABOUT this -- so does the sincere Muslim...who truly understands God’s words! To tell you that you’re blocked from understanding the Qur`an -- you looked for “mutafsiirs” -- but GOD tells you in the Qur`an that the Qur`an is “easy for your tongue(44.58), easy to understand(54.17), and easy to remember(54.17)” -- why, are you not those BELIEVERS who God talks about? Are you those he says they cannot hear it, see it, and understand it? Ah, God is Great! Your “mufasiriin” of the Qur`an -- MANIPULATED the words of Allah. They “translated” the word “DAL-LAN” like “wondering” -- when it really means “ERRING”(wanna see the Arabic dictionary?) I do agree with their story -- and I do agree with all other translations...but I HAVE a question to that. WHAT was Muhammad “erring” about? Muhammad NEVER erred about the Qur`an -- or his Message. Yes, Allah did shelter Muhammad -- but Allah shelters...BILLIONS of idol-worshipers, what is the point? Besides, Muhammad had to be sheltered for he was to be the Messenger of Allah. And yes, Muhammad was made “KHULIQIN CADIIM” -- this is an attribute given to all Messengers of Allah...for they had posessed that attribute. Once they become Messengers -- they had a highter status...of understanding, wisdom, etc etc etc. You said; [Well, I heard and read many many times where Muslims like me calling and saying all the prophets as "holy prophets of Allah". And we say "Sallalahu calayhi wasalam" when the name of our messenger Muhammad is said and it is being commanded by Allah that we should sent specail solutations to our messenger Muhammad. It is in the Quran. SALUU CALAYIM WA SALIMUU TASLIIMA.] I didn’t ask “for many places” I only asked for ONE official transcript where any Prophet beside Muhammad is said “holy prophet”. ALSO, now you too are in the game; WHAT is the meaning of the “SALLI” -- I asked “walaalkiin” this...and he never posted again; go figure. FORGET what was told to you of “HOW” it should be done -- what does it mean???? God asks US, Muslims, “Allahu wa malaa`ikitihi yusalluuna cala Nabiyi...Yaa ayuhal ladiina aaminuu...Salluu calayhim wa salimun tasliimaa” WHAT DOES “SALLI” mean...what is it? I don’t want to know “HOW” it is done -- I want to know what it means! Also, notice how THIS same word is used for the BELIEVERS, as well; “He it is Who sends SALLI on you, as do His angels, that He may bring you out from the depths of Darkness into Light: and He is Full of Mercy to the Believers.”(Huwa ladii YUSALLA calaykum wa Malaa`ikitihi liyuqrijikum minal dulimaati ilal nuuri, wa kaani bil mu`miniina raxiimaa; 3343) SO, certianly this thing we’re asked...is SOMETHING that we’re supposed to send upon all those who believe -- INCLUDING the Prophet Muhammad...and OTHER messengers(that is if we still do it -- even when they go back to their Lord!) right? You tell me! You said; [Allah is mentioning other prophets and saying them: SALAAMU CALAA Ibraahim, CALAA MUUSAA and other prophets as well. We also say CALYHUMA SALAAM when other propphets's names are mentioned] Yeah, what is your point??? Do you never see where God tells Muhammad to tell when he meets those who believes in His(Allah’s) signs; “SALAAMUN CALAYKUM” as well? Why, do you not speak Arabic? Past and Present figures are not used the same in the Arabic language!(this is just beside the point!) You said; [Ahmed said "Please tell me ANOTHER Messenger whom his tomb HAJJ is made to every year? Please tell me another Messenger whose tomb is made a HARAM(A SACRED PLACE TO EMMIGRATE)??? " Well, there is nothing wrong visiting the tomb of our messenger. Where did Ahmed find that the Quran forbids the act of visiting the grave of the prophet?] NOW, lets see who is hypocrite: In Volume 2, Book 23, number 1444, Aisha reports the Prophet saying “Jews and the X-tians were cursed by God for they took the graves of their Prophets as a Praying Place.” This is a hadith that I believe in to be true -- Since it is supported by the Qur`an; “162. Say: "Truly, my prayer and my service of sacrifice, my life and my death, are (all) for Allah, the Cherisher of the Worlds: 163. No partner hath He: this am I commanded, and I am the first of those who submit to His will” Chapter SIX. SO, what did the “Muslims” do??? You said “there is nothing wrong visiting the tomb of our messenger” YES -- something is VERY WRONG with it; You make hajj(pilgrimage) to one beside god. ALSO, why not visit the other Prophets’ tombs??? You don’t differentiate the Prophets, correct? then why only Muhammad? Perhaps, he’s the “devault” Messenger? “Qayrul qal-qulLah!” eh? ;) Umar, people DIE over who is gonna touch his grave before the other!!! Millions of people come together -- who want to touch it all at the same time. Hundreds of people die during this time...for the cause of NOTHING but idol-worship! Cursed are truly those who take gods beside God! You said; [Ahmed said "God's curse is upon the conjectures. It is a true FACT that Muhammad is made the "devault" Prophet in this Religion!" It is a "true FACT" that Ahmed is desplying his hypocricy every time he writes on here. He makes up his own religion along with submitters. But hypocrites hide their own wrong doings. Ahmed refuses to tell us how he performs his prayers. !!] ACTUALLY, I did post a whole POST just of how I pray. It is similar to both sunnis/submitters. AND, yes, I do make up my own religion FROM the Qur`an. I don’t follow the cursed ones -- is that bad? Qur`an is MORE than I need for salvation -- it goes BEYOND humankind’s history needs of salvation. You said; [He says it is in the Quran, but he can't produce it! The hypocrite’s *curse* is in the lowest depth of hell, even lower then the unbelievers. They are worst than open kaafirs.] Ah, God knows best! PRODUCE what? God already PRODUCED it -- To Abraham, Ishmael, Kedar -- and those who came after them. You’re making the Arabs like people who “never” had God. They had God...and hold on to some of his practices to the core -- but they also corrupted much of it. AND, what is corrupted is corrected in the Qur`an. You said; [After refusing to answer the question that was put to him about the prayers being in the Quran, Ahmed said this: "NOW, where in (even hadiths) do you see that Muhammad was told to tell the WORLD to pray *this* way." ] I answered the Question if you missed it. I SAID; [I answered your question a thousand times -- it’s NOT there because it didn’t need to be. You’re acting like someone new to islam. Islam was NOT new religion -- nor did it began with Muhammad. IT EXISTED in Arabia; the Ka`abah is proof of that. The point is, that Islam was corrupted -- which called for “new Messenger”. Had the Arabian pagans believed in ALLAH ALONE -- they would BE better than the Jews and X-tians, why? Because they had adopted and did NOT lose the practices of their fathers; Kader, Ishmael, and Abraham. UNLIKE the Israelites who neglected/forgot their fore-fathers’ practices of religious. The `Arabian Pagans corrupted the teachings of their fathers to the core -- because of their neighbors’ cultures.] Then, you said; [Would Ahmed believe the many hadeeths that tell us our messenger taught how to worship Allah in SALAAT? As I said before, Allah told us that there is an excellent example for us in our messenger Muhammad who was to teach people the Quran and Xikma(WA YUCALI-MUHUL-KITAABA WAL XIKMA). What is XIKMA? It is the sunnah given to our prophet and it includes the sunnah of prayers. We follow the way our prophet performed the salaat. Ahmed, however, follows something else which is not in the Quran, but he REFUSED to tell us how and where is it in the QURAN!!!] Oh, you’re funny -- I DIDN’T ask for MANY hadeeths -- I asked for ONE hadith that tells us God gave this “formula” to Muhammad of how to pray...that Muhammad should teach people. The example in Muhammad has nothing to do with this -- and YOU are a Liar when you say “QURAN AND XIKMA” don’t lie against God...it is the “BOOK AND XIKMA”. IF you bring to me ONE verse that says “QUR`AN AND XIKMA” I shall...follow ALL the hadiths to the core! God says; “who is more unjust than he who forges lie against God” I truly know not. Cursed, beyond recognition, are those who forge lie against God. “Quran and Wisdom” what a liars! He brings a verse that says “KITAABA” and says “QURAN” -- OY VEY! Book and Wisdom -- make up the Grand Qur`an. BOOK = letters in the book, verses, and all the recitations of any kind. WISDOM = their meanings, what they are talking about, who they are reffering to, etc. This IS the reason God asks us TO LISTEN TO THE QUR`AN WHEN IT IS RECITED. Because people miss the “WISDOM” in the Qur`an when they do not listen to its meanings. I, Ahmad, used to do this -- would read the Qur`an as FAST as I could...without really listening to it. I would come for a friday prayer -- and would read chapters and chapters of the Qur`an before salat...in a speed that I can’t believe I used to do. At the time, I thought “WOW -- this is nice” but no...it’d be better for me to just read one chapter and understand it correctly...and listen to its meanings. BUT, then again, I was deaf, blind, and dumb! I accept all the universally accepted method of prayer. There are many things which ALL sects of Muslims agree on. I abide by these -- since this is the continuation of the practice. AND, I realize that there are MANY MANY MANY added stuff. Like, prayers for Muhammad and Abraham and Ali and Abdu-wahab and Faatimah-Zahrah and Agha Khan, etc etc etc. There are also some practices added to it -- like talking to the PROPHET, directly. Making *fishmah* for Ali and his family, blessing “Abaay Sitti” in the atih-yaad, etc. All these are purely idol-worship practice that the QUR`AN rejects. Peace and Love to all Muslims, -Ahmad!
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| | Unrecorded Date Ahmed said "It’s all in my head???? Really???" I know. "Are you wishful thinking, Bro?" No, I know that Ahmed's head is messed up. "You can trust me when I tell you -- my head is as clear as crystal ABOUT this" I can trust, but no I would not trust Ahmed. How can I trust what is Ahmed's head if I think he is a messed up and hypocrite individual?! "so does the sincere Muslim...who truly understands God’s words!" A hypocrite can not be a sincere Muslim? Ahmed said: "To tell you that you’re blocked from understanding the Qur`an -- you looked for “mutafsiirs” " Well, since these verses do not say what Ahmed is suggesting(Muhammad worshipped idols) and since Ahmed looked for the *historian* for evidence, he is the one *blacking* his mind to understand the Quran and seeing what the devils let him see. Ahmed said: :but GOD tells you in the Qur`an that the Qur`an is “easy for your tongue(44.58), easy to understand(54.17), and easy to remember(54.17)” -- why, are you not those BELIEVERS who God talks about? No, Allah did not say in the Quran that Muhammad was worshipping idols. Ahmed is lying about Allah. Ahmed said: "Are you those he says they cannot hear it, see it, and understand it? Ah, God is Great!" Yes, Allah is Great but Ahmed is a lair. Ahmed said: "Your “mufasiriin” of the Qur`an -- MANIPULATED the words of Allah. They “translated” the word “DAL-LAN” like “wondering” -- when it really means “ERRING”(wanna see the Arabic dictionary?)" The Classic Arabic dictionary translates the word *DAALAN* as *wondering*, *unaware,* *lost*. But does Ahmed understand and speak the Arabic language? Ahmed said: "I do agree with their story -- and I do agree with all other translations...but I HAVE a question to that. WHAT was Muhammad “erring” about? Muhammad NEVER erred about the Qur`an -- or his Message." Muhammad was in search of the TRUTH and he did not worship IDOLS. Allah GUIDED him to the TRUTH. Muhammad(saw) was "struggling to find his way--in search of the true light"----he used to be a "reserved and meditative"---"he shunned the idol devotions of his people"--and "he lived much within himself; "he never bowed down before any idol"----because Allah GUIDED him and PROTECTED him any devotions to the idos-- until the TRUTH came to him---Allah Himself says He made Muhammad KHULIQIN CADIIM---WA-INAKA CALAA KHULIQIN CADIIM--"And verily you are of a high and noble disposition" 68-4. The whole life of Muhammad was a wonderful moral character. Ahmed said: "Yes, Allah did shelter Muhammad -- but Allah shelters...BILLIONS of idol-worshipers, what is the point?" Allah *sheltered* Muhammad from IDOL WORSHIP, that is the point. But Ahmed says Muhammad WORSHIPPED IDOLS, something that is not in the Quran!. Ahmed said: "Besides, Muhammad had to be sheltered for he was to be the Messenger of Allah." That is right and Ahmed can say that again. Ahmed said: "I didn’t ask “for many places” I only asked for ONE official transcript where any Prophet beside Muhammad is said “holy prophet”" With or without an *official transcript*, can Ahmed show from the Quran that it is xaraam to say "holy mosque", "holy prophet"",the holy water samsam", etc? I will, insha-Allah, come back to respond the rest of the message---later on today.
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| | Unrecorded Date Ahmed said: "ALSO, now you too are in the game; WHAT is the meaning of the “SALLI” -- I asked “walaalkiin” this...and he never posted again; go figure. FORGET what was told to you of “HOW” it should be done -- what does it mean???? God asks US, Muslims, “Allahu wa malaa`ikitihi yusalluuna cala Nabiyi...Yaa ayuhal ladiina aaminuu...Salluu calayhim wa salimun tasliimaa” WHAT DOES “SALLI” mean...what is it? I don’t want to know “HOW” it is done -- I want to know what it means!" Well, "Allahu wa malaa`ikitihi yusalluuna cala Nabiyi...Yaa ayuhal ladiina aaminuu...Salluu calayhim wa salimun tasliimaa" means "Verily Allah and His angles send their blessings upon the prophet. O you who believe! send your blessings also upon him and salute him with a goodly salutation". Ahmed said: "Also, notice how THIS same word is used for the BELIEVERS, as well; “He it is Who sends SALLI on you, as do His angels, that He may bring you out from the depths of Darkness into Light: and He is Full of Mercy to the Believers.”(Huwa ladii YUSALLA calaykum wa Malaa`ikitihi liyuqrijikum minal dulimaati ilal nuuri, wa kaani bil mu`miniina raxiimaa; 33:43)SO, certianly this thing we’re asked...is SOMETHING that we’re supposed to send upon all those who believe -- INCLUDING the Prophet Muhammad...and OTHER messengers(that is if we still do it -- even when they go back to their Lord!) right? You tell me!" Yes, Allah sends blessings to the BELIEVERS, but the point is that there is NOTHING wrong sending blessing to the prophet. Ahmed said: "You said; [Allah is mentioning other prophets and saying them: SALAAMU CALAA Ibraahim, CALAA MUUSAA and other prophets as well. We also say CALYHUMA SALAAM when other prophet's names are mentioned]. Yeah, what is your point??? Do you never see where God tells Muhammad to tell when he meets those who believes in His(Allah’s) signs; “SALAAMUN CALAYKUM” as well? Why, do you not speak Arabic? Past and Present figures are not used the same in the Arabic language!(this is just beside the point!). The point is that we Muslims honor and love our messenger/prophet Muhammad. In fact, we are commanded to pray to Allah for our messenger Mohammed’s blessings on him. "O you who believe! send your blessings also upon him and salute him with a goodly salutation". Ahmed said: You said; [Ahmed said "Please tell me ANOTHER Messenger whom his tomb HAJJ is made to every year? Please tell me another Messenger whose tomb is made a HARAM(A SACRED PLACE TO EMMIGRATE)??? " Well, there is nothing wrong visiting the tomb of our messenger. Where did Ahmed find that the Quran forbids the act of visiting the grave of the prophet?] NOW, lets see who is hypocrite: In Volume 2, Book 23, number 1444, Aisha reports the Prophet saying “Jews and the X-tians were cursed by God for they took the graves of their Prophets as a Praying Place.” Well, the hadeeth does not say you can't visit graveyards. Visiting graveyards and sending blessing does not make me a hypocrite. I've never been to the graveyard of the prophet, but I have been to and visited the graveyards of a loved ones. I didn't pray or worshipped them(the dead). I sent blessings and prayed for them. There is nothing wrong with that. We Muslims pray for the dead and perform the salaat over the them(the JANAASA SALAAT), but that doesn't mean we are worshipping the dead.! Ahmed wrote: This is a hadith that I believe in to be true -- Since it is supported by the Qur`an; “162. Say: "Truly, my prayer and my service of sacrifice, my life and my death, are (all) for Allah, the Cherisher of the Worlds: 163. No partner hath He: this am I commanded, and I am the first of those who submit to His will” Chapter SIX." Well, that verse and the hadeeth do not say that one can't visit the graveyards.! Ahmed said: "You said “there is nothing wrong visiting the tomb of our messenger” YES -- something is VERY WRONG with it; You make hajj(pilgrimage) to one beside god." No, the Quran does not say that you can't visit the graveyards and pray for the dead. The Hajj is in Makkah and the graveyard of the prophet is in Madiina. Ahmed said: "ALSO, why not visit the other Prophets’ tombs???" Well, some Muslims visit the known tombs of other prophets and there is nothing wrong with that either, just as there is nothing wrong visiting any Muslim graveyard in order to pray for them(the dead). Ahmed said: "You don’t differentiate the Prophets, correct?" Correct. Ahmed said: "then why only Muhammad? Perhaps, he’s the “devault” Messenger?" Well, as I said, I've not been able to go and visit the prophet's graveyard, but the only graveyards I visited are the dead people that I have known before. Ahmed said: "“Qayrul qal-qulLah!” eh? ;)" CALAA KULIQIN CADIIM. Ahmed said: "Umar, people DIE over who is gonna touch his grave before the other!!! Millions of people come together -- who want to touch it all at the same time. Hundreds of people die during this time...for the cause of NOTHING but idol-worship! Cursed are truly those who take gods beside God!" Well, hypocrites are known to smooth talk into their way. Actually, the hypocrites worship their own idle talk. They possess of a lively imagination and a ready tongue. They can distort facts as smoothly and as effortlessly as they can lie. Hypocrites and the cursed ones are those who exaggerate and make a mountain out of a molehill in order to trick people into their way. Ahmed said: "You said; [Ahmed said "God's curse is upon the conjectures. It is a true FACT that Muhammad is made the "devault" Prophet in this Religion!" It is a "true FACT" that Ahmed is displaying his hypocrisy every time he writes on here. He makes up his own religion along with submitters. But hypocrites hide their own wrong doings. Ahmed refuses to tell us how he performs his prayers. !!] ACTUALLY, I did post a whole POST just of how I pray. Where? Ahmed said: "It is similar to both sunnis/submitters." Well, the sunnis did not learn how to perform the salaat from the QURAN, but from the hadeeth books, right? And submitters claim to follow something else in their way of prayers----their own hadeeth. So, Ahmed is here saying he follows some hadeeth from the sunnis and some hadeeth from the submitters in the way of prayers----which makes Ahmed what? A half sunni and half submitter? Ahmed said: "AND, yes, I do make up my own religion FROM the Qur`an." Well, if the way of performing SALAAT is not in the QURAN, then Ahmed is a liar, because he does way of SALAAT is not from the QURAN. Ahmed said: "I don’t follow the cursed ones -- is that bad? Well this is a hypocritical view coming from Ahmed. You see, Ahmed says the way hhe performs his SALAAT "is similar to both sunnis/submitters.", yet he is not one of the curse ones! Ahmed said: "Qur`an is MORE than I need for salvation -- it goes BEYOND humankind’s history needs of salvation." That is good, but it is just a lip-service coming from Ahmed. Ahmed said: "You said; [He says it is in the Quran, but he can't produce it! The hypocrite’s *curse* is in the lowest depth of hell, even lower then the unbelievers. They are worst than open kaafirs.] Ah, God knows best! PRODUCE what? God already PRODUCED it -- To Abraham, Ishmael, Kedar -- and those who came after them. You’re making the Arabs like people who “never” had God. They had God...and hold on to some of his practices to the core -- but they also corrupted much of it. AND, what is corrupted is corrected in the Qur`an." But Ahmed CAN NOT *PRODUCE* or *CITE* the SALAAT that is been corrected in the QURAN! Ahmed said: "You said; [After refusing to answer the question that was put to him about the prayers being in the Quran, Ahmed said this: "NOW, where in (even hadiths) do you see that Muhammad was told to tell the WORLD to pray *this* way." ] I answered the Question if you missed it. I SAID; [I answered your question a thousand times -- it’s NOT there because it didn’t need to be." Ahmed is here double talking again. One time he says "God already PRODUCE it and another time, he says "its(the SALAAT) NOT there(in the Quran). "it’s NOT there because it didn’t need to be.----Vs-----"PRODUCE what? God already PRODUCED it" What a game this hypocrite Ahmed is plying! Ahmed says: "I accept all the universally accepted method of prayer." Even if it is not in the QURAN, right? Will come back to the WA YUCALIMUHUMUL-KITAABA WAL XIKMA and KITAAB vs BOOK points, insha-Allah.
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| | Unrecorded Date Umar. Brother, well done. Have you heard we have been there done that?.
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| | Unrecorded Date "O our Lord, raise up amongst them an Apostle, one of themselves, to recite to them Thy signs and to teach them the Book and Wisdom and to purify them. Verily Thou art All-mighty, All-wise [Q. II, 123]. And He, glorious be His praise, said: And also we have sent among you an Apostle, one of yourselves, to recite to you our signs, and purify you, to teach you the Book and the Wisdom, and to teach you what you did not know [Q. II, 146]. And He said: God bestowed a favor upon the believers when He raised up amongst them an Apostle, one of themselves, to recite His signs to them, to purify them and to teach them the Book, although they had formerly been in manifest error [Q. III, 158]. And He, glorious be His praise, said: It is He who has raised up an Apostle among the untutored people, one of their number to recite to them His signs, to purify them, and to teach them the Book and the Wisdom, though formerly they had been in manifest error [Q. LXII, 2]. And He said: But remember the goodness which God has shown you and how much of the Book and the Wisdom He has sent down to you to admonish you thereby [Q. II, 231]. And He said: God has sent down to thee the Book and the Wisdom, and has taught thee what thou did not know before; the bounty of God towards thee is ever great [Q. IV, 113]. And He said: And call to mind the signs of God and the Wisdom which are recited in your houses; verily God is gentle, well-informed [Q.XXXVI, 34]. So God mentioned His Book-which is the Qur'an-and Wisdom, and I have heard that those who are learned in the Qur'an-whom I approve-hold that Wisdom is the sunna of the Apostle of God. This is like what [God Himself] said; but God knows best! For the Qur'an is mentioned [first], followed by Wisdom; [then] God mentioned His favor to mankind by teaching them the Qur'an and Wisdom. So it is not permissible for Wisdom to be called here [anything] save the sunna of the Apostle of God. For [Wisdom] is closely linked to the Book of God, and God has imposed the duty of obedience to His Apostle, and imposed on men the obligation obey his orders [See paragraph 22 in ar-Risalah]. So it is not permissible to regard anything as a Duty save that set forth in the Quran and the sunna of His Apostle. For [God], as we have [just] stated, prescribed that the belief in His Apostle shall be associated with the belief in Him. The sunna of the Apostle makes evident what God meant [in the text of His Book], indicating His general and particular [commands]. He associated the Wisdom [embodied] in the sunna with his Book, but made it subordinate [to the Book]. Never has God done this for any of His creatures save His Apostle. http://www.islaam.com/articles/sunnah_shafi1.htm
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| | Unrecorded Date O Prophet, fear God, and obey not the unbelievers and the hypocrites. Verily God is All-knowing, All-wise. But follow what is revealed to thee from thy Lord. Verily God is aware of the things you do [Q. XXXIII, 1-2]. And He said: Follow what has been revealed unto thee from thy Lord - there is no god but Him - and turn thou away from the polytheists [Q. VI, 106]. And He said: Then we set thee upon an open way of the Law; therefore follow it, and follow not the whims of those who do not know [Q. XLV, 17]. So God instructed His Apostle that He has favored him with His established knowledge and that he will preserve him from mankind, for He said: O thou Apostle, proclaim what is sent down to thee from thy Lord - if thou do it not thou hast not delivered His message - and God will defend thee from the people [Q. V, 71]. [See Tabari, Tafsir Vol. X, pp. 467-72. Previously the Prophet was safeguarded by a few of his followers.] 92. Shafi`i said: [Bulaq ea., p. 15] And [He], glorious be His praise, certified [the Prophet's] firm belief in what He commanded him, and in Guidance to himself and to whoever follows him. For He said: Thus We have revealed to thee a spirit belonging to Our affair. Thou didst not know what either the Book or the Faith were. But We have made it a light by which We guide whoever We please of Our servants, and verily thou shalt guide unto a straight path [Q. XLII, 52]. And He said: Had it not been for the bounty and mercy of God toward thee, a party of them would have proposed to lead thee astray; but they lead only themselves astray; they do not hurt thee at all. God has sent down to thee the Book and the Wisdom, and He has taught thee what thou didst not know; God's bounty to thee is ever great [Q. IV, 113]. Thus God declared that He commanded His Prophet to obey His order, and certified what he proclaimed on His behalf as well as what he certified for himself. [Tabari, Tafsir Vol. IX, pp. 199-201; Baydawi, pp. 126-27.] We [also] certify for him in order to draw near to God by our belief in Him, and we make entreaties to Him by belief in His words. [For] `Abd al`Aziz [b. Muh.ammad al-Darawardi] told us from `Amr b. Abi `Amr - the freed slave of al-Muttalib- from al-Muttalib b. Hantab that the Apostle of God said: I have left nothing concerning which God has given you an order without giving you that order; nor have I neglected anything concerning which He has given you a prohibition without giving you that prohibition. [Al-Suyuti al-Jaami al-Saghir (Cairo, 1352/1933)] 93. Shafi`i said: What God has informed us of in His established knowledge and in His final and irrevocable judgment- a favor and a blessing from Him - is that He prevented those who attempted to lead [the Prophet] astray, and informed him that they could not hurt him at all. In certifying that [the Prophet] guides mankind along a straight-forward path - the path of God - and that he delivers His message and obeys His commands - as we have stated before - and in ordering obedience to him and in emphasizing all [of this] in the [divine] communications just cited - God has given evidence to mankind that they should accept the judgment of the Apostle and obey his orders. 94. Shafi`i said: Whatever the Apostle has decreed that is not based on any [textual] command from God, he has done so by God's command. So God instructed us in His saying: And verily thou wilt guide [mankind] to a straight path, the pathof God [Q. XLII, 52-53]. For the Apostle has laid down a sunna [on matters] for which there is a text in the Book of God as well as for others concerning which there is no [specific] text. But whatever he laid down in the sunna God has ordered us to obey, and He regards [our] obedience to him as obedience to Him, and [our] refusal to obey him as disobedience to Him for which no man will be forgiven; nor is an excuse for failure to obey the Apostle's sunna possible owing to what I have already stated and to what the Apostle [himself] has said: Sufyan [b. 'Uyayna] told us from Salim Abu al-Nadr - a freed slave of 'Umar b . 'Ubayd-Allah-who heard 'U bayd-Allah b. Abi Rafi' relate from his father that the Apostle had said: Let me find no one of you reclining on his couch and whenconfronted with an order of permission or prohibition from me,say: ' I do not know [whether this is obligatory or not]; we will follow only what we find in the Book of God.' [Abu Dawud, Vol. IV, p. 200. This tradition is followed by a statement, paragraph 296 (Shakir's edition), which reads: "Sufyan [b. Uyayna] said: ' [This hadith] was related to me by Muhammad b. al-Munkadir, who transmitted it from the Prophet without citing the names of [other] authorities." such a tradition, lacking the names of other transmitters, is called hadith mursal. Shafi'i, however, seems to have depended on the authority of 'Ubayd-Allah b. Rafi', the son of Abu Rafi', a freed slave of the Prophet, who transmitted the tradition from his father (See Ibn Hajar, al-Isaba, Vol. I, p. 488).] 95. Shafi`i said: [Bulaq ed., p. 16] The sunnas of the Apostle together with the [communications of the] Book of God fall in two categories: First, for every textual [communication] in the Book the Apostle laid down [a similar sunna] in conformity with divine communication. Second, for any [ambiguous] command the Apostle laid down on God's behalf [a sunna] clarifying the meaning implied by God and specifying what [kind of] duty God imposed, whether general or particular, and how man should carry it out. In both categories [the Prophet] followed the Book of God. 96. [Shafi`i] said: I know of no scholar who does not agree that the sunna of the Prophet falls in three categories, two of which were agreed upon unanimously. These two categories agree [on certain matters] and differ [on others]. First, for whatever acts there is textual [legislation] provided by God in the Book, the Apostle [merely] specified clearly what is in the text of the Book. Second, as to any [ambiguous] communication in the Book laid down by God, [the Prophet] specified the meaning implied by Him. These are the two categories on which scholars do not disagree. The third category consists of what the Apostle has laid down in the sunna and concerning which there is no text in the Book. 97. Some [scholars] have said: God empowered [the Prophet], by virtue of the duty He imposed [on mankind] to obey Him and his success in obtaining [God's] approval in accordance with His established knowledge, to provide sunnas [for matters] on which there is no text in the Book. Others said: No sunna was ever laid down [by the Prophet] unless there was a basis [Literally: ' Foundation,', i. e., a fundamental principle or a precedent] for it in the Book, such as the sunna which specified the number of prayers [each day] and [the modes of] their performance, based on the general duty of prayer. In like manner, [tile Prophet] laid down sunnas dealing with sale [of property], as well as others. For God said: Do not consume your property among you uselessly [Q. IV, 33].And He said:God has permitted sale and forbidden usury [Q. II, 277]. Whatever God has provided by [way of] permission or prohibition, he has specified on God's behalf as he did in [the case of the duty of] prayer. Others said: [The Prophet] received a message from God confirming the sunna by a command from Him. Still others said: [The Prophet] was inspired with all that he had laid down. The sunna is [divine] Wisdom inspired by God, and so whatever He inspired him with [constitutes] sunna. [For] `Abd al-'Azlz [b. Muhammad al-Darawardi] told us from 'Amr b. Abi 'Amr from al-Muttalib, who related that the Prophet said: The trustworthy spirit [Gabriel] has inspired me [with the thought] that no soul will ever die until it will receive its full provision. Be, therefore, moderate in your request. [See note 13, above.] 98. Shafi`i said: [Bulaq, ed., p. 16] Among the things with which [the Prophet] was inspired is his sunna. This [sunna] is the Wisdom which God mentioned [in His Book], and whatever He sent down to him is a Book - the Book of God - all of these have been given to him as favors from God and by His will. These favors are either embodied in one Favor [I.e., the Message] or take different forms. We pray God for protection from error and success. In whatever form it may take, God made it clear that He imposed the duty of obedience to His Apostle, and has given none of mankind an excuse to reject any order he knows to be the order of the Apostle of God. God has rather made men have need for him in [all matters of] religion and He has given the proof for it by providing that the sunna of the Apostle make clear the meanings of the duties laid down in His Book, so that it might be known that the sunna - whether in the form specifying the meaning of God's commands as provided in the text of the Book which they can read or in the form of legislation in the absence of such a text - in either form represents God's command and is in [full] agreement with that of His Apostle; both are [equally] binding in all circumstances. This has been confirmed by the Apostle in the tradition of Abu Rafi` which has already been cited. [See note 15, above.] 99. Shafi`i said: [Bulaq ed., p.16] I shall explain what I have already said about the sunna, [whether] it specifies the Book of God or provides [additional legislation] for matters on which there is no text in the Book, such examples as may clarify the meaning of the subject that was discussed. The first one I take up will be [a discussion] on the sunna based on the Book of God. I shall discuss by means of istidlal (deductive reasoning) the sunna relating to the subject of the nasikh (abrogating) and the mansukh (abrogated) passages in the Book of God. Next, [I shall] state the duties provided in the text [of the Book] and the sunna which the Apostle has laid down on the basis of the Book; the general duties which the Apostle specified for its modes and its times of fulfillment; next, the general [commands] which were intended to be general and the general [commands] which were intended to be particular; and [finally] the sunna [of the Prophet] for which there is no text in the Book. http://www.islaam.com/articles/sunnah_shafi4.htm http://www.islaam.com/articles/sunnah_shafi.htm
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| | Unrecorded Date Brother Umar. ilaahey hakaa abaal mariyo. Axmed waa habaaran yahay oo habaarkii nabi maxammed caleyhi salaam buu qabaa illeyn waa ninkii yiri"NABI MAXAMMED SANAM BUU CAABUDI JIREY". "Allahumalcan man iftaraa calaa muxammad".
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| | Unrecorded Date Asalama Alaykum Muslims! I’m in the middle of writing an article JUST about “SALLI” -- lets wait until that is finished. NOW, the other part of the Prophet Muhammad’s History will be done during this weekend -- and we’ll be able, insha allah -- to see where somethings are “ommitted” in a its seperate article. :) The discussion at hand is abondoned -- something that is familiar with this forum...and some somalis. BUT, I won’t allow it. MESSENGERS AND PROPHETS!!! God in the Qur`an, says this: [It was We who revealed the Torah: therein was guidance and light. By its standard have been judged the Jews, by the prophets who bowed (as in Islám) to Allah's will, by the rabbis and the doctors of law: for to them was entrusted the protection of Allah's book, and they were witnesses thereto: therefore fear not men, but fear Me, and sell not My signs for a miserable price. If any do fail to judge by (the light of) what Allah hath revealed, they are unbelievers. 5.44] This verse tells clearly that the Prophets of Israel...were revealed to the Torah; the books of the Hebrew Prophets! TO prove that the “TORAH” was NOT the Book given to Moses/Aaron, God NEVER mentions them by name with the Torah...as He does with Jesus and the Gospel. This is because Moses and Aaron only recieved a Book -- part of that Torah. Thus, NOT “messengers” but “prophets”...were the “judges” of the Torah. Another verse is; [And it is your Lord that knoweth best all beings that are in the heavens and on earth: We made some prophets to excel others: and We gave to David the Psalms.17.55 ] NOTICE, not “messengers” but Prophets -- who are excelled to others -- and what does God mention? THE PSALMS!!! The psalms is a book that is NOTHING but songs of praises to God. God commanded the Mountains, the Birds, Beasts, etc to sing along with David. NO prophet did EVER God give a book as Glorifying to God as the Psalms; a book that is TOTALLY devoted to the praising of the Lord. Other books given to other Prophets were Laws to manking -- and salvation to mankind...except this book. God mentions hundreds of times the “torah” and how it was ruled on the Israelites...while God never mentions the Psalms. Why? Because the Psalms is not a book of law -- but a book of praise to the Lord. To this day, Israelites and Christians sing into the Psalms. Most certainly, they corrupted it -- and added stuff to it, but still...the practice is still there. I agree when God says; “We bestowed Grace aforetime on David from Us”. Another verse is the answer from Jesus to the Israelites; [He said: "I am indeed a servant of Allah. He hath given me Book and made me a prophet; 19.30] WHY “prophet” and not Messenger if Book is given to the Messengers??? BECAUSE he said that he’s “i am indeed a servant of Allah” this says that “I’M FROM GOD”(Messenger) and He says that God given him a “BOOK” -- thus, to say that God gave him a book -- he must say his STATUS; “and MADE ME A PROPHET”. He should’ve said “And made me a MESSENGER” if it’s the Messengers are the ones given the Book, correct? RE - read the verse again, please! Another verse is God’s introduction to some prophets; [Also mention in the Book (the story of) Moses: for he was specially chosen, and he was a messenger (and) a prophet. 19.51] “WA KAANA RASULLA NABIYA” “And he was a Messenger, prophet”. NOT “Nabiya Rasulla” but “rasulla nabiya” why???? This is because...when you identify someone in a company(working)...you say; “Umar...is an employee of this company, a supervisor” or “a temp” or “an over-flow” or whatever his specialty is -- that makes this person different from other employees. This is the same; “He was a Messenger”(REMEMBER, God says; “mention in the book moses” -- thus he introduces; so, THE people he’s among...is “messengers”...and then says) his specialty; “A PROPHET”(meaning...he was one who brought a book - different from normal messengers who did not). After this, as you would say; “Umar, does a good job...in his work, etc” God says “52. And We called him from the right side of Mount (Sinai), and made him draw near to Us, for converse in secret” -- explaining when he got the task. and after this verse, God GOES ahead and introduces AARON. Notice, Aaron was NOT a messenger or chosen messenger...until Moses asked God for his(Aaron’s) help. BECAUSE he got to be given the Book WITH Moses, God made him a Prophet. Notice, your normal everyday kind of employees are intorduced like “he’s an employee” unless there is another reason; Aaron didn’t posses this...he wasn’t a messneger before. God says; [53. And, out of Our Mercy, We gave him his brother Aaron, a prophet!] IF...the deal, as MANY Muslims believe was “messengers” delivered the Books. THEN, Aaron would be introduced here as a “RASULLA NABIYA” and not just “NABIYA”. God, CLEARLY states in a verse that he gave the Book to Moses and Aaron. SO, what is the ONLY description that Moses and Aaron have in common here???? PROPHET!!! There is an argument that Aaron was NOT messenger at all -- but a Prophet. However, in another verse -- God lists him...in the list of the Messengers. So, *Submitters* may be right in their saying that his prophethood earned him a messengerhood, as well. This is beside the point...but one thing is clear -- He was a PROPHET. And God gave him the Book with Moses. However, in this chapter, God goes ahead and introduces other messengers by being a “prophet”. BUT, other prophets whom God mentions are people whom we have NO history of them. It’s the prophet; Idris. Who, as far as we’re concerned, could have recieved his prophethood through an special way as Aaron. Only God knows. Now about the Salat deal. HAHAHAHAAHAH! Well, if you think i’m half half -- then you’re mistaken...i’m PIECES of ALL the sects: that is ISLAM. Arabs sorta just inherited each tribe/country to some! hehehe! You would be surprised of HOW pieces i’m. With submitters, they think i’m “sunni” with shias, they think i’m “sunni/submitter” with sunis, they think i’m “submitter” with suffis, i’m just simply a “tabur”(lost!!!) hahahahahahah!!! Check “salaada” post...where i have my prayers posted(with little exception i made lately; I don’t say...”muhammadan abduhu wa rusulluhu -- since this makes a dinstiction between Messenger and violates the verse in the Qur`an!) ALSO, Umar -- there are many things which are NOT named formulatiy in the Qur`an...yet I do -- such as; - “how” to fast -- God only tells me to “FAST”...Yet I fast -- not according to hadiths...but the REAL fasting. I don’t start fasting until the month is done(SINCE we have a technology today -- getting to the moon’s info to us, quickly!) And I don’t stop fasting...with “people’s sighting” but with calendar. - I don’t pray in mosques which have GRAVES in it(including the Mosque of the “prophet”) - I don’t believe there is any place to make hajj to..EXCEPT the Masjidul-Haram! - I don’t give friday any more importance than any other day -- and go for the Salatul Juma`...as it is commanded without idolizing the day. ...all these are BECAUSE they violate the Qur`anic laws -- even though God did not “prohibit” them out-right....or allowed them out-right. Being a Muslim isn’t just following with the crowd, Umar -- it’s questioning and living it the WAY God wants it not some old hypocrite liars...who were blind and in dark-ages. THIS is because one who truly follows God -- and not “fathers” is blessed by the Lord. And God knows the cursed ones! And God produced the salat in the Book of Abraham -- you go get it...and tell me it is not there. God tells me that IT WAS Abraham...who said “accept this” from us. THUS, I have my answer -- Glory be to God! AS for what is corrected in the SALAT, here goes...open your ears, for a change: PAGANS: “we can pray any time we wish”(some Muslims, the Freebie-Minders...think that they can only pray morning and evening) QURAN: NOPE, but as follows; DAWN(Fajr): "24.58. O you who believe, permission must be requested by your servants and the children who have not attained puberty (before entering your rooms). This is to be done in three instances - before THE DAWN Prayer, at noon when you change your clothes to rest, and after the Night Prayer. These are three private times for you. At other times, it is not wrong for you or them to mingle with one another. GOD thus clarifies the revelations for you. GOD is Omniscient, Most Wise." THE LIGHT(Nur)! NOON(Duhur): "17.78. You shall observe the Contact Prayer (Salat) when the sun declines from its highest point at noon, as it moves towards sunset. You shall also observe (the recitation of) the Quran at dawn. (Reciting) the Quran at dawn is witnessed." NIGHT JOURNEY(Isra)! AFTERNOON(Casar): "2.238. You shall consistently observe the Contact Prayers, especially the middle prayer, and devote yourselves totally to GOD."(this is why...masjids don't agree on WHEN to pray this prayer...because it must be between noon and sunset---with no specific time mentioned...many pray BETWEEN in exact, as the verse implies!) SUNSET(Maqrib): "11.114. You shall observe the Contact Prayers (Salat) at BOTH ends of the day, and during the night. The righteous works wipe out the evil works. This is a reminder for those who would take heed." HUD! NIGHT(Cishaa): Once again, "24.58. O you who believe, permission must be requested by your servants and the children who have not attained puberty (before entering your rooms). This is to be done in three instances - before the dawn Prayer, at noon when you change your clothes to rest, and after the NIGHT PRAYER. These are three private times for you. At other times, it is not wrong for you or them to mingle with one another. GOD thus clarifies the revelations for you. GOD is Omniscient, Most Wise." THE LIGHT(Nur)! PAGANS: “We can address in our salats...our gods, fore-fathers, the saints, the good, etc”(MANY Muslims address in the Salat Muhammad, Ali, Fatimah-Zahra, Abdu-Wahab, etc -- some DIRECTLY talk to the prophet by saying; “asalama alayka ayuhal nabiyu warahmatulahi wabarakaatuh” “peace be upon you, o you prophet...” -- Some Muslims do prayers...in the salat for the Prophet, Fatimah-Zahra, Abdul-wahab, Ali, each...differently -- each sect...prayes for some...haha! Talk about INHERITANCE!!!) QURAN: “ [Say: "Truly, my prayer and my service of sacrifice, my life and my death, are (all) for Allah, the Cherisher of the Worlds]...and...["And the masjids are for Allah (alone): So invoke not any one along with Allah.” ALSO, Umar -- sorry that mis-understood my saying of “visitng the grave of the prophet”...I was TALKING about making a HAJJ or SIYAARA. NO Corrupted-Muslim EVER leaves Hajj without visiting the Mosque of the Prophet and touch the Grave...as PART of the Hajj. WOW -- Hajj is VERY incomplet without visiting the graveyard of the prophet, according to the Corrupted-Muslims(don’t they know there is only dust left there???) AND, also, I was talking about MAKING them Mosques..or burying them into mosques, etc. ALSO, NOBODY visits any prophet’s grave except Muhammad. MOST of the Israelite prophets’ graves are KNOWN and taken care of -- however, they were “Israelites” remember? Arabs are STILL Arabs. Please, tell me ONE Israeli prophet’s grave that any arab-muslim(that is known) ever visited??? You have old ladies tales -- I want FACTS and REFERNCES! I never ask you for much -- but ONE. ALSO, please tell me one Israeli Prophet’s birthday that ANY Arab-Muslim ever celebrated...or the Arab-corrupted muslims, for that matter. Did we EVER celebrate Jesus’ birthday(NISSAN 13th of the Hebrew Calender) in somalia...EVER? any other Arab-corrupted/arab country? How about Moses? John? Zacharias? I don’t talk cheap, my friend - i talk facts! NO “exegration” my dear -- ALL FACTS. Otherwise, prove me wrong. AND, people dying over who is gonna touch the grave of the prophet? ah, ask your Hujay! Those who you “trust”...;) AND, No, it’s not a lip-service for me that Qur`an is my Law. No jose, this is the corrupted Muslims’ way of being. I live the world...by the Qur`an -- Qur`an along -- as a salvation for my destiny. It is simply...more than I need! As for “KITAB WA AL-XIKMA” BOOK AND WISDOM. I told you -- you were a LIAR when you said “quran and xikma” -- but I ask you again...bring a verse that says “QURAN WA AL-XIKMA”...then i will follow hadiths to no end. You said; “and I have heard that those who are learned in the Qur'an-whom I approve” well, obviously, this is just “no, we’ll follow what we found with our fathers” -- what, even if those “learned” ones were liars??? KITAAB is a “BOOK”(verses, letters, lines, etc etc etc) without wisdom -- Kitab is NOTHING...but a mamae talkie wag. It is the “WISDOM”(the meaning of the kitab) that are what complete the KITAB and make the two into GRAND QUR`AN! But, a deaf friend of mine...never heard me when looking another way! God only guides whomever He wishes -- I learned this, period. Peace - Ahmad!
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| | Unrecorded Date Ahmed said "NOW, the other part of the Prophet Muhammad’s History will be done during this weekend -- and we’ll be able, insha allah -- to see where somethings are “ommitted” in a its seperate article. :)" People can *add* something to or *omit* something from the history of Muhammad, but Ahmed's *his story* about Muhammad---accuses, alleges, incriminates Muhammad being an idol worshipper. Ahmed and his made-up *his story* about Muhamad being an IDOL WORSHIPPER(before he was a messenger) is nothing but distortion and falsification. An Idol worshipper has an *immoral* and *evil* CHARACTER, but the whole life of Muhammad was a wonderful *moral* character. Allah was *always* GUIDING and PROTECTING his future MESSENGER Muhammad. Muhamad was always* a KHULIQIN CADIIM and Muhammad was NEVER an IDOL WORSHIPPER as Ahmed alleges. The Quran does not say that Muhammad used to be an IDOL WORSHIPPER. On-the-contrary, It is Allah Himself Who said in His QURAN this when He was talking about Muhammad: WA-INAKA CALAA KHULIQIN CADIIM--"And verily you are of a high and noble disposition" 68-4.
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| | Unrecorded Date Ahmed said: "The discussion at hand is abondoned -- something that is familiar with this forum...and some somalis. BUT, I won’t allow it. MESSENGERS AND PROPHETS!!!" Mohammad (pbuh) the Last Messenger: To fully understand why the Qur’an has considered it sufficient to declare that Mohammad (pbuh) is the last Nabi (prophet) and has not felt the need to declare that Mohammad (pbuh) is also the last Rasu’l (messenger) of Allah, one must first understand the difference between the two offices of “Nabi” and “Rasu’l”. The Qur'an has used the words “Nabi” (literally meaning: “one who informs”) and Rasu’l” (literally meaning: “one who delivers a message”) as terms as well as in their literal meanings. In their literal meaning, these words have also been used interchangeably. As terms of the Qur’an, the two words have been used in more qualified and distinct meanings. “Nabi”, as a term of the Qur’an refers to individuals selected by the Almighty for the specific purpose of delivering the message revealed to him from God and to remind people of the Day when they shall be presented before the Almighty and shall have to answer for their deeds. In other words, “Nabi” is an individual who guides his people to the path of the Creator’s liking in the light of the message revealed to him. On the other hand, “Rasu’l” (as a term of the Qur’an) is a special position, which was given only to a few of the “Nabis”. Every “Nabi” is not necessarily a “Rasu’l”. According to the details scattered in the Qur’an regarding the position of “Rasu’l”, God sends His “Rasu’ls” as symbols of His final Judgment. “Rasu’l”, in contrast to “Nabi” is not just a deliverer of God’s message. On the basis of the response that he receives from his addressees, he decides the fate of his nation. The Qur’an, regarding “Rasu’ls” says: “Those that oppose God and His Rasu’ls shall be brought low. God has decreed: I will surely triumph, Myself and My Rasu’ls. God is Most Powerful, Mighty.” (Al-Mujadilah 58: 20, 21) It should be quite clear from this clarification, that though “Nabi” and “Rasu’l” are separate designations of the Qur’an and all Nabis are not Rasu’l, yet all “Rasu’ls” are “Nabis” too. Thus when the Qur’an said that Mohammad (pbuh) is “the seal of Nabis”, it automatically implies that the Qur’an holds him as the seal of “Rasu’ls” too, because a person who is a “Rasu’l”, according to the Qur’an, has to be a “Nabi” first. One of the prophet's sayings is this: It has been reported that the prophet to have said: "From Adam to me, Allah sent a hundred and twenty-four thousand Prophets, of whom three hundred and fifteen were entrusted with a Book." Now, the question is why were there so many more Prophets than Books as the hadeeth tell us? If the role of a Prophet were simply to HAVE a BOOK and deliver the Book, as Ahmed and Submitters believe, there should have been as many Books as Prophets, right? "The chain of MESSENGERS and PROPHETS has come to an end. There shall be no MESSENGER nor PROPHET after me." (Tirmidhi, Kitab-ur-Rouya Babu Zahab-un- Nubuwwa, Musnad Ahmad, Marwiyat-Anas bin Malik).
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| | Unrecorded Date Ahmed said: "Now about the Salat deal. HAHAHAHAAHAH! Well, if you think i’m half half -- then you’re mistaken...i’m PIECES of ALL the sects: that is ISLAM. Arabs sorta just inherited each tribe/country to some! hehehe! You would be surprised of HOW pieces i’m. With submitters, they think i’m “sunni” with shias, they think i’m “sunni/submitter” with sunis, they think i’m “submitter” with suffis, i’m just simply a “tabur”(lost!!!) hahahahahahah!!! Ahmed is here laughing at himself. He is the one who said his salaat is similar to both sunnis/submitters, yet submitters and Ahmed say that sunnis do not follow the Quranic salaat.! Ahmed said: "Check “salaada” post...where i have my prayers posted(with little exception i made lately; I don’t say...”muhammadan abduhu wa rusulluhu -- since this makes a dinstiction between Messenger and violates the verse in the Qur`an!)" Where is the post that Ahmed keeps talking about? I asked him where, but he would not tell where! Just as the submitters(which Ahmed plagiarized many of his writings) have accused the sunnis of following something not in the QURAN(in worship), Ahmed has been here blaming the sunnis for not following the QURAN ALONE in prayers/worship(CIBAADADA). However, the point is that if most of the salaat formula the sunnis follow are not listed in the Quran and if Ahmed's salaat is similar to the sunnis--"with little exception"--then isn't Ahmed with the submitters also following what is not in the QURAN.-------and instead follow THEIR OWN HADEETH OR SOMEONE ELSE'S HADEETH.? Ahmed said: "ALSO, Umar -- there are many things which are NOT named formulatiy in the Qur`an...yet I do -- such as; - “how” to fast -- God only tells me to “FAST”...Yet I fast -- not according to hadiths...but the REAL fasting." "not according to hadiths"----that is the point I was looking for.!! I mean if Ahmed does "things" in CIBAADA, "things which are NOT named formality in the Qur'an", isn't Ahmed then following his OWN HADEETH different than the hadeeth the sunnis practice. I mean, aren't then Ahmed and submitter hypocrites? The Quran does not say that one can NOT say in salaat "muhammadan abduhu wa rusulluhu" in his or her SALAAT. On the contrary, in many places, the QURAN says that Muhammad is the rusuul of Allah and the slave of Alah. And we Muslims bear witness that Allah is ONE and that Muhammad is the slave and messenger of Allah(muhammadan abdahu wa rasulahu". Ahmed said: "And God produced the salat in the Book of Abraham -- you go get it...and tell me it is not there. God tells me that IT WAS Abraham...who said “accept this” from us. THUS, I have my answer -- Glory be to God!" I was asking the FORMULA of salaat THAT is been CORRECTED....STEP BY STEP.! Let Ahmed PRODUCE it. Ahmed said: "PAGANS: “we can pray any time we wish”(some Muslims, the Freebie-Minders...think that they can only pray morning and evening)--DAWN(Fajr): "24.58--NOON(Duhur): "17.78--AFTERNOON(Casar): "2.238--SUNSET(Maqrib): "11.114--NIGHT(Cishaa): "24.58." Now we are getting to the real point.! How many RAKACA fajar, duhu, casar, cishaa are there and who taught this to the Muslims? Let Ahmed and the submitters produce this from the Quran. Maybe Ahmed and the submitters can tell us if he and the submitter learned this formula of SALAAT from their "fore-fathers" of the old "generations" Ahmed said: "ALSO, Umar -- sorry that mis-understood my saying of “visitng the grave of the prophet” The Quranic ayats and the hadeeth Ahmed cited do not say that one can't visit graveyards of the loved ones in order to pray for them. Ahmed said: "I was TALKING about making a HAJJ or SIYAARA. NO Corrupted-Muslim EVER leaves Hajj without visiting the Mosque of the Prophet and touch the Grave...as PART of the Hajj. WOW -- Hajj is VERY incomplet without visiting the graveyard of the prophet, according to the Corrupted-Muslims(don’t they know there is only dust left there???) AND, also, I was talking about MAKING them Mosques..or burying them into mosques, etc." Again, is the act of visiting the graveyard of the prophet invalidate the hajj? Where can Ahmed show us in the Quran that if visited the graveyard of Muhammad, the Hajj is invalidate? Here is information about Haj and how it is done: .............................. The word Hajj means, literally, repairing to a place for the sake of visit, and in the terminology of the Islamic Sharia, it implies repairing to Bait-Allah (the House of Allah, one of the names of al-Ka'aba) to observe the necessary devotions. Hajj is not a new institution introduced by Islam in its Sharia, This institution is as old as al-Ka'aba itself which is called in the Holy Koran ‘the first House of Divine Worship appointed for mankind’ (3:95). This verse corroborates the Hadith (Prophetic Saying) which tell us that al-Ka'ba was first built by Adam, the first man on earth. The whole ceremony of Hajj is commemorative of Prophet Ibrahim and his family's acts of devotion to Allah Almighty. This demonstrates that Muhammad, the Holy Prophet, peace and blessings of Allah be upon did not innovate this institution but purged it of all evil practices and made it an obligatory act of piety by which one can develop God-consciousness; hence it is one of the five pillars of faith incumbent upon each believer to do if he is capable physically and financially. Pilgrimage is rightly said to be the perfection of faith since it combines in itself all the distinctive qualities of other obligatory acts of prayer, patience, privation of amenities of life, devotion, Zakat (alms) and supplication. In fact, physical pilgrimage is a prelude to spiritual pilgrimage to Allah when man would bid good-bye to everything of the world and present himself before Him as His humble servant saying: 'Here I am before Thee, my Lord, as a slave of Thine.' The rites connected with pilgrimage are divided into two kinds: 1 - 'Umra (Lesser pilgrimage) is made by the individual at any date he wishes, except at the times of the official pilgrimage. 2 - Hajj (official pilgrimage) which must be undertaken at a given date and in company with all the other pilgrims. It takes place in the months of Shawwal, Dhul-Qua'da and Dhul-Hijja (the last three months of the Hijri calendar). The Meccan territory is sacred (al-Haram). The pilgrim enters this territory in a state of Ihram (one enters in a state in which he is forbidden to do certain things that were permissible before. In technical terms it implies undertaking Hajj or 'Umra). Al-lhram entails wearing special garment. In this regard, there is a consensus of opinion that a pilgrim is not allowed to wear sewn clothes or to cover his head or hands. If he wears stockings or shoes these must be above the ankles. This is done inorder to foster a sense of humility and a feeling of brotherhood among the Muslims. Al-Ihram or pilgrim’s garment consists of two seamless (unsewn) pieces of white woolen or cotton cloth, of which one wound around the waist and reaches below the knees, while the other is slung loosely around one shoulder with the head remaining uncovered. This attire goes for males, whereas females have to cover all their body except the face, hands and feet. Before putting on this sacred dress the pilgrim goes through an ablution (Ghusl for major purification and has his hair shaved or clipped. A man in lhram is consecrated: He cannot hunt, pick plants, shed blood or have sexual intercourse. After putting the lhram, the pilgrim recites prayer and pronounces his intention of making the 'Umra and the Hajj at the same time; or only one of them as the case may be. Then he begins to utter in loud voice 'Labbayk’ meaning 'at Thy service.' This cry is constantly repeated up to the beginning of the ceremony of the throwing of stones. Having arrived in Mecca, the pilgrim circumambulates the Ka`aba seven times (Tawaf), then enters the court of the sanctuary and kisses or touches the Black Stone. When the pilgrim leaves the sanctuary he formulates his intention of performing the ritual of al-Sa'i which consists of visiting the two hills of Mecca: Safa and Marwa several times. One part of the route is traversed by trotting. These visits complete the rites of 'Umra. If the pilgrim has no further intention of maidng the official Hajj, he shaves his head as a sign of being free from further ritual interdictions. If, on the other hand, he intends to continue with theHajj, he retains hisIhram and the following rules are observed, 1.On the eighth day of Dhul-Hija, the pilgrim goes to Mina and to Muzdalifa. 2.On the morning of the ninth day he halts at the hill of 'Arafat; and here the pilgrims climb the hill crying 'Labbayk, Labbayk [Here I come to Thee (Allah)] 3.After the sun crosses the meridian, the prince of pilgrimage ascends the hill of 'Arafat where he preaches and recites pious invocations amid general emotion. When the sun sets, the 'Ifada’ begins. This is a swift movement towards the Muzdalifa plains where the pilgrims spend their night. 4.Early in the morning of the tenth day there is a congregational prayer followed by a sermon after which the pilgrims start for Mina. The day is marked by three different rituals: a. Each pilgrim carries some stones with him from Muzdalifa. When the assembly reaches each pilgrim throws his stones (Jamrat) on each of the stone-heaps of Mina (Jamrat al-Aqaba, al-Jamrat al-Wustat, alJamrat al-Sughra). Throwing the stones is a physical movement expressing a spiritual endeavour to conquer Satan and ward off its evil schemes. b. Each pilgrim offers a sacrificial goat to be slaughtered to distribute its meat among the poor. c. Finally the pilgrim shaves his hair again. He is then in a state of semi-consecration (Tahallul). His complete consecration is achieved after he has visited the rest of the sacred places of Mecca. Verily, the praise belongs to Allah, the Most High, and may the Blessings of Allah and Peace be upon His Prophet Muhammad and his family and companions, all of them. It is narrated from Ibn Abbaas (RAA) that the Prophet (PBUH) of said: "There are no days in which righteous deeds done in them are more beloved to Allah than these days, ie the ten days (of Zul-Hijjah). They said: O Messenger of Allah, not even Jihaad in the path of Allah? He said: Not even Jihaad in the Path of Allah, the Most High, except if a man goes out (for Jihaad) with his self and his wealth, then he doesn't return with anything from that." (Al-Bukhaaree, Abu Daawood and others. The exact wording is that of Abu Daawood) It is narrated from Ibn Umar that the Prophet Muhammad (Blessings of Allah and Peace be upon him) said: "There aren't any days greater, nor any days in which deeds done in them are more beloved to Allah, the Most High, than these ten days (of Zul-Hijjah). So, increase in them the saying of Tahleel (La Ilaaha illa Allah), and Takbeer (Allah Akbar) and Tahmeed (al-Hamdu li-llah)" [Musnad Imaam Ahmad] The Types of Deeds in These Ten Days: First: The performance of Haj and Umrah, and these are the best of deeds that may be done. And what indicates their superiority are a number of Ahaadith, one of which is the saying of the Prophet (PBUH). Performance of Umrah is an expiation of the sins committed between it and the previous Umrah, and the reward of the Haj which is accepted by Allah, the Most High, is nothing but Paradise. (Al-Bukhaaree and Muslim) Second: Fasting during these days - as many of them as may be easy (for one to fast); especially the Day of Arafah. There is no doubt that the act of fasting is one of the best deeds, and it is from what Allah, the Most High, has chosen for himself, as in the Hadith Qudsee: Fasting is for Me, and it is I who give reward for it. Verily, someone gives up his sexual passion, his food and his drink for My sake..." (Al-Bukhaaree, Muslim, Maalik, at-Tirmidhee, Nasaa'ee and Ibn Maajah) Also, from Abu Sa'eed al-Khudree who said that the Messenger of Allah said: No servant (of Allah, the Most High) fasts one day in the Path of Allah, except that Allah, the Most High, removes his face from the Fire because of it (the distance of travelling) seventy years. (Al-Bukhaaree and Muslim) From Abu Qatadah that the Prophet said: Fasting the Day of Arafah will be credited with Allah by forgiving one's sins of the previous year and the following year. (Muslim) Third: At-Takbeer (Allah Akbar) and adh-Dhikr (the remembrance of Allah through different words of praise and glorification) in these (ten) days, Allah said "And mention the name of Allah on the appointed days"(12:28). This has been explained (by some) to mean the ten days (of Zul-Hijjah), and the scholars consider it desirable to increase adh-Dhikr in these days, based upon the hadith of Ibn Umar narrated by Ahmad, which contains the words: ... so increase in these days the Tahleel and Takbeer and Tahmeed... It is reported about Ibn Umar and Abu Hurairah that: the two of them used to go out to the market place during the ten days (of Zul-Hijjah) saying: Allahu Akbar, causing the people also to say it. (Al-Bukhaaree) Ishaaq narrates from the scholars of the Taabi'een that in these ten days they used to say: Allahu Akbar, Allahu Akbar Laa Ilaaha illa 'llah Wa 'llahu Akbar, Allahu Akbar Wa li'llahi al-hamd. It is a beloved act to raise the voice when saying the Takbeer in the markets, the houses, the streets, the Masjids and other places, because of the saying of Allah, the Most High, in Surah al-Hajj, verse 37: "... that you may magnify Allah for His Guidance to you" The saying of Takbeer in congregation, ie everyone pronouncing the Takbeer with one voice, is not permissible since this has not been transmitted (to us) from the early generations of the Sahabah and those who followed their ways. Verily, the Sunnah is for everyone to say the Takbeer individually. And this is (generally) applicable to Dhikr and supplications, except if the person doesn't know what to say. In that case he may repeat after someone else until he learns (the words to be said). It is also permissible to make Dhikr with all the different wording of Takbeer and Tahmeed and Tasbeeh, and the rest of the Islamic legislated supplications (from the Qur'an and Sunnah). Fourth: At-Tawbah (repentance) and abstaining from disobedience and all types of sins, since forgiveneand mercyare the results of deeds. Disobedience is the cause of being far away (from Allah, the Most High) and repulsion, while obedience is the cause of being near (to Allah, Most High) and His love. In the hadith of Abu Hurairah he said that the Prophet said: Verily Allah has a sense of Ghaira, and Allah's sense of ghaira is provoked when a person does that which Allah has prohibited. (Al-Bukhaaree and Muslim) Fifth: Doing plenty of voluntary (nafl) righteous deeds of worship like Prayer, Charity, Jihaad, reading the Qur'an, Commanding what is Good and Forbidding what is Evil, and other such deeds. Verily, these are amongst the deeds that are multiplied in these days. It is during these days that even deeds that are less preferred, are superior and more beloved to Allah than superior deeds done at other times. (These deeds are superior) even to al-Jihaad - which is one of the most superior of all deeds - except in the case of one whose horse is killed and his blood is spilled (loss of life in Jihaad). Sixth: It is legislated in these days to make at-Takbeer al-Mutlaq at all times of night and day until the time of the Eid Prayer. Also, at-Takbeer al-Muqayyad is legislated, and it is done after the (five) obligatory prayers that are performed in congregation. This begins from Dawn (Fajr) on the Day of Arafah (the 9th of Zul-Hijjah) for those not performing Haj, and from Noon (Zhur) on the Day of Sacrifice (10th of Zul-Hijjah) for those performing Haj (pilgrims); and it continues until Asr prayer on the last day of the days of Tash-reeq (13th of Zul-Hijjah). Seventh: The slaughtering of a sacrificial animal (Adhiyah) is also legislated for the Day of Sacrifice (10th) and the Days of Tashreeq (11th, 12th and 13th). This is the Sunnah of our father Ibraaheem - when Allah, the Most High, redeemed Ibraaheem's son by the great sacrifice (of an animal in his place). It is authentically reported that The Prophet Muhammad slaughtered (sacrificed) two horned rams, black and white in colour, and said Takbeer (Allahu Akbar), and placed his foot on their sides (while slaughtering them). (Al-Bukhaaree and Muslim) Eighth: Offering animal as Udhyia It has been narrated from Umm Salamah (may Allah be pleased with her) that the Prophet said: If you see the Hilal (new moon) of Zul-Hijjah, and any one of you wants to make a sacrifice, then he should not cut (anything) from his hair and his nails. (Muslim and others) . And in one narration, he said: .Then he should not cut (anything) from his hair, nor from his nails, until he performs the sacrifice. Perhaps this is because of the similarity with the one who is bringing a sacrificial animal for slaughter (in Haj). As Allah, the Most High, said: And do not shave your heads until the Hady (sacrifice) reaches the place of sacrifice... The apparent meaning of this prohibition is that it is particularly for the one whom the sacrifice is for, and does not include the wife or children, unless there is an individual sacrifice for one of them. There is no harm in washing the head, or scratching it, even if hairs may fall out. Ninth: It is incumbent for the Muslim (who is not performing Haj) to make every effort to perform the Eid Prayer wherever it is performed, and to be present for the Khutbah and benefit. He must know the wisdom behind the legislation of this Eid (celebration). It is a day of thankfulness and performing deeds of righteousness. So, he must not make it a day of wildness, pride and vanity. He should not make it a season for disobedience and increase in the forbidden things like music and singing, uncontrolled amusement, intoxicants and the like - those things which could cause the cancellation of the good deeds done in these days (of Zul-Hijjah). Tenth: After what has been mentioned, it is fitting that every Muslim, male and female, take advantage of these days by obeying Allah, the Most High, remembering Him, thanking Him, fulfilling all the obligatory duties, and staying far away from the prohibited things. He must take full advantage of this season, and the open display of Allah's gifts, to attain the pleasure of his Lord. Surely, Allah, the Most High, is the One Who grants success, and He is the Guide to the Straight Path. And may the blessings of Allah, the Most High, and peace be upon Muhammad and his family and companions! Ghaira: A sense of honour and prestige, and the anger caused by its being violated. At-Takbeer al-Mutlaq: the Takbeer (Allahu Akbar) which is unrestricted to specific times or any specific form. At-Takbeer al-Muqayyad: The Takbeer which is done at a particular time and in a specific manner. The Blessed Days of Dhul Hijjah In what follows, we will highlight some of the Sunnah regarding these days, hoping by this to provide an incentive to make the best out of them and gain Allaah’s reward, in shaa’ Allaah. The First Ten Days of Dhul-Hijjah "The best days in the world are the Ten days." [Ibn Hibbaan, al-Bazzaar, authenticated in Saheeh Jaami` us-Sagheer #1133] "There are no days during which good deeds are more beloved by Allaah than these (ten) days." [al-Bukhaaree, at-Tirmidhee and others] The Prophet, sallallaahu `alayhi wa sallam, was then asked: "Not even Jihaad in Allaah’s way?" He replied: "Not even Jihaad in Allaah’s way; except for a person who went out (for Jihaad) with his self and wealth and came back with none (i.e. lost all for Allaah)." [at-Tirmidhee, authenticated in al-Albaanee’s Irwaa’ ul-Ghaleel, #953] All good deeds can be done during these days and the early generations of Muslims used to exert themselves excessively in worshipping Allaah. In particular, fasting and dhikr (mentioning and remembering Allaah) are to be done in plenty on these days. Dhikr Ibn `Abbaas commented on the verse <<…and to mention Allaah’s name [plentifully] on Known days>> [22:28] by saying: <…these known days are the ten days [of Dhul Hijjah].> [Tafseer ibn Katheer] Fasting One of the wives of the Prophet, sallallaahu `alayhi wa sallam, said: "Allaah’s Messenger used to fast the (first) nine days of Dhul Hijjah, the day of `Ashooraa’, and three days of each month. [Saheeh Sunan Abee Daawood #2129] Fasting on all these days, however, is not a waajib (compulsory), nor is it a constant sunnah that the Messenger, sallallaahu `alayhi wa sallam, never dropped. `Aa’ishah said: "I never saw the Messenger, sallallaahu `alayhi wa sallam, fast the ten days." [Muslim] The Day of `Arafah - The Best Day of the Whole Year The day of `Arafah is the day when the pilgrims stand in worship on the Mountain of `Arafah. "Fasting the day of `Arafah expiates the [minor] sins of two years: a past one and a coming one. And fasting the day of `Aashooraa’ expiates the sins of the past year." [Muslim] "There is no day on which Allaah `azza wa jall frees people from the Fire as He does no the day of `Arafah. He comes close (to those standing on `Arafah) and then revels before His angels, saying: "What are these people seeking?" [Muslim] The Day of al-`Ad-haa The tenth of Dhul-Hijjah is `Eed ul- Ad-haa or the day of an-Nahr (slaughtering). It marks the conclusion of the major rites of Hajj, and commemorates Allaah’s bounty on His Messenger Ibraaheem, when He gave him a ram to sacrifice as ransom for his son Ismaa`eel, `alayhimassalaam. "The day of al-Fitr [i.e. `Eed ul-Fitr], the day of an-Nahr, and the days of Tashreeq are `Eed days for us Muslims. They are days of eating and drinking." [Ahmad, an-Nasaa’ee, Saheeh ul-Jaami` #8192] The Three Days Following `Eed ul-`Ad-haa On these days, the pilgrims complete their rites, Muslims continue with their `Eed celebrations, and are prohibited to fast. "The days of tashreeq are days of eating, drinking and mentioning Allaah." [Muslim] The Sacrifice Allaah `azza wa jall mentioned the sacrifice together with the first and foremost worship in Islaam: prayer. This is a clear indication of its great importance. Thus He ordered His Messenger, sallallaahu `alayhi wa sallam, to slaughter sacrifices by saying: <<…Pray unto your Lord and slaughter [your sacrifice]…" [109:2] Ruling The general concensus of the Muslim scholars is that the sacrifice is an important sunnah, and a worship called for in the Law of Allaah. However, they differ as to whether it is nafl (voluntary) or waajib (mandatory) for those who can afford it. Some scholars have explained the different ahaadeeth on the subject by stating that the sacrifice is obligatory on those who can afford it and not obligatory on those who cannot. Abu Hurayrah reported that the Messenger, sallallaahu `alayhi wa sallam, said: "He who has the capacity, and does not sacrifice, may not approach our musallaa (place of prayer - on the `Eed)." [Ibn Maajah, Ahmad and others, authenticated by Al-Albaanee in Saheeh Sunan Ibn Maajah, #2533] Regarding this hadeeth, Imaam ash-Shaukaanee said: "Prohibiting the one who could afford to sacrifice, but did not do so, from approaching the musallaa indicates that he must have left off a waajib, as it becomes useless to offer the salaah without this waajib [obligation]." [Nayl ul-Awtaar] Avoid Cutting Hair or Nails The one who plans to sacrifice (normally, the head of household) is prohibited to cut his hair or nails from the first Dhul Hijjah until he offers the sacrifice. "For the one who has a slaughtering to perform (on `Eed then, once the hilaal (crescent) of Dhul Hijjah is observed, let him not cut any of his hair or nails until he sacrifices." And in another narration: "Once the ten days start, for those of you who havethe intention to sacrifice, let them not cut any of their hair or nails (until they sacrifice)." [Muslim] This prohibition is the opinion of the majority of the scholars of the early generations of Muslims. Allaahu A`lam Our last call is all praise is to Allaah and may His salaah and salaam be upon our Prophet Muhammad and his family. .............................................. Ahmed said: "i talk facts! NO “exegration” my dear -- ALL FACTS. Otherwise, prove me wrong. AND, people dying over who is gonna touch the grave of the prophet? What Ahmed has for FACTS is nothing but an "exaggeration". "Ahmed said: "ah, ask your Hujay! Those who you “trust”...;)" the "Hujay" would have been dead themselves, right? or do the dead people talk? Ahmed said: "You have old ladies tales -- I want FACTS and REFERNCES! I never ask you for much -- but ONE." Well, Ibraahim's grave(who was by the way no israeli or arab prophet)is a known visited area in Iraq. Muslims and non-Muslims visit there every year. Again, there is nothing wrong visiting and praying for the dead. Visiting the loved ones (even non-prophets) in order to pray for them ALSO happens all the times and there is nothing wrong with that either. We do not worship the dead; we honor, pray and send blessing FOR them; we also take heed, because the dead remind us that we are the next people to perish sooner or later. Ahmed said: "AND, No, it’s not a lip-service for me that Qur`an is my Law. No jose, this is the corrupted Muslims’ way of being. " Then let Ahmed produce and show us where the Quran says you can NOT visit, send blessing and pray FOR the dead. If Ahmed can NOT produce an evidence, then he is nothing but a lair. Ahmed said: "I live the world...by the Qur`an -- Qur`an along -- as a salvation for my destiny. It is simply...more than I need!" Lairs and hypocrites *lived their own world* and they said the same things Ahmed is saying before and their "salvation and destiny" is in the lowest depth in the fire, because they lied against Allah's words. The "world" of hypocrites and what they say are always giving lie direct to what is in their hearts.
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| | Unrecorded Date Ahmed said : "You said; “and I have heard that those who are learned in the Qur'an-whom I approve” well, obviously, this is just “no, we’ll follow what we found with our fathers-- what, even if those “learned” ones were liars??? ” Let's ask Ahmed and the submitters this question: Whom did Ahmed and the submitters learn from how to worship and perform the prayers? Did Ahmed and the submitters learn the formula of SALAAT---(how many RAKAH in what salaat)--from their "fore-fathers" or just from the reading of the QURAN? Ahmed said "KITAAB is a “BOOK”(verses, letters, lines, etc etc etc) without wisdom -- Kitab is NOTHING...but a mamae talkie wag." No, the BOOK is the QURAN. Allah said this: "Alif-Lam-Mim, Daali-kal KITAABU Laa Rayba Fiihi Hudan Lil-Mutaqiin". Also this: "Alif-Lam-Ra, Tilka Ayatul Kitaabil Xakiim(full of wisdom). Thus, the KITAAB and its verses are not "a mamae talkie wag". Ahmed said: "It is the “WISDOM”(the meaning of the kitab) that are what complete the KITAB and make the two into GRAND QUR`AN!" That is right and who taught "the meaning of the kitab" and it is "WISDOM"-----that is right---Muhammad was the teacher. Prophet Ibrahim prayed this way to Allah "Our Lord! raise up for them a Messenger from among them, who will RICITE to them Thy revelations and will TEACH them the BOOK and WISDOM, and will CLEANSE them. Surely Thou alone art Mighty and Wise". What did the messenger Muhammad RICITE? He ricted and taugt the BOOK(KITAAB). The Quranic meaning is the WIDSOM(XIKMA) and it is the prophet's own percepts and examples. Thus, XIKMA(the WISDOM), the meaning the of the BOOK(THE QURAN) is what prophet taugt and it is what prevents or restrains us from ignorant behavior in religion. It is the knowledge in matters of QURAN(RELIGION) and It understanding THAT the messenger had. The XIKMA(the knowledge to teach the BOOK) that Muhammad had was a Divine Law. Allah gave him the XIKMA, the ability to understand and teach the Book. It is the gift of prophecy, or the prophetic office and messengership. Allah said to us in the QURAN perform the SALAAT, but how to perform the SALAAT can be known only throgh the XIKMA that the prophet had, the knowledge to teach and understand the Quran, the prophet's own percepts and examples. Ahmed said "But, a deaf friend of mine...never heard me when looking another way! God only guides whomever He wishes -- I learned this, period." Yes, but hypocrite’s muddled thinking and their wishful thinking makes them that they learned people. The submitters and Ahmed think that they are better than Muslims. The submitters and Ahmed think that they are some kind of reformists, but they do not know that they are deficient in understanding. They reverse the true order of things and mistaking their vice for virtue and calling corruption by the name of righteousness. That is what the hypocrites do.
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| | Unrecorded Date Ahmed's tactics was clear from the beginning. Attack Islam while acting as a muslim, but how long did he think he could fool us was not something he counted on. He can't answer the questions so he elludes them and can't stand by his words so he denies them. What a fit for a big hypocrite. And his so called propject is nothing more than the filth of the submitters. While they claim the source is from the Quran, they fabricate their own stories and call it religion when it is pure delusion.
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| | Unrecorded Date Asalama Alaykum Muslims! Umar, LET me...respond to your friend’s argument: <<<<According to the details scattered in the Qur’an regarding the position of “Rasu’l”, God sends His “Rasu’ls” as symbols of His final Judgment. “Rasu’l”, in contrast to “Nabi” is not just a deliverer of God’s message. On the basis of the response that he receives from his addressees, he decides the fate of his nation. The Qur’an, regarding “Rasu’ls” says: “Those that oppose God and His Rasu’ls shall be brought low. God has decreed: I will surely triumph, Myself and My Rasu’ls. God is Most Powerful, Mighty.” (Al-Mujadilah 58: 20, 21) It should be quite clear from this clarification, that though “Nabi” and “Rasu’l” are separate designations of the Qur’an and all Nabis are not Rasu’l, yet all “Rasu’ls” are “Nabis” too. >>>> OH, my God -- what a liar. God WANTS us all NOT to oppose ANYTHING that comes from HIM!!! IF as the guys say, then Nabis can be opposed? How evil vile scheme. Now, if God wants us all to not oppose ANYTHING that comes from him -- then what would God use??? He would use something that is PLURAL to all things that come from Him. What is that? MESSENGERS, as He says; “God chooses Messenger among Men and Angels”. Thus, everything that comes FROM God...as something that can let us know things -- are Messengers. PLEASE, ask yourself this question; are all ANGELS bringers of “BOOKS”??? NO! However, look at this: - God terms the Angels who punish humankind(The Lut’s people, etc) as MESSENGERS(11.17). - He terms the Angels who take souls to death as MESSENGERS(7.37). - God terms the ANGELS who write down our mistakes/goods as MESSENGERS(10.21) ...thus, i’m very right when I say ANYTHING that comes from God is a Messenger. NOTICE -- the Angels who don’t come to us are NOT Messengers. We know there are Angels in Heaven who do nothing but pray for our forgiveness -- they’re NOT Messengers. God chooses Messengers “AMONG” them...as He does with us. You said; [One of the prophet's sayings is this: It has been reported that the prophet to have said: "From Adam to me, Allah sent a hundred and twenty-four thousand Prophets, of whom three hundred and fifteen were entrusted with a Book." Now, the question is why were there so many more Prophets than Books as the hadeeth tell us? If the role of a Prophet were simply to HAVE a BOOK and deliver the Book, as Ahmed and Submitters believe, there should have been as many Books as Prophets, right.] You’re reffering to corrupted hadiths -- I’m reffering to the Qur`an. I know it’s hard for you to accept that hadiiths are not all “true” -- it was for me, too...but those who LOVE God, sincerely...learn -- learn from the Qur`an. Muhammad did NOT, at any rate, know how many messengers have passed in the past -- nor does he know their stories. God names towns in the Qur`an...that NO HUMAN BEING knows. Towns that rejected their messengers and were punished...like the over-thrown cities. People say these cities are “sodom and gomorath” this is not so. God names, by name ...many cities that we don’t know any story of -- except they rejected their messengers. Do you really believe that Muhammad would say something that would contradict the Qur`an? It was his mission -- delivering the Qur`an -- a song God talked about in the past Scriptures. Something so big -- and so wonderful. Muhammad would NEVER contradict it. It was made for him -- by his enemies...and people who did not have knowledge of the Qur`an. Umar, I know you’re intelligent enough to understand ALL the proofs I have given you from the Qur`an. And, if you’re disclosed from this -- I cannot help you. I’m just a human -- I have no power to go into your mind...and make you understand this. Notice, all that I say are from the Qur`an. Your friends only say “what” that is not in the Qur`an. You said; [Ahmed is here laughing at himself. He is the one who said his salaat is similar to both sunnis/submitters, yet submitters and Ahmed say that sunnis do not follow the Quranic salaat.!] NO, NO, NO -- the Sunnis do follow the Qur`anic salat -- they just extended it...and corrupted it. PLEASE, note -- the people of Ishmael/Kedar...were ARABS. And the people of Muhammad were ARABS. And history repeats itself. Arabian pagans -- did follow the Abrahamic Hajj/Salat/Saum/Zakkat -- they only extended it...and reduced it...and corrupted the addressees and the recipients. God warned the Arabs in the Qur`an that IF they don’t corrupted this religion, that he would bring another people -- i’m just waiting those people to come! hehehe! ;) You said; [Where is the post that Ahmed keeps talking about? I asked him where, but he would not tell where! Just as the submitters(which Ahmed plagiarized many of his writings) have accused the sunnis of following something not in the QURAN(in worship), Ahmed has been here blaming the sunnis for not following the QURAN ALONE in prayers/worship(CIBAADADA).] Umar, I already told you -- the name of it is “SALAADA” -- and I don’t post any islamic thought on anywhere EXCEPT the Islamic section. I also need to tell you that since that Post -- I changed my mind about “Muhammadan rasululah” since it’s NOT right...and discriminates Muhammad from other messengers. Yes, it’d be okay had I the energy to say that from Adam to Muhammad -- but I don’t even know MOST of the messengers’ names, as Muhammad himself didn’t, either. And, please, Umar -- i’m NOT blaming anyone. I’m telling what is right. I know YOU know i’m telling what is right, that is if you’re a sincere follower of God. Forget about the Submitters or whoever else. I’m not blaming anyone except correcting what I believe to be the right way. I have recieved alot of good information from the Quran through submitters -- but I have ALOT of problem with much of submitters’ beliefs. Similar, I recieved alot of information that is GOOD through Sunnis and hadiths, but I have alot of problem with much of the beliefs in these sects. My problem begins with their names -- ALL of them. ICS, Sunis, Ahmadiya, Shi`ite, Wahabia, etc etc etc. Nothing is valid except ISLAM. And, no matter how they “rationalize” it, if ANYONE goes beyong “ISLAM” as a group or people...then that is what they did; went beyong Islam. You said; [However, the point is that if most of the salaat formula the sunnis follow are not listed in the Quran and if Ahmed's salaat is similar to the sunnis--"with little exception"--then isn't Ahmed with the submitters also following what is not in the QURAN.-------and instead follow THEIR OWN HADEETH OR SOMEONE ELSE'S HADEETH.?] Actually, the “formula” of Salat is listed NOWHERE. When the Hadiths showed up in the 3rd century A.H., the family of the Prophet -- who kept a close eye on his tradition...were outraged. Before the hadiths, most of the Prophet’s family were killed by people who claimed to be “muslims”. Ali ibn abu-talib and his sons...were loved and talked highly of by the Prophet Muhammad, yet they were all killed by people who claimed to be Muslims. Not that, later when the hadiths came, Ali’s family were bullied and oppressed by other Muslims...because they didn’t want to take all the things that Hadiths said Muhammad did in salat. Even the people they were part of, the Shi`ites, oppressed them to no end. Later the Shi`ites themselves took them as ‘gods’ beside God...and made them “IMAMS” and claimed that they should have been messengers -- and had the status of being that. Part of them also claimed that Ali was supposed to be the Messenger and that Gabriel “erred” the message -- how evil vile scheme! SUBHANNALLAH! Umar, it’s not following anything -- you just have to examine everything THROUGH the Qur`an. You have to apply to it...and if it is not applicable -- and not there...then you have to do away with it. LIKE -- “Asalama alayka ayuhal nabiyu”(Peace be upon you o prophet) this talking to the Prophet directly. Prophet Muhammad was ASKED to “SAY” that “his prayers” among other things were ONLY for God. What do you have there? Listen to me when I say everything is INNOCENT until proven guilty. All tradition is good until it comes contradiction with the Qur`an. Arabian Pagans...worshipped in their prayers gods beside god -- and addressed them and talked to them. God ASKED Muhammad to say that his prayers were ONLY for God. You said; ["ALSO, Umar -- there are many things which are NOT named formulatiy in the Qur`an...yet I do -- such as; - “how” to fast -- God only tells me to “FAST”...Yet I fast -- not according to hadiths...but the REAL fasting." "not according to hadiths"----that is the point I was looking for.!! I mean if Ahmed does "things" in CIBAADA, "things which are NOT named formality in the Qur'an", isn't Ahmed then following his OWN HADEETH different than the hadeeth the sunnis practice. I mean, aren't then Ahmed and submitter hypocrites? The Quran does not say that one can NOT say in salaat "muhammadan abduhu wa rusulluhu" in his or her SALAAT. On the contrary, in many places, the QURAN says that Muhammad is the rusuul of Allah and the slave of Alah. And we Muslims bear witness that Allah is ONE and that Muhammad is the slave and messenger of Allah(muhammadan abdahu wa rasulahu".] NO, no -- but you see...in the Qur`an GOD agrees with me...while the hadiths don’t. God said “fast from sunrise to sunset” and He said “fast in Ramadan, all of it” I do follow these instruction in applicable to WHERE i’m today and what is today. This is because the Qur`an is that; past, present, and future. HOWEVER, hadiths tell us to LOOK for the moon to fast and to break(a practice in the time of the dark-ages...when no one had the technology we have today!) Thus, while the Qur`an is applicable to all times -- Hadiths only organized people to stay in the past, see? Today, we have the technology to know WHEN ramadan begins and ends. We don’t have to miss any fasting-days...with today’s technology. Now, as I said above, I do bear witness that Muhammad is the Rasul of Allah -- like I do in Abraham, Moses, Jesus, Aaron, David, Solomon, Adam, AND ALL the Messengers that existed. Is this the point? NO! The point is -- saying EXCLUSIVELY to only Muhammad -- is discriminating God’s Messengers. This is NOT my own hadeeth -- but God’s Hadeeth in the Qur`an. Is anyone denying that Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah? Is this the point? You said; ["PAGANS: “we can pray any time we wish”(some Muslims, the Freebie-Minders...think that they can only pray morning and evening)--DAWN(Fajr): "24.58--NOON(Duhur): "17.78--AFTERNOON(Casar): "2.238--SUNSET(Maqrib): "11.114--NIGHT(Cishaa): "24.58." Now we are getting to the real point.! How many RAKACA fajar, duhu, casar, cishaa are there and who taught this to the Muslims? Let Ahmed and the submitters produce this from the Quran. Maybe Ahmed and the submitters can tell us if he and the submitter learned this formula of SALAAT from their "fore-fathers" of the old "generations"] Actually, THAT is my point also -- this was NOT corrupted. Anything that is not mentioned in the Qur`an as correction of the Salat...is FINE. As for Submitters, they have “MATH” that is truly neat to prove their point. BUT, that is not mine...not until I believe in Rashad -- and if i don’t believe in him, then it’ll never be mine. The rakacaas of the Salat...are universally, majoritly, accepted. This is vital until it contradicts the Qur`an -- which it doesnt. Freebie-Minders say since God says “prayers to morning and evening” it means we only pray those. this is not so -- because God says; “morning and evening” and giving how many places we need to pray between them, etc. IF the Arabian pagans only corrupted the dawn prayer, then we’d have NOTHING but that -- and that would STILL be fine, Umar. I mean -- now at least we have “when” and “who” and “where”...the what was not corrupted...and it remained as that. Besides, read the following Qur`anic evidence; [Do men think that they will be left alone on saying, "We believe", and that they will not be tested? We did test those before them, and Allah will certainly know those who are true from those who are false! 29.2-3] God could give us formula in the Qur`an. God could make us all in the right direction. However, God tests people’s faith in Him and how much of a sincere they’re. I lose my friends and loved ones...over my beliefs in Him -- I suffer of insults and hate from my co-religionists. YET, i’m still sincere to Him and am here every day...telling people what is -- instead what my father and grand-father told me “is.” ABOUT HAJJ, It’s despicable to say only “ten” days and in “THREE MONTHS” are the hajj when God says FOUR months. [For Hajj are the months well known. If any one undertakes that duty therein, let there be no obscenity, nor wickedness, nor wrangling in the Hajj. And whatever good ye do, (be sure) Allah knoweth it. And take a provision (with you) for the journey, but the best of provisions is right conduct. So fear Me, O ye that are wise. ] [Allah made the Kàba, the Sacred House, an asylum of security for men, as also the Sacred Months, the animals for offerings, and the garlands that mark them: That ye may know that Allah hath knowledge of what is in the heavens and on earth and that Allah is well acquainted with all things.] [The number of months in the sight of Allah are twelve (in a year)- so ordained by Him the day He created the heavens and the earth; of them FOUR are sacred: that is the right religion. So wrong not yourselves therein. And fight the Pagans all together as they fight you all together. But know that Allah is with those who restrain themselves.] (NOTE: it’s NOT three but FOUR! Talk about corruption!!!) Also, Umar, visiting graves has nothing to do with doing “hajj grave”. Was I talking EVER about visiting graves? I, Ahmad, visit graves. HOWEVER, I never visit any grave as an act of worship...nor do i wheep on it and ask for gain, nor do i give any sacrificial to them...nor do i talk to them...like they can “hear” me. WHEN you go to Hajj, you OFFICIALLY go to the Prophet’s Mosques/tomb. People believe that the Mosque/Tomb of the Prophet(medina) is HAJJ and that you can make HAJJ to it...from the Hadiths. This is idol-worship...since God NEVER tells us that...anywhere in the Qur`an. Also, Abraham’s cave is in Iraq? really? hahah! I must re-locate Israel to Iraq then, I guess. Do Muslims visit there? REALLY? You didn’t name any official who visited there! hhhhmmm, ah! You said; [Ahmed said "KITAAB is a “BOOK”(verses, letters, lines, etc etc etc) without wisdom -- Kitab is NOTHING...but a mamae talkie wag." No, the BOOK is the QURAN. Allah said this: "Alif-Lam-Mim, Daali-kal KITAABU Laa Rayba Fiihi Hudan Lil-Mutaqiin". Also this: "Alif-Lam-Ra, Tilka Ayatul Kitaabil Xakiim(full of wisdom). Thus, the KITAAB and its verses are not "a mamae talkie wag".] This is the THING; God NEVER used “Qur`an and Wisdom” if He did -- and I missed it...tell me. AS I said...and Qur`an says, ayatul kitabi wa al-xikma...make up Qur`anul Al-kariim. And, yes, when I used to only “read” the Qur`an it was NOTHING but an arabic recitation...and empty; verses and book. However, when I read it slowly...and listen to it -- I got the QUR`AN; the BOOK and the WISDOM! [Ahmed said: "It is the “WISDOM”(the meaning of the kitab) that are what complete the KITAB and make the two into GRAND QUR`AN!" That is right and who taught "the meaning of the kitab" and it is "WISDOM"-----that is right---Muhammad was the teacher.] Cursed be the Liars -- “Araxmaan, CALAMAHU AL-QUR`AN!!!”(The Merciful, the TEACHER OF THE QUR`AN!) Prophet Muhammad was A TOTALL believer; who UNDERSTOOD the Qur`an. WHO did he teach it to? THE ARABIAN PAGANS. Some believed in his message -- others didn’t. However, to those who believe, they gain the UNDERSTANDING OF THE QURAN -- unless a new revelation comes. When the Qur`an is complete, they UNDERSTAND IT...because they are Believers who God gives them the WISDOM to understand. Thus, the only thing that the Messengers are excell above the believers is the fact that they recieve a MESSAGE and NOTHING but that. Yes, Prophet Muhammad did teach man the Qur`an -- with His Wisdom; Because he could understand it...unlike the unbelievers. This is not so with the Believers. Did the PROPHET -- EVER preach the Muslims in regard of teaching them the Qur`an? NO. He would recite the revelation to them -- and they would understand it...for God had made them Believers. However, among them were those who did not believe...and those asked questions. The prophet gave most of his time to the Unbelievers...because they were dumb, deaf, and did not have the intelligence/wisdom to understand. I understand the Qur`an today...NOT because any scholar or Prophet Muhammad teaches it to me -- but GOD teaches it to me. He gives me the power to understand the Qur`an...because I believe. If you don’t have this -- then I swear on the holy name of my God...you’re not a believer. Peace - Ahmad!
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| | Unrecorded Date http://www.submission.org/muhammed/shahada.html http://www.submission.org/messenger/prophet.html http://www.submission.org/hajj/ Ahmed will be coming back day after day untill HE TELLS US ALL ABOUT THE SUBMITTERS. We knew about the SALAAT(SUBMITTER WAY), SUNNAH(SUBMITTER WAY), BIBLE QUOTATION(SUBMITTERS) Eve(Submitter view) etc etc. TOday he talked ABOUT HAJJ but as usual FAILED TO MENTION HIS SOURCE THE SUBMITTERS. If AHMED is not a submitter AND not a believer GO VISIT THE ABOVE WEBSITES AND SEE IT FOR YOURSELF. Whether AHMED'S hypocricy WORKS OR NOT SHALL BE SEEN. Muslims are not afraid to ADMIT THEY ARE MUSLIMS and don't hide their sources because they know they won't be rejected BUT AHMED HAS A REASON TO DENY SUPERFICIALLY WHILE SUBMITTING TO THE FORUMS. Be my guests and VISIT THE ABOVE.
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| | Unrecorded Date Ahmed said: "OH, my God -- what a liar." God WANTS us all NOT to oppose ANYTHING that comes from HIM!!!" No one did lie and said that Allah WANTS us all to oppose ANYTHING that comes from HIM". These are Ahmed's own twisted words and what a *liar* he is. Ahmed said: "IF as the guys say, then Nabis can be opposed? Again no one did say that a Nabi can be opposed, but a rasul can not be opposed. Again these words are Ahmed's own twisted words. Allah gives the people a free will to oppose anything and anyone that they choose. Ahmed said: "How evil vile scheme." The twisting words is "an evil vile scheme" which the hypocrites(like Ahmed) employ every well. Ahmed said: "Now, if God wants us all to not oppose ANYTHING that comes from him -- then what would God use??? He would use something that is PLURAL to all things that come from Him. What is that? MESSENGERS, as He says; “God chooses Messenger among Men and Angels”.Thus, everything that comes FROM God...as something that can let us know things -- are Messengers. PLEASE, ask yourself this question; are all ANGELS bringers of “BOOKS”??? NO! However, look at this: - God terms the Angels who punish humankind(The Lut’s people, etc) as MESSENGERS(11.17). Well, Allah SENT the *wind* and other elements and even animals(birds) to "punish humankind" also. Then, does that mean the *winds* and the *birds* are also messengers people need to follow? Ahmed said: "- He terms the Angels who take souls to death as MESSENGERS(7.37). - God terms the ANGELS who write down our mistakes/goods as MESSENGERS(10.21)....thus, i’m very right when I say ANYTHING that comes from God is a Messenger....NOTICE -- the Angels who don’t come to us are NOT Messengers. We know there are Angels in Heaven who do nothing but pray for our forgiveness -- they’re NOT Messengers. God chooses Messengers “AMONG” them...as He does with us." Well, angels were sent also to the messengers/prophets of Allah. "Allah sends down the angels with the spirit by His command upon whomsoever of his bondmen He will" Suratul Nahal 2. Allah also sent a servant of His(a human being)"a bondman from Our own bondmen"---Suratul Kahl 65---to the messenger/prophet Muuse(who was to receive a "knowledge" from this servant of Allah). Ahmed said: "You said; [One of the prophet's sayings is this: It has been reported that the prophet to have said: "From Adam to me, Allah sent a hundred and twenty-four thousand Prophets, of whom three hundred and fifteen were entrusted with a Book." Now, the question is why were there so many more Prophets than Books as the hadeeth tell us? If the role of a Prophet were simply to HAVE a BOOK and deliver the Book, as Ahmed and Submitters believe, there should have been as many Books as Prophets, right.] You’re reffering to corrupted hadiths -- I’m reffering to the Qur`an. Well, the Quran does not say that every prophet was given a BOOK of his own, does It? No the Quran does not say that, but Ahmed is here to tell us---while using his made-up and false *hadeeth* from the submitters--that every prophet had a BOOK of his own. Ahmed said: "I know it’s hard for you to accept that hadiiths are not all “true” -- it was for me, too...but those who LOVE God, sincerely...learn -- learn from the Qur`an." Well, I know that I do not *believe* and *accept* the many false *hadeeths* that Ahmed and submitters believe. Ahmed and the submitters say they follow QURAN ONLY, but they believe what is NOT in the QURAN; thus, they are nothing but hypocrites. Ahmed said: "Muhammad did NOT, at any rate, know how many messengers have passed in the past -- nor does he know their stories." But Ahmed and submitters know better than the messenger, RIGHT?! By the way, how did Ahmed know that Muhammad(saw) did NOT know HOW MANY messengers have passed in the past and their stories? Let me guess----Ahmed knows it from the Quran, right? Can Ahmed count how many prophets the prophet knew and who many he didn't know? Ahmed said: "God names towns in the Qur`an...that NO HUMAN BEING knows. Towns that rejected their messengers and were punished...like the over-thrown cities. People say these cities are “sodom and gomorath” this is not so. God names, by name ...many cities that we don’t know any story of -- except they rejected their messengers. Do you really believe that Muhammad would say something that would contradict the Qur`an? It was his mission -- delivering the Qur`an -- a song God talked about in the past Scriptures. Something so big -- and so wonderful. Muhammad would NEVER contradict it. It was made for him -- by his enemies...and people who did not have knowledge of the Qur`an." Well, I do not believe that Muhammad(saw), the last prophet/messenger from Allah, would "contradict the message of the Quran" . Muhammad's job was not only to "deliver" the Quran and yes Muhammad knew what people did not know. Muhammad had the Quran along with Xikma. Muhammad's knowledge was not limited to what is in the Quran. Allah have him the gift of prophethood/messengerhood along with the revelations. Muhammad(saw) was a *walking Quran* himself. He knew more than the hypocrites(like Ahmed and the submitters) know. Ahmed said: "Umar, I know you’re intelligent enough to understand ALL the proofs I have given you from the Qur`an. And, if you’re disclosed from this -- I cannot help you. I’m just a human -- I have no power to go into your mind...and make you understand this." Yes, Ahmed is just a human being who is been deceived by his own hypocrisy. So many questions that was put to Ahmed about the Quran and was asked about a proof from the Quran, he showed what the Quran does not say. So, how can a lair and a hypocrite like Ahmed help me understand the Quran? Ahmed said: "Notice, all that I say are from the Qur`an. Your friends only say “what” that is not in the Qur`an." Well, submitters and Ahmed are known to be lairs. Whenever they can't find something from the Quran, something that is been asked, they accuse others of not seeing what is not there.!
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| | Unrecorded Date Ahmed said: "It is the “WISDOM”(the meaning of the kitab) that are what complete the KITAB and make the two into GRAND QUR`AN!" Then, I said: "That is right and who taught "the meaning of the kitab" and it is "WISDOM"-----that is right---Muhammad was the teacher.] Then Ahmed said this: "Cursed be the Liars“Araxmaan, CALAMAHU AL-QUR`AN!!!”(The Merciful, the TEACHER OF THE QUR`AN!)"!. You see, Muhammad was to become the one the *teacher* Allah will RAISE from Arabia, the one whom Ibrahim prayed for: "Our Lord! raise up for them a Messenger from among them, who will RICITE to them Thy revelations and will *TEACH* them the BOOK and *WISDOM*, and will CLEANSE them. Surely Thou alone art Mighty and Wise". Ahmed said: "Prophet Muhammad was A TOTALL believer" Yes, and he was to be the teacher who explains the Quran and this teacher*(Muhammad) and the one who prayed to Allah for a teacher(Ibraahim) NEVER worshipped IDOLS. Allah TOTALLY protected them from anything that is not befitting to future messenger\prophet of Allah. Therefore, *cursed* be on the one who *curses* without a reason and *cursed* be on the one who *accuses* of IDOLS WORSHIP to the future messengers\prophets of Allah---Ibraahim and Muhammad. Ahmed said: "Yes, Prophet Muhammad did teach man the Qur`an --with His Wisdom; Because he could understand it...unlike the unbelievers." That is right and thus *Muhammad was the *teacher*. Ahmed said: "This is not so with the Believers. Did the PROPHET -- EVER preach the Muslims in regard of teaching them the Qur`an?" But I thought Ahmed was here to teach the Muslims the ENGLISH Quran that he offers on here!!! Ahmed said: "The prophet gave most of his time to the Unbelievers...because they were dumb, deaf, and did not have the intelligence/wisdom to understand" That is not the truth. The last prophet/messenger of Allah, Muhammad(saw) was available for anyone who wants to learn the Quran and anyone who did not want also. Most of his time was spent with the Muslims. Unbelievers kicked him out from his home and fought him. He taught the Quran to the Muslims who was ready to learn and the last prophet/messenger Muhammad encouraged the Muslims to teach others too. BALIQ CANII WALAW AYAH. Ahmed said: "I understand the Qur`an today...NOT because any scholar or Prophet Muhammad teaches it to me -- but GOD teaches it to me. He gives me the power to understand the Qur`an...because I believe." Allah did not teach Ahmed the Quran. If Allah taught Ahmed the Quran, Ahmed would not have said Allah's future messengers/prophets used to worship IDOLS. The Devil is teaching Ahmed what is not in the Quran. The devil gives him the "power to understand" false stories about the Ibraahim and Muhammad. Ahmed said: "If you don’t have this -- then I swear on the holy name of my God...you’re not a believer." *Cursed* be on the one who *curses*. "And of mankind are some who say: we believe in Allah and the Last Day, yet they are NOT believers. They would deceive Allah and those who believe, whereas they deceive not SAVE THEMSELVES, and they PERCEIVE NOT. In their hearts is a disease. So Allah has increased unto them that disease, and for them shall be a torment afflictive for they have been lying. And when it is said them: make not mischief on the earth they say: we are but REFORMISTS. Surely it is they who are the mischief-makers and yet they realize not"
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| | Unrecorded Date Asalama alaykum Muslims! umar, it is not that anyone *SAID* or said not. it is what explained. when god says do not oppose my messengers -- god says do not oppose prophets or no prophets. all the *rasuls*. also, umar -- don't be a child...everything that god sends are not "messengers" -- it is everything that have contact with us. winds and birds ARE god's staff -- but they did not warn us...or come to us with a message -- unlike angels(some) and humans. i didn't understand why you had to quote the "bondmen" to me. i was talking about that not humans only are messengers. you said; [Well, the Quran does not say that every prophet was given a BOOK of his own, does It? No the Quran does not say that, but Ahmed is here to tell us---while using his made-up and false *hadeeth* from the submitters--that every prophet had a BOOK of his own.] oh, pppuuuuhhhhlllleeezzzz, remember -- you backed out when i was gonna show you FROM the qur`an that every prophet was given a book. u raised your corrupted hadiths' idealogy...and when i brought the qur`an to help YOU see it -- you ran in aversion. you said; [ By the way, how did Ahmed know that Muhammad(saw) did NOT know HOW MANY messengers have passed in the past and their stories? Let me guess----Ahmed knows it from the Quran, right? Can Ahmed count how many prophets the prophet knew and who many he didn't know?] well, u guessed right. and i don't care "count" -- i know muhammad did NOT know all the messengers of allah. to some, god mentioned to him -- to others he left out. EVEN in the qur`an...god talks about some messenger -- and leaves out their names. and some he named them,,,and left out their stories. god, thus, is the praised one -- above all others! you said; [Muhammad's job was not only to "deliver" the Quran and yes Muhammad knew what people did not know. Muhammad had the Quran along with Xikma. Muhammad's knowledge was not limited to what is in the Quran. Allah have him the gift of prophethood/messengerhood along with the revelations.] muhammad's job was to deliver the qur`an. the qur`an is what god put EVERYTHING human being needs. and don't be dumb -- had not muhammad had "xikma" he would not understand the qur`an...but god gave him that for he would need to preach with it. the gift of messengerhood is nothing but delivering what god wanted him to deliver; the qur`an! and you're ungrateful man when you ask people something that is not in the qur`an. things that god left for YOU as a mercy and kindness. it was people like you who created hadiths...and corrupted them beside the qur`an. and god knows the unjust. you said; [You see, Muhammad was to become the one the *teacher* Allah will RAISE from Arabia, the one whom Ibrahim prayed for: "Our Lord! raise up for them a Messenger from among them, who will RICITE to them Thy revelations and will *TEACH* them the BOOK and *WISDOM*, and will CLEANSE them. Surely Thou alone art Mighty and Wise"] so, what? you think that "arahmaan" is muhammad? CURSED be the liars beyond recognition! muhammad died -- the qur`an is living. you think about that. you said; "Ahmed said: "Yes, Prophet Muhammad did teach man the Qur`an --with His Wisdom; Because he could understand it...unlike the unbelievers." That is right and thus *Muhammad was the *teacher*." am i the teacher of the qur`an when i teach it to unbelievers who do not understand it? no! this means -- god given me wisdom(as he does to all believers) but god is and always will BE the teacher. i'm teacher to ther unbelievers regarding the qur`an...but i'm NOT the teacher of the qur`an. i sure hope you get this. muhammad was a believer -- he was given a wisdom(MUCH more wisdom than normal believers -- for he was a messenger) he taught the qur`an to the unbelievers -- but he did NOT teach the qur`an. he died -- god continues to teach it to others after him. why? because god IS the teacher of the qur`an -- and NO ONE but god. you said; [Ahmed said: "This is not so with the Believers. Did the PROPHET -- EVER preach the Muslims in regard of teaching them the Qur`an?" But I thought Ahmed was here to teach the Muslims the ENGLISH Quran that he offers on here!!!] no, no, no -- ahmad is here to correct the "corrupted" brothers of his. there are people among here who are deaf, dumb, and blind. there are those who are so eager to protect their fore-fathers. thus, ahmad is not here to teach any believer what is in the qur`an. don't mistake the two. you said; [Ahmed said: "The prophet gave most of his time to the Unbelievers...because they were dumb, deaf, and did not have the intelligence/wisdom to understand" That is not the truth. The last prophet/messenger of Allah, Muhammad(saw) was available for anyone who wants to learn the Quran and anyone who did not want also. Most of his time was spent with the Muslims. Unbelievers kicked him out from his home and fought him. He taught the Quran to the Muslims who was ready to learn and the last prophet/messenger Muhammad encouraged the Muslims to teach others too. BALIQ CANII WALAW AYAH.] well, i didn't say he wasn't available. but, when the prophet was free -- he went to the markets of makkah to preach his religion. he got most of his followers this way -- for they would fall in love with his message when they hear it. he was kicked out -- and nearly killed...but the prophet NEVER stopped trying to get to them. he would come out in ramadan -- early years...because in ramadan he had a protection from the unbeliever for it was their own religion. Later in medina -- prophet muhammad did the same...with medins where he preached in the markets and the streets. when something important was revealed, prophet muhammad would go to the market -- and NOT tell his followers first. they would go with him and hear it from the market. and the good thing was, the believers were happy with this. they wanted to get as much brothers/sisters possible. you said; [Allah did not teach Ahmed the Quran. If Allah taught Ahmed the Quran, Ahmed would not have said Allah's future messengers/prophets used to worship IDOLS. The Devil is teaching Ahmed what is not in the Quran. The devil gives him the "power to understand" false stories about the Ibraahim and Muhammad.] what the heck do you mean "future messengers/prophets"?? also, jews and christians will agree with you in your statement that "the devil" teaches me stuff. but, then again, ask me if i care. god loves me -- he made me a muslim and taught me the qur`an. there are those who doesn't like to hear this -- so ka naxoo nafta waa! ...and your last verses of the qur`an just gave me a wonderful feeling. it is amazing what god shows us through others. hahaah! it is also amazing how people recite what explain themselves, perfectly. for a few mish-chief makers, lets see; god <no believer shall kill another believer> "muslims": somalia, pakistan, iraq, iran...did NOTHING but that. god <We will, without doubt, help Our messengers and those who believe, (both) in this world's life and on the Day when the Witnesses will stand forth,-> "muslims": since when the hadiths were written, no muslim country won a battle of its own. muslims started fighting themselves over and over. muslims were oppressed to no end. muslims were defeated and their mosques were taken into uneblievers' hands. 4 million jews keep fights off 400 million arabs. oh, just what else??? hhhmmm...such "believers" don't yah think?! :) god <And those who, when an oppressive wrong is inflicted on them, (are not coward but) help and defend themselves> "muslims": ooops, israel keep bombs and kills poor *muslims* and other *muslims* are too coward to even raise their voice to them. saddam, saudi, syria, etc etc etc - are all powerful countries...who do not defend their own people. every three years -- muslim country is oppressed and ethnic - cleansed, other *muslims* stand around and talk. god <Why then was no help forthcoming to them from those whom they worshipped as gods, besides Allah, as a means of access (to Allah)? Nay, they left them in the lurch: but that was their falsehood and their invention.> "muslims": ooops, ali, muhammad, fatimah-zahrah, abdi-wahab, etc etc etc - fail time and time again to help their idolators. don't they know that they themselves were those who worshipped god? well, well,...hahaha! god <O ye who believe! If ye will help (the cause of) Allah, He will aid you, and plant your feet firmly.> "muslims": oops, what is the intention of doing anything? bin laden blows off some buildings for the WRONG reason -- he gets to hide and be casted every where. arabs start wars -- for the WRONG reason, they are defeated to no end...and they lands are taken and people are oppressed. somalis went to war against each other for the WRONG reason -- and is still suffering the consequences. now, lets think of those who say "we believe" when they don't...those when u tell them STOP injustice and idol-worship,,,tell you "NAH...we're believers -- who do good". cursed by god, angels, and the cursors...are those who do mischief in the land! peace - ahmad!
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| | Unrecorded Date Ahmed said: "it is not that anyone *SAID* or said not. it is what explained. Well, what Ahmed "explained" does not change the fact. Ahmed said: "when god says do not oppose my messengers -- god says do not oppose prophets or no prophets. all the *rasuls*." yes, the fact is that all Nabis are not Rasul but all Rasuls are Nabis. Ahmed siad: "also, umar -- don't be a child...everything that god sends are not "messengers" -- That is right! "everything that god sends are not "messengers" -- Ahmed said: "it is everything that have contact with us." The jins and the devils have "contract with people too, right? are they messengers? Ahmed said: "winds and birds ARE god's staff -- but they did not warn us...or come to us with a message -- unlike angels(some) and humans." Does Ahmed think that the angles come to us and warn us? The Allah's ayats(the QURAN) and His messenger's examples(the sayings of the messenger) are enough for warning. Ahmed said: "i didn't understand why you had to quote the "bondmen" to me. I was pointing out that--that "bondman" from Allah to the prophet/messenger Muuse was sent in order to teach something. Then, was that bondman from Allah a messenger like a prophet? If not, let not Ahmed "be a child"--because "everything/everybody that god sends are not "messengers like prophets", right? Ahmed said: "you said; [Well, the Quran does not say that every prophet was given a BOOK of his own, does It? No the Quran does not say that, but Ahmed is here to tell us---while using his made-up and false *hadeeth* from the submitters--that every prophet had a BOOK of his own.] oh, pppuuuuhhhhlllleeezzzz, remember -- you backed out when i was gonna show you FROM the qur`an that every prophet was given a book. Well, what Ahmed did "show" was his *false hadeeth from the submitters" that says every prophet was given a BOOK of his own. The Quran does not say that. Ahmed said: "u raised your corrupted hadiths' idealogy...and when i brought the qur`an to help YOU see it -- you ran in aversion." Well, we Muslims believe the QURAN + SUNAH. Ahmed, on the other hand, is running with the RASHAD KADAAB'S HADEETH, but he claims to follow the QURAN ALONE.!!! Ahmed said: "you said; [By the way, how did Ahmed know that Muhammad(saw) did NOT know HOW MANY messengers have passed in the past and their stories? Let me guess----Ahmed knows it from the Quran, right? Can Ahmed count how many prophets the prophet knew and how many he didn't know?] well, u guessed right. and i don't care "count" -- i know muhammad did NOT know all the messengers of allah." Ahmed can not "count", but he knows how many prophets our last messenger/prophet Muhammad did NOT know!!! Ahmed said: "to some, god mentioned to him -- to others he left out." Yes, but does Ahmed know the ones our messenger knew and the ones he didn't know? or did Rashad Khadaab taught Ahmed the number of prophets our messenger Muhammad knew NOT? I don't believe the hadeeth Ahmed follows, but I believe this one: It has been reported that the prophet to have said: "From Adam to me, Allah sent a hundred and twenty-four thousand Prophets, of whom three hundred and fifteen were entrusted with a Book." "The chain of MESSENGERS and PROPHETS has come to an end. There shall be no MESSENGER nor PROPHET after me." (Tirmidhi, Kitab-ur-Rouya Babu Zahab-un- Nubuwwa, Musnad Ahmad, Marwiyat-Anas bin Malik). I will, isha-Allah, come back to the point of the prophet being the *teacher* prophet Ibraahim prayed for": "Our Lord! raise up for them a Messenger from among them, who will RICITE to them Thy revelations and will *TEACH* them the BOOK and *WISDOM*, and will CLEANSE them. Surely Thou alone art Mighty and Wise"
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| | Unrecorded Date Aslamu 'Alaykum Warahmatulahi Wabarakatu! I like to join this discussion because: 1) Its interesting. 2) I know something about it. 3) I like to share my idea and knowledge with YOU my brothers and sisters. First, I like to start with a little intorduction about our Prophet Muhammad. Muhammad, who for the devout Muslim stands as the 'seal' (khatam) at the end of a line of prophets and is usually designated simply as 'the Prophet' (an-nabi) or 'the messenger of God' (rasul Allah), was born in Mecca around 570 as the posthumous son of 'Abd Allah ibn "Abd al-Muttalib of the clan of Hashim or the tribe Quraish. Then, when he was six yrs old, his mother Amina died, and then orphan, Muhammad, grew up at first under the guardianship of his grandfather 'Abd al-Muttali, and then of his father's brother Abu Talki (died 619), whom he is suppsed to bave accompanied on a business trip to Syria. As a young man Muhammad enterd into the services of the rich mechant windown Khadija, whom he married when he was approximetly 25 yrs old. Although Khadija was considerably older than Muhammad, the marriage progressed very happily and was blessed with several children, of whom however only the daughters survived beyond early youth. ***It appears that Muhammad did not at first enter into the public life of his native city in any speacial way. We know very little concerning the inner develpment that led Muhammad, at the age of forty or more, to go before his countrymen with religious revelations. According to the Muslims tradition, the calling occured suddenly; however, it is known that Muhammad had occupied himself with religious questions for some time previously, either consciously or uncounsciously. The decisice point for Muhammad's mission as a porphet originated, of course, with the conviction that he was a chosen 'messenger' (rasul) of God who was given a responsiblility in matters of faith, not only for himself but also for his people. Quote from the Quran: "Did He not find thee erring" Sura 93:6-8, ...The meaning is that (at that time) Muhammad was found erring regarding knowledge of the revealed laws (shara'i, sing. sharia), which can be perceived only through being instructed (sam'). Thus God says: 'Thou knewest not what the (revealed) Book was, nor belief; but We made it a ligt, whereby We guide whom We will of Our servants. And thou, surely thou shalt guide unto a straight path' (sura 42:52) ***If one asserts that for forty years Muhammad lived just like his fellow tribesmen, and if this is meant in the sense that like them he lacked learning, which can be gained only through being instucted (sam'), then this is fine; however, if, one means it in the sense that he lived according to the religion and the unbelief of his fellow tribesmen, then God forbid! For the prophets must remain free (ma'suum) from shameful sins, both serius and mild, before and after the commencement of their prophethood, and how then can there be ubelief and ignorace of the (divine) creator? (The answer to this is given in the words of God:) 'It is not ours to associate anything with God (as a partner in his divinity)' (sura 12:38). In the eyes of the unbelievers it would be a sufficeient defect in the Prophet if he had lived in unbelief before the commencement of his porphethood... *** By the way, do you guys know the difference between a messenger (rasul) and a propet (nabi)? It is related from the Prophet that e was asked about the Prophets, whereupon he said: '(There are) one hundred and twentyfour thousands.' When he was then asked how many messengers there were among these, he answered: 'The great host of three hundred and thirteen. ***Now, let me tell you the distinction between the two (messenger/prophet=rasul/nabi). The distinction between the two is that a messenger is one of the prophets to whom, together with the verification miracle (mu'jiza), the Book s send down. A prophet, on the other hand, who is not a messenger, is one to whom no book is send down, but who was commanded only to restrain people on the basis of the earlier revealed law (sahr'ia). *Please feel free to write me your coments and questions. Your brother in Islam, Abdinasir!
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| | Unrecorded Date Tbone99. You are welcome Brother. I am wary of extending my gratitude to anybody now. Since december 1999 we had a case here in the forums. I know you started with this subject "the difference between a messenger and a prophet" which is fine. However, I would like you to be a mediator here by way of answering very important questions that were the fundamental argument between AHMED SUBMITTER a follower of a new MESSENGER called RASHAD and US AHLUSUNNA WALJAMAACA. I ask you these QUESTIONS: 1-Do you believe ANOTHER MESSENGER after Mohammed Scw?. That will come and teach us THINGS mohammed DIDN'T?. I know Prophet JESUS peace upon him was fortold. 2- What do you think ABOUT THE SUNNA?. 3- How do you perform your prayers?. Based on how the prophet said we should pray or another form that is in existence that we don't know about?. 4- What is your take on AHADITH OF THE PROPHET?. 5- Do you believe the PROPHET wrote the QURAN as AHMED SUBMITTER believes?. I hope you will take sometime to answer these questions by either simple yes or no.
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| | Unrecorded Date Salaam 'aleukum Liman Tabical Hudaa; Tbone99; As brother Bashir stated earlier, we would like to invite any brother who is interested in these topics, may be it would be nice if you could glance a bit a past history as far as october/november last year to be able to identify how far we went. Basically, The PROPHET Muhammed (ppuh) and His SUNNAH is cenral issue in this discussion. Take your time!!
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| | Unrecorded Date Ahmed said: "you said; [Muhammad's job was not ONLY to "deliver" the Quran and yes Muhammad knew what people did not know. Muhammad had the Quran along with Xikma. Muhammad's knowledge was not limited to what is in the Quran. Allah have him the gift of prophethood/messengerhood along with the revelations.] Then Ahmed said "muhammad's job was to deliver the qur`an. the qur`an is what god put EVERYTHING human being needs. and don't be dumb -- had not muhammad had "xikma" he would not understand the qur`an...but god gave him that for he would need to preach with it. the gift of messengerhood is nothing but delivering what god wanted him to deliver; the qur`an!" Muhammad(saw) did not ONLY *deliver* the Quran. The last messenger(saw) Muhammad was more than just a postman, but the hypocrites/submitters want us to believe Muhammad was just a deliverer of the Quran. Ahmed said: "and you're ungrateful man when you ask people something that is not in the qur`an. things that god left for YOU as a mercy and kindness. it was people like you who created hadiths...and corrupted them beside the qur`an. and god knows the unjust." I'm grateful that Allah sent us the Quran along with Muhammad's examples. Muhammad(saw) was the purifier of people who was suppose to *instruct* people what is in the Book and the Wisdom. His practical example is the epitome of the Quran. Hypocrites, however, create their own hadeeth to deny this fact. They say that Muhammad's job was only to deliver the BOOK and nothing else that the Quran does not mention. It is on the brink of kufr to reject this and say that the Messenger(saw) did not have any role except as a mere postman. Ahmed said: "you said; [You see, Muhammad was to become the one the *teacher* Allah will RAISE from Arabia, the one whom Ibrahim prayed for: "Our Lord! raise up for them a Messenger from among them, who will RICITE to them Thy revelations and will *TEACH* them the BOOK and *WISDOM*, and will CLEANSE them. Surely Thou alone art Mighty and Wise"] so, what? you think that "arahmaan" is muhammad? CURSED be the liars beyond recognition! muhammad died-- the qur`an is living. you think about that." Allah makes the principle of true FAITH incumbent on us to OBEY by the command and the teachings of Muhammad(saw), even thought he is no longer with us--------->OBEY ALLAH AND OBEY THE MESSENGER. We have the Quranic teachings and the Sunah of the last messenger/prophet of Allah. Muhammad(saw) is entrusted with the task of *teaching*, *reciting* *purifying* *delivering* the message completely by his examples. He is to be obeyed by the command of Allah. The Prophet Muhammad(saw) performed such regulations as salaat and zakaat and the people could see *visually* over and over again.* The people themselves instituted the same practices and it was spread in this manner. Just as the Quran is attested to verbally by the ummah, the *teachings and examples*, the sunnah is attested to practically. The notion that the Prophet Muhammad(saw) was just a postman is purely "beyond recognition" and *false*. Ahmed said: "muhammad was a believer -- he was given a wisdom(MUCH more wisdom than normal believers -- for he was a messenger) he taught the qur`an to the unbelievers -- but he did NOT teach the qur`an. he died -- god continues to teach it to others after him. why? because god IS the teacher of the qur`an -- and NO ONE but god." The manner in which the Prophet(saw) lived(his examples) and the way the prophet(saw) did teach the Quran is the way to Allah. Allah "continues to teach" us IN THE QURAN to *follow* the *examples* and the *teachings* of His messenger(saw)--->(If you love Allah, follow me." "You have in the Messenger of Allah, an excellent example.) Ahmed said: "ahmad is here to correct the "corrupted" brothers of his. there are people among here who are deaf, dumb, and blind. there are those who are so eager to protect their fore-fathers. thus, ahmad is not here to teach any believer what is in the qur`an. don't mistake the two." Well, Ahmed is here to *promote* the teachings of another *dead* man by the name of Rashad Khalifa who lied and said to be a messenger from Allah. Ahmed is the "deaf, the dumb and the blind" who said Rashad Kadaab showed him the correct teachings in the Quran! Ahmed said: "when something important was revealed, prophet muhammad would go to the market -- and NOT tell his followers first. they would go with him and hear it from the market. and the good thing was, the believers were happy with this. they wanted to get as much brothers/sisters possible." this is not entirely the truth. You see, "something important" did not only concern the "unbelievers". The Quran is full of places where Allah is addressing the "believers" who already believed. The messenger is the one who was told to say to the "unbelievers"---?LAKUN DIINAKUM WALIYA DIIN Ahmed said: "you said; [Allah did not teach Ahmed the Quran. If Allah taught Ahmed the Quran, Ahmed would not have said Allah's future messengers/prophets used to worship IDOLS. The Devil is teaching Ahmed what is not in the Quran. The devil gives him the "power to understand" false stories about Ibraahim and Muhammad.] what the heck do you mean "future messengers/prophets"?? Well, before Ibraahim and Muhammad became messengers/prophets they were *future messengers/prophets*. And they were NOT PAGANS and they did NOT worship IDOLS as Ahmed alleges. Will, insha-Allah, respond to the rest of the post.
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| | Unrecorded Date Ahmed said: "god loves me -- he made me a muslim and taught me the qur`an. there are those who doesn't like to hear this -- so ka naxoo nafta waa! also, jews and christians will agree with you in your statement that "the devil" teaches me stuff. but, then again, ask me if i care." There were Muslims during the prophet's time who said there were Muslims, but they were in fact Munaafiqiin and they were in bed with the jews in Madina. The jews loved the hypocrites among Muslims. . If Ahmed says he is a Muslim, that is his sayings, but I know that what he puts forward on here is from the teachings of a Kadaab named Rashad Khalifa(a dead hypocrite who misled Ahmed and another Somali by the name of Abib). Ahmed said: "...and your last verses of the qur`an just gave me a wonderful feeling. it is amazing what god shows us through others. hahaah! it is also amazing how people recite what explain themselves, perfectly. for a few mish-chief makers, lets see;" Yes, the Quran explains how the hypocrites operate and what is in their hearts. Ahmed said: "god <no believer shall kill another believer> "muslims": somalia, pakistan, iraq, iran...did NOTHING but that. god <Why then was no help forthcoming to them from those whom they worshipped as gods, besides Allah, as a means of access (to Allah)? Nay, they left them in the lurch: but that was their falsehood and their invention.> "muslims": ooops, ali, muhammad, fatimah-zahrah, abdi-wahab, etc etc etc - fail time and time again to help their idolators. don't they know that they themselves were those who worshipped god? well, well,...hahaha! I think Ahmed trying to tell us something---that he is not a "muslim". He forgot to mention his own name(Ahmed) and his own-self. Is Ahmed not one of the "muslims"? And is he not a Somali? Is he not one of the Somalis who fled the country and "did NOTHING" and is he not a refugee like the rest of the Somalis?
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| | Unrecorded Date Exactly umar. Axmed markuu qoraayo waa is ogyahay inuu gaal yahay oo isaga muslimka uusan ku jirin sidaa daraaddeed ayuu wuxuu doono ugu yeeraa mar walba.
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| | Unrecorded Date asalama alaykum muslims, umar, ...or maybe ahmed knows that the *majority* of the muslims -- are not after all...god's people? facts, my brother -- facts. non-corruptable, indisputable...facts. FROM qur`an and today...and god knows the unjust. also there is a reason why god threatens muslims -- as he threatened the jews...that if they turned back, he would replace them with another people. p.s. will write more when i have more time. peace - áhmad!
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| | Unrecorded Date Ahmed said: "...or maybe ahmed knows that the *majority* of the muslims" But does Ahmed think that he is better than the Muslims who come to Somalinet forum? Ahmed said: "also there is a reason why god threatens muslims" Including Ahmed, right?
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