Is Somalinimo just a myth?

[sahal80]

Somalinimo is fake though..

When they were rallying for Cali Samatar in Minnesota and during his burial in Mogadishu I think the word was mentioned 50 times and this is a man who oversaw state terrorism and murder.

How is tolnimo and Somalinimo the same thing? There's no code of conduct for Somalinimo, it's abstract and cannot compete with something so real as Tol.

your points are great but i dont get why you guys like to bring up so much from the past. SFG is basd on reconciliation mainly between two clans, ali samatar is attributed to one of them just like moorgan who lives now in garowe. Do you think ahmed madobe would have attended his funeral from kismayo if he was belonging to another clan? They present their clans

State funeral for goobaale despite being hated by some clans
http://www.raxanreeb.com/2016/09/madaxw ... gobsalaad/

We r like that .

I brought it up because it's a contradiction.

Waa laba shay oo iska soo horjeeda, Somaliduna fahanku kuma yaree way is yeelyeeleyaan.

I cannot preach Somalinimo and then bury a Somali war criminal. It's ridiculous!

I know what you saying but let me put it this way for you: Suppose isaaq joined the SFG they don't have to celebrate about who they see as criminals. Yeey had state funeral and he is the one who used the ethiopians against xamar people. The people who celebrated cali samatar belong to the same clan. In reality It only concerns certain group so who cares about their damiir. It means we just share a govt and see this as some thing from the past.

The man who burned baledweyne-muxiyadiin ina sayid- is now JL army commander!

[Xildiiid]

^
But it's wrong sxb can't you see that?

[sahal80]

^
But it's wrong sxb can't you see that?

of course. I never give likes/thumps up to such guys like samatar but at the end of the day they represent their clans.

[GalliumerianSlayer]

Samatar, Aideed, Barre and Yusuf are all dead, let Allah judge them accordingly to their sins.

Morgan's still alive and HAS yet to be detained... Cali Mahdi is still alive and so other warlords/criminals.

[Khalid Ali]

I dont get it didnt Hawiye win the war over the afweyne regime why celebrate the dead remnants of the regime. Because of the SFG isn the SFG a new dawn a new generation a new era. WHEN U celebrate the likes of Samatar u kinda agree that the regime was a Somali regime and their leaders deserve a state burial something strange is going on Mogadishu

[gurey25]

I dont get it didnt Hawiye win the war over the afweyne regime why celebrate the dead remnants of the regime. Because of the SFG isn the SFG a new dawn a new generation a new era. WHEN U celebrate the likes of Samatar u kinda agree that the regime was a Somali regime and their leaders deserve a state burial something strange is going on Mogadishu

This i agree with.
If you give figure of the previous regime a state burial, you are accepting the legitimacy of the old regime.
You are stating that you committed treason for rebelling against your rightful government.
They should go further and return the booli qaraan to members of the regime, and compensation for crimes committed.

[Raganimo]

^that's not how reconciliation works. Daarood are not crying about Hawiye warlords who murdered civilians, why should Hawiye make a fuss about Daarood generals and warlords?

[Khalid Ali]

thats not reconciliation thats admiting those that fought the old regime were traitors how come state burial was given to maxammad dhere. this is just weird its like the tplf allowing general giorgis who commited allot of crimes against the people of tigray and eritrea to be given a state burial next meles zenawi.. andm amhara party asked for a burial the tplf said if we allow that its like we pissing on the graves of those he fought and killed they said take the body bury him in shewa with his close relatives ethiopian national tv did not even mention his death nor his burial.


not sure whats going on in Mogadishu

[smartyt]

thats not reconciliation thats admiting those that fought the old regime were traitors how come state burial was given to maxammad dhere. this is just weird its like the tplf allowing general giorgis who commited allot of crimes against the people of tigray and eritrea to be given a state burial next meles zenawi.. andm amhara party asked for a burial the tplf said if we allow that its like we pissing on the graves of those he fought and killed they said take the body bury him in shewa with his close relatives ethiopian national tv did not even mention his death nor his burial.


not sure whats going on in Mogadishu

What happend is 3 decades this is not 1989 Hawiyie has nostalgia for the kacaan there is this former USC fighter in my town I often speak politics with he says with deep sad honest voice if he could get another chance he will not had joined the rebels this is because the living hell that changed the government made people forgive the kacaan for mistakes of the late 80s the late 80s in Beenadir was paradise compared with the 90s where rapists and thugs were running the streets of Xamar even a former wabaari singer who in 1991 turned into a USC singer and was a burning moral boost for the USC the singer few years ago he asked the kacaan forgiveness for his stupidity in 1991

[gurey25]

^that's not how reconciliation works. Daarood are not crying about Hawiye warlords who murdered civilians, why should Hawiye make a fuss about Daarood generals and warlords?

Thats not reconciliation, its just stupidity.
If there is real reconciliation, then nobody involved in crimes during the civil war can have a state burial,
no hawiye, no darood.

[TheMightyNomad]

Tol precedes the idea of clan and its manifestation in the Horn of Africa.

Somalinimo is not a synonym for Somali. We don't need a synonym for Somali.

Somalinimo does not transcend qabiil. Afweyne was preaching Somalinimo when he was destroying Hargeysa, the current president of the AMISOM trusteeship is preaching Somalinimo while being complicit in the war against the native communities in the interriverine area so that 'federal states' can be formed in the name of Somalinimo.

That term is nothing but crocodile tears and sinister plans mashed together.

I call it Daroogo/Walaweyn munaafaqnimo.

Tol is just another word for clan or nation or locality(nothing more than that). One could say that Somalinimo is similar to tolnimo just around Being Somali. Wether it is an old or recent construction doesn't take away the fact it was constructed out of the Self-determination of somali people.

Somalinimo is a concept that hugs clan identity and ethnic identity.Because being ISaaq,Darood,Hawiye,Raxanweyn,Gabooye and Dir is part of the parcel of being Somali. Somalinimo articulates the social-cultural-political reality of Somali people. (i.e Somali solidarity).

I see the fact that you bring up Afweyne's injustice and Political puppets in mogadishu as if their actions are a reflection on the concept of Soomaalinimo. . Any system, whether we call it religion, politics, ideological, can be hijacked for any objective the power-broker desires—good or bad.

You wouldn't say the Islamic concept of ''Ummah'' is bad and divisive just because ISIS blows up muslims, would you? Or just because United States bombs people in the name of democracy, does it mean democracy is a false system? We must deal with the root, the general ignorance that allows people to be manipulated in these ways. Because most will agree that those who control power use Soomaalinimo & Qolo(Clan) in a scapegoat capacity.

[Xildiiid]

There's no such thing as an "ummah". Arabs use the 'ummah' card to brainwash and Arabize non Arab Muslims.

Tol is a term that's cemented in our history and our everyday life. When was Somalinimo coined?

To give you the answer, it was during the colonial era.

[TheMightyNomad]

There's no such thing as an "ummah". Arabs use to the 'ummah' card to brainwash and Arabize non Arab Muslims.

''Ummah'' is a concept like any concept,ideology,religion,politics etc.. Which can be hijacked for any objective the power-broker desires—good or bad. Power struggles are common to all areas of human activity and Islam is no different. While America was expanding democracy it was also expanding capitalism and Americanism.

So just because United States bombs people in the name of democracy, doesn't mean democracy is a false system We must deal with the root, the general ignorance that allows people to be manipulated in these ways. Instead of scapegoating the agents at play,

Tol is a term that's cemented in our history and our everyday life. When was Somalinimo coined?
To give you the answer, it was during the colonial era.

Under what time-frame it was constructed is generally irrelevant, it does not take away from the fact that it was constructed out of Self-determination.

Meaning Somali people as self-determined people coined it to articulate their social-political-cultural reality as a reaction to external agression. To pepetuate Somali solidarity and unity around common shared empirical realities and interests.

[Xildiiid]

Maybe realities and emotions but not interest...

Somalinimo existed as a sociopolitical reality. The peoples emotional cry for freedom in the occupied territories vs a political machine using this emotional outcry in order to mobilize Somali nomads and urban dwellers for their own goals and ambitions.

Somalinimo is still used in this context, just look at the song released by some group in London on the current Somali maritime dispute rallying on behalf of the SFG. The difference is that Somalis live in a modern world today and therefore not susceptible to the same intense propaganda like the Somalis were during the Cold War.

Unfortunagely by the looks of the poll, the majority of Somalis in here are brainwashed

Tol is part of the social fabric unlike Somalinimo. You are protected by the Tol and in return you pay money to the Tol, kinda like a protection racket, it's just that everyone is part of it on equal terms. You may not accept the reality but Somalinimo by today's standard is nothing but a Cold War slogan.

Galliumerianslayer,

I appreciate history and the Ajuuraan empire is just a small passage in the recorded history of humanity, nonetheless I appreciate and admire their achievements.

[TheMightyNomad]

Xidiiid

Somalinimo is based around interests & reality not emotion. It was construction around commuting foreign driven external aggression by perpetuating solidarity and unity around the reality social cultural and political reality of ''Being Somali'' against Western Imperialism.

I am starting to think you don't even understand what ''Self-determination'' means to begin with.
Definition:

1. determination by oneself or itself, without outside influence.
2.
the determining by the people of the form their government shall have, without reference to the wishes of any other nation, especially by people of a territory or former colony.

self-determination refers to the characteristic of people that leads them to make choices and decisions based on their own preferences and interests, to monitor and regulate their own actions and to be goal-oriented and self-directing.

The only context it has ever been used and always will been used in. Is the context of ''Self-determination''. The right of somali people to determine their own destiny. To determine the culture,opinions and systems etc that define them. The right for Somalis to govern themselves and co-exist harmoniously together.

The concept will never be defined by oppurtunists who hijack it to carry out the wrong doings, but by its inherent definition

Dont pretend your stance is based on reasoning or rational. It is based on emotions like emnity, distrust and denial of Somali peoples right to be self-determined people.