Damn This forum is becoming Wahabia hang-out!

[Biif Baaf]

Alluring: you support A. Yusuf eventhough he murdered countless people, what does that make you? Sweety, its Ramadan, don't incur the wrath of your creator. I support no warlord, Aweys was never a warlord, I am not a fan of many things he's done in the past, but compared to A. Yusuf he looks like a saint. I am neither Hawiye nor Daarood, I am Degodiye, we don't even live in any city in Somalia, we live in Ethiopia & Kenya. My views are not biased nor do I considerate myself to be a qabiilist.

[SomeGuy]

Fah1223

You are just another Somali moron!. Aren't you?. When and where did I say there is contradiction in the Qoran?. Maxaad meesha u keeneysaa waxaan loo joogin?. Are you trying to escape and change the subject because you can't re-battle?.

I am talking about ayahs whic are null and void because of Islamic was progressive.
And that is exactly what you agreed on what you wrote down "the gradual prohibition of Alcohol'. But then you are accusing me missing some point that never was!.

Look kid, I am scholar of his own. I studied Islamic Theology and read the translation of Qoran from cover to cover. And I know what I am talking about. You have every reason to disagree with me and as long as you have daliil and reason to do so. However, I am not saying 100% correct and have all answers.

I am looking for answers. And I know one thing Whahabism is not the answer.


Alluring,

That is all good sister. Don't you worry as long as you are not whahabi we can get long well. By the way did you give up hating Ethiopian borthers coming over to punland and Somalia,anyway?.

Someguy

[SomeGuy]

[quote="SomeGuy"]Alluring,
6) as female you have wear vield purdah tip to toe
-Lies.
7) you can't wear deodrant
-More lies.
10) as female you have stay home.
-Lie, any Muslim woman can work outside the home, as long she is doing acceptable work.


Biif Baaf,

I wrote down 10 points, you justified 7 of them in your Whahabia brand of Islam and I will re-battle each and every one. However, let's talk about the above 3 you said I am lying about first.

Now are you saying
6)Whahabia don't believe muslim women should wear viel from top to toe?.
Please clarify. will you?.

7) are you saying according to Whahabia, it is allowed muslim women wear perfume when she is outside of her home? in public?, please clarify.
10) What is acceptable work you are talking about that muslim women can do outside of her home?. Please clarify. will you?.

Someguy

[FAH1223]

[quote="SomeGuy"]Fah1223

You are just another Somali moron!. Aren't you?. When and where did I say there is contradiction in the Qoran?. Maxaad meesha u keeneysaa waxaan loo joogin?. Are you trying to escape and change the subject because you can't re-battle?.

I am talking about ayahs whic are null and void because of Islamic was progressive.
And that is exactly what you agreed on what you wrote down "the gradual prohibition of Alcohol'. But then you are accusing me missing some point that never was!.

Look kid, I am scholar of his own. I studied Islamic Theology and read the translation of Qoran from cover to cover. And I know what I am talking about. You have every reason to disagree with me and as long as you have daliil and reason to do so. However, I am not saying 100% correct and have all answers.

I am looking for answers. And I know one thing Whahabism is not the answer.

[/quote]

That verse could be talking about a messed up state of mind. Implying people need to come to prayers in a good state of mind. Without the drowsiness of some other type of drug (medicine, obviously alcohol, ect, ect). I hope you are trying to see where I'm coming from.

I'm not a Wahabbi either

[FAH1223]

Other translations of the WHOLE ayah....I only put a snipper...I don't see why the other parts are null and void when we practice them before salat

YUSUFALI: O ye who believe! Approach not prayers with a mind befogged, until ye can understand all that ye say,- nor in a state of ceremonial impurity (Except when travelling on the road), until after washing your whole body. If ye are ill, or on a journey, or one of you cometh from offices of nature, or ye have been in contact with women, and ye find no water, then take for yourselves clean sand or earth, and rub therewith your faces and hands. For Allah doth blot out sins and forgive again and again.

PICKTHAL: O ye who believe! Draw not near unto prayer when ye are drunken, till ye know that which ye utter, nor when ye are polluted, save when journeying upon the road, till ye have bathed. And if ye be ill, or on a journey, or one of you cometh from the closet, or ye have touched women, and ye find not water, then go to high clean soil and rub your faces and your hands (therewith). Lo! Allah is Benign, Forgiving.

SHAKIR: O you who believe! do not go near prayer when you are Intoxicated until you know (well) what you say, nor when you are under an obligation to perform a bath-- unless (you are) travelling on the road-- until you have washed yourselves; and if you are sick, or on a journey, or one of you come from the privy or you have touched the women, and you cannot find water, betake yourselves to pure earth, then wipe your faces and your hands; surely Allah is Pardoning, Forgiving.

the whole of the ayahs is also talking about wudu too

[SomeGuy]

fah1223

it doesn't matter what translation you come up with , this ayah and many others in the qoran are nullied and voided while the prophet was alive, of course. There are two kinds of "Mansuukha":

1) one that is the one that is completely deleted from Qoran.
2) One that is still in the Qoran but nullied and vioded--overrided when it comes to Islamic law--Sharia and is no longer valid.

That ayah is belong to the 2nd category. There are many Ayah that is completely deleted from Qoran. For instance if you read Ibnu Katheer translation in the begining of Sura al ah-zab, Ibnu khateer mentions that is narrated that Sura Al Ahzab was as long as Sura Al Baqra, but later many of its Ayah have been deleted--became Mansuusha-- from Qoran. I don't know authentic is that. But that is what Ibnu Khatheer wrote down.

And if you are not Whahabia then what the hell you argueing me for?. I have beef on Whahabia cults who are brain washing our community.

Have you seen how Biif Baaf tried to justify my arguments of how Whahabia don't allow us to vote, to take student loans, buy houses on mortages, invest in stocks, can't phisically great the opposite gender when you are even looking for job, how our women would wear that ugly attire from tip to toe?. Have you?. Why only us Somalis? why not Arabs?, Pakis? why Somali women should wear only when their peer muslim women of other nationalities don't ?.

We live in government housing gettos because we can't buy houses when even we can afford, Whahabia told us so. And that is why our kids are drop outs and are in jail because government housing is for losers, prostituitions, drugs dealer and all people Ilaahey nacay.

Our bright young students can't afford to pay college because their parents are qaxooti with no penny and Whahabia shiekhs who don't like western education are telling us we can't apply student loans? are you following me here?.

They even said students can't be lawyers because it is Haram. Can you believe that?. I even see one said we can't work for the financial instituitions like banks because your money is not Halaal.

We can't work any where is sold liquors and sigarettes?. But then it is ok to beg the system--on a welfare?.

We need change here. this is nutts!!

someguy

[jamalllll]

someguy

After you and the government have killed every opposition ,who is going to protect you from yourself

Are you proposing a system or is it going to be the same thing again ......rule by force.

[SomeGuy]

Jamalll,

We haven't reach that point yet, bother. We are still struggling to restore law and order in Mogadishu forget the rest of country. We need help from anyone that will help us to be nation again even dictator one. We need even opinion of any sane Somali to join us to reach there.

Many other Somalis and I all we want is something--not even close to perfect. Corrupted dictator and cash-starved Ghedi deserve our support as long as they are trying to establish even bad government. Rome is not built one day.

I personally don't support individual leaders but a system instead. System and individuals are way different. Here is US the Bush regime is corrupted and are run by misguided individuals. Not to mention Bush robbed Al Gore in 2000 election. He even didn't win the election and everybody knows that. Why US people won't run down their country, run around streets and chant death Bush and his neocon religious fanatics?. It is because they believe the system. If they run down the system, the country is lost. and everybody loses. they mature society while on the other hand we are immature society who most of them act like two year old kid who couldn't get his way--might mom is not giving him candy!

Next day when Bush robbed Al Gore, it was business as usual. We need society that understand that system is above some mortal individuals. A/Y is an old man. And I don't think he even can run government after this term. It is possible he won't run second time as president. can we wait less than 2 years and in the meantime build our opposition parties who are led by good and educated individuals who will take over near future?.

That is my two cents.

Someguy

[jamalllll]

someguy

I happen to agree with you on the need to establish the system and only accepting defeat when it comes is the only way forward.

I hope though that you are not still bent on selling our soul to the strongest.

That will build no system freind ,its principals and consistency that can do that. Dont you agree ?

[SomeGuy]

Jamalll,

While i do agree with you in theory that sounds good--having principles and some kind of pride, practically where have no many choices. We are running options here, man. Anything is better than this way!. I have seen people supporting UIC last year. And i questioned why, they told me "Hey, at least these fanatics have power to capture the whole country and we just want someone to capture that motherfocking country from Ras-asyar to Ras Kaamboni". And guess, what as much as I hate Whahabia, I had to agree them. Then it occured to me why support system that west will destroyed tomorrow because west won't agree anyone else when they can get their way.

And that is why never support UIC because I knew Taliban style government won't work anywhere in today's world.

So we need to swallow our pride and principles since they won't get us far. No one is happy how Uncle Sam is bossing around and pretend the only policeman, not even fellow Europeans. However, everybody and government safeguards is after its interest.

There are some folk tales that poor people use as an excuses in order to cover their failures. For instance, you will hear some loser who will tell you money is not important to him/her. Love is what matters to his/her life!.Please mothafocker!!!. The fact of matter is this loser can't make money. And all he/she is doing is use love as defence machinism. Another classic excuse is when poor people tell you they can't do that because they have some dignity and principles--principle my azz, man--when i got nothing to eat and shelter!

Somali can't be nation because the west can't blackmail somali leaders. Somali leaders have nothing to lose because they are from nation of loser who has nothing to lose!. And that is why west don't like nomadic somalis who can't be tamed, ruled, governed. That is our problem we are nation of losers who has nothing to lose!.

Someguy

[jamalllll]

someguy

Interesting view. But since a proposed system must stand firmly under many adverse circumstances and for a very long time as well as being just in its operation ,how do you account for the fact that FORCE IS NOT THE ANSWER ,it has been proven by the failure of communism and dictatorships of which somalia is a good example .

Are we then not all fools who will never learn from history's mistakes.

[King-of-Awdal]

[quote="SomeGuy"]Fah1223

You are just another Somali moron!. Aren't you?. When and where did I say there is contradiction in the Qoran?. Maxaad meesha u keeneysaa waxaan loo joogin?. Are you trying to escape and change the subject because you can't re-battle?.

I am talking about ayahs whic are null and void because of Islamic was progressive.
And that is exactly what you agreed on what you wrote down "the gradual prohibition of Alcohol'. But then you are accusing me missing some point that never was!.

Look kid, I am scholar of his own. I studied Islamic Theology and read the translation of Qoran from cover to cover. And I know what I am talking about. You have every reason to disagree with me and as long as you have daliil and reason to do so. However, I am not saying 100% correct and have all answers.

I am looking for answers. And I know one thing Whahabism is not the answer.


Alluring,

That is all good sister. Don't you worry as long as you are not whahabi we can get long well. By the way did you give up hating Ethiopian borthers coming over to punland and Somalia,anyway?.

Someguy[/quote]



Now why would u call a non-Believer ur brother.

[SomeGuy]

Jamalllll,


No mistake can make our condition worse than we are. We are at lowest ebb of our luck. I don't think we can sink down more than we already sunk. We are at the bottom of abyss. Swallow your bride and support your warlords who are trying to establish corrupted government. It is because govenment led by warlords is better than we are now.

By the way what your other username?.


King_of_Awdal,

You bet!--nonbelievers are my brothers and better than many so-called muslims who will kill you becase you don't believe their version of Islam!. Are you kidding to me?. And by the way, Ethiopians are closer than Somalilanders to us. It is because Somalilanders want Somalia to divide and Ethiopians want Somalia to unite!. And that is why Ethiopian government is keeping eye on Somaliland milatia who want to attack Puntland. Last time your uncle, Riyaale, was told to watch out if he ever try to attack puntland. And Puntland troops in Aricadeeye were shipped to Mogadishu. Another time your old-spy uncle, riyaale, was told to accept new Somali passport if his regime resisted it first. Well, there you have it, man.

And one last thing, King_Of _Awdal(if there i any kingdom in that goddamned place). You uncle was complaning to Melez when Melez told him to negotiate with A/Y. In his complians he mentioned that he is from small clan and he dare not to tell Isaacs Somaliland will negotiate with Faqash. "This is committin political suicide", said he--your old NSS president. Meleze and understood that. And ok, next election you need to go and let one Isaacs opposition leaders to be president and then he and A/Y will strike a deal. And your uncle agreed on.

Someguy

[Password]

And I thought Someguy dude here was among the learned and the patriots. Interesting to see how out of twisted logic, little knowledge and ill-comprehension, emotional attachment to one's clan, makes one extremely prone to disbelief.

Just when you think there is one bright one among these men and minority women who support the occupation of thier country, you realize they have irrepairable defects in their thinking to begin with for them to support such blasphemy and the blasphemous men of the TFG.

[jamalllll]

Someguy

For your information ,i do support the TFG ,but not because of tribal loyalties....neither of them is my tribe.

I support them because i happen to think that it (TFG)had a good start which incorporated everyone according to their wishes. I dont agree with thier insistance on tribal representation .I would rather have representation of needs by the most able.

I see the need for government (the institution -as opposed to an administration)

I care not for A/Y OR GEDI OR ANY OTHER WARLOAD and would rather have them put through (the future ie to come INSHA ALLAH) justice system and convicted for their crimes.

I wish i could say the same for the ICU but ,in all honesty, you cant try someone for trying to establish order even though they failed miserably.

But your solution is not only not going to solve it ,it will make you a criminal as well as disable everyone else rather than enable them.

I know that you wont do this intentionaly ..oh no..but unless all is calibrated to the highest possible efficiency wont come about.

A good example of this is the Iraq war . I we can go past the initial violation of soverignty , you would then think that the whole affair should have been planned so precisely as to have been both quick and highly effective ,istead of this bloody war. The inability to be very precise and highly effective is then the line ,where crossing is a sourse of great evil. THUS EXTREME CAUTION MUST BE PRACTICED.

I 'll let you quess my former--not other username ....you must already know to have asked it. hehehe

I hope you do understand my point sxb.