Is Somali Arab hatred justified or due to ignorance

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Talo alle udaa
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Is Somali Arab hatred justified or due to ignorance

Post by Talo alle udaa »

Sometimes ignorance is a disease. I was surprised, perplexed, and was amazed at the level of vitriol Somalis have developed towards the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia and Arabs in General. I posted this topic in here because this matter has become an epidemic (ie insulting of Arabs). To simplify matters, I will post what grievances Somalis have against Arabs and what grievances Arabs may have against Somalis.

1.Issue of mistreatment and abuse
2.Lack of justice and unfair treatment
3.Kicking out Somalis who are poor
4.Not doing what England or U.S. or doing with regards to taking refugees
5.Wahabism (ie Alshabaab syndrome).


The first issue is easy to deal with because the issue of mistreatment and abuse is wide spread between Arabs themselves. In order for a community to be just to outsiders, justice has to be readily practiced in that community. The Arab community is one of the most subjugated in the world. We just have to see what's happening in Syria to realize the level of brutality these people are under. Somalis are expecting justice from a system created to oppress Arabs let alone outsiders. This is from the government stand point.

With regards to the people themselves, the level of racism and injustice that permeates among'st Arabs is also wide spread among'st other backward communities like Somalia and Pakistan. It's an issue of tradition rather than ignorance because it's often the most educated that perpetuate this false sense of superiority to others (nasab vs. midgaan). This creates an environment were minorities are seen almost below the level of animals and are abused. However, Abuses of minority between Arabs and Somalis are not the same. The Arabs themselves are also far apart in this regard. It seems those who live in the Hejaaz (ie Saudia) are the most harshest because in terms of ignorance from tradition, they exceed far ahead of others. Look at the Arabs of Syria, Egypt, Yemen, Saudia, etc. You will come to see those that are most open to outsiders (ie Syrians, Egyptians), are the least tribalistic, and those most harshest to outsiders (Saudi, Yemen) are most tribalistic.

However, some forms of tradition are positive (ie guest honoring) and this trait is not shared amongst the Arabs. You will come to see the poor country of Yemen allowing Refugees in the thousands even though they are dirt poor compared to Saudi Arabia (filthy rich) because the people do not have the same view. Even though both are conservative, Yemenis are far more tolerant.

So we now that we have dealt with this point, we can make the following conclusions.
1a. Arab government practice injustice towards Somalis because they are not just to their own people
1b. Arab communities are racist towards Somalis due to the concept of ignorance from tradition, just like Somalis are racist towards others.
1c. Those Arab communities most harshest can be said to the most advent protectors of their tradition (most conservative), perpetuating the ignorance from tradition concept.




Let's focus on these point first I will deal with the other topics when time permits.

Professor Talo, simplifying complicated somali topics since 2013 8-)
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Re: Is Somali Arab hatred justified or due to ignorance

Post by Talo alle udaa »

Were's Yalaxoolow and the crew
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Re: Is Somali Arab hatred justified or due to ignorance

Post by hydrogen »

In mind the Somal are peculiar as in body. They are a people of most susceptible character, and withal uncommonly hard to please. They dislike the Arabs, fear and abhor the Turks, have a horror of Franks, and despise all other Asiatics who with them come under the general name of Hindi (Indians). The latter are abused on all occasions for cowardice, and a want of generosity, which has given rise to the following piquant epigram:
“Ask not from the Hindi thy want:
Impossible that the Hindi can be generous!
Had there been one liberal man in El Hind,
Allah had raised up a prophet in El Hind!”
http://ebooks.adelaide.edu.au/b/burton/richar...

First footsteps in East Africa, by Richard Burton

Chapter 4

The Somal, their Origin and Peculiarities.
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Re: Is Somali Arab hatred justified or due to ignorance

Post by Talo alle udaa »

hydrogen wrote:
In mind the Somal are peculiar as in body. They are a people of most susceptible character, and withal uncommonly hard to please. They dislike the Arabs, fear and abhor the Turks, have a horror of Franks, and despise all other Asiatics who with them come under the general name of Hindi (Indians). The latter are abused on all occasions for cowardice, and a want of generosity, which has given rise to the following piquant epigram:
“Ask not from the Hindi thy want:
Impossible that the Hindi can be generous!
Had there been one liberal man in El Hind,
Allah had raised up a prophet in El Hind!”
http://ebooks.adelaide.edu.au/b/burton/richar...

First footsteps in East Africa, by Richard Burton

Chapter 4

The Somal, their Origin and Peculiarities.
Proton, please read the topic and reply in context.

regards, Professor Talo 8-)
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Re: Is Somali Arab hatred justified or due to ignorance

Post by Cumar-Labasuul »

Why do Somalis hate Arabs?

simply because Somalis are a proud and arrogant people, they see themselves above all others and for them to be racially abused by a race they consider below themselves is a massive dent on their ego.

To answer your question (is it justified): hatred is never justified.
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Re: Is Somali Arab hatred justified or due to ignorance

Post by hydrogen »

Talo alle udaa wrote: Proton, please read the topic and reply in context.

regards, Professor Talo 8-)
Lol, sorry professor - I'll hand in the essay next week? :dead:

What that means, is the hatred is somewhat natural. The Somali peninsula is the wife of the Arabian peninsula and there is a love-hate relashionship. Somalia expects love and care from Arab League and as soon as she doesn't feel it, she will use the threat of divorce (leaving Arab League). That same affair doesn't exist with her next door neighbour (the African Union), she doesn't care if he listens to loud music all night (when the Somalis are killed in South Africa) she wouldn't threaten to move out or call the authorities (leave the AU).
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Re: Is Somali Arab hatred justified or due to ignorance

Post by Talo alle udaa »

Cumar-Labasuul wrote:Why do Somalis hate Arabs?

simply because Somalis are a proud and arrogant people, they see themselves above all others and for them to be racially abused by a race they consider below themselves is a massive dent on their ego.

To answer your question (is it justified): hatred is never justified.
The Somalis have justifiably arguably points why they feel Arabs are racist towards them. I do not believe the current generation of Somalis hate Arabs out of superiority but the percieved injustice their fellow countrymen are being put through by Arab government & communities a like. However, the juxt of the matter is not to argue whether their is injustice, that is a known fact, but the source of that injustice. In the above, I argue the source of this injustice by the Arabs is not due to hatred on their part ( will expand on this latter) but due to ignorance from tradition compounded by authoritarian regimes abusing the Arabs themselves.
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Re: Is Somali Arab hatred justified or due to ignorance

Post by Negritude »

Though I much prefer disliking individuals, I have come across a few racist Arabs. Then again, the same could be said for Somalis. Check out this website.
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Re: Is Somali Arab hatred justified or due to ignorance

Post by ModerateMuslim »

Cumar-Labasuul wrote:
To answer your question (is it justified): hatred is never justified.
such generic statement! i only hope it's just that - a generic and sheepish statement. in other words, a statement from the top of your lips that you unconsciously and sheepishly utter because it's what is expected of you and not some bs you've sheepishly swallowed and is now part of who you're in your innermost self.
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Re: Is Somali Arab hatred justified or due to ignorance

Post by ModerateMuslim »

Negritude wrote:Though I much prefer disliking individuals, I have come across a few racist Arabs.
i dont get the likes of you. you love homos to death but you hate arabs because of the actions of the rulers, their families and collaborators who most of them just happen to be homos themselves. how do you square that? seems like you hate arabs even more than you love homos. i'm really surprised that theres a limit to your love for homos.
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Re: Is Somali Arab hatred justified or due to ignorance

Post by Cumar-Labasuul »

Talo alle udaa wrote:
Cumar-Labasuul wrote:Why do Somalis hate Arabs?

simply because Somalis are a proud and arrogant people, they see themselves above all others and for them to be racially abused by a race they consider below themselves is a massive dent on their ego.

To answer your question (is it justified): hatred is never justified.
The Somalis have justifiably arguably points why they feel Arabs are racist towards them. I do not believe the current generation of Somalis hate Arabs out of superiority but the percieved injustice their fellow countrymen are being put through by Arab government & communities a like. However, the juxt of the matter is not to argue whether their is injustice, that is a known fact, but the source of that injustice. In the above, I argue the source of this injustice by the Arabs is not due to hatred on their part ( will expand on this latter) but due to ignorance from tradition compounded by authoritarian regimes abusing the Arabs themselves.
You may be right that the hatred from somalis is to do with how they were treated in the many arab countries, however from my knowledge this ill treatment of somalis in arab countries is fairly recent i.e. post civil war, at most the last 25 yrs.
The somalis living in the arab world in the 50s, 60s and 70s were treated much better (also note, this was before most of the arab countries started producing oil) e.g. in particular countries like kuwait, syria, egypt, iraq (yes I know :lol: , my dad even spent time there in baghdad and basra in the 80s) sudan, saudi and yemen (aden was like somalis 2nd home) somalis were well respected and lived nice lives there. With the civil war this brought many types of somalis who had no limits and brought their connery just like that which is witnessed today in the west.

Today the main mistreatment of somalis in arab countries are these groups:
1) somalis who are doing tahriib, they are mostly caught in libya and egypt where they are badly abused - but then those police there are also brutal to their own people
2) poor somalis who have fled war and are living illegally in places like saudi and yemen - they are also badly abused
3) average somalis who have witnessed racism (probably in the gulf countries and yemen) - this exists but I have never witnessed it
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Re: Is Somali Arab hatred justified or due to ignorance

Post by Cumar-Labasuul »

Somali-Star wrote:
Cumar-Labasuul wrote:
To answer your question (is it justified): hatred is never justified.
such generic statement! i only hope it's just that - a generic and sheepish statement. in other words, a statement from the top of your lips that you unconsciously and sheepishly utter because it's what is expected of you and not some bs you've sheepishly swallowed and is now part of who you're in your innermost self.
why exert energy hating on someone :Shrug:
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Re: Is Somali Arab hatred justified or due to ignorance

Post by DR-YALAXOOW »

Arabs are Good People :up: I like Arabs :up: Gods first language is Arabic : . in heaven all humanity will speak Arabic.. Arab are the masters of this planet .
Black people made of to be slaves of Arabs( according many scholars) . I like arabs :lol: :up:
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Re: Is Somali Arab hatred justified or due to ignorance

Post by Talo alle udaa »

hydrogen wrote:
Talo alle udaa wrote: Proton, please read the topic and reply in context.

regards, Professor Talo 8-)
Lol, sorry professor - I'll hand in the essay next week? :dead:

What that means, is the hatred is somewhat natural. The Somali peninsula is the wife of the Arabian peninsula and there is a love-hate relashionship. Somalia expects love and care from Arab League and as soon as she doesn't feel it, she will use the threat of divorce (leaving Arab League). That same affair doesn't exist with her next door neighbour (the African Union), she doesn't care if he listens to loud music all night (when the Somalis are killed in South Africa) she wouldn't threaten to move out or call the authorities (leave the AU).
You have a touched on a point i was planning to expand on.
The rest of the point are as follows. Since the attention span of the typical user on this board is limited to comprehending a paragraph, i will limit my responses.


3.Kicking out Somalis who are poor
4.Not doing what England or U.S. or doing with regards to taking refugees
5.Wahabism (ie Alshabaab syndrome)

3,4-I feel these two points go together. The somalis judge, whether they know it or not- Arab governments in light of the situation of their people in Europe & U.S.
The problem is, the institutions present in Europe and the U.S. to deal with refugees and their problems simply do not exist in the ME.This issue ties back to the system of government in place. When the typical Arab citizen feels his or her government is not accountable, and nepotism is the norm, it's far fetched for Somalis to think such government has the capacity to deal with the issue of refugees and illegal immigrants to the same level as western countries.

From this we can conclude the following:
3/4-Arab countries do not have institutions to deal properly with Somali refugees because of the nature of the government and rule

5-The issue of Wahabism (Salafism) is a complex situation. During the Siyad Barre's experiment with Scientific Socialism, many Somali scholars fled the country. This exposed them to new waves of Religiosity that was a direct reaction to European colonialism. This form of awakening, spearheaded by the Muslim brotherhood, rejected apolitical ways of Sufism and separation of the mosque and state. It was the outcome of this awakening that many Somali culima went to Azhar and Medina, and came back with Salafism.

We can also say that Wahabism (Salafism) or the increase in Somali religiousness is a direct outcome of the civil war, when former generals of the Siyad Barre regime (who were mostly secular in outlook) used their tribes to destroy the fabric of the Somali nation. It was the void left by these men that lead to the increase of Somali religiosity as a whole.

Saudi charity organization Somalis talk about, were largely in action from 1995-2001, providing food and religious education to Somalis in Refugee camps in Kenya. I would say this played a rather minor role.

with that we can conclude by saying
5a-The increase of Salafism/Wahabism in Somalia is not unique and is widespread in the Muslim world.
5b This increase is due to the the secularism that was imposed on those communities by dictators.
5c-Wahabism represents one view among'st many by different Muslim movements that were born in 19th century.
Last edited by Talo alle udaa on Sat Mar 16, 2013 4:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Is Somali Arab hatred justified or due to ignorance

Post by Negritude »

Somali-Star wrote:
Negritude wrote:Though I much prefer disliking individuals, I have come across a few racist Arabs.
i dont get the likes of you. you love homos to death but you hate arabs because of the actions of the rulers, their families and collaborators who most of them just happen to be homos themselves. how do you square that? seems like you hate arabs even more than you love homos. i'm really surprised that theres a limit to your love for homos.
I never said I hated Arabs. Can you read? I was speaking of individuals who happened to be Arab. I thought that was spelled out but I guess I overestimated the likes of you.
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