So for the first time in my life I have met a real Christian

[Voltage]

Shirib I tend to believe there is a difference between people who have not really been exposed to the truth yet versus others that have and because of malice beeniyeen. In time I am confident this individual will see the light. My job is to provide the resources.

[Shirib]

Shirib I tend to believe there is a difference between people who have not really been exposed to the truth yet versus others that have and because of malice beeniyeen. In time I am confident this individual will see the light. My job is to provide the resources.

Dawah is good, Insha'Allah he will see the light and accept Islam

[Salahuddiin]

Voltage

Wallahi these are very dangerous thoughts, because what you are basically saying is that people don't need Qur'aan nor Islaam nor Prophet Muhammad SCWS to be on the right way and go to Paradise while all Qur'aan from the beginning to the end is commanding us clearly to be Muslims and follow the Qur'aan and take our religion and methdos of worship from Prophet Muhammad SCWS. And it also very clearly states that those who don't do this will be forever in Hell. Aayaat of this kind are too numerous to put here, just open any page of Qur'aan.

It's the most basic part of caqiida that is supposed to be one of the first things that children learn from Islaam, that Islaam is the right religion and only way to be saved and every other ways are false and lead to destruction. Another very basic part of caqiida that every Muslim must know is that there's no iman if doesn't include belief to all the Prophet's and Books sent by Allah.

Allah says:

“O you who believe! Believe in Allaah, and His Messenger (Muhammad SCWS), and the Book (the Qur’aan) which He has sent down to His Messenger, and the Scripture which He sent down to those before (him); and whosoever disbelieves in Allaah, His Angels, His Books, His Messengers, and the Last Day, then indeed he has strayed far away” (4:136)

“This day, I have perfected your religion for you, completed My Favour upon you, and have chosen for you Islâm as your religion” (5:3)

“And whoever seeks a religion other than Islâm, it will never be accepted of him, and in the Hereafter he will be one of the losers” (3:85)

Suuratul Bayyina (98) is talking about ahlul kitaab and Prophet Muhammad SCWS:

"Those who disbelieved among the People of the Scripture and the polytheists were not to be parted [from disbelief] until there came to them clear evidence - A Messenger from Allah (Muhammad SCWS), reciting purified scriptures within which are correct writings........Indeed, they who disbelieved among the People of the Scripture and the polytheists will be in the fire of Hell, abiding eternally therein. Those are the worst of creatures."

Person who rejects Muhammad SCWS and Qur'aan doesn't have any excuse before Allah except only if he lives in a place far away from Muslims and never hears about Islaam. This guy you are talking about lives among the Muslims and without any shadow of doubt heard about Islaam so evidence is already established against him if he rejects it.

In a sahiih hadiith Prophet Muhammad SCWS said:

"By Him in Whose Hand Muhammad's soul is, there is none from amongst the Jews and the Christians (of these present nations) who hears about me and then dies without believing in the Message with which I have been sent, but he will be from the dwellers of the Fire." (Muslim)

Shirib I tend to believe there is a difference between people who have not really been exposed to the truth yet versus others that have and because of malice beeniyeen. In time I am confident this individual will see the light. My job is to provide the resources.

This is very good, give him material to read and may Allah guide him to see the light.

Brother people who have not been exposed to the truth are very few in this world now in year 2010. Basically everybody know about Islaam and Prophet SCWS and if they want there is Qur'aan and a ton of material easily available for them to learn more. It is not shart for someone to be a kaafir that he knows the truth and because of maliciousness rejects it. Someone can sincerely believe that he is following the truth and this doesn't help him at all. Allah says that they yaxsabuuna annahum muhtaduun:

"A group [of you] He guided, and a group deserved [to be in] error. Indeed, they had taken the devils as allies instead of Allah while they thought that they were guided." (7:30)

Even if someone seems like a good person and he stays away from shirk, still he doesn't do what Allah commanded him because Allah commanded him to follow Qur'aan and Prophet Muhammad SCWS and believe and worship the exact way that he SCWS taught us.

[James Dahl]

It says in the Qu'ran that all Tawhiid go to heaven, whether they are Muslim or not.

[Jamac_Yare]

It says in the Qu'ran that all Tawhiid go to heaven, whether they are Muslim or not.

go make a somali map or something dont indulge in matters of the deen

[Tuba]

It says in the Qu'ran that all Tawhiid go to heaven, whether they are Muslim or not.

go make a somali map or something dont indulge in matters of the deen

^He is entitled to give his 2 cents, lakin kii Voltaga aha ba' ka si daray.

[Jamac_Yare]

It says in the Qu'ran that all Tawhiid go to heaven, whether they are Muslim or not.

go make a somali map or something dont indulge in matters of the deen

^He is entitled to give his 2 cents, lakin kii Voltaga aha ba' ka si daray.

ukhtii fii allah he trying to come across like some who knows better when doesnt

[Enlightened~Sista]

It says in the Qu'ran that all Tawhiid go to heaven, whether they are Muslim or not.

go make a somali map or something dont indulge in matters of the deen

Why can't he?

[James Dahl]

Well the argument is that many scholars believe that Judaism and Christianity have either become idolatrous or have taken on pagan elements. This is undoubtedly true in the case of Christianity, especially Catholicism, but the question is, where is the line between the pre-Islamic Haniif and Tawhiid and idolatry within Christianity? Is it the belief in divinity for Isa? The Trinity idea?

The Qu'ran essentially says that the Christian churches that accepted the doctrine of Trinitarianism have defied God, while Unitarian churches have remained Tawhiid.

People of the Book, do not go to excess in your religion, and do not say anything about God except the truth: the Messiah, Jesus, son of Mary, was nothing more than a messenger of God, His word, directed to Mary, a spirit from Him. So believe in God and His messengers and do not speak of a 'Trinity'—stop, that is better for you—God is only one God, He is far above having a son, everything in the heavens and earth belongs to Him and He is the best one to trust.

Those who say, 'God is the Messiah, son of Mary,' have defied God. The Messiah himself said, 'Children of Israel, worship God, my Lord and your Lord.' If anyone associates others with God, God will forbid him from the Garden, and Hell will be his home. No one will help such evildoers.

Those people who say that God is the third of three are defying [the truth]: there is only One God. If they persist in what they are saying, a painful punishment will afflict those of them who persist. Why do they not turn to God and ask his forgiveness, when God is most forgiving, most merciful? The Messiah, son of Mary, was only a messenger; other messengers had come and gone before him; his mother was a virtuous woman; both ate food. See how clear We make these signs for them; see how deluded they are.

Basically, the Trinitarian churches are the Catholic and Orthodox churches, including most Protestants, so the Qu'ran is saying the vast majority of Christians are not believers in Tawhiid and are therefore "partial pagans".

Unitarian churches for instance do not use the symbol of the cross, because they do not believe Isa was a demigod.

Ebionites, Jews and Samaritans all believe in Tawhiid.

In the 16th century a few Protestant churches revived unitarian beliefs, such as the Polish Brethren and the Christadelphians, and the Unitarian Church.

The Christadelphians in particular have the most "Islamic" view of Isa.

[grandpakhalif]

James,

What's preventing you from reverting to Islam?

[James Dahl]

Essentially the Qu'ran does not state anywhere that Islam is the sole path towards salvation, and indeed states quite specifically that Islam is not a new religion, thus the term "revert" rather than "convert", and that indeed, the original forms of Christianity and Judaism WERE Islam, but had become corrupted over time.

James,

What's preventing you from reverting to Islam?

The ignorance of the human race as to the nature of the universe presents the possibility of the existence of God, but also present me with the possibility that God does not exist, the classic Agnostic paradox.

On the other hand, the old Jewish Kabbalah mysticism discusses the nature of the universe and of God and essentially states that the two are synonymous, that all that is is all part of God. In this sense, then God obviously exists as no sensible person can deny that the universe exists. This is a rather unorthodox view of God however, and I'm sure that would label me a Kafir in many parts of the Muslim world.

[ToughGong]

the Qu'ran does not state anywhere that Islam is the sole path towards salvation,

"If anyone desires a religion other than Islam (submission to God), never will it be accepted of him." (Qur'an 3:85)

[SultanOrder]

On the other hand, the old Jewish Kabbalah mysticism discusses the nature of the universe and of God and essentially states that the two are synonymous, that all that is is all part of God. In this sense, then God obviously exists as no sensible person can deny that the universe exists. This is a rather unorthodox view of God however, and I'm sure that would label me a Kafir in many parts of the Muslim world.

Indeed the whole world is Imagination. Only He [Allah] is the real in reality. Whoever understands this knows the secret to the spiritual path. James Dahl Wallah there is a whole ocean of knowledge that most muslims are oblivious to. You will hardly find this info on the internet go to the righteous ulema see what the deep Islamic believes are and you will hardly recognize what you have known. It's like going from the base matter into a realm where subxannallah you will just be amazed and you will hardly recognize this world.

[grandpakhalif]

James,

Allah SWT's knowledge is universal, we don't believe Allah SWT physically is everywhere, except some extreme Suufi sects.

[James Dahl]

James,

Allah SWT's knowledge is universal, we don't believe Allah SWT physically is everywhere, except some extreme Suufi sects.

Well I guess chalk me up as an extreme Sufi who doesn't believe in Hadith
That's probably worse than being an Atheist as far as many people would be concerned.