The real story of Christmas

[James Dahl]

People will tell you that Christmas is a Christian holiday celebrating the birth of Jesus, but this is not, nor has ever been, true. The actual birthday of Jesus was never recorded and remains unknown.

Christmas dates back to Emperor Lucius Domitius Aurelianus Augustus, known to history as "Aurelian". Aurelian came to the throne in a time of great division known as the Crisis of the Third Century, when the empire had been torn into 3 pieces. Aurelian was determined to reunite the Empire and had decided that a lack of religious unity was one of the problems the Empire faced. In 271, he established a new state religion (the Roman Empire had never had a state religion prior to this) worshipping "Sol Invictus" or "the unconquerable Sun", as the state religion of the Roman Empire. He established a new temple of Sol Invictus in Rome, and established a feast day for the "Natalis Invicti" or birth of the Sun on the Roman calendar's Winter Solstice on 25 December. The pagan Germanic people, prior to their acceptance of Christianity, also celebrated their winter solstice festival starting on 25 December called Yule or Yuletide. Both the Germanic and Roman winter solstice celebrations involved great feasts, and the "12 days of Christmas" comes from the pagan Yule celebration, which went on for 12 days. Both festivals included gift giving.

Christmas has been considered a pagan relic by a number of Christian fanatics, such as the Puritans who banned Christmas while they were in power during the Commonwealth of England period. It has absolutely nothing to do with Jesus, and actual Christians consider Easter/Good Friday and the Epiphany their most important holidays. Many Christian churches don't even celebrate Christmas, especially ones with little to no Roman or Germanic influence such as the Armenian or Coptic churches.

[eyes-only]

Is it wrong to like the christmas lights and cards....to have seen Christmas movies countless times and to sing along to the carols?

[James Dahl]

Is it wrong to like the christmas lights and cards....to have seen Christmas movies countless times and to sing along to the carols?

I don't see why not
Sending people nice cards and decorating your house with lights is always fun, people should do that more times a year.

[Grant]

It's really about the Solstice, recognition of which goes back much further than Aurelian. The Satunalia, celebrated at the same time, predates the founding of Rome.

http://natasha-sheldon.suite101.com/saturnalia-a35729

There is good evidence the Solstice was celebrated at least by Neolithic times:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winter_solstice

Xmas-New Years are "The Holidays", a celebration of the return of sunlight and the hope of a new year. They are days off, to be spent with the family. You don't go to church.

[arabmtu]

Muslims should stop celebrating this pagan event.

[Grant]

The Solstice is a natural event. How can it be Pagan? Just don't call it Christmas or Saturnalia and you will be fine.

[ToughGong]

Muslims should stop celebrating this pagan event.

[Somaliman50]

interesting james. do you know what oliver cromwell thought of christmas? the irish are strong adherents of the christmas practise so was protestant england different to them at the time?

also, do you yourself celebrate christmas with your family?

[Basra-]

eyes only
Why does it matter? U are an atheist any way.



Christmas is a symbolic birth celebration of the savior. Dahl, i dont know what is your issue? By the way, aint u a Jew?

[James Dahl]

interesting james. do you know what oliver cromwell thought of christmas? the irish are strong adherents of the christmas practise so was protestant england different to them at the time?

also, do you yourself celebrate christmas with your family?

The Puritans wanted to eliminate any practices that had no Biblical basis, which was quite a few things including Christmas.
My family does celebrate it sort of, more as an excuse to get the whole family together for a dinner.

[Somaliman50]

interesting james. do you know what oliver cromwell thought of christmas? the irish are strong adherents of the christmas practise so was protestant england different to them at the time?

also, do you yourself celebrate christmas with your family?

The Puritans wanted to eliminate any practices that had no Biblical basis, which was quite a few things including Christmas.
My family does celebrate it sort of, more as an excuse to get the whole family together for a dinner.

what was the view of the quakers and the ranters? were they on the extreme side of the spectrum or did they share the same views with the puritans? i always heard they were heretics but did they also reject christmas?

and how would you say the people began to accept christmas? even with the return of monarchical rule the dominant group were the protestants, so did they somehow dilute their beliefs and accept Unitarian ideas and christmas etc?

[Basra-]

oliver cromwell ???? Abakar why would u care about him? The barbaric man who bloodied England one upon a time? Who killed King Charles the first? U must be insane.

The irish are catholics---Oliver was obviously an evil protestant. Any christian denominon that is NOT Catholic is a reformed christianity. Meaning--Catholics are less likely to celebrate christmas as a valid christian holiday. Like Dahl said-- Easter friday is more preferable to Christianss. Catholics are more proned to be puritan than Protestant or the other ones. Catholics have this sense that they hold the pure teaching of Jesus more than the other interpretted sections of christianity. King Henry demolished the power and influence of Catholic further by destroying the churches and divorcing from the Roman apostles.--and making the world adhere to a more or less a mild dose of the real Christianity!

[Somaliman50]

oliver cromwell ???? Abakar why would u care about him? The barbaric man who bloodied England one upon a time? Who killed King Charles the first? U must be insane.

The irish are catholics---Oliver was obviously an evil protestant. Any christian denominon that is NOT Catholic is a reformed christianity. Meaning--Catholics are less likely to celebrate christmas as a valid christian holiday. Like Dahl said-- Easter friday is more preferable to Christianss. Catholics are more proned to be puritan than Protestant or the other ones. Catholics have this sense that they hold the pure teaching of Jesus more than the other interpretted sections of christianity. King Henry demolished the power and influence of Catholic further by destroying the churches and divorcing from the Roman apostles.--and making the world adhere to a more or less a mild dose of the real Christianity!

catholics were welcoming to all innovative measures that somehow made religion look more holy and beautifying the worship, it was the puritans who rejected the stone altar and the communion table. and king henry was just a moderate protestant, though his divorce from the roman church was more political based than anything.

[James Dahl]

interesting james. do you know what oliver cromwell thought of christmas? the irish are strong adherents of the christmas practise so was protestant england different to them at the time?

also, do you yourself celebrate christmas with your family?

The Puritans wanted to eliminate any practices that had no Biblical basis, which was quite a few things including Christmas.
My family does celebrate it sort of, more as an excuse to get the whole family together for a dinner.

what was the view of the quakers and the ranters? were they on the extreme side of the spectrum or did they share the same views with the puritans? i always heard they were heretics but did they also reject christmas?

and how would you say the people began to accept christmas? even with the return of monarchical rule the dominant group were the protestants, so did they somehow dilute their beliefs and accept Unitarian ideas and christmas etc?

The Puritans were always a fringe group, and it was the sorts of things they did, banning Christmas and other holidays and extreme religious intolerance of other Christians that turned the population against them. The Puritans were sort of the "al-Shabaab" of 17th century England. The Quakers for instance left England for America because the Puritans persecuted them in England badly enough that they left en-masse.

The Quakers don't believe in organized religion or imposing religion on people, and consider religion to be a personal decision. The memory of the religious persecution of the Puritans is why the American Constitution protects the right to practice religion freely without persecution or the establishment of a state religion. The modern Republican Party in America seems to want to be a neo-Puritan group, but the US Constitution is written to prevent such a group from rising again.

[Basra-]

"catholics were welcoming to all innovative measures that somehow made religion look more holy and beautifying the worship"


abakaar i beg to differ. Catholics are naturally ordained to be the real Christian religion. Because they truly followed the genesis of the bible and Jesus teaching. They are more fanatic and adhere strictly to their faith. Catholic and 'innovations' are very far from each other. They are more closed minded, more judgemental and more proned to puritanical outburst. If i were to be a christian, i will be a Catholic. The others are just reformed modern propaganda.