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     | Sunday, April 08, 2001 - 09:23 am I am sick and tired of answering that question. Why does it matter, we are poor, ignorant people who set their country on fire, killed their brothers and sisters, find themselves in white man's land, and only in such small numbers. Does it matter what qabil. To be honest, most of the time it is Girls that ask me this question, most of my guy friends don't give a dam about my clan, and I don't give a crap about theirs. I read this forum and I come to the conclusion only few people don't think in this mentality, most somalis are still stuck in 1960 Somalia... Durgal: I would gladly help you, except that we don't have Siberia to shipt those old mentality somalis, like Stalin had. Rest of you what do you think, you still have clan mentality or you are new person?
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| | Sunday, April 08, 2001 - 10:09 am Sirrus,so what if someone asks you that question?
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| | Sunday, April 08, 2001 - 10:14 am Ifis, which question? Whats your qabil or do you still have qabil mentality? I asked two questions, and I have two answers.
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| | Sunday, April 08, 2001 - 10:49 am Sirrus,can you answer both?
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| | Sunday, April 08, 2001 - 11:43 am maaaaaaan someone agrees with me after ten thousand years later,damn i agree with you after all we are people with the same looks,tall,skinny with dark skinn and jareer hair,with all that matchings what does qabiil matter.It's time we recycle qabiil well atleast i did. the question is what the hell is qabiil for ????????and how do we make our people to get rid of it????????this qabiil thing is pissing me off.anywayz if u have an answer or solution to both these questions just drop two lines u will be surprised who might benefit from it. wasalaamu caleeykum.
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| | Sunday, April 08, 2001 - 12:26 pm Both,meaning what wrong with the question qabil? and are you free of it!
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| | Sunday, April 08, 2001 - 01:58 pm Salaam ppl Ifis..."what's wrong with the question qabiil?" Well, let me tell you...qabil is the samething that destroyed our country, the same reason we fled our country and find ourself all over the world...qabil is what killed our ppl, the same reason why we our country was the only one in the world who did not have a government for 10yrs, qabil is what caused our ppl economical hardship, our country physical hardship...the list is endless...at the end of the day it doesn't matter about your backround...it's about being a Muslim and what type of person you are inside...
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| | Sunday, April 08, 2001 - 04:00 pm My Qabil is irrelevant, do I have qabil mentality, well no, I will defend every somali so as long as he defends me. I will welcome every somali so as long as he welcomes me, I will pray with every somali so long as he beliefs in Allah. get my drift.
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| | Sunday, April 08, 2001 - 04:27 pm Sirrus nigga you are right there are some ignorant people out there who doesn't know anything about Qabil and killing for their brothers and sisters for it.. but •••• them all who ever believe that need to dead and ship to somalia to my adress so i could have them for dinner in that way i will be happy.........................................
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| | Sunday, April 08, 2001 - 06:55 pm Well, i was taught it is wrong to ask someone about his/her qabil, because you can simply know that person's qabil from the city he/she is from. I think it is so ghetto to pop the question WHAT IS YOUR QABIL?. you have to be slick about it, by asking WHERE WERE U BORN? and etc.... I don't have a clan mentality, but i also think it doesn't heart to know your clan name, as long as u don't think that your clan is better than the rest...... and not over use it.......
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| | Sunday, April 08, 2001 - 08:11 pm Sirus I beg to differ To me Qabil is everything.I cannot marry someone who is not my qabil or have any intimate relationship with them,ofcourse i can communicate and interact but only on the basic level,a human obligation,out of politeness.But when it comes to down right truth,we can't seat on our chair and type words we dont mean just to look political corect.I personaly believe Qabil brings order,self worth and class.Every society needs class,from bottom to the top,the loothed to the admired.The same applies in economical status,from a janitorial to a lawyer.You can't have a lawyer associate witt the janitor,it will be funny. You can only feel opposed on Qabil if you belong to the lower class of Qabils eg the Midgaans and Hawiyee(For their Moryaan Reputation).If you ask me,Qabil helped me in many dilemas,where i just had to mention my qabil and have my brothers running to help me.Stop acting all ignorant and enlightened,you know i speak what you think of.Only i have the guts to say it loud!
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| | Sunday, April 08, 2001 - 11:05 pm salaam fellow muslims, for me personally wen i hear of qabiil i automatically associate with it something negative (the destruction of our beloved nation), for this reason i have a great hate for qabiil talk and get offended when asked which qabiil i belong to. i am sick to death and tired of this trash talk nowadays because it is no longer used as a sign of recognition but rather haram motives. TIME MAGAZINE: u beg to differ because it is clear ur mind has been polluted, alhamdullilah i have not been subjected to such pollution. u claim that qabiil brings "order,self worth and class", i beg to differ because ur claims r unjustified. all qabiil has brought is hatred, killing, chaos, injustice and feeling no self worth. we have become a nation of havoc and all because of the misuse of qabiil (like u obviously do). furthermore, u made the claim that "The same applies in economical status,from a janitorial to a lawyer.You can't have a lawyer associate witt the janitor,it will be funny". once again ur arguments r feebile and incorrect. In a successful society all individuals are equal and the there is unity. let me give u an example, at the time of our prophet Muhammed (S.A.W) and the companions, there was great prosperity and peace. they conquered lands and transformed a whole ppl, but yet there was no seperation between so-called "classes". If u remeber Bilaal, the first muadhin of islam associated with the most best of mankind, our prophet, and he was a slave. doesnt that show u something. There is no class unless in terms of faith. so out of curiosity, wat makes u better than a person who u claim to be of a lower class(hawiye, midgaan...). its pretty obvious ur far lower of class then most of the hawiye and midgaan ppl. and u talk about ur qabiil coming to help u, if u werent so damn qabiilist maybe ppl from other qabiils would help u if called for ur fellow muslimiin rather than talking qabiil crap. Man, all i hope is that ur not of the younger generation, because we dont need polluted minds. SULKHA: u cant really tell which qabiil someone is from where they were born. for example, how many ppl lived in moqadishu, almost every qabiil in somalia, so really sista just show ur true intentions that qabiil matters to u, so that inshallah the next generation who are true muslims and want peace for somalia can stay away from u.
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| | Sunday, April 08, 2001 - 11:08 pm Salamacaleykum!! Walalayaal, qabiilka waa wax na burburiey, taas waan lawada soconaa kuligeenba, laakiin as long as the qabil is used right, wax fiican oo noqokaraa, hadaan runta isku sheegno. Markaad qabiilka u isticmaashit in aad qabiilo ku kalasaartid, oo aad midna hoosgeysid, ama midna korgesid, markaas uu imaanaayaa qabyaalada dhibkeeda. Markaad dhadid qabiilkaygaa dadka dhan ka fiican, ama angaa qabiilada dhan oo kale ka sarey, that is when you have sick qabiil mentality Salaamacaleykum..
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| | Monday, April 09, 2001 - 01:54 am I don't think there is something with Clan thing It is just what it means to you.For me : It's a family thing,u started by your father and then his father all the to the clan.It's kind of like am making my family tree.I don't know mine and am learning it now,just to know my family history.It is not like i hate a clan,I mean the war happened and everybody that killed and raped is guilty.If you want someone to pay,let the guilty ppl pay.You are born with a clan it is nothing more.
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| | Monday, April 09, 2001 - 06:33 am What i hate about qabiil is when some1 asks me what qabiil i am b4 they even ask my name....and the way it ruined our beautiful land...!! But qabiil aint all bad.....true it is the reason why we 'somalii's fight over qabiil....and the problem is not comin' from the qabiil is comin' from the pple.......!! Every nation has tribes and clans......gaalo pple just dont care and thats why they have fewer relatives compared to us somaliis or most africans........!! Qabiil is just ur family tree....and it dont hurt to know it or to know what family tree ur friend comes from......as long as it dont make a big diff. to u or u dont start treatin' the person differently once u know what tribe they r.....and i mean diff. either better or worse.....its just not fair....!! Sirrus.....to answer ur second question.....i dont have a clan mentality......i dont believe in it......but i dont deny it either.....it dont bother me when friends wanna know what qabil i am and it dont make no diff. to me if i find out what qabiil they r........!! But never will i ask some1 what qabiil they r.......i have real close friends i've known for years and i honestly dont know what clan they belong to.....i find it ceeeeeeeeeeeb to ask some1....!! But its ok when some1 asks me......aint that weird....hmmm...!! Salaam
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| | Monday, April 09, 2001 - 06:59 am I believe whatever Mr H Hefner believes....I guess that's my Qabil
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| | Monday, April 09, 2001 - 07:20 am Good topic. Honesita, once again U said it all my sis. Whenever, people ask me my qabil and i think it's unnecessary for them to know i just say. i am from 'abnaa Aadem', just like U! some people just laugh and others give me this weird look...but oh well  . Qabiil ain't a bad thing...it's what U make it! On the otherhand, 'Qabyaalah' is somalias biggest problem... i remember someone saying that it is one of the mordern 'Idols', which is worshiped by our nation. As long as we engage in qabyaalah. we are not gonna get far in the world. I really hope we can over come this desease. and I don't know about You guys, but i want our country, to be a Country.. On a positive note, I know we'll get there some day InshaAllah peace n love
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| | Monday, April 09, 2001 - 07:36 am Let me start with this, It bothers me when ppl ask me my qabiil I wouldn't mind if me and the person who is asking my qabiil should know me for while before the QABIIL thing comes out of his/her mouth... This is what I found out, the most ppl who ask me my QABIIL happened to be the ladies, my buddies dont care what qabiil I am, they find out some where else.. To answer your second Q? I dont have the clan mentality and to be honest with you I never ask a person clan unless they tell me or someone else tell me their clans... Nabadeey
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| | Monday, April 09, 2001 - 08:04 am In my views, asking some one about this/her qabiil, is not the end of the world, unless u harm that person, because of his qabiil. You know if u talk to the elders , they tell u that qabiil, use to be the way we govern our people.and the thing was each qabiil use to send thier wise people to represent them and make sure that they do not bring shame to thier qabiil, sure it was not all good , because they use to fight between them,But one thing was clear, the wise men use to represent them. now a days the most foolish , self serving fools are the representatives of each qabiil in somali, they do not have the best of the qabiil in heart nor they care about thier qabiil, only themselves,and we still support them, even though they are no good son of a bitches. damn do't even start me with those ass holes, sorry for the language
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| | Monday, April 09, 2001 - 08:12 am To answer the question “what is your qabli”…. its Somali, full stop. I have experienced the negative and positive of qabil...I lost my father due to it...but I have not been consumed by hatred for the people who did murdered him.... inshallah they will deal with god, now that being the extreme negative. Qabli when used, as identity is not negative especially, when one is looking for their people at a time of need to give a helping hand. However, I do have a problem when its used to discriminate or treat other's in an unjust manner. There is no tribe in the court that matters...judgment day...so why waste your time and energy on such a worthless cause. I have lived in different countries majority of my life and have witnessed people speak different language (tribal based) and religion co-exist in peace. Yet Somalia’s have one language, religion and culture, yet we are so divided on a trivial issue as qabli...even after witnessing first hand the consequence of qabli and the impact & havoc it has caused in our beloved country… which now brings me to ask this question, are we blinded by our ignorance or we are just people who are out of touch with reality? Majority of us have aunts, uncles or cousins who intermarried or intermarried with someone of a different tribe or have some sort of connection with more then one clan, so how do they choose who to hate or discriminate? Most of us have had some impact of what qabli has done to us in our country…why do we still want to practice it when there is far more greater causes that we could take part in like contributing to the rebuilding of our country and coming up with solutions rather then focusing on issues that are worthless and not progressive to us as Somalis. We should put efforts on causes that bridge the gap and bring us closer as people of one nation. This should be the generation that can bring an end to the misery our people are going through, now that is a worthy cause for discussion. I am the borrowing quote from Ali-Boston posted on the career forum here on Somalinet. Yes, I have a dream that my country shall be free one day free from tribalism, ignorance, and curable diseases I have a dream that I will be proud again one day proud of the achievements that my fellow Somalis have made from the ashes of civil war I have a dream that one day I will return return to the beautiful blue sky and sandy beaches that don't need me to take a vacation I have a dream that one day our tribal divisions will contribute to our development instead of our destruction I have a dream that we will strike oil and use the proceeds from oil to develop our land and see no more hunger finally, I have resolved to do all I can to make my dream come true until the the day that I die. The brother says it all for me…I hope we can put our energy on issues that bring us together not divide us. Peace.
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| | Monday, April 09, 2001 - 08:54 am To Muslimsista. God bless you sis, and you actually made a very good sense.. To be honest, my intention is not qabil, but i simply don't think there is anything wrong with knowing about your qabil name. I believe qabil destroyed your country, and our ppl, but still it doesn't hurt to know your qabil name, as long as u don't think that your qabil is better than the rest... Qabil was not a bad thing before the civil war. It just became a bad thing after the war, and Somalis over used it...
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| | Monday, April 09, 2001 - 09:07 am SIRRUS Well said mate.....I am proud to have an intelligent brother/sister like U Time Magazine When was the last time you took your brain to the Laundry? Ignorance has touched the very core of you brother..........and I reckon it is impossible for you to swim out of the hatred coz U R not a QABIILISTE.......U R a GRADE A JAAAHIL Straight from the JUNGLE. I feel sorry for you coz U never had a good upbringing, did ya? I can identify with Morons like ya coz I have seen your type around. PEACE
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| | Monday, April 09, 2001 - 02:03 pm Believe or not, I do not believa that Qabiil exists,.... we made up those maladetti.. names such as HW, DR, IS, etc. As long as we believe those big gods (some of us believe more qabiil than Allah) we go nowhere. I see Somalia and Somalis as a clinical case: SUBJECT: bunch of poor, ignorant and worthless people called Somali. PAST-MEDICAL HISTORY: unknown because of their ignorance. PRESENT MEDICAL HISTORY: Diffuse metastatic malignant cancer in every organ caused by the so-colled "qabiil". DIAGNOSIS:Ignorant-related delusional disorder associated with Chronic pschosis, post-traumatuc stress disorder, depression, paranoia, sexual disorder, behaviour problems, Qat-related schizoprenia, TB meningitis, Hepatitis B and C, all parasites, protazoo and helmints diseases that you cannot immagine. PROGNOSIS: Extremely poor (infausto) TREATMENT: Only god knows the causative therapy, But the symptomatic one is cocktail of neuroleptics (anti-psycosis), anti-depression, anesthetics, anti-alzheimars, electro-shock therapy, behavioural modification therapy and the most important one is UDUCATION, EDUCATION and EDUCATION. Alfa
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| | Monday, April 09, 2001 - 02:27 pm From most of you, I get the notion that Qabil has both negative and positive effect. Most of the time you equate Qabil with family and help from relatives. Well need I remind you, in the recent wars of our homeland, the following phenomena was observed. --Nephews killing their aunts and uncles of their mother side, because they were of different clan.Or your cousins from our mother side killing, hating or abusing you because you belonged to the enemy clan. Now does that sound like family thing. As far I am concerned Qabil had his place, among our nomad ancestors who roumed the land for water and lived in constant treat. Call me westernised, call me modernised, all I see is people who refuse to grow, refuse to learn, refuse to change. I spend most of my life growing among foreigners, and when I first set foot on my country I thanked god that I was among people who spoke like me, looked like me, and acted like me. Only then do I find out, you have to belong to group. Now I cannot inspire to become the leader of my country why, because people are not gonna see me, they are gonna see my clan. So here is my question, which are you 1)HUMANS 2)MUSLIMS 3)AFRICANS 4)SOMALI 5)CLANS 6)REER Most of the modern world falls between 1-2, somalis seem to fall between 5-6, so what does that say about our patriotism, about our Islamic values. Time Magazine You disagree with me, thats fine. But never claim to know what I am thinking, I don't think like you thank god. Is people like you, who were dispositioned from their homeland, from hintherland of Somalia (Badiyo) and now find themselves with computer, that pollute the young generation. Son you hold so much anger, that seeing another clan would cause you cardiac arrest. I was recently reading a page writen by R.J Henson, leader of the ARYAN Nation, he was speaking of how great was the white race and everybody was crap. He said niggers are animals and Jews thiefs, they he said white were the only humans on earth. You should try to contact him, I think you too have alot in common. Just appologise to him, that you are black and then tell him of how great your clan is, he might symphatise with you,,,,,
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| | Monday, April 09, 2001 - 03:21 pm To: TimeMagazine ••••! i never heard such bogus, absurd and pathetic lines of rhetorics in my lifetime.When i read what u wrote two things come to mind. Either your an over aged adolescent who esteems himslef wiht his qabil credentials, or ur a naive teenager who has no idea the meaning of ur words. all in all your a misguided being, we all pray for you. AMIN. Getting to the matter at hand.Answer these questions for me: how does qabil bring class? how does it bring self worth? how does it bring order? your conclusions on why qabil is good,certanily speaks of a shallow man who endeavors to seek confidence and fullfilment from the works of others of the same qabil, how sad! Hear me out, for i will repeat myself once. Firs, qabil does not bring class because this question is an open ended question, it is relative to the person whom you ask. personal opinions and perspectives vary, spo who is to say which qabil has more class than the next? Essentially, the class u speak of applies to you and only you and no one else. Second, it does not bring selfworth and should not bring self worth. Why? selfworth comes from the individual the person in question, not what a member of your qabil did or will do.Those who seek their selfworth form their qabil have flawed character, such as you. Selfworth, self respect, self love, self etc, comes from the individual & not from anone else.Third,qabil does not bring order, conversly, it brings chaos, havoc and unnecessary bloodshed. Qabil if you follow contemporary issues or even read the Time MAgazine your name connotes, wabil in general creates a fierce loyalty to a group as opposed to the whole and the loyalty of a nation. If the memebers of qabils were a centralized oragnizations with strict edicts for conducts, than yes you can say it brings order. But what we have back home is a bunch of uneducated, unsanetized, hyena-like, toothless-carnivores who call themselves leaders. So you tell me how these motherless-goats will bring order, when they themsleves do not know the meaning of the word like yourself? Brother of mine it saddens me to read what you wrote, espesially this day in age. For heave's sake we are in the twenty first century, the world is debating about whether to clone humans, corporations are patening your gene sequences & you have the balls to advoate for the very thing that brought us to a white man's country. Where we work like slaves, where our family structures are debased by the minute, where our culture is being eroded like a puddle of water in the sahara desert. Qabit my friend is what bought you where you are today. You enjoy have the opportunity to deat three times a day, yet there are kids back home dying every day, going to bed hungry & unfed for days, where young kids have no future and know nothing else in life than kill or be killed. If you are so passionate of qabil as you seem, than why don't you back and defend what you claim to be yours? You ashame me brother-of- mine, no, dis-owned-brother-of-mine, i have spent considerable valuable time of mine to write this piece, i pray this will educate you and i sincerely hope it will shed some light in the no turning back predicament your in.
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| | Monday, April 09, 2001 - 03:28 pm AMIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIINNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN
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| | Monday, April 09, 2001 - 03:41 pm Assalamu Alaikum, Dear Sirrus, I understand your concerns and very much subscribe to your ideology. Nevertheless, there is only one problem. Regardless how much you distance yourself from tribalism you cannot. So you ask, what is the answer! The answer is to view your tribe as nothing more than your last name. The same way people refer to you as Sirrus The Great, they can say Sirrus Clan X. Furthermore, I believe, that tribalism is not the problem. We can abolish tribalism today, and have another conflict on which city you're from, or which way you cut your hair. You see condemning tribalism is only a cosmetic attempt to solve our problems. What I propose is to educate our people to learn to value one another. To learn to have mutual respect and that we are all Somali. Not only that, we must learn that what happens to the least of us, affects all of us, and vice versa. As a Somali proverb states, the last camel walks as quickly as the first. Thus, more or less, our destiny is intertwined and our paths overlap. So in order for all of us to survive we must co-exist. It doesn't really matter what tribe you are, it’s whether you have a pure heart and pure intentions; and the only way to reach that utopia is to follow our RELIGION. Wassalam Wabilaahi Towfiiq.
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| | Tuesday, April 10, 2001 - 05:18 am to i've never read so much crap in my life!!!!!!!!!! where the hell did get this idea that class is a good thing? yes all societies probably do have hierarchies but it does mean they go boasting about it. It is difficult to run a communist society, where everyone must be equal we have seen it fail may times.But we should be doing our every best to make that people have the equal opportunties to get to where they wanna be. Whereas in western world it is social class that prevents this from happening in the Somali society it will be qubil that will not allow us to have meritocratic system. here's an example; a huge business opens up some where in somalia and it's recruiting employees, the owner is a certain tribe would you not think that there would be some bias towards people from a tribe that he did not like. And if your thinking that there is minor chance that this sort of could occur, i think you are the ignorant one. it has been stated in many books over the past that it will be difficult for somalia to have economy whilst clanism existest.It is difficult enough lack and muslim in a world that is run by the white capitalist males that only wants to benefit himself and people of his kind, and uses and exploits people like us, we do not need to be fighting amongst our selfs as well,we need to be united as a country not as south and north or as tribes but as Somalia. But with uneducated dumbass like you still around it will be along time before people starting thinking like SIRRUS. To sirrus think you have raised some good points in this discussion. here's my e-mail if you wanna continue this discussion gacaliso_21@hotmail.com
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| | Tuesday, April 10, 2001 - 05:20 am To timemagazine i've never read so much crap in my life!!!!!!!!!! where the hell did get this idea that class is a good thing? yes all societies probably do have hierarchies but it does mean they go boasting about it. It is difficult to run a communist society, where everyone must be equal we have seen it fail may times.But we should be doing our every best to make that people have the equal opportunties to get to where they wanna be. Whereas in western world it is social class that prevents this from happening in the Somali society it will be qubil that will not allow us to have meritocratic system. here's an example; a huge business opens up some where in somalia and it's recruiting employees, the owner is a certain tribe would you not think that there would be some bias towards people from a tribe that he did not like. And if your thinking that there is minor chance that this sort of could occur, i think you are the ignorant one. it has been stated in many books over the past that it will be difficult for somalia to have economy whilst clanism existest.It is difficult enough lack and muslim in a world that is run by the white capitalist males that only wants to benefit himself and people of his kind, and uses and exploits people like us, we do not need to be fighting amongst our selfs as well,we need to be united as a country not as south and north or as tribes but as Somalia. But with uneducated dumbass like you still around it will be along time before people starting thinking like SIRRUS. To sirrus think you have raised some good points in this discussion. here's my e-mail if you wanna continue this discussion gacaliso_21@hotmail.com
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| | Tuesday, April 10, 2001 - 05:43 am Everything as a good side and a bad side,so does the whole clan thing.It is just up to you on which side you are going to approach it! You can write for ever about what happened and what is happening now but how is that going to solve anything???? I for one don't belive that Somali ever existed, Somali exist in the atlas.You are a Somali when a foreigner asks you,Were you are from?.If a Somali asks you that question,you r from North or South,let's say you are both from North,next question will be which clan,if you are from the same clan,well then you will move on to which sub-clan.Do you ppl see my point?This goes on and on,so how can Somalis be patriots?
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| | Tuesday, April 10, 2001 - 06:28 am I once read in a book that there were this small tribe some where in India that believed that their were from theses Gods with different names. We do believe in NAMES aka QABIIL. Think about it: You do see 2 Somalis either a man or woman, and you cannot tell who they are, you ask their NAMES aka QABIIL, so all of the sudden those 2 people are different. I do not believe Qabiil exist just bases on the basic fact we all look the same. Maybe when somebody talks then you can say they are from such and such part of the SOMALIAN country....... Peace
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| | Tuesday, April 10, 2001 - 06:50 am Yasmin I agree with you and with Mr. in perfect partition. He said not to blame all our problems on clan, true, some of the problems in our homeland can be well acredited to our ignorance and general lack of education from our people. Yet, history has shown no nation can survive without a good social stratification, meritocratic system and very competitive economy(capitalism). I refrain from using the term Tribilism, for it denotes barbaric savagery, I would refer to call our social system as Segmentary society. What else do we have to show for Clanism, other than good family tree, personal pride and a very solidaric society. Nothing. It is said brothers fight more than unrelated distant people. What do we fight about, a dry land posed to be swept by the Sahara desert, with ecologically raped and abused sea. Is that what we fight about? Ifis The Ethiopians claim somali nationhood or sense of "SOMALIA" was only born from European ambition,it never existed, that we somalis always hated, dispised and ferouciously fought with each other. Our animosity toward our brothers and sisters was worse than that toward the Ethiopian empire. That we could easily be played one against the other. That we were no better than the SCOTTISH Highlanders, who the English subjugated. They used the example of Said Muhamed Abdul Hassan, that he fought with the Isaaks and Abgaals both somali clans, that this man was known as father of the somali nation. So I think you are right Somalia proper never existed, the Republic of Somalia did, and it should be the foundation of all future Unity of the "WARYAAS" People I think clanism only survived because it was well used and exuprantly displayed in our last government. But thats past, I believe with good communication system in our country like, Railoads that connect every city, greater movement of our people for work to cities foreign to their clan should produce the likes of Mogadishu society well mixed people, seeking money and education rather than tribal help like our friend "TimesMagazine" who is lazy, low self esteemed people no better than those that join the Ku Klax Klan to feel better about their skin, because they are sad at living in trailler home, drinking beer and sleeping with their kids. Thank you all for the great contribution,Now I know somali has hope with her offspring running and preaching like that...lol
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| | Tuesday, April 10, 2001 - 06:56 am I have done many favors for Somalis. After helping them out they ask me, they assume that I belong to the same tribe as them. They are so happy when I have finished assisting them and simply want to know my clan affiliation. I tell them, I helped u as a Somali but If u must know my qabiil, it is Hawiye, specifically Haber Gedir. You should see the look on their faces. They become shocked, bitter, and if looks could kill I would be a dead man. I then realized the hate that these Somalis have for me. I have learned to never help out any more Somali refugees. If they hate me cause of my tribe then I will not assist them as it is helping out those who wish u ill will. Now I have realized that Somalinimo is dead. There is nothing that links me with these haters so I best take care of myself and my own. Whatever you do for these people, they will hate u and curse u for being who u are. RONIIN
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| | Tuesday, April 10, 2001 - 08:01 am RONIIN A person of the Marehan clan feels the same way too, it is not that they dispise your clan, those ignorant people dispise anything out side their Clan. Let me ask you a question, when you are faced with an overwhelming problem, do you break down and retreat or face it and solve it. Bro if you decide to retreat, thats fine more are left to carry the fight. Try this next time a person gives you looks, just open the topic on them. Tell them exactly how you feel, you might educate a hopeless clanist.
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| | Tuesday, April 10, 2001 - 09:17 am Roniin!! what you said is interesting but i encourage you to keep helping your som ppl regardless of qabil, they will realize one day they were wrong. I will tell you why the qabil don't make any sense. I work with this guy(ali), and we known each other since back home somalia, we don't belong same clans but we are friends... one day we where just chatting, and this guy shows up(coworker)which happened that he is same clan as me, which i never knew and did not have interest of knowing him that way....anyway ali said don't you know this guy is your brother? i looked at him and said why is he my brother? then he goes ya belong same clan..I laughed and i said i thought you was my brother because i've known you all my life and all the sudden we met this guy at work and he is my brother! common! what is wrong with this picture....we all three of us talked and came up with "qabil is just nothing but a name" that is it!! so try not to make a big deal of it and handle yourself as individual... Mahdi
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| | Tuesday, April 10, 2001 - 01:31 pm Answer the Q!!!!!!!!!! What's your qabiil????
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| | Wednesday, April 11, 2001 - 10:07 am This is probably 1 of the best topics i've eva come across on SomaliNet! Well dun Sirrus! Qabiil is simply a way of identifying 1 anutha, it was not invented so that we could discriminate and hate on 1 anutha. I personally, like Honesita, hate it wen a person asks my qabiil b4 they have even asked such a basic question as my name! Tribalism is wat destroyed our country in the 1st place, surely none of u wanna c that again? I think that a person's qabiil is totally irrelevant nowadays, u cannot judge a person simply because of "wat" they r, instead u should view ppl as "who" they r. None of us chose our tribes, we had nothin 2 do wit it so who really cares? There r obviously sum sad individuals who r still mentally disturbed from the war[and u have othas who there is no explanation 4]!! But we need 2 move 4ward as Somali ppl n stop all this hatin. We need 2 quit wit all the divisions that that exist within us n GET ALONE!! I've got no problem wit n e tribe AT ALL, I c ppl as individuals, I dont c their tribes. SALAAMA ALEYKUM
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| | Wednesday, April 11, 2001 - 11:30 am What's next "WHAT'S THE COLOUR OF YOUR KASTUUMO??"
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| | Wednesday, April 11, 2001 - 12:08 pm Sirrus,what is ''WARYAAS''???
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| | Wednesday, April 11, 2001 - 12:26 pm SOMALIS,cut the crap and face IT deep inside of every single one of you there is a qabiilayste DYING to COME out WHENEVER somebody else gets on your SENSITIVE side and attacks your qabiil FOR the main time PRETEND to be LIBERAL all you want. "I SEE YOUR TRUE COLORS,DEEP,DEEP YOU'RE UGLY just like MOI."
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| | Wednesday, April 11, 2001 - 12:48 pm To Wondering Waryaa, Waryee, Wardee. Those are terms somalis use to call each other, I never heard them call themselves "Hey somali can I talk to you" But I heard them alot call themselves Waryaa, waar kaaleei an so on. SpoiltRichGirl I am sorry nobody asked you that question, usually that is the first question a guy asks a girl, so would you be kind enough and answer the question "WHAT'S THE COLOUR OF YOUR KASTUUMO??" LOL LOL. hussien I totally disagree with you, but I I agree with you so far as, Liberalism is concerned. True Liberalism is not a somali trait, just answer this question, if you were told you are from such a clan, then you are told such a clan is being killed and abused, how would you react? That doesn't make us Clanist inside, it only makes us Humans. Hell even a police man will fill you up with bullets if he sees you killing another police officer, does that mean he is Ugly Policistic inside.. So you cut the crap and stop labelling people clanist. For we are told we are somalis, and if you see another somali being killed infront of you by an Ethiopian or who ever would you say I don't care he/she is not from my clan or would you help him/her.
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| | Wednesday, April 11, 2001 - 01:43 pm My Qabil.....is Chemical Compound...ya can say C3O4Cl22
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| | Wednesday, April 11, 2001 - 08:37 pm i am frank in admiting that Timemagazine has a point most of ye do know but unfortunately wont admit. It saddens me to even see some of ye making lectures and unwarranted distortion of a naked truth. Educated doesnt mean one to argue against a plain naked truth by presenting a well-written prose intended to just conceal one's denial of a naked truth.As(in the case of c/qani who gets emotionalised and sidekicks from the main issue) I do agree with what TimeMagazine said wholly and many others and i would be justified to say that the majority do know the truth in what timemagazine said. But to turn the whole discussion into a forum of two sides while one is arguing from a detailed, well, tested plain premisses that can be seen in real life like Timemagazine's point, the other is engaged in westernised ideals and views about tribalism and petty things that have nothing to do with the point. Furthemore, tribalism doesnt destroy nr does it kill in itself. What kills and destroys is a human being. Please try to put your facts in record before you bubble like a depressurized air in a water container. Timemagazine you have a point and frankly you have earned a respect from me from now onwards. I hate to see people who argue for the sake of argument by uttering whatever they wanna say. After all, arguments have one aim, to solve our disagreements over one thing. when you are presented with an infallible argument with strong credentials to it than yours, then please dont keep arguing on and on,,,rest your case and agree with the other. that is all, latter i firmly believe that tribe has its own unique advantages that most of ye know yet blame it for something it has nothing to do,,none of ye seem to grasp the so-called somali wars ,,infact ye all seem to be following a doomed line.
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| | Wednesday, April 11, 2001 - 09:04 pm Somalians are all dupes and today their best weapon made in Somalia is Qabiil,,,,its our best and worst product Made in Somalia,,,Qabiil is our welfare and Qabiil is our Enemy ?
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| | Thursday, April 12, 2001 - 05:36 am Sirrus, what do you mean,a unieted Somali for the 'WARYAAS'!??What about the 'NAYAAS'? CIA,what makes you so sure?You don't know all Somalis!
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| | Thursday, April 12, 2001 - 05:50 am Sirrus, what do you mean,a united Somali for the 'WARYAAS'!??What about the 'NAYAAS'? CIA,what makes you so sure?You don't know all Somalis!
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| | Thursday, April 12, 2001 - 08:02 am Ifis Sis how can I forget the "NAYAAS", without them I fear there would be no nation nor people named Somalis. I regret, I mean I am sorry, very sorry to have forgotten our very beautiful sisters for my unification formula. CIA. "It saddens me to even see some of ye making lectures and unwarranted distortion of a naked truth." Freud once said, "when it comes to question in physics, only those acknowledged speak, and rest voluntarily hold their tungs. But when it comes to psychology, every imbecile assumes to know the naked truth" The case is the same when it comes to Qabil and Somali politics in general. "Educated doesnt mean one to argue against a plain naked truth by presenting a well-written prose intended to just conceal one's denial of a naked truth." Well my friend, guess their is no need for us educated, westernized person to speak on the matter, since god has endowed you with the naked truth and we are simply denying it. One only wonders, what is "your" naked truth. Care to enlighten us. If you read my previous writing you would notice that I stated, that Clanism is the vector that caused Somali expansion in 18-19 century. That it sustained our ancestors in a arid and hostile territory, but much like how a child out grows a pacifier, it is imperative that we outgrow Qabil, for the sake of our people, for our future. My naked truth of how useless and costly Qabil is, is not based on western view, but rather on facts: 1) Two Somali republics have collapsed due to Qabil corruption. 2) Third republic is on life support, because Qabil rules the land. 3) The ghost of 1 000 000 Somalis, killed and tortured because of their Qabil. 4) over 2 000 000 Somalis dispositioned to foreign lands, and will not return,(contrary to what you think), due to clan fights. 5) Back home people support Ignorant Bastard leaders just because they are from the same clan. I find it hard to conceal that, but then again you seem to have the talent to close your eyes to those fact and simply see the very small positive things clans achieved. An you are right clan doesn't kill, ignorant people like you and TimeMagazine kill.
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| | Thursday, April 12, 2001 - 03:24 pm siruus, you watch too much TV... get your facts straight
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| | Thursday, April 12, 2001 - 07:25 pm sirrus,brother waxaa wax loo sheegaa dad waxgarad ah,not like time-magazine iyo kuwa la midka ah,which i doubt they aged 60's and trying to corrupt the young generation,but luckily they won't buy it.laakiin weli waxaa jira dad ku doodaaya qabiil ma xuma,laakiin....maxaa lakiintaba keenay...dhibaatadiisa waatan halkan ku keentay,there is no absolutely any benefits to no-one..and you know that unless you still worshipping the greatest BUDHA like statue of QABIIL...war somaliyeey ha laga tanaasulo qabiil dhibkiisa waa aragteen...mise weli wax baa idiin harsan.
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| | Friday, April 13, 2001 - 02:28 pm ----------------The Naked Truth------------------- Dear: Confused Ignorant Agent [CIA] I sit here in the beautiful city of Toronto Canada, at 6:00PM in the evening, under the guise canopy of serenity and contagious tranquility. I laugh, laugh and laugh some more as I read what ye wrote. How absurd, inane, incoherent, and bogus ye mere words and thought seem. Ye claim to have an infallible argument; even great men such as Newton and Einstein did not conclude this. So how can ye, Confused Ignorant Agent be so audacious to state such. Especially, when ye have no credentials and mundane judgment to show for this. After all, ye are the one advocating for the 18th century theme of Qabil. A question: what is the naked truth? From what ye wrote it’s obvious that the Qabil is something that is necessary and imperative. Dear Ignorant, ye must be silly or naïve to utter this. What has Qabil done for Somalia? In the larger scheme of things, what has Qabil done for the Somali people? If ye’re one who does not deny the truth, ye would claim without a second thought that Qabil has done more harm than good to the Somali nation. Qabil is what forced us to reside in these foreign lands, where our ways as Somali people are eroded. Where our kids imitate rap artists, where our elders are stuck at home 24/7 because it’s too chilly or humid outside, where families are fragmented in all directions. Qabil is what’s forcing half-brothers to kill each other because of the different lineage of their fathers. Qabil is what’s creating dysfunctional homes where loved ones can’t live in peace from the continuous infringements from their families. Qabil dear Agent is the impetus that initiates unnecessary quarreling and fighting when two or more Somali’s come together. Qabil, is the evil that caused the Somali’s in Toronto and worldwide to have 20 or more community services performing the same function. Are we so viably different in terms of religion and culture to have all these communities? Is our background so alien from one another that we can’t compromise? With Qabil frame of mind, we fit so perfectly.…. in fact too perfect, in the divide and rule concept of Western policy, that no energy will be utilised to achieve the later. For instance, we have a population of 80,000 in Toronto yet we can’t even elect one MP to serve our purposes. The Chinese, Indians, Sri Lankans, Ukraine do it, why can’t we? Qabil dear Confused Ignorant Agent, is the evil that created the wound in the Somali nation that even time will think twice about heeling it. Yet, a somewhat rational person as ye , endorse this, how sad indeed, [sigh]…. Now, the ‘real’ naked truth. Dear Ignorant Agent, ye right, Qabil is good. But to what extent? It’s good, when ye are trying to identify yer extended family and yer relatives. But it’s harmful….. in fact dangerous, when it is overused the way our Somali people, as they have done in the past. To belittle, to degrade, to discriminate to harm, people with the same origin, culture, religion as yerself is wrong and barbaric. More importantly, Qabil is an 18th century pastoralist phenomenon. It was an important tool to tha lives of Somali’s back then when we fought invaders, particularly, the Galo- Ethiopians. It was a necessary evil that was useful. Dear Agent, what purpose does Qabil have in contemporary age? Qabil has no use today, other than serving as a identification tool for some and segregation tool for others. The only people who use Qabil are ones who have vested interest in it or those who’s mind is so minute that they lack the ability to think out-side their cranium. Dear Confused Ignorant Agent, Qabil is that wedge that prevents us, from meeting as one & letting our differences settle. How can ye possibly support this???????? Lastly, the term Westerner is one that is used to label individuals or persons who embody the western culture, ideology, values, beliefs and ways wholeheartedly. Dear Ignorant Agent, for ye to refer to those who are against Qabil as ‘Westerners’ is simply incorrect and frankly outrageous. The western ideology is contrary to our ways in so many places, but on the question of Qabil,…their solution is simply flawless. During the 14th & 15th century Europeans all had their clan system, today, they think in terms of nations and patriotism. As Sirrus stated ye must outgrow Qabil, like a child out grows a pacifier ( a nipple made out of rubber to pacify infants when in need of milk). They got rid of the Qabil system that was impeding their progress. Why not systematically emulate this system? The Japanese copied every piece of technological advancements made by the U.S- home appliances, cars etc, are they considered Americans? As a Somali nation we seem to be short in our endeavor for a solution, so is it a sin or a western apparatus if we as people import foreign ideas to solve our problems? Dear Agent, yer usage of the term ‘Western’ is loose and baseless on these grounds. Those who endeavor for solutions to mitigate our nations suffering, should be esteemed and not chastised. Ye see…. anyone can drive, but if ye are driving on the wrong lane repeatedly, what is the purpose of driving……. better why drive? Ye might get hurt! Similarly, ye wrote…. in fact ye have the potentiality of a modest writer but ye words were for another era, misguided and fell short of their target.
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| | Friday, April 13, 2001 - 02:52 pm if the question is what is your qabiil??? i'm SACAD MUSE"HABAR AWAL"...any other questions
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| | Friday, April 13, 2001 - 03:49 pm TRUE THAT YOU ASKED THE Q THEN WHY U COMPLAINING IM SADE MUSE"HABAR AWAL WHICH IS A ISSAQ YA HEARD AND I REPRESENT SOMALILAND. PEACE
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| | Saturday, April 14, 2001 - 09:43 am Good For You YASMINE Now that you got that of your chest, do you feel better, can you breath easily. It must have been bugging you to death. Anyway what does that tell me, other than you are very proud of your clan and region (Somali-land). Next time somebody says: are you Somali, just tell them no, you are from "HABAR AWAL WHICH IS A ISSAQ", I have nothing against my brothers and sisters of SHEIK ISSAQ, I just wonder when will they be proud enough to call themselves somalis rather than just clans.
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| | Saturday, April 14, 2001 - 10:04 am SIRRUS I am a Somali and who says I wear a Kastuumo ?*&%$£!~':+=
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| | Saturday, April 14, 2001 - 03:37 pm Dear Sirus, How considerate of ye! After all, a vessel caught up in a storm far in the deep waters.....you add the rest. A/qani.. Personal feelings shouldnt have to blur your vision as you seem to be in dillema as to the proprietiness of qabiil. A point missed indeed is an indication of short-sightedness and a lack of perceptive understanding. There are common prevalent sentiments in somali societies regardless of their respective tribe. These sentiments are often reflected in the daily interactions of these ppl. While such sentiments are really common, yet we sometimes fail to admit lest we might be perceived as out-dated, primitive characters,(as in your case) First i argued not from a point i have forwarded but a point well said by TimeMagazine-the truth of what timemagazine said or the essence of it, i leave that to your twisted conscience if you have any. Secondly, the mere denial of something true is an indication of two things, namely concealment of the truth or denial for the sake of compromising. In your case, it must be the latter of the two. Furthermore, please avoid being too personal and vehement. Words like absurd inane incoherent arent warranted,on the contrary unless you are trying to emphasize your propensity to personal decrechment. Few incidents of tribal incidence shouldnt have to be a ground against tribal ways of life. By the way, tribe has existed long before ye came into this world. A sufficient reason for (tribal existence)justification can be found in da quran too if you have the time to read it. After all, when i say tribe is advantegous, the likely assumption that come to your mind is somali war which you wrongly conclude that i am a proponent of it. Far from it. Be objective and try to get your incoherent scattered points together and present a convincing argument, who is da absurd me and ye?
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| | Saturday, April 14, 2001 - 04:22 pm Assalaamu Aliakum, People regardless of your social, political, and economic affiliation your still Somali. Moreover, as it so happens every Somali is born of a certain tribe. The conflict here is not of, I have a clan and you do not, it's about my clan should rule and yours should not. Furthermore, I have come to understand that Somali people are power hungry and dictators by nature. Therefore, the ultimate goal is to seek power, and tribalism in this perspective is nothing more than a means to an end. Since the drive, and the ambition to rule would polarise any other discrepancies amongst society. So what? Well if we understand why tribe has become extremely important in the past four decades, then tribalism will extremely subside. Wassalam Wabilaahi Towfiiq.
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| | Saturday, April 14, 2001 - 04:56 pm hehehehhe I see the only supporter of mine here is CIA. Man this is the benovolence of somali associations.It is irreplicable;one is doomed to the end with any hope to go further without having a nanger thrown on your throat. I said it before and i am saying again,Qabil is everything to me.You can cry or you can sing,i dont give a damn.It is with this attitude that made me say the truth in the first place.I see Hypocricy overflooding the cyber world. Qabil makes us who we are,it is a human obligation to sutisfy curiousity,or to understand the unknown.Without Qabil,we stand confused and unable to comprehend the peremters of interraction.You can call it stereotypes;i know it is a harsh vice but damn important to have.Qabil brings people to their boxes and categories.The identification factor,or what i call mordern elite gang memebership.There is the loyality and brotherhood among people of the same Qabil.We can't live blindly,under the flag of we are all equal,although we are in the eyes of Allah,but we all need to be living in this world to understand the rules and live by it.I am not saying you need to go and shoot someone who is not your qabil,because you find them beneath you,actually you are allowed to be pride and looth other qabil,just as long as it is confined in the peremeters of non violent and harmless acts.all i am blabbering here is,we need Qabil,i can count my fore fathers names to the original of my fore fathers,you can call it the original invention of Qabil,and i am damn proud of it.Once again,i say i am only saying something you all are thinking and have no guts to say it loud.
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| | Sunday, April 15, 2001 - 02:56 am Mushkilada waxay taala Somalida waxay u dhintaan anay meeshay u xisaabsan yihiin ay power leedahay, waxaad arkaysaa hadii qabiil laga baxo waxay ku dagaal tamayan wadankaan joogo aafiican iyo kayga kaa fiican like Toronto is better than Ottawa, UK is better than USA, and things like that.Hadii ay Somalia u noqdaan without qabiilaysti waxay noqon sheekada Woqooyi ayaa Koonfur ka fiican and the opposite. Hadii taa laga baxo waxay noqon, kani waa pure somali kana waa mix somali... hadii taa laga baxo sheekadu waxay tahay wiilasha soomalida gabdhahaa kafiican and the opposite. Waa sheeko aan dhamaanayn. Walaashiin
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| | Sunday, April 15, 2001 - 10:34 am -------------------Total Incoherence---------- Dear Confused Ignorant Agent (CIA) It is now clear to me, your stand is one of mere ostentatious and pure attention seeking. Your words remind me of gifted filmmaker who lacks focus, you babble with rosy words, but of what content? From the start of your posting until the end, I was in complete search of meaning and comprehension of your message. What is your message? You advocate for Qabil, but on what grounds? For failure in presenting supportive evidence, you proceed on an accusatory tone: denial, emotional, short sightedness, scattered points are some of the words you use to describe. Need I remind you these lexicons are ones used by spectators. True debaters; strive to present their argument with sufficient evidence. But since you lack the later, you became agitated and commence on pointless trench warfare. To what end? Is it to conceal your lack of knowledge, or just to respond for the sake of response! Our evidence supporting the eradication of Qabil and Qabil mentality has been more than enough presented. In addition if you scroll up you will find an overwhelming support for our ideology. But then again, more than once you have shown your talent to put on a blindfold and ear plucks when faced with insurmountable argument. Hence, what is produced by your mind, lacks sensory inputs and is full ambiguities, case in point: ------"After all, a vessel caught up in a storm far in the deep waters.....you add the rest." *******Elaborate!!!! ------"First i argued not from a point i have forwarded but a point well said by TimeMagazine-the truth of what timemagazine said or the essence of it…." ****** You have no point of your own, other than being passionate cheerleader of Timemagazine, hence this is a forwarded argument. ------"Few incidents of tribal incidence shouldnt have to be a ground against tribal ways of life." ***** Few? I fear during your period of sensory depravation, with your customized blindfold and earplugs many incidents pertaining to Qabil and Somalia occurred. ------"There are common prevalent sentiments in somali societies regardless of their respective tribe. These sentiments are often reflected in the daily interactions of these ppl." ***** I am afraid the terms "Group Mentality" and "Blind loyalty" are more applicable here than "sentiments" ------"After all, when i say tribe is advantegous, the likely assumption that come to your mind is somali war which you wrongly conclude that i am a proponent of it. Far from it." ******Logic, Valid deductive arguments: If Qabil is the root source of Somali wars, then supporters of Qabil are also supporters of Somali wars. Correct! I am not here to convince you, for your polluted mind is beyond my efforts and only age and wisdom can remedy such. It is neither my goal to endure your baseless argument and perpetual accusations. If you have any evidence to support the continued existence of Qabil, very well present it, but if you do not (which is the case) then refrain from this unwarranted, elementary, feline backlashing.
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