Axmed Gurey and Imam Axmed Ibraahim Al Ghaazi, revisited.

[Siciid85]

Imam Ahmed was Ogaden. I thought everyone already knew this! why argue??

I hate stupid lazy people. This man took time and effort to share something he found that clearly backs his position, what do YOU have that backs your claim that Imam Ahmed was Ogadeen?

[jalaaludin5]

Imam Ahmed was Ogaden. I thought everyone already knew this! why argue??

Not according to the exhibit of Ahmed Gurey's footprint cast at the British Museum.
-
-
-

[samaalenoble]

Yes, let's google translate French and Italian interpretations of a book/records that are already available in English and Arabic.




ROFL

[inaXasan]

Imam Ahmed was Ogaden. I thought everyone already knew this! why argue??

I hate stupid lazy people. This man took time and effort to share something he found that clearly backs his position, what do YOU have that backs your claim that Imam Ahmed was Ogadeen?

lazy part is right sxb. I do not have the time or patience to do what he's doing. I don't even think it's necessary to go through all this bullshit. It's like the black Americans with their inferiority complex who claim other people's history and write walls of text in their forums and their blogs to feel better about themselves. Just because they took the time to write the 5000 character blogs and backed their claims doesn't make Nabi Musa the ancestor of black Americans or make black Americans Israelites.

The only reason I said he was Ogaden was because I thought it was common knowledge since everyone I know that ever talked of this topic said that that was his clan and I seem to trust the words on the streets a lot more than internet theories.

If it was discovered tomorrow that he wasn't Ogaden or even Somali, It wouldn't and shouldn't do anything to us because our pride doesn't depend on him and his achievements.

[JSL3000]

Imam Ahmed was Ogaden. I thought everyone already knew this! why argue??

I hate stupid lazy people. This man took time and effort to share something he found that clearly backs his position, what do YOU have that backs your claim that Imam Ahmed was Ogadeen?

lazy part is right sxb. I do not have the time or patience to do what he's doing. I don't even think it's necessary to go through all this bullshit. It's like the black Americans with their inferiority complex who claim other people's history and write walls of text in their forums and their blogs to feel better about themselves. Just because they took the time to write the 5000 character blogs and backed their claims doesn't make Nabi Musa the ancestor of black Americans or make black Americans Israelites.

The only reason I said he was Ogaden was because I thought it was common knowledge since everyone I know that ever talked of this topic said that that was his clan and I seem to trust the words on the streets a lot more than internet theories.

If it was discovered tomorrow that he wasn't Ogaden or even Somali, It wouldn't and shouldn't do anything to us because our pride doesn't depend on him and his achievements.

Sounds like stupidity.

[somalilander4211]

During my recent exile from the forum banished as usual by the Ogaden sneaky weasel and his feigned religious guardianship , immersed in my usual research I came accidently upon an Italian manuscript of " Futuux Al Xabasha" translated at the turn of the 20th century. The remarkable thing about this old translation ( before the French and the recent English one ) is that the Imaam is never called by " Guray" , throughout the Italian translations the Imaam is referred too simply as the Iman Ahmed , or Iman Ahmed Ibn Ibraahim , or Iman ahmed Ibn Ibraahim Al-Ghaazi , or simply as the Iman. The man nicknamed Guray is mentioned as Axmed Xuseen Gurey leader of the Habar Magaadle or as Ahmed Gurey Ibn Xuseen, or sometimes Axmed Ibn Xuseen.

The Italian translation (La conquista mussulmana dell'Etiopia nel secolo XVI. Traduzione d'un manoscritto arabo con prefazione e note di Cesare Nerazzini, e una carta geografica del 1636 by Nerazzini, Cesare, ). This particular book is only available in http://www.hathitrust.org using a USA proxy ( only American citizens have an access to this digital library) access it via a usa proxy.

Translation Page 15.

Formation of a new army with Somali tribes and departure for Ethiopia. Battle of Demircore. - Return Muslim army in theirlands.

After a short time after his arrival in Harrar the Iman began to prepare for a new expedition, and sent a lot loot reported in Somali territory, writing them promptly they come to him. Somalis that Iman required. They were of the tribe of labarre and Gheri, and those of the tribe of Mattan and the tribe of Merrean. The Negus of Abyssinia had sent many shopkeepers with cargo of ivory, gold and sell it to civet in a Muslim country, and these dealers had sold everything and had come up to Aden and up to Mokalla or Makalla 'and now wanted to return to their country. But Iman had knowledge of what had them killed all, and he took them all they had. The tribes Somali Gica requests were on the street, and were very well armed and content for received gifts. The Abermagadli came the first of all, with their leader Akmed Gurei.

The Iman ordered accampassero in the country of Seem, and other tribes. He wanted them to stop in Harrar. The tribe of Merrean with his Chief Erabo greatly delayed his coming, and then 1 'Iman sent a courier to urge it. The head Erabo did start his tribe composed of 700 people on foot and 60 horse, but remained egh in their own territory. . "All this mass of people began to march towards Abyssinia, creating a huge mess in the street. each tribe . He had its own flag. Also he left the 'Iman and brought with him the'He also writes Mocòla, very important market in the Arab region of Hadramut or Hadramat.

So with further research I came upon the French version (Histoire de la conquète de l'Abyssinie, XVIe siècle

by 'Arabfaqīh, Aḥmad ibn 'abd al-Qādir, fl. 1543; Basset, René, 1855-1924 Published 1897 )
https://archive.org/details/histoiredelacon00bassgoog
and the nickname Gurey is also never applied to the Imam, it was again applied to the leader of the Habar Magaadle.


The below is a rough translation of the French by google translate :

12 HISTORY OF THE CONQUEST OF ABYSSINIE
Two messengers came to announce the arrival of Imam
Somali tribes and said, No one heard read your letter,
without eagerly obey God Most High; were answered
your call; we made many preparations ° and equipment
coats of mail to several rows; the tribes follow
each other, the troops succeed the troops, the people
the peoples.

The first tribe that happened was that the Habr Magadi, with
its leader Ahmed bin Husain Gouraï es Somâli. encamped
in a place called Qacha, in the upper part of the
Harar3 Valley; they showed their weapons and equipment
ment and mounted their horses; there were horsemen, and
What riders! infantry, and what foot! Their arrival caused great joy to the Imam; they made their way with
him; he welcomed them, gave them clothes and
food, showed their respects and donned their chief Ahmad
Gouraï a beautiful dress. After them went Tribe
Girri who were headed Mattan b. 'Uthman b. Khaled
Somali-es; they did see their weapons and equipment,
mounted on horseback, carrying their bows slung and
presented to Ahmed: it sent them forth to

Now as it was stated and argued before many years around this forum ( with the ardent Kombo-legist like Warsame and others ) the preponderance of evidence suggest that what the Somalis call Axmed Guray and what the Amxaara call Axmed Grang are one and the same but not the Imaam persay . Now the question is how this historic confusion began , was the Imam a left handed to begin with? was it due to them sharing a same common name? or better yet did the original Arabic manuscript ever refered to the Imaam as either been left handed at all or applied the nick " Guery" to the Imam. As far as I know in the Arabic manuscript which I read through its English translations ( 2005) refered to Axmed Gurey Ibun Xuseen as Axmed Girri ( as in giraffe) also the author translated the tribe Geri Koombe as Girri Koombe , that's also raises another question , was it Geri or Gurey?

Now its been a long time since I read classical Arabic , the old Arabic version is in online, what is needed is for those of you who have a crisp grasp of classical Arabic to quote the Arabic version where Axmed Gurey is mentioned and the Imaam and also the tribe Girri , the last to see how the Arabic version spelled Geri the tribe and Gurey the habit.

This a link to the original Arabic manuscript:

https://archive.org/details/futalabashahorc00argoog

Also its obvious from all three translations the confusion of the Mareexaan clan , with Yippirs , the Mareexaan with the Habar Magaadle and the Yippirs with the Habar Magaadle and even the leader Ahmed Gurey in few occasions is assigned the wrong clan. This confusion is from the original Arabic . Hence the confusion of Nuur Ibn Mujaahid with Nuur Ibnu Xuseen . The later been the brother of Axmed Gurey and the former supposedly a nephew of the Imam who supposedly wed his widow.

In the Italian translation the Majeerteen clan is mentioned:

Translations Page 24.

The Iman Akmed, mounted on horseback, ran before the file

of her and she prayed for God to give them patience and luck, and

he sent forth between the rows because the songsters incite to Combat

chin. He called his nephew with many "other leaders and delivered unto them

all the tribe of Harla with other tribes, placing them on the starboard side;

He puts the Somalis to the left under the command of Akmed Curi; he

the same was held at the center, having under him the whole people, and

choice courageous and 500 soldiers to guard his person. The sun was

Digia very high: the number of horses of the Muslims was 5 ^ 0

and soldiers on foot 1 2000; to the left were the Migiurtini and the

Somali Harla and Maid in number of 300, very good for

wield the sword; 400 were armed with arrows and had ordine to

pull from a standstill; the tribe of Ghiri had a lot of cavalry.

L 'Iman ordered to stand up quietly and then began to pray:

the same Kadi stepped off the mule and took sword and shield. a

Aììisa, famous for its strength, when he had seen the Christians,

He could not wait any longer, and two men had to hold it with

force but also the whole of Harla people were furious as Amsa.

Christians were divided into seven distributions, and their leader was king

Unassegged: he was with 400 soldiers and 400 left to right:

but for combat he ordered its 800 soldiers went

gU with others, and distributed Egyptian swords and iron armor. There

seventh part of the Christians was equal to any number of do muscles

lims: as an ox red leather, which has on one side a one white spot.

The Majeerteen were not mentioned in the original text, the Italian translator arbitraly added " majeerteen" as the people of Maydh. This might disappoint out Kumbo nemesis but this is interesting fact. Also the tribe of Harti is questionable and one should check the original version if such tribe was mentioned also.


I would have posted all the relevant pages of both translations , but stupid somalinet forum doesn't allow more then 5 urls. I will post all relevant pages on the next post.

This is really intresting sxb is there any sources that i could read a bout nur ibn hussein ill appreciate it highly , thanks

[MidriGeez]

late to the Party but Ahmed Gragn was actually originally From today Eritrea, here is My reasons.

1) he was called belew by the Ethiopians but not his generals and most of his troops who were mostly somali, Only him was called belew, belew was the name Ethiopians habesh called the people from Eritrea exclusively. The word Belew comes from belew kelew who is the forefathers of the Tigrigna/Tigre/ and some Saho clans Living in Eritrea who first arrived in Eritrea around 2000-1000 BC among many waves. they understood to come from the Himyarite kingdom of north yemen/ south arabia. When that bastard King Yohannes went on a killing rampage against Eritreans ( mostly Muslims ) he called them Belew as well. Read my last point to see why Ahmed Gragn was called Belew by the ethiopians.

2) At that time when he invaded habesh land and destroyed Axum he refused to cross the mereb river into the kingdom of Midri Bahri inside what is Eritrea today, when asked by his Somali general why not proceed as they also have christian population Ahmed Gragn responded by saying we can't attack the host of the sahaba as the prophet said not to attack them if they do not bother you.

3) When Ahmed Gragn was attacking Tigray, Eritrea was still under the Beja-Afar Confederacy which lasted for over a thousand years. The Kingdoms were The Afar sultanate ( Afars ) + Adulis Kingdom ( Saho ) + Midri Bahri ( Tigrigna + Tigre ) + Bazin Kingdom ( Beja + Kunama ) + Belgin Kingdom ( Tigre beni amer ) stretching from south east Egypt till Djbouti. Near the end of the Confederacy the Adulis Kingdom was abosrbed between the Afar sultanate and the Belgin Tigre Kingdom.

4) Now Guess where Ahmed Gragn Grandfather was born before his father/grandfather Migrated south to what was the Adal Kingdom? Yep you guessed right he was born Near Zula ( some say close to T'io ) where at that time the zula peninsula was mostly populated by arab migrants who moved to the Eritrean coast, at that time Zula which was previously was under the Adulis kingdom was under the control of the Afar sultanate which is why the Afar claim him, There are really 3 possibility about the origin of Ahmed Gragn before his father/grandfather migrated south from the Zula area, Either Afar Or Tigre Or Arab ( Jeberti ) who might have mixed with local Zula population which was the norm those days. The Ethiopians knew his origin that is way the only called him belew, you would never hear the ethiopians call somali or oromo or Harari etc a belew.