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In fact, this worked the other way around. You haven't brought anything new to the debate that hasn't been known to almost all the members here, but challenging your claims of Islam and showing all the holes in them in my counterarguments could actually benefit many Muslim members who are on the verge of leaving Islam. Many Muslims are leaving Islam in big numbers today than ever before, as has been reported recently hereand here, and there are many who're struggling with their doubts and want answers for their questions re Islam. So the more you lot try to repeat the same old nonsensical stories, the closer those folks will have the courage to speak up and leave this death cult. And you're helping that cause, so thank you!
Allah told Muslims this already when he said:
"O you who have believed, whoever of you should revert from his religion - Allah will bring forth [in place of them] a people He will love and who will love Him [who are] humble toward the believers, powerful against the disbelievers; they strive in the cause of Allah and do not fear the blame of a critic. That is the favor of Allah ; He bestows it upon whom He wills. And Allah is all-Encompassing and Knowing." 5:54
So, no one will be missed with their sorry ass if they leave Islam. it is their loss. For every person who leaves Islam, there are more replacing that person and accepting Islam. In the USA alone, since 9/11, there are hundred thousand Latino Muslims per estimate. Westerners are accepting Islam, mostly women in the west ironically. Simple you-tubing of who is converting in the west will give you an idea of how reverting to Islam is far more dominant than the opposite happening.
Islam teaches faith is conditional(It exists with conditions present), comes with conviction, can increase and decrease based one one's deeds. Also, sins do play a role in how far removed from Islam someone becomes. No muslim with good faith who studied his/her religion becomes a non-muslim. No one goes from Monotheism to polytheism, from monotheism to atheism. People who find themselves on shaky grounds are people who invested little in studying their religion to be honest. Plus hardly anyone who leaves Islam is outstanding individual. From greed to sell books, to the pursuit of worldly desires, some do leave Islam. But that is hardly news or surprising, because the beauty and light of faith does not find abode in dark hearts. Light was bound to be absent from where there is dark.
Allah states in explaining this darkness that compounds on one's heart which ultimately leads to their disbelief:
or [their situation is] like layers of darkness out on a deep sea [the surface of] which is covered by a wave, on top of which there is another wave, on top of which there are clouds; layers of darkness piled one upon the other; when he [the disbeliever] puts out his hand he can hardly see it. And one who is not furnished with light by God has no light.24:40
Indeed saxib, If Allah gave you no light, as the verse ends with, no one else can give you light. We are lucky to have faith in God since we have no power on our own to give ourselves the light of faith.
Plus the anger you feel, and the time you spend arguing with people over Islam clearly indicates how much bitterness you experience in life. I am certain you are very unhappy individual for his lack of faith.
And Allah will always have people who respect him and love him in return for his love and generosity towards them as human beings. That is human tradition for you. Nothing is new.
Gacan baan kuu taagay, you're still debating these brick walls.
People with convictions and who more educated in what they believe in are hard to dissuade. A more advanced being in terms of power and prestige, who knows what he is doing and who lived far longer than any human being struggles daily with their stubbornness(muslims) and persistence. That dude is Ibliis who has soldiers fanning out everyday to just do what Twist and You Xildiid are amateur at doing
Big fail saxib. Orodoo qabiilka ka sheekee iyo xaafaddaydii yaa reer ugaas iyo abokor culus soo waeerareen lol.
Your "arguments" are NOT worth addressing because you keep regurgitating quotes that don't prove anything. It's the same copy and paste with references to a source that's contradictory.
I guess 'iblees' made you use profanity and ad hominems everytime you couldn't address basic questions about Islam.
Xildiiid wrote: Mon Aug 28, 2017 3:16 pm
Your "arguments" are NOT worth addressing because you keep regurgitating quotes that don't prove anything. It's the same copy and paste with references to a source that's contradictory.
I guess 'iblees' made you use profanity and ad hominems everytime you couldn't address basic questions about Islam.
- If my arguments are not worth addressing, why write back to me? Simply, ignore me.
- The profanity felt Good saxib. Harmless little insults said in jest. But, if that bothered you, and you want an apology, you get one as a Somali brother.
In fact, this worked the other way around. You haven't brought anything new to the debate that hasn't been known to almost all the members here, but challenging your claims of Islam and showing all the holes in them in my counterarguments could actually benefit many Muslim members who are on the verge of leaving Islam. Many Muslims are leaving Islam in big numbers today than ever before, as has been reported recently hereand here, and there are many who're struggling with their doubts and want answers for their questions re Islam. So the more you lot try to repeat the same old nonsensical stories, the closer those folks will have the courage to speak up and leave this death cult. And you're helping that cause, so thank you!
Allah told Muslims this already when he said:
"O you who have believed, whoever of you should revert from his religion - Allah will bring forth [in place of them] a people He will love and who will love Him [who are] humble toward the believers, powerful against the disbelievers; they strive in the cause of Allah and do not fear the blame of a critic. That is the favor of Allah ; He bestows it upon whom He wills. And Allah is all-Encompassing and Knowing." 5:54
So, no one will be missed with their sorry ass if they leave Islam. it is their loss. For every person who leaves Islam, there are more replacing that person and accepting Islam. In the USA alone, since 9/11, there are hundred thousand Latino Muslims per estimate. Westerners are accepting Islam, mostly women in the west ironically. Simple you-tubing of who is converting in the west will give you an idea of how reverting to Islam is far more dominant than the opposite happening.
Islam teaches faith is conditional(It exists with conditions present), comes with conviction, can increase and decrease based one one's deeds. Also, sins do play a role in how far removed from Islam someone becomes. No muslim with good faith who studied his/her religion becomes a non-muslim. No one goes from Monotheism to polytheism, from monotheism to atheism. People who find themselves on shaky grounds are people who invested little in studying their religion to be honest. Plus hardly anyone who leaves Islam is outstanding individual. From greed to sell books, to the pursuit of worldly desires, some do leave Islam. But that is hardly news or surprising, because the beauty and light of faith does not find abode in dark hearts. Light was bound to be absent from where there is dark.
Allah states in explaining this darkness that compounds on one's heart which ultimately leads to their disbelief:
or [their situation is] like layers of darkness out on a deep sea [the surface of] which is covered by a wave, on top of which there is another wave, on top of which there are clouds; layers of darkness piled one upon the other; when he [the disbeliever] puts out his hand he can hardly see it. And one who is not furnished with light by God has no light.24:40
Indeed saxib, If Allah gave you no light, as the verse ends with, no one else can give you light. We are lucky to have faith in God since we have no power on our own to give ourselves the light of faith.
Plus the anger you feel, and the time you spend arguing with people over Islam clearly indicates how much bitterness you experience in life. I am certain you are very unhappy individual for his lack of faith.
And Allah will always have people who respect him and love him in return for his love and generosity towards them as human beings. That is human tradition for you. Nothing is new.
So ultimately your answer is 'Allah said this' and 'Allah said that'. He's the most powerful and the all knowing god who can either lead or mislead whomever he wants, innit? So that means he misled us, non-Muslims, whereas you, the "lucky ones", he showed you the right path. Keeping that in mind, wouldn't that make me incapable of believing in god's message even if I wanted to, and make god unfair, since he's the one who made me disbelieve his message? Or now you'll go back and change your stance on "free will"? And again, doing what you're good at doing. I couldn't have been happier with my life today than I have ever been back in my Muslim days. Had I had any unhappiness in my life due to my disbelief, and thought Islam was the answer, common sense would suggest that I would have gone back to Islam. But hey, if you can't defeat ex Muzzies, throw false and baseless accusations about themselves and their lives at them as a last resort.
This chart sums up well the problem I have with your god:
Last edited by Twist on Mon Aug 28, 2017 3:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Here is a reply to one of the issues Twist Raised as a Math problem in the Quran. The inheritance math Twist allegedly says are wrong. I already know Twist and like minded individuals have no clue what they are talking about and only agree with the critics of Islam just because they share their dislike of Islam. Hundred percent of the time, and every criticism they write has its roots in their lack of knowledge of Arabic, understanding of the Quran, or a culture. Often these websites seek to distort the facts in the Quran. Plenty of examples like flat earth claim, embryology information etc. Anyways, moving on to below.
Here is the reply to the Al-Nisa verse 11-12 that twist posted from his favorite website. Twist needs to read this since it debunks and exposes the idiocy he is too fond to quote. One of many indeed.
This reply was written by a muslim woman who responded to these websites Twist Quoted From:
"
First let me put up the Quranic Verses 4:11-12 (Surah An-Nissa) concerning inheritance laws.
"Allah chargeth you concerning (the provision for) your children: to the male the equivalent of the portion of two females, and if there be women more than two, then theirs is two-thirds of the inheritance, and if there be one (only) then the half. And to each of his parents a sixth of the inheritance, if he have a son; and if he have no son and his parents are his heirs, then to his mother appertaineth the third; and if he have brethren, then to his mother appertaineth the sixth, after any legacy he may have bequeathed, or debt (hath been paid). Your parents and your children: Ye know not which of them is nearer unto you in usefulness. It is an injunction from Allah. Lo! Allah is Knower, Wise." 4:11.
"And unto you belongeth a half of that which your wives leave, if they have no child; but if they have a child then unto you the fourth of that which they leave, after any legacy they may have bequeathed, or debt (they may have contracted, hath been paid). And unto them belongeth the fourth of that which ye leave if ye have no child, but if ye have a child then the eighth of that which ye leave, after any legacy ye may have bequeathed, or debt (ye may have contracted, hath been paid). And if a man or a woman have a distant heir (having left neither parent nor child), and he (or she) have a brother or a sister (only on the mother's side) then to each of them twain (the brother and the sister) the sixth, and if they be more than two, then they shall be sharers in the third, after any legacy that may have been bequeathed or debt (contracted) not injuring (the heirs by willing away more than a third of the heritage) hath been paid. A commandment from Allah. Allah is Knower, Indulgent." 4:12.
Now, I will quote below the childish criticism of the AI and WI kuffar which is hilarious. Even a child with half a brain would not be as dumbwit as this.
Quoting them -
"Mathematical Error in Hereditary Laws.
The total does not equal to 1. This error can never be reconciled in any way."
Unquote -
Addressing AI and WI: What the heck are you talking? The denomination of "1" is never taken as a presumed total for calculating any distribution, and it's certainly never a presumed standard total for a legacy. How on earth do you expect to calculate the distribution of inheritance without knowing the total assets to be divided among the heirs. The fallacy arises because Answering Islam / WikiIslam's complete lack of mathematical knowledge. How can you get the balance of the total without deducting the amount of bequest and the debt? Are you completely out of your mind? Even for a simple demonstration, you first need to pick a value for the estate prior to mathematical workings otherwise your workings are bound to be fallacious as in Wiki's case. And Wiki is attributing its own mistakes to the Quran.
So let us take a few examples demonstrating simple distributions of inheritances within families based on the figures of Quranic Verses 4:11-12 and then check the total of the break-up with the original value of the estate to verify for conformity.
EXAMPLE ONE:
A man who is a widower dies. His modest estate is worth 100,000. He leaves behind a son, a daughter and a brother. He makes a bequest of 20,000 to his brother. His total debt of 5,000 needs to be deducted from the value of his estate. That makes the balance worth of his estate to 75,000. Daughter gets half the share of the son out of 75,000 which would be 25,000 and son gets the remaining 50,000. Now lets calculate the total and whether or not it tallies with the total worth of the estate.
Bequest 20,000
Debt 5,000
Daughter 25,000
Son 50,000
Total 100,000 --> original worth of the estate as mentioned above.
If there be 2 sons and 2 daughters with the same bequest and same debt, then from the balance of 75,000 each son would get 25,000 and each daughter would get 12,500. Let's again check the total.
Total 100,000 --> original worth of the estate as mentioned above.
EXAMPLE TWO:
A wealthier man dies leaving an estate worth 450,000. He leaves behind a son, 2 daughters, a wife and 2 sisters. He makes a bequest of 15,000 for each of his 2 sisters making the total bequest to 30,000. His total debts amount to 8,000. Balance worth of estate after deducting the bequest and debt is 412,000. The wife is entitled to one-eighth of that total, that is 51,500. That leaves the balance of the estate at 360,500. The 2 daughters are entitled to half the share of the son. Half of 360,500 is 180,250 (total share of both daughters). Thus, each of the 2 daughters get 90,125. Balance is the son's share that is 360,500 minus 180,250 = 180,250 (exactly the amount shared by his 2 sisters). Now let's total up the distribution to see if it tallies with the original worth of the estate which was 450,000.
Thus total solidly tallies with the original worth of the estate 450,000 as mentioned above.
If there were 3 or more sisters, then they would be sharers in two-third of the total of 360,500. So, if there were 3 or more sisters, then we would need to calculate two-third of 360,500 which would be 240,332. Hence 3 or more sisters would share from 240,332. The son would get the remaining 120,167. Similarly the original total value of the estate would add to 450,000. You can do that calculation yourself.
If there be 2 sons and 2 daughters, both sons get 225,312 (out of 360,500) that is 112,656 each. Both daughters get the balance of 135,188. Therefore each daughter gets 67,594. Check the total.
Total 450,000 --> Total tallies completely with original worth of estate.
Answering-Islam and WikiIslam: Learn you primary school maths before you talk next time!
And now .. some other important points to be kept in mind:
Remember, the figures mentioned in Verses 11 and 12 of Surah An-Nissa are to be taken after deducting the bequest (if any) left behind by the deceased and after the deduction of debt (if any). The amount of bequest is not specified in the Quran. That depends on the will of the deceased. However it's to be understood that a bequest shouldn't be unfair which might completely deprive the other heirs. This would particularly apply in the cases of the wealthy who leave behind a substantial estate.
It's also to be understood that these figures mentioned in the Noble Quran are the standard principles that highlight the basic framework of Islamic inheritance laws. It's important to know that exceptional situations can (and do) occur concerning the number of heirs and their varying situations that aren't spelt out in Verses 4:11-12. In all such cases a Muslim is by all means allowed to make suitable decisions exercising their rationale with the help of the standard guidelines in Verses 4:11-12 and the spirit of justice/fairness as also highlighted throughout the Quran. For example, a man of modest means dies leaving behind two sons and an asset worth 50,000. One of his sons has a successful career having his own independent assets worth 200,000. The other son is not so fortunate. He is virtually penniless, toils with hard labor, struggles to pay his daily expenses with a meager saving that might not be enough even to pay a bill for a medical emergency. In such a case, the father may decide to give his entire asset of 50,000 as a gift to his son who is financially stretched and he is allowed to do so. It certainly sounds very acceptable in the light of Quranic principles of justice, kindness and fair play. The final Judgment is up to Allah Almighty to be dispensed in the Hereafter. One will have to wait for that with patience and silence.
Yet there are far more complicated legacies in cases of bigger families and there are any number of excellent legal experts out there who calculate the distribution of inheritances on the lines of Quranic figures, accurate to the last penny.
The very important reason why according to the Quranic Law of Inheritance, sons get twice the share of daughters, is because sons have plenty of financial responsibilities, unlike daughters. These responsibilities include meeting all expenses of their marriage including dowry, supporting their wives and children, supporting elderly parents and dependent siblings. Contrary to this, daughters have no such financial burdens. Any portion of wealth she inherits or earns is her personal possession with which she's not obligated to support her dependents, unless she volunteers to do so. Hence, those Muslim men who have gotten deviated enough to overrule the Quranic dictate concerning their financial duties, must also voluntarily forgo to claim double the share of inheritance. After all, Allah Almighty has commanded to give males twice the share of females with a specific reason. If some men are not able to handle that specific reason, they cannot simply dismiss their responsibility and move on without any adjustments. That would be getting the cake and eating it too. It would disrupt the entire balance of the structure of this law established by Allah. "
WiredForGood wrote: Mon Aug 28, 2017 3:47 pm
Here is a reply to one of the issues Twist Raised as a Math problem in the Quran. The inheritance math Twist allegedly says are wrong. I already know Twist and like minded individuals have no clue what they are talking about and only agree with the critics of Islam just because they share their dislike of Islam. Hundred percent of the time, and every criticism they write has its roots in their lack of knowledge of Arabic, understanding of the Quran, or a culture. Often these websites seek to distort the facts in the Quran. Plenty of examples like flat earth claim, embryology information etc. Anyways, moving on to below.
Here is the reply to the Al-Nisa verse 11-12 that twist posted from his favorite website. Twist needs to read this since it debunks and exposes the idiocy he is too fond to quote. One of many indeed.
This reply was written by a muslim woman who responded to these websites Twist Quoted From:
"
First let me put up the Quranic Verses 4:11-12 (Surah An-Nissa) concerning inheritance laws.
"Allah chargeth you concerning (the provision for) your children: to the male the equivalent of the portion of two females, and if there be women more than two, then theirs is two-thirds of the inheritance, and if there be one (only) then the half. And to each of his parents a sixth of the inheritance, if he have a son; and if he have no son and his parents are his heirs, then to his mother appertaineth the third; and if he have brethren, then to his mother appertaineth the sixth, after any legacy he may have bequeathed, or debt (hath been paid). Your parents and your children: Ye know not which of them is nearer unto you in usefulness. It is an injunction from Allah. Lo! Allah is Knower, Wise." 4:11.
"And unto you belongeth a half of that which your wives leave, if they have no child; but if they have a child then unto you the fourth of that which they leave, after any legacy they may have bequeathed, or debt (they may have contracted, hath been paid). And unto them belongeth the fourth of that which ye leave if ye have no child, but if ye have a child then the eighth of that which ye leave, after any legacy ye may have bequeathed, or debt (ye may have contracted, hath been paid). And if a man or a woman have a distant heir (having left neither parent nor child), and he (or she) have a brother or a sister (only on the mother's side) then to each of them twain (the brother and the sister) the sixth, and if they be more than two, then they shall be sharers in the third, after any legacy that may have been bequeathed or debt (contracted) not injuring (the heirs by willing away more than a third of the heritage) hath been paid. A commandment from Allah. Allah is Knower, Indulgent." 4:12.
Now, I will quote below the childish criticism of the AI and WI kuffar which is hilarious. Even a child with half a brain would not be as dumbwit as this.
Quoting them -
"Mathematical Error in Hereditary Laws.
The total does not equal to 1. This error can never be reconciled in any way."
Unquote -
Addressing AI and WI: What the heck are you talking? The denomination of "1" is never taken as a presumed total for calculating any distribution, and it's certainly never a presumed standard total for a legacy. How on earth do you expect to calculate the distribution of inheritance without knowing the total assets to be divided among the heirs. The fallacy arises because Answering Islam / WikiIslam's complete lack of mathematical knowledge. How can you get the balance of the total without deducting the amount of bequest and the debt? Are you completely out of your mind? Even for a simple demonstration, you first need to pick a value for the estate prior to mathematical workings otherwise your workings are bound to be fallacious as in Wiki's case. And Wiki is attributing its own mistakes to the Quran.
So let us take a few examples demonstrating simple distributions of inheritances within families based on the figures of Quranic Verses 4:11-12 and then check the total of the break-up with the original value of the estate to verify for conformity.
EXAMPLE ONE:
A man who is a widower dies. His modest estate is worth 100,000. He leaves behind a son, a daughter and a brother. He makes a bequest of 20,000 to his brother. His total debt of 5,000 needs to be deducted from the value of his estate. That makes the balance worth of his estate to 75,000. Daughter gets half the share of the son out of 75,000 which would be 25,000 and son gets the remaining 50,000. Now lets calculate the total and whether or not it tallies with the total worth of the estate.
Bequest 20,000
Debt 5,000
Daughter 25,000
Son 50,000
Total 100,000 --> original worth of the estate as mentioned above.
If there be 2 sons and 2 daughters with the same bequest and same debt, then from the balance of 75,000 each son would get 25,000 and each daughter would get 12,500. Let's again check the total.
Total 100,000 --> original worth of the estate as mentioned above.
EXAMPLE TWO:
A wealthier man dies leaving an estate worth 450,000. He leaves behind a son, 2 daughters, a wife and 2 sisters. He makes a bequest of 15,000 for each of his 2 sisters making the total bequest to 30,000. His total debts amount to 8,000. Balance worth of estate after deducting the bequest and debt is 412,000. The wife is entitled to one-eighth of that total, that is 51,500. That leaves the balance of the estate at 360,500. The 2 daughters are entitled to half the share of the son. Half of 360,500 is 180,250 (total share of both daughters). Thus, each of the 2 daughters get 90,125. Balance is the son's share that is 360,500 minus 180,250 = 180,250 (exactly the amount shared by his 2 sisters). Now let's total up the distribution to see if it tallies with the original worth of the estate which was 450,000.
Thus total solidly tallies with the original worth of the estate 450,000 as mentioned above.
If there were 3 or more sisters, then they would be sharers in two-third of the total of 360,500. So, if there were 3 or more sisters, then we would need to calculate two-third of 360,500 which would be 240,332. Hence 3 or more sisters would share from 240,332. The son would get the remaining 120,167. Similarly the original total value of the estate would add to 450,000. You can do that calculation yourself.
If there be 2 sons and 2 daughters, both sons get 225,312 (out of 360,500) that is 112,656 each. Both daughters get the balance of 135,188. Therefore each daughter gets 67,594. Check the total.
Total 450,000 --> Total tallies completely with original worth of estate.
Answering-Islam and WikiIslam: Learn you primary school maths before you talk next time!
And now .. some other important points to be kept in mind:
Remember, the figures mentioned in Verses 11 and 12 of Surah An-Nissa are to be taken after deducting the bequest (if any) left behind by the deceased and after the deduction of debt (if any). The amount of bequest is not specified in the Quran. That depends on the will of the deceased. However it's to be understood that a bequest shouldn't be unfair which might completely deprive the other heirs. This would particularly apply in the cases of the wealthy who leave behind a substantial estate.
It's also to be understood that these figures mentioned in the Noble Quran are the standard principles that highlight the basic framework of Islamic inheritance laws. It's important to know that exceptional situations can (and do) occur concerning the number of heirs and their varying situations that aren't spelt out in Verses 4:11-12. In all such cases a Muslim is by all means allowed to make suitable decisions exercising their rationale with the help of the standard guidelines in Verses 4:11-12 and the spirit of justice/fairness as also highlighted throughout the Quran. For example, a man of modest means dies leaving behind two sons and an asset worth 50,000. One of his sons has a successful career having his own independent assets worth 200,000. The other son is not so fortunate. He is virtually penniless, toils with hard labor, struggles to pay his daily expenses with a meager saving that might not be enough even to pay a bill for a medical emergency. In such a case, the father may decide to give his entire asset of 50,000 as a gift to his son who is financially stretched and he is allowed to do so. It certainly sounds very acceptable in the light of Quranic principles of justice, kindness and fair play. The final Judgment is up to Allah Almighty to be dispensed in the Hereafter. One will have to wait for that with patience and silence.
Yet there are far more complicated legacies in cases of bigger families and there are any number of excellent legal experts out there who calculate the distribution of inheritances on the lines of Quranic figures, accurate to the last penny.
The very important reason why according to the Quranic Law of Inheritance, sons get twice the share of daughters, is because sons have plenty of financial responsibilities, unlike daughters. These responsibilities include meeting all expenses of their marriage including dowry, supporting their wives and children, supporting elderly parents and dependent siblings. Contrary to this, daughters have no such financial burdens. Any portion of wealth she inherits or earns is her personal possession with which she's not obligated to support her dependents, unless she volunteers to do so. Hence, those Muslim men who have gotten deviated enough to overrule the Quranic dictate concerning their financial duties, must also voluntarily forgo to claim double the share of inheritance. After all, Allah Almighty has commanded to give males twice the share of females with a specific reason. If some men are not able to handle that specific reason, they cannot simply dismiss their responsibility and move on without any adjustments. That would be getting the cake and eating it too. It would disrupt the entire balance of the structure of this law established by Allah. "
I stopped reading this dumb bitch right there when she said percentages or fractions should not add up to 100% or 1 in the case of fractions.
And this idiot is quoting her lol do these muzzies check the veracity of the defense they pass around? That's the problem with Muslims the herd mentality is amazing.
X.Playa wrote: Mon Aug 28, 2017 4:03 pm
I stopped reading this dumb bitch right there when she said percentages or fractions should not add up to 100% or 1 in the case of fractions.
And this idiot is quoting her lol do these muzzies check the veracity of the defense they pass around? That's the problem with Muslims the herd mentality is amazing.
Let me translate for you what the woman wrote: In simple and short paragraph, what the Ai and Wi websites did was - which shows how clueless they are, and blind in their drive to critique islam- use the Number One "1" as the bequest(wealth to be inherited) spoken by the Quran that needed to be divided among inheritors. Instead of calculating the amount of wealth left by the dead, they are using "1" to show how that number divided according to the fractions stated in the verses would not add up to the original "1".
This is how clueless these people are including you who claim to be experts in Islam. And twist because of his ignorance and willingness to go along with anyone who criticizes Islam was demanding an answer all along thinking no one could answer.
You have to feel sorry for the ignorant sometimes. All other so called challenges he posted on page six are the same, useless and toothless challenges.
Who is the idiot is obvious. You didn't even read what the woman wrote admittedly yet you were willing to sacrifice your dignity nonetheless. You folks have no shame in life at all.
Every fraction adds to 1 , if you use fraction then your total sum must equal 1. And the Koran is using fractions. So its bizarre how Muslim argue the sum shouldn't be 1.?
Same thing with porpotion its sum has to equal to 100%. Now since the Koran failed basic mathematics the Muslims are trying to reinvent the wheel.
The Koran divided up an inheritances using fractions and when all the fractions are added the result must be 1 lol but its more then 1 so that's a basic mistake.
And no amount of large copy and paste text will change that math.
Yeah, here's where she posted her answer. But she based her explanation on a much later Fiqh on Islamic inheritance, which doesn't answer how god got it wrong in the first place. Also, there are two different ways that Islamic jurisprudence of inheritance; Shias have their own version, and the Sunnis have totally a different one, and none of them is based on those verses.
Here's someone who explains how the Fiqh answers to the inheritance issue is different from that Koranic verse:
When one considers the Muslim claim that the Qur'an is a perfect, inerrant, and God given book, one must then examine this claim rather than blindly accepting it. When this process is undertaken, however, one begins to find that the Muslim claim quickly falls under the weight of some rather obvious errors in Islam's holy book. One of these concerns the inheritance laws laid out by Mohammed in Surah 4 (An-Nisaa). Let us begin by looking at the pertinent verses, from the Yusuf Ali translation:
"Allah (thus) directs you as regards your children's (inheritance): to the male, a portion equal to that of two females: if only daughters, two or more, their share is two-thirds of the inheritance; if only one, her share is a half. For parents, a sixth share of the inheritance to each, if the deceased left children; if no children, and the parents are the (only) heirs, the mother has a third; if the deceased left brothers (or sisters) the mother has a sixth. (The distribution in all cases is) after the payment of legacies and debts. Ye know not whether your parents or your children are nearest to you in benefit. These are settled portions ordained by Allah: and Allah is All-Knowing, All-wise." (4:11)
"In what your wives leave, your share is a half, if they leave no child; but if they leave a child, ye get a fourth; after payment of legacies and debts. In what ye leave, their share is a fourth, if ye leave no child; but if ye leave a child, they get an eighth; after payment of legacies and debts. If the man or woman whose inheritance is in question, has left neither ascendants nor descendants, but has left a brother or a sister, each one of the two gets a sixth; but if more than two, they share in a third; after payment of legacies and debts; so that no loss is caused (to any one). Thus is it ordained by Allah; and Allah is All- Knowing, Most Forbearing." (4:12)
These two passages lay out many of the rules for inheritance which Allah supposedly revealed to Mohammed. The problem is that when one begins to actually plug in a man's surviving relatives into these convoluted equations, some funny results appear.
For example, let us propose that a man dies, and leaves behind him two daughters, his wife, and his widowed mother. The shares of the inheritance then are divided as such: Two daughters get 2/3 (4:11), his wife gets 1/8 (4:12), and the widowed mother gets 1/6 (4:11). Adding the fractions, 16/24 + 3/24 + 4/24 = 23/24. The inheritance laws provides no further information which suggests where the final 1/24 of the inheritance goes.
Even more amusingly, however, is when we take an example involving the death of a man who leaves four daughters, both parents, and his wife. The shares divvied up become: Daughters get 2/3 (4:11), his parents get 1/3 total (4:11), and his wife gets 1/8. This adds up to 9/8 of the inheritance being distributed! Let's hope the IRS doesn't find out about this!
These demonstrate a serious mathematical problem in the Qur'an, which calls into question the divine nature of the Quranic revelation. It seems that these passages are of human origin, and demonstrate the fallability of this book on what is really an issue of basic fractional mathematics.
When confronted with this information, Muslim apologists will typically attempt to circumvent the Quranic aspect of the argument, and try to make an argument from later Islamic jurisprudence, known as fiqh. This word refers to the body of later Muslim interpretation of the Qur'an and the ahadith, which is presented as legalistic interpretation (or rationalisation) of the initial Quranic and hadithic precepts. Yusuf Ali presents a typical demonstration of this argument,
"The principles of inheritance law are laid down in broad outline in the Qur'an; the precise details have been worked out on the basis of the Prophet's practice and that of his Companions, and by interpretation and analogy."1
With reference to the extra 1/24 of a man's inheritance (which comes up fairly often, apparently), the apologist will argue from later fiqh, pointing out that Islamic law makes a provision for the distribution of the remaining inheritance, and thus, there is not an error in the Qur'an. Of course, this answer is nonsense, as the apologist is pointing to what is essentially later and lesser addenda to the Qur'an, which was added centuries after the Qur'an was compiled and standardised. The argument is anachronistic, attempting to correct the prior literature with later interpretation, and then claiming that this corrects the problem present in the original work.
In the case of excessive inheritance division (such as the 9/8 from the example above), both Shi'a and Sunni Muslims have worked out different ways to solve this problem. The Shi'a, typically, will grant to the widow her full share of the inheritance first, and then distribute the rest from unity according to the Quranic precept, keeping the ratios the same with a proportional lowering of the total absolute share. The Sunni follow the principle of "proportional distribution", whereby every inheritor receives a proportionally lower share to keep the inheritance ratio the same, but based on unity, without the surplus. Again, though, this is based upon later Islamic legal tradition, and not on the Qur'an itself. The supposedly infallible Qur'an has to be corrected by human jurisprudence for it to be fully applicable.
X.Playa wrote: Mon Aug 28, 2017 4:15 pm
Every fraction adds to 1 , if you use fraction then your total sum must equal 1. And the Koran is using fractions. So its bizarre how Muslim argue the sum shouldn't be 1.?
Same thing with porpotion its sum has to equal to 100%. Now since the Koran failed basic mathematics the Muslims are trying to reinvent the wheel.
The Koran divided up an inheritances using fractions and when all the fractions are added the result must be 1 lol but its more then 1 so that's a basic mistake.
And no amount of large copy and paste text will change that math.
X.Playa wrote: Mon Aug 28, 2017 4:15 pm
Every fraction adds to 1 , if you use fraction then your total sum must equal 1. And the Koran is using fractions. So its bizarre how Muslim argue the sum shouldn't be 1.?
Same thing with porpotion its sum has to equal to 100%. Now since the Koran failed basic mathematics the Muslims are trying to reinvent the wheel.
The Koran divided up an inheritances using reactions and when all the fractions are added the result must be 1 lol but its mire then 1 so that's a basic mistake.
And no amount of large copy and paste text will change that math.
Dude, Wealth/Bequest and what someone leaves behind of property does not equal to one. Unless you have some form of insanity where your world is upside down, there is no way you can show from the verses what is being divided to be "1". Alas, confusion and desire to hate religion is what leads you to be blind to simple realities in life.
You wish the Quran failed in anything. Try again. Wealth is being divided not the digital number "1". Plus, as stated by the lady, a muslim can even determine how he will assign shares of wealth based on the pursuit of justice among inheritors.
X.Playa wrote: Mon Aug 28, 2017 4:15 pm
Every fraction adds to 1 , if you use fraction then your total sum must equal 1. And the Koran is using fractions. So its bizarre how Muslim argue the sum shouldn't be 1.?
Same thing with porpotion its sum has to equal to 100%. Now since the Koran failed basic mathematics the Muslims are trying to reinvent the wheel.
The Koran divided up an inheritances using reactions and when all the fractions are added the result must be 1 lol but its mire then 1 so that's a basic mistake.
And no amount of large copy and paste text will change that math.
Dude, Wealth/Bequest and what someone leaves behind of property does not equal to one. Unless you have some form of insanity where your world is upside down, there is no way you can show from the verses what is being divided to be "1". Alas, confusion and desire to hate religion is what leads you to be blind to simple realities in life.
You wish the Quran failed in anything. Try again. Wealth is being divided not the digital number "1". Plus, as stated by the lady, a muslim can even determine how he will assign shares of wealth based on the pursuit of justice among inheritors.
You have no case.
Lol Jesus Christ how dull these people are. Ofcourse the actual sum isn't one it could be a million or 99 goats but once divided in fraction it will be equal to the original sum. That is if you have original sum. That's that.
Now the Koran used fractions and the total of these fractions has to be equal to 1 which it fails to lool that means if we apply this crazy Koran math the sum of the total Islamic division will exceed any original amount lol.
Lol Jesus Christ how dull these people are. Ofcourse the actual sum isn't one it could be a million or 99 goats but once divided in fraction it will be equal to the original sum. That is if you have original sum. That's that.
Now the Koran used fractions and the total of these fractions has to be equal to 1 which it fails to lool that means if we apply this crazy Koran math the sum of the total Islamic division will exceed any original amount lol.
Did you see the examples given? If what you are looking for is division matching the original amount(when added), there are countless of examples I can quote for you. Scroll up and look at her examples if you care mate for starters. Plus there is no rigid rule since people will leave behind different wealth or no wealth.
Keep dividing One .
Last edited by WiredForGood on Mon Aug 28, 2017 4:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
X.Playa wrote: Mon Aug 28, 2017 4:15 pm
Every fraction adds to 1 , if you use fraction then your total sum must equal 1. And the Koran is using fractions. So its bizarre how Muslim argue the sum shouldn't be 1.?
Same thing with porpotion its sum has to equal to 100%. Now since the Koran failed basic mathematics the Muslims are trying to reinvent the wheel.
The Koran divided up an inheritances using fractions and when all the fractions are added the result must be 1 lol but its more then 1 so that's a basic mistake.
And no amount of large copy and paste text will change that math.
