Hargeisa was almost Ethiopian?!

[Waachis]

''During the negotiations between Abyssinians and British officials for the cessation of the Ogaden and other Somali homelands, Ras Makonnen, Haile Selassie's father, even more strongly asked for more Somali territory up to Hargeisa, the Somaliland capial, to be included in that cession (Silberman 1961, 37-83).''

The Ogaden: Versus the Mythical Ethiopian Claim
By Jama Mohamed Ghalib-PAGE 47


btw-there are other sources that validate this.... in case you were in doubt

[Khalid Ali]

i am not sure we can use qaalib and his source as reference he was very biased and always usea Ethiopia as a boogeyman.

[Waachis]

i am not sure we can use qaalib and his source as reference he was very biased and always usea Ethiopia as a boogeyman.

''Ras Makonnen wanted to obtain Hargeisa, an important commercial and strategic town...''

[The Journal of Ethiopian Studies, Volumes 3-4, page 33]


“. . . in August of last year [1895] Ras Makonnen wrote to the Habr Awal tribes around Hargeisa claiming them as Abyssinian subjects and calling upon them to destroy small zareeba built there by Lord Delamere, which he
said was Abyssinian territory. . . .”

(Vol. 7, Letters from Aden, Political Agent and Consul of Somalia Coast to
Consul General, Cairo, no 746 of Sept. 21, 1896).

[Khalid Ali]

hargeisa was no comercial town back then nor was it the capital of british somaliland back then berbera was als it made no sense. and the habar awal knew about meneliks expansion hence why we made deals with the english and not the shewans

[Waachis]

okay but what about the other reference.
can u refute it?

[Khalid Ali]

simly the ethiopian empire tried to make a claim but the British had already up to the hawd and reserve area which is today ethiopia it was just wishful claim by the ethiopian monarchy at that time. nothing the English or isaaq could take seriously

[Waachis]

but be honest, without the british, ethiopia could've taken it, right?
secondly, would u be against being part of ethiopia
if so, why, when u say u want ogaden to stay apart of ethiopia?
if not, why not?

[Khalid Ali]

no because we are not ogaden we cannot be colonized by an African. we were not even colonize by england. we had a protectorate agreement. cadaankanu loolana madaw ciiseyn meyno isaaq man said in the 18 century he said there is a rivalry between the isaaq and the whites and we have no respect for Niggers which includes your ethiopian masters

why would i want to be part of Ethiopia

as for ogaden its up to them if they free them selves or not its not our concern our concern is somaliland and reserve area the hawd area in ethiopia

we cannot decide for others

but it would have been better if they stay in ethiopia since they are land locked have little resources. but if they want to be free then they should fight up to them

[Waachis]

so the isaaqs had more than 100,000 rifles to fight off meneliks army, is what ur saying? or?

[Khalid Ali]

very simple we know the land better them. their army needs logistics which would not be there. if u continue to fight they will never hold. look at iraq the usa army defeated saddam but it can never hold iraq. isaaq are beligerent in history they have never lost an inch of land

and isaaqs were also smart by signing treaties and creating english interest around the red sea. we carved the majority of the isaaq land as part of british somaliland

so even if it was not for the English. we still would be there. remember somaliland was the launching pad that took out many Ethiopian emperors in the 16 century. it was the powerful isaaq habar magaadle that did that.

no abbissinian king ever ruled over this land.

having said that i have allot of respect of menelik the former king of ethiopia just for one simple reason for defeating the italians.

[Waachis]

the land? did that save the ogadenis? forget logistics, 100,000 rifles or more could've crushed any local indigenous army, like it or not.
the abyssinian kings were negotiating for somali-land with the british and got a NO, had they said YES, i do not think somali-land would've been able to resist, for long. what resources did it, or does it, have to maintain and sustain a resistance/guerrilla warfare

[Lion104]

so the isaaqs had more than 100,000 rifles to fight off meneliks army, is what ur saying? or?

"The Ethiopian Emperor Menelik’s Somali expedition, consisting of an army of 11,000 men, made a deep push into the vicinity of Luuq in Somalia. However, his troops were soundly defeated by the Gobroon army, with only 200 soldiers returning alive.

The Ethiopians subsequently refrained from further expeditions into the interior of Somalia, but continued to oppress the people in the Ogaden (aka Somali region) by plundering the nomads of their livestock.

The British blockade in firearms to the Somalis rendered the nomads in the Ogaden (aka Somali region) helpless against the armies of Menelik."

They could never make a push inside Somalia, since it was heavily armed with strong armies. They couldn't even take the Ogaden region, but were only able to plunder the nomads like thieves. Had it not been for the European arm blockade, them supporting the Habesha Christians, and colonizing our lands, the Somalis would have eventually united and taken all of Ethiopia like the days of Ahmed Gurey. Don't compare us to you Oromos, we have the longest sea in mainland Africa. No way would we get colonized by niggers.

[Khalid Ali]

ogadens are not brave they give up easy isaaqs are people that never give up. i will give u an example siyad bare had the 3rd largest army. isaaq said u and ur army will go down and we did put him down. even if the odds are against us we never give up. i will give u an example the dervish movement was a home grown resistence army that fought the english in the early 20 century it was led by an ogaden whom are very bad leaders in the end it failed in 1921. because it was led by the mad mullah though it had allot of isaaqs in high ranking places it failed because it was led by sayid siigeyste. fast move forward amir ahmed godane former leader of alshabab an isaaq his organization till this day cannot be defeated by amisom. it is because of leadership warfare skills and being determined


as for the ethiopian kings yes they might have negotiate this and that but the isaaq chiefs knew the plans of the kings of abyssinia and we were always on the table of talka sheikh madar the sheikh of hargeisa warnerd the ogaden many times he said make deals with the English but they did not listen they are not that smart.

[Lion104]

At the turn of the 16th century Adal regrouped and around 1527 under the charismatic leadership of Imam Ahmad ibn Ibrihim al-Ghazi (Gurey in Somali, Gragn in Amharic, both meaning “left-handed), Adal invaded Ethiopia. Adalite armies with Ottoman support and arms marched into Ethiopia and caused considerable damage on the Highland state.

Adal’s use of firearms, still only rarely used in Ethiopia, allowed the conquest of well over half of Ethiopia, reaching as far north as Tigray. The complete conquest of Ethiopia was averted by the timely arrival of a Portuguese expedition led by Cristovão da Gama, son of the famed navigator Vasco da Gama.

The Portuguese responded to the Ethiopian pleas for help and sent a military expedition to their fellow Christians. A Portuguese fleet under the command of Estêvão da Gama was sent from India and arrived at Massawa in February 1541. Here he received an ambassador from the Emperor beseeching him to send help against the Muslims, and in July following a force of 400 musketeers, under the command of Christovão da Gama, younger brother of the admiral, marched into the interior, and being joined by Ethiopian troops they were at first successful against the Muslims but they were subsequently defeated at the Battle of Wofla (28 August 1542), and their commander captured and executed.

The Habeshas can only cry for "Christian" help against Somalis, you see. My ancestors would have united all Somalis were it not for the British using the first aerial bombardment in Africa against my people.

[Waachis]

so the isaaqs had more than 100,000 rifles to fight off meneliks army, is what ur saying? or?

"The Ethiopian Emperor Menelik’s Somali expedition, consisting of an army of 11,000 men, made a deep push into the vicinity of Luuq in Somalia. However, his troops were soundly defeated by the Gobroon army, with only 200 soldiers returning alive.

The Ethiopians subsequently refrained from further expeditions into the interior of Somalia, but continued to oppress the people in the Ogaden (aka Somali region) by plundering the nomads of their livestock.

The British blockade in firearms to the Somalis rendered the nomads in the Ogaden (aka Somali region) helpless against the armies of Menelik."

They could never make a push inside Somalia, since it was heavily armed with strong armies. They couldn't even take the Ogaden region, but were only able to plunder the nomads like thieves. Had it not been for the European arm blockade, them supporting the Habesha Christians, and colonizing our lands, the Somalis would have eventually united and taken all of Ethiopia like the days of Ahmed Gurey. Don't compare us to you Oromos, we have the longest sea in mainland Africa. No way would we get colonized by niggers.

11,000 troops? sounds like he under-estimated you, that's all. it took menelik about 40 years to conquer oromos, even tho, oromos had no guns, and some even submitted peacefully. how long did it take menelik to take the ogaden again? few years? few hours?

it took menelik 6-7 years to conquer just 1 oromo clan, while he beat italy in a few hours.

those same niggers were free while 3 different european powers took somali land and split it like pie. don't get emotional bro.