Is it true that Somalis assume we are all Habesha?

[Itrah]

I had a Bilen Eritrean classmate in high school.

Weird thing is that his family only spoke Arabic at home, the Sudanese dialect. They didn't speak their own ethnic language. I never bothered to ask why.

[AwRastaale]

There are number of reasons why many Eritreans do not speak their native tongues in public.

First of all they wanted to re-inforce new identity and that meant distancing themselves from the Habesha so they had to abandon a lot of things that were deemed "Habesha" including local languages.

Also many abandoned because they simply grew up in Sudan and generation to generation only knew Arabic.

Finally Arabic became the common language for many diverse lowland groups. I assume there are over 20 languages in Eritrea so it's hard to keep up and communicate with everyone without the usage of Habesha Tigringya so the next best thing was Arabic.

The largest group of the lowland is the Tigre of Keren and many Tigres live inside Sudan especially Kassala region like many Issa from Djibouti live in Shinile.

When these bi-ethnic group (Tigrai and Beja) embraced Arabic, the rest of the lowlands followed suit with small exception of Saho and Afar, where Arabic has not penetrated as much as it did in Tigre, Hedareb (Nilotic-Beja), Bin Amer, Jeberti communities and the Rashaida in the north are already Arabs.

The Kunama and Nara who are Nilotic/Bantu groups also speak very little Arabic but they are a minority.

The Bilen live with the Beja-Habesha Tigres in and around Keren. They are great warriors despite their small population. Very fearsome fighters. Their language is Habesha. Culturally they mix aspects of Habesha, Sudanic and Cushitic especially from the Saho. They practice Islam and Christianity especially Catholic because of the Italian rule. They are fantastic people and will die for you as friends. They are feared by both lowlanders and the Highlander Habesha. The first player you want on your team is always the Bilen.

[Itrah]

I read that many Beja speak Sudanese Arabic only. Kinda sad that this language is taking off in this region in favor of native languages.

PS. The Kunama and Nara are Nilo-Saharan, they have no Bantu ties at all.

[AwRastaale]

Kunama is considered semi-Nilo-Bantu. They can fit into both groups. The Nara are pure Nilo-Saharans.

[Itrah]

Kunama is considered semi-Nilo-Bantu. They can fit into both groups. The Nara are pure Nilo-Saharans.

Trololol, just because they look dark and very ''Sub-Saharan'' does not mean they are Bantu. They are purely Nilo-Saharan.

The Hausa and Fulani on the other hand also found in that region are indeed from elsewhere in Africa, but definitely not the Kunama.

[AwRastaale]

Itrah,

Not really bro. Sometimes it's hard to separate some central Nilotics and some south-western Bantus as well as some Omotic groups for example the Kunama is a tricky group as are the Shinasha, who don't live far from the Kunama. This is a diverse region where many ethnic taboos were long broken and new roots formed.

Whatever the case maybe I know Eritrea is more complex than the eye meets and many of our friends want to run away from their past and have gone as far as abandoning their language in order to re-invent themselves but personally I admire the Eritreans. Somaliland should re-invent itself like Eritrea to better distinguish itself from failed Somalia.

Let's pay tribute to Hamid Idris Awate and the other pioneers who spearheaded the Eritrean identity.

[Hararboy]

Es Salam Alaykum.

Is it common for Somalis to portray Ethiopia and Eritrea as a Habesha nation? I have been lurking this forum for a while now, and it seems every time there is a thread about Ethiopia or Eritrea, Habesha is mentioned but outside, I never never experience hearing it.

I will make it clear for you. The term doesn't exist nor used anymore after Abyssinia died out. It is also a very offensive term where Eritreans will disrespect you if you mention it directly. For two reasons why calling Habesha is wrong:

1) Habesha only refer to the people of Amhara, Tigray and the Gurage. They're minority and only inhabit in the Northern Highland. However, they have more power - the government, economical and military sector is owned by them (mainly Tigray) for several decades which is why you often hear deceitful sources from them and common portrayal like Amharic, Tigrinya or Tigray etc and not the others who are not commonly known.

2) It is a term associate with Christianity so it is an insult for the Muslims. 85% of the Eritreans are Muslims and all tribes other than the Tigray are Muslim dominated but the country is ruled by the minority Tigrays. In Tigray led-Ethiopia, despite its portrayal of Christian nation, 65% of the people are Muslims, mostly Cushitic. They often hate being labelled as Habesha. About 20% of the so-called Habesha are Muslims as well.

So, please do not lump us as one people or link us with Habesha.

Hope that's clear!

Id say its going to be difficult to seperate yourself from thr Habesha identity if youre a Tigrinya which constitute the majority of Eritreas population as even tho you guys had your own region for a long time, youre still culturally connected to the Tigryans and Amharas of Ethiopia even if you believe they arent linked to the Axumite empire (which they are if you consider than most still have partial Yemeni ancestry altho Eritrean Tigrenyas are a bit more mixed). Habesha is essentially a overarching ethnicity which traces most Northrrn Highlander groups to the Dmt and Axum empire which precedes Abyssinia and Behr Negash. For much of your history, the Habeshas were one. Geez is the parent langauge of the habesha, not Tigrinya. Most of you practice a unique form of Christianity before you converted to Islam, you all use very similar script , and you all have similar cultural practices and clothings.

Politics is the reason why semitic Eritreans dont like to be associated with Habesha. And if you say your people have different identity, thats fine, but from what Ive observed, theres not much cultural difference between Tigrayans and Tigrinyas, only subtle regional differences. Ive seen Eritrean Tigrinhas And Ethiopian Tigrayans speak perfectly with one another, even Oromos from Borana and Jimma wouldnt be able to communicate with each other due to large differences in dialects and phrases and they both call themselves oromo.. Its the reason your people started claiming them as Agame or fakes. Northern Amharas are genetically similar to Tigrayans who are similar to Tigrinyas. And Id say Gondar or Gojjam is the homeland of the Amhara, Wollo is too far south for it to be Amharas homeland, even the Oromos claim Wollo as Oromo territory. Amharas or the protoAmharas migrated southward because the once fertile Tigray region started becoming drier and it couldnt support a larger population. Climate change was actually a major reason why Axum collapsed.


I support Eritrea, but I dont support widespreak Tigrinya cognitive dissonce caused by decades of anti habesha propaganda promoted by regimes backed by italians colonialists who were intent on maintaining a divide between Eritrean and Ethiopian highlanders.

[AwRastaale]

Harar,

Yeah their anti-Habesha status-quo is not healthy because in reality they were all Habesha yesterday one way or another and many still are. So Eritrea should not alienate them and re-brand itself as Arab Republic.

What happens in post Isaias? Will there be war between lowlands and the Kebessa?
Who wins in such case?

Eritrea always needs the Kebessa regardless because the Kebessa understand the Tigregus the most and their insight knowledge could make the difference as it did when EPLF was formed. I doubt ELF would have won the war at least not as quick as EPLF.

As for the Amhara you mix a lot of things.

The original homeland of the Amhara has always been Wollo and before it was re-named Wollo, it was known as Bete Amhara.

They moved to Begemder (Gonder) much later time because originally the Agews sat on its passage (Wag).

Oromo only arrived in Wollo in the late 15th century taking advantage of the Abyssinian-Adal Empire wars.

They followed the Othordox religion but Tewahedo was a 18th century name or reforms under Emperor Tewadoros II having banned the Walda-Qib/Qebat and Walda-Tsagga (sons of Grace) sects-----he re-named it Tewahedo meaning Unity.

I notice many Ethiopians who are called Tsegge (Grace) now days happen to follow Pente maybe they protesting Tewahedo's outlaw

[Hararboy]

Harar,

Yeah their anti-Habesha status-quo is not healthy because in reality they were all Habesha yesterday one way or another and many still are. So Eritrea should not alienate them and re-brand itself as Arab Republic.

What happens in post Isaias? Will there be war between lowlands and the Kebessa?
Who wins in such case?

Eritrea always needs the Kebessa regardless because the Kebessa understand the Tigregus the most and their insight knowledge could make the difference as it did when EPLF was formed. I doubt ELF would have won the war at least not as quick as EPLF.

As for the Amhara you mix a lot of things.

The original homeland of the Amhara has always been Wollo and before it was re-named Wollo, it was known as Bete Amhara.

They moved to Begemder (Gonder) much later time because originally the Agews sat on its passage (Wag).

Oromo only arrived in Wollo in the late 15th century taking advantage of the Abyssinian-Adal Empire wars.

They followed the Othordox religion but Tewahedo was a 18th century name or reforms under Emperor Tewadoros II having banned The Walda Qib and Tsagga sects-----he re-named it Tewahedo meaning Unity.

. Im not a christian, all I know is theyve been practicing the christian faith for more than a thousands years. Perhaps there are other sects but theyre still under the Ethio/Eri orthodox branch, kinda like how sufism and whabhism is still under islam.

[Hararboy]

Harar,

Yeah their anti-Habesha status-quo is not healthy because in reality they were all Habesha yesterday one way or another and many still are. So Eritrea should not alienate them and re-brand itself as Arab Republic.

What happens in post Isaias? Will there be war between lowlands and the Kebessa?
Who wins in such case?

Eritrea always needs the Kebessa regardless because the Kebessa understand the Tigregus the most and their insight knowledge could make the difference as it did when EPLF was formed. I doubt ELF would have won the war at least not as quick as EPLF.

As for the Amhara you mix a lot of things.

The original homeland of the Amhara has always been Wollo and before it was re-named Wollo, it was known as Bete Amhara.

They moved to Begemder (Gonder) much later time because originally the Agews sat on its passage (Wag).

Oromo only arrived in Wollo in the late 15th century taking advantage of the Abyssinian-Adal Empire wars.

They followed the Othordox religion but Tewahedo was a 18th century name or reforms under Emperor Tewadoros II having banned the Walda-Qib/Qebat and Walda-Tsagga (sons of Grace) sects-----he re-named it Tewahedo meaning Unity.

I notice many Ethiopians who are called Tsegge (Grace) now days happen to follow Pente maybe they protesting Tewahedo's outlaw

Im not very optimistic when it comes to Eritrea. Issias should have been assasinatwd by now and replaced by a unity government. And also im also very worried about this potential muslim lowlander vs predominatly christian highlander conflict once isias dies. As much as Eritreans in the diapsora want to paint a unified front, theres still a large cultural gap between lowlanders and highlanders and Eritrea has only been held together by a universal hatred of Ethiopia and Afewerkis i iron fist. Eritrea is too young for a national indentity to exist, not to mention most Eritrean ethnic groups besides Tigre/Tigrenya dont even interact with other ethnic groups. Its a bit like Ethiopia in that respects. Once Isias dies, Im expecting a civil war to ensue as The eritrean regime was always dependant on Afewerkis personality to maintain control and I dont think a puppet leader will ever replace Afewerki. I dont know how Ethiopia didnt go through a violent phase when meles died, he must of had some arrangements. Meles, as much as I hate him, is a very smart man in that respect

[AwRastaale]

Harar,

Yeah Tewahedo is Orthodox but the word Tewahedo means Union/Unity. Emperor Tewodros II popularised it in the 18th century because the religion was going under some reforms and new challenges from new school of thoughts. For example the Tigringya speakers including the Eritrean Habesha especially Hamasien were in favour of Qibat, which has its origins in Gojjam and Shoa was inline with the Sost Lidet (3 births) under Debre Libanos school.

The original school of Tewahedo was the two births or Hulat Lidet-----Shoa later accepted this teaching and Menelik II encouraged like the former Emperor Tewodros II.

Tewodros wanted to unify them.

Gojjam still has its Qibat while Hamasien (Eritrea) modified the Qibat. Gojjam always maintained its own rule and Church doctrines.

Of course I'm Muslim btw but its good to understand others.

Sirtoda inad fahantiid wa muhim.

[Hararboy]

Harar,

Yeah their anti-Habesha status-quo is not healthy because in reality they were all Habesha yesterday one way or another and many still are. So Eritrea should not alienate them and re-brand itself as Arab Republic.

What happens in post Isaias? Will there be war between lowlands and the Kebessa?
Who wins in such case?

Eritrea always needs the Kebessa regardless because the Kebessa understand the Tigregus the most and their insight knowledge could make the difference as it did when EPLF was formed. I doubt ELF would have won the war at least not as quick as EPLF.

As for the Amhara you mix a lot of things.

The original homeland of the Amhara has always been Wollo and before it was re-named Wollo, it was known as Bete Amhara.

They moved to Begemder (Gonder) much later time because originally the Agews sat on its passage (Wag).

Oromo only arrived in Wollo in the late 15th century taking advantage of the Abyssinian-Adal Empire wars.

They followed the Othordox religion but Tewahedo was a 18th century name or reforms under Emperor Tewadoros II having banned the Walda-Qib/Qebat and Walda-Tsagga (sons of Grace) sects-----he re-named it Tewahedo meaning Unity.

I notice many Ethiopians who are called Tsegge (Grace) now days happen to follow Pente maybe they protesting Tewahedo's outlaw

You seem very knowledgeable, what regions of Amhara do you think has the most legitimate claim to Aksumite ancestry? I mean we all know the Aksumites had alot of yemeni Ancestry, and ive seen alot light skin Amharas ut Ive also seen alotta amharas who could pass as pure oromos.

[AwRastaale]

Harar,

Amhara do not really claim Axumite though they were part of it, it was a multi-ethnic/tribal entity and its hard to single out any particular group. The Tigringya speakers lay more claim to Axumite and accuse the Amhara of stealing their throne. That's where the Amhara resentment emerged and the Tigringya speakers always wanted to reclaim the throne.

The Habesha tradition is that Axum was ruled by the Habesha who spoke Geez as their official language. King Ezana was the founding father of Christian Axumite but his rule short lived since the Agews unseated him and installed their own kingdom, the Zagwe dynasty (Ze Agew - meaning the Agew Dynasty in Ethiopic/Geez).

We have to remember the Agews were both Jews and Pagans. They openly challenged the Habesha theory and their claim to Solomon. The Agews insisted that they even went further and trace their ancestry to Moses and his "Ethiopian wife"

When that didn't work they claimed that they were the children of Sheba's servant whom herself was impregnanted by Solomon in the absence of Sheba

The Agews were clever people and always took extra notch to whatever Habesha claimed.

They introduced Judaism to Ethiopia, the star of David and many symbols from Jerusalem.

The Agews also moved their capital from Axum to Roha in Lasta (Wollo), which later was re-named Lalibela after Emperor Lalibela who built the stone churches following Agews embracing of Christianity. In these churches they tried to recreate Jerusalem and even introduced Solomonic symbols.

The Agews ruled for about 400 years of uninterrupted until in the mid-12th century where Amhara emerged from the south and removed the Zagwe dynasty. There they then announced they were reinstating Solomonic dynasty and Amharic was the new language to replace Geez and Agew in the courts while the Church still maintained Geez.

The Amhara had about 23 successive Emperors more or less but again they were unseated by the Agews who had the next 18 rulers. From there things were mishmashes, things went back and forth and there was no much distinctive between Agews and Amhara. The Tigrais long got sidelined and hardly had any rulers apart from Yohanes IV who was really throned by the British after he became stooge for them following the 1868 battle of Magdala between British forces and Tewodros II.

British left large arms in Yohannes' hands after he collaborated with them. Before he crowned himself Yohannes he was simply Dajazmach Kassa of Tigray. He was killed by the Beja Dervishes.

Menelik II told his illegitimate son to sit back because Tigray had no parental rights to the throne and that's where TPLF resentment came from as well. Amhara were more warm to Agews as people, culture and rulers than Tigrais or Tigringya speakers. The Agews neither resented Amhara or used the ethnic card. This made the two cohesive and today Agews are pretty much absorbed into Amhara.

Amhara do not really base their identity on specific looks but rather parental line. One can be as Bantu as he can but if he can prove his father was direct descendant of Menelik I through the various Amhara nobility then no issues. Menelik II himself did not posses the "Habesha" looks or features in the eyes of Tigringya speakers but that did not concern Amhara. In fact, it is said his mother was a slave girl of Gurage origin.

The three groups that played huge role in Ethiopia's history really are the Agews, Amhara and some northern Oromo (the Yejju).

I personally give most credit to Agews who had created the Judaism doctrine, most Tewahedo Saints are even Agews including Tekle Haymanot and most physical establishment in Ethiopia including Axum obelisk, Lalibela and Gondar. Tekle was a named used by Agew rulers and unbeknown to the Habesha. Even the last Agew ruler was Tekle Giyorgis, who was defeated by Kassa of Tigray with the British arms.

Amhara do not really tie themselves to Axumite though they use it to legitimise Solomonic establishment inline with religious teachings or Kebra Nagast since Axum was the first "Christian city". Their nobility starts with Yekuno Amlak, which is also the birth of their language as a royal court literature and Tigringya speakers despise Yekuno because he diminished any hope of Tigringya ever challenging Amharic---thus it is where it is today.

If both the Agews and northern Oromo did not embrace Amharic, it too, would probably be as small or perhaps little bit bigger than Tigringya.

These two Cushitics made all the difference.

[gegiroor]

I read that many Beja speak Sudanese Arabic only. Kinda sad that this language is taking off in this region in favor of native languages.

PS. The Kunama and Nara are Nilo-Saharan, they have no Bantu ties at all.

What is wrong with them learning Arabic? May be they are very religious and want to learn their deen and be closer to their Sudanese brethren. It is also possible that they are learning Sudanese Arabic because they want to maintain dual nationalities, and maintaining a Sudanese Arabic guarantees them obtaining Sudanese residency or citizenship.

[dvision01]