Thank You African Americans .....

[Sir-Luggoyo]

[quote="AbdiWahab252"]Sir Luugoyo:

Some whites did help out but if blacks did not shed their blood, get imprisoned or killed who would have recognized their rights.

.[/quote]


A/Wahab,

Are you for real? A black man's blood getting shed or being in shackles doesn't make a difference even as we speak, let alone years passed when they were considered property, just like the cup and the kittle. I thought you were more enlightened than that. A slave (no matter where) can never initiate his imancipation unless his struggle is espoused with outside influence that wields enough weight to deter the course.

[intellex]

that is good without their struggle we would have lived like europe , hated , openly discriminated and rejected for job

thanks my african americans to all tyrones and shuannas

[AbdiWahab252]

Sir Luugoyo:

What provokes that outside influence ? A struggle by the affected group that shames the conscious of some of the oppressors. If there is no struggle by the oppressed, no one will highlight the shame.

Lincoln did not go to war with the South to free the slaves. He went to war with the South because they broke away from the Union. The slaves were free not out of the generosity of his heart but he wanted to create a group of loyal Union supporters in the South and to humiliate the White Confederates.

Without the African American's rising up against Slavery, be it Frederick Douglass, or Nat Turner, no white would have been drawn to the cause.

Intellex,

You are right bro. For all its faults, we have a better deal in America than in Europe.

[Duh]

'Without the African American's rising up against Slavery, be it Frederick Douglass, or Nat Turner, no white would have been drawn to the cause.'


Look at him! he even knows their names. Akhaas! loool

[FAH1223]

[quote="intellex"]that is good without their struggle we would have lived like europe , hated , openly discriminated and rejected for job

thanks my african americans to all tyrones and shuannas[/quote]

TRUE

Abdi, good thread, its 100% true, AAs have suffered and prevailed in their struggle for equality in this country

what pisses me off are the house negros!

[AbdiWahab252]

FAH1223,

Do they piss you more than the Somali House Negroes ?

Its not time to finger point but to appreciate the contributions of our African American brothers and sisters.

[Grant]

I lived the 50s and the 60s.

The marches and the demonstrations in the South were mostly Black, but there were some Whites there and I know at least one white activist in the voter registration drive in Mississippi was killed.
The Civil Rights Movement in the North was distinctly multi-racial. By the time Robert Kennedy was assassinated I think most of the people in the country under 30 were at least partially on board.

Those who thank only Blacks themselves for a bootstrap operation should look at the racial makeup of the Peace Corps and Vista programs. They should also consider that John and Robert Kennedy and Lyndon Johnson were right in there with them fighting the good fight and making the advances in policy into Law.

AW,

The South broke away over the issue of "State's Rights", which amounted to the issue of slavery. The northern Abolitionists considered slavery an ethical and moral issue, despite what some Evangelicals found in their Bibles. I think you are wrong about Lincolns motives. Do you recall his quote about the impossibility of the Union continuing "half slave and half free"?

[FAH1223]

[quote="AbdiWahab252"]FAH1223,

Do they piss you more than the Somali House Negroes ?

Its not time to finger point but to appreciate the contributions of our African American brothers and sisters.[/quote]

EQUALLY!

hey Grant, I remember learning in my AA History class that Lincoln really could have cared less if there was slavery or not, if slavery could have prevented the breakup of the union, he would have still allowed it!

[SahanGalbeed]

Well if we get to the "Somali house negroes " that's a whole different discussion . Let's stick to the topic here ! lol

[AbdiWahab252]

Grant,

Thank you for your post.

What did it take to get Lincoln, Lyndon Johnson, RFK and other prominent whites to abhor slavery ? It took the struggle of African American's to highlight the evils of slavery and segregation. If the African American's had not stood up against overwhelming odds, there would have not been as many white allies.

About the war against the South, slavery was not the key reason nor was it sellable to good white folks to destroy their nation for the rights of the black folk. The underlying issue was separatism. Lincoln as with all politicians tried to frame war as being a moral one. I don't deny that Lincoln was disgusted at slavery but he could not sell a war with the Confederacy as "To End Slavery" to the Union. He could sell such a war if it were one to protect the Union and add some political/moral spin of ending slavery.

[Grant]

Fah,

Lincoln was one thing. He probably was concerned about property rights, but he was NOT pro-slavery. The issue had raged in the North for a long time and sentiments had solidified. Are you familiar with the words to the Battle Hymn of the Republic? This is what the folks actually fighting the war were fighting for:

"In the beauty of the lilies Christ was born across the sea,
With a glory in His bosom that transfigures you and me:
As He died to make men holy, let us die to make men free,
While God is marching on.
Chorus
While God is marching on.

He is coming like the glory of the morning on the wave,
He is Wisdom to the mighty, He is Succour to the brave,
So the world shall be His footstool, and the soul of Time His slave,
Our God is marching on.
Chorus
Our God is marching on.


[edit] Notes
In later years, when this song was sung in a non-military environment, the clause "let us die to make men free" was sometimes changed to "let us live to make men free"."

[AbdiWahab252]

Grant,

So do you concede that Lincoln would have not gone to war solely to free the slaves ?

[Grant]

AW,

It's fairly clear the Abolitionists were not going to let the issue die. Remember John Brown's attack on Harper's Ferry and the Federal Armory there? His execution raised a veritable firestorm.

The country split over the issue. I'm not sure Lincoln had all that much control over it once things got going. I do admit his issue was more to preserve the Union than to end slavery, but slavery was the dividing issue.

It is true that the Emancipation Proclamation didn't free a single slave when it was proclaimed, but it did eventually free all slaves as Northern victory reached all parts of the country. Lincoln never rescinded it, and it and he did free the slaves.

I don't know that Lincoln considered it a victory, but I know the Abolitionists did.

[intellex]

very interesting topic, keep the discussion alive guys

[Duh]

Intellex oh shut up! Go die! looooool