Just out of curiosity, when did ISAAQ come about as a Clan.

[theyuusuf143]

No clan on earth can claim decent from a single line, clans are created through centuries of political and religious factors. Even Mohammed of Quraysh can't maintain a one man clan patriarch. Quraysh is a clan made up of many ancestry through the centuries no different then the modern Isaaq. These are universal sociological reality.

But that doesn't negate two important things, one that sheekh Isxaaq was a historical personality and two that sheekh Isxaaq is the founder of the Isaaq clan in both ancestry and religious community members.

The Dir theory advanced by some revisionist have not a single shred of evidence and it doesn't not predates Ina Cigaal political alliance in the1960.

No body said isaaq is not the founder of the isaaq clan. What we are discussing here is how he did it ? Are they all his children, were they his xer ? If for example they were his xer what was their clan before they joined him ? Sheikh isaaq himself was he Somali or Arab ?

We know who sheekh Isxaaq was and according to historical manuscripts and eyewitness accounts he was an Arab emigrant. We also know he is the founder of the Isaaq clan, we can also deduce that the modern Isaaq clan can be grouped into :

1- his descendants
2- the descendants of his religious community and disciples
3- his sociological descendants, by that I mean individuals and groups whom through social and political factors joined and through time intermingled with the above two groups.

The Isaaq clan is no different then any other clan on earth and all clans are created by the above means.

That absolutely negates the Dir crap " who's my daddy" theory. My advice to the dirty-waqooyi is stop shopping for a daddy.

Excellent ! Now we are close to the point . How about if I believe that my ancestors came from those last 2 groups? And they were Dir before isaaq . I ain't no Arab I am African , Somali .

[X.Playa]

No body said isaaq is not the founder of the isaaq clan. What we are discussing here is how he did it ? Are they all his children, were they his xer ? If for example they were his xer what was their clan before they joined him ? Sheikh isaaq himself was he Somali or Arab ?

We know who sheekh Isxaaq was and according to historical manuscripts and eyewitness accounts he was an Arab emigrant. We also know he is the founder of the Isaaq clan, we can also deduce that the modern Isaaq clan can be grouped into :

1- his descendants
2- the descendants of his religious community and disciples
3- his sociological descendants, by that I mean individuals and groups whom through social and political factors joined and through time intermingled with the above two groups.

The Isaaq clan is no different then any other clan on earth and all clans are created by the above means.

That absolutely negates the Dir crap " who's my daddy" theory. My advice to the dirty-waqooyi is stop shopping for a daddy.

Excellent ! Now we are close to the point . How about if I believe that my ancestors came from those last 2 groups? And they were Dir before isaaq . I ain't no Arab I am African , Somali .

If you believe in dragons and orcs you have to prove they exist ,. you just can't believe in anything because you just like it.

[Xildiiid]

We are not Dir!

Within Dir only Magaadle, Surre and Biimaal are our brothers. The rest can go fuck themselves.

[DayrBare]

Your question simply can be summarized into " was sheekh Isxaaq a historical personality"? Meaning did he exist, and the question to that is simply yes. We have enough of first hand witnesses visiting Maydh encountering sheekh Isxaaq there in the 1300s. At least 3 Arab travels left behind a written account of meeting sheekh Isxaaq.

Now one mistake Somalis commit regarding dates , is when they say the 14 or 15 century they mean the 1400s and the 1500s which is wrong when you say the 14 century in English it means the period from 1300-1400 same for the 15 century meaning 1400-1500.

Now the average generation is 3 generation in a century or maximum 4 in a century. Taking the average in your case 15 generation to Ayuub multiplied by 33 years that will give you an approximate of 500 years putting Ayuub around early 1500s . That's the years of Futuux Al Xabasha so it's pretty much accurate. That doesn't mean Ayuub lived at that time it's just an approximate using your 15 generation. Most Isaaq today are at least 17 generation to Isaaq putting the 8 sons of Sheek Isxaaq in the 1400s, which is plausible since Sheek Isxaaq time was between 1300-1400.

The rest of the mumbo jumbo dir ibnu rag ibnu bnu zag ibnu Ram is pure gibbirish invented recently.

Ok then one must ask the question how a segment of the Isaaq (Habr-magaadle in this case) were able to enlist such large soldiers that took part in the conquest of Abyssinia since they were two to three generation to Sheekh Isxaaq?

The war of the conquest of Abbysiniya took place in the 1530s some 200 years since the founding of the Isaaq clan which puts the Habar Magaadle in their 5th or 6th generation. Putting a force of 800 men is not really much in my opinion they could have provided double that.

Look at it this way the modern reer Guuleed can employ 800 men easily and they are 6 generation old never mind the entire habar Magaadle.

That make sense