SomaliNet Forums

Itrah wrote:

Togdeer wrote:Not true. Somalis in Europe class them selves as Somalis. Not Habashi, not black and not african. We may be black by colour but we are completly different people. And somalis get more respect than other black people. We all know Somalis are at the bottom of the food chain, but somalis get more respect than normal black, even though somalis hardly contribute to society. But then again somalis are stubben, and very difficult to control.

With associate, I meant with whom they socialize and find similarities with. Not their identity.

Most Somalis associate with other somalis. Only a very small minority associate with blacks.

Togdeer wrote: Most Somalis associate with other somalis. Only a very small minority associate with blacks.

Yeah, but when they do, it's usually Ethiopians, Eritreans or sometimes muslim Africans.

Very rarely do they associate with Westernized New World Blacks like Afro-Caribbeans etc. Most avoid them like the plague. Somali parents even tell their children not to hang out with Afro-Carribean kids because of their rotten culture.

AbdiJohnson wrote:Mailman, the man who claims to be religious is emphasizing the point that Somalis are not related to the Bantu as if he is trash or something

Disgusting hypocrites

I am,

Abdi "I thought you were all the children of Adam" Johnson

I am not an Arab nor am I an Indian either. Yet you don't get incensed over that. Me claiming I'm not Bantu doesn't mean I hate them. That's what's wrong with you.

Get the fuck outta my face warya, you sound deluded.

TheMailMan wrote:MaliPrince, you sound a little crazy here.

Again, the vast majority of Somalis do not live in America, and are thus not bound by American social standards on race. We don't give a fock what the American society thinks we Somalis are. I know who I am. I am a Somali and I'm proud of my heritage.

BTW Itrah you don't seem to understand here that I largely agree with you.

Again, I repeat: Somalis are not related to Bantus whatsoever. We come under a different category and have nothing to do with these West Africans or South African Bantus. And we aren't related at all genetically to the Afro-Americans or Jamaicans either. Nothing in common with them except skin-color. That's it.

look walaal. you might be right about Somalis in Africa. I don't live there. but I'm right about Somalis in America. so what does that tell you? It tells me RACE is not real. its not some blood test. Its based on the society you live in. You are right that Somalis in Kenya for example are looked at as a different race than the Bantu. However, that doesn't make it UNIVERSAL. that was my only point. In America and Canada (places I've lived), we are most definitely looked at and treated by whites as no different than African-Americans and Jamicians. particularly when it comes to the police.

and you are wrong about Somalis having "no relation" to the Bantus. we both share a common ancestor 30,000 years ago. you can dismiss that all you want but the reality is they are closer to us GENETICALLY than the Europeans, Asians, and Arabs. Like you estutely pointed out, the only non-cushitic groups more closesly related to us than the bantu GENETICALLY are the berbers, some southern europeans, and some nilotic speakers (like the Masai and Samburu).

so what does this all mean? to me NOTHING. just like the Andamense look black and have asian genetics. some europeans look black but share african genetics. or some africans look black but share europeans genetics. if anything it shows that genetics has little to do with what most people regard as race.

Togdeer wrote:

Itrah wrote:

Togdeer wrote:Not true. Somalis in Europe class them selves as Somalis. Not Habashi, not black and not african. We may be black by colour but we are completly different people. And somalis get more respect than other black people. We all know Somalis are at the bottom of the food chain, but somalis get more respect than normal black, even though somalis hardly contribute to society. But then again somalis are stubben, and very difficult to control.

With associate, I meant with whom they socialize and find similarities with. Not their identity.

Most Somalis associate with other somalis. Only a very small minority associate with blacks.

Exactly. This is something MaliPrince just refuses to understand. We Somalis have nothing to do with these Madow people.

Infact, the Somalis I know ALL prefer the company of Pakis and Arabs than we do with Madow people.

AbdiJohnson wrote:Mailman, the man who claims to be religious is emphasizing the point that Somalis are not related to the Bantu as if he is trash or something

Disgusting hypocrites

I am,

Abdi "I thought you were all the children of Adam" Johnson

co-sign. you can't really claim to be a muslim and be racist or hate the bantu. but then again, you can't really be muslim and hate other clans but somalis have always done that.

all it shows is that there are very few true muslims in this world. the majority are just kaffirs claiming to be muslim.

Itrah wrote:

Togdeer wrote: Most Somalis associate with other somalis. Only a very small minority associate with blacks.

Yeah, but when they do, it's usually Ethiopians, Eritreans or sometimes muslim Africans.

Very rarely do they associate with Westernized New World Blacks like Afro-Caribbeans etc. Most avoid them like the plague. Somali parents even tell their children not to hang out with Afro-Carribean kids because of their rotten culture.

Somalis in the UK hate ethiopians, ethiopians associate with other blacks. Somalis either keep themselves to themselves or they socialise with other muslims such as pakis, arabs and other muslims. There might be 1 or 2 black muslims.
Eritreans are OK, as long as they are muslim.

I'm only interested in why you lot are so offended by being called "black."

We understand that it is a social construct imposed on people with the highest concentration of melanin. Once you start including dark asians into the fold it starts to get confusing.

You have the right to accept or reject/resist a label other people attempt to stick on you. To be combatant is a Somali thing. However, the countervailing opinion from outsiders is that you are black. Albeit black is not a culture, ethnicity or phenotype.

People might notice that you look 'distinct' inspite of your dark pigment, and people might attempt to confuse you illustrating that you look 'black', but no you are not, but yes you are. Other people can't tell anyone with a similar hue apart. Bad eyes I guess.

Truthfully if you don't ever want to be called black anymore - increase your numbers and your GDP. When you have power, you have the power to create your own labels and make others use them too.

It also appears as though having panafrican leanings like MaliPrince means you want to copulate with anything African just because they are a part of the E haplogroup. That couldn't be further from the truth. You people seem to have irrational fears of being "wiped out." Get a grip.

For goodness sake. You don't have to ally yourself with other Africans if you don't want to, or denigrate them either. Similarly you don't have to ally yourself with non-Somalis either. To be Somali is to think of yourself as better than all non-Somalis and each other.

TheMailMan wrote:I'm sick of seeing Somalis define themselves according to how White Americans define "Blacks" and "Whites"....it makes no scientific sense at all. The races of Africa are as different as they could get, yet somehow we have Somalis defining themselves using American standards.

The vast majority of Somalis haven't set one foot in the Western World, yet we define ourselves by their standards. We are Cushites. We aren't like these Bantus nor are we Arab nor are we Indians.

How is that so difficult to understand?

talk about being a hypocrite. you claim to want to define us by our standards then use the word CUSHITE which was created by some europeans anthropologists. fukk outta here. there ain't more than 10 somalis in somalia you could find that even know what that word means. now you claiming it makes us who we are.

Togdeer wrote:Somalis in the UK hate ethiopians, ethiopians associate with other blacks. Somalis either keep themselves to themselves or they socialise with other muslims such as pakis, arabs and other muslims. There might be 1 or 2 black muslims.
Eritreans are OK, as long as they are muslim.

I grew up in Germany and the Habesha community is slightly larger than the Somali community here. So, maybe the dynamics are different. Most get along fine and tend to be friends even. I even have a couple of cousins married to German Habeshas.

Here in the UK we have our own separate identity and we tick that box. It's not black but Somali.

I think the problem is that some blacks are ashamed of being associated with their parents country and would rather be labeled a colour than the said country. With Somalis it's different because for one Somalis cannot just blend in with other blacks and two, the are some proud mofokers who would be offended to be labeled anything but Somali.

You don't see Pakistanis accepting browns or Chinese accepting yellows or even European whites being revered to as whites.

TheMailMan wrote:

Togdeer wrote:

Itrah wrote: Most Somalis associate with other somalis. Only a very small minority associate with blacks.

Exactly. This is something MaliPrince just refuses to understand. We Somalis have nothing to do with these Madow people.

Infact, the Somalis I know ALL prefer the company of Pakis and Arabs than we do with Madow people.

and there are Somalis I know who prefer the company of non-Somalis to Somalis. most of them are very successful people in the west. and the advice I got was the less you associate with other somalis the better off you will be. does that make them not somali?

the difference between me and you, is that I'm not a racist. while you are. I don't whole-heartedly discriminate.

Togdeer wrote:

Itrah wrote:

Togdeer wrote: Most Somalis associate with other somalis. Only a very small minority associate with blacks.

Yeah, but when they do, it's usually Ethiopians, Eritreans or sometimes muslim Africans.

Very rarely do they associate with Westernized New World Blacks like Afro-Caribbeans etc. Most avoid them like the plague. Somali parents even tell their children not to hang out with Afro-Carribean kids because of their rotten culture.

Somalis in the UK hate ethiopians, ethiopians associate with other blacks. Somalis either keep themselves to themselves or they socialise with other muslims such as pakis, arabs and other muslims. There might be 1 or 2 black muslims.
Eritreans are OK, as long as they are muslim.

Somalis also hate one another and associate with their clans. I don't think the bigotry of Somalis has much to do with how the rest of the world views us.

MaliPrince wrote:

TheMailMan wrote:MaliPrince, you sound a little crazy here.

Again, the vast majority of Somalis do not live in America, and are thus not bound by American social standards on race. We don't give a fock what the American society thinks we Somalis are. I know who I am. I am a Somali and I'm proud of my heritage.

BTW Itrah you don't seem to understand here that I largely agree with you.

Again, I repeat: Somalis are not related to Bantus whatsoever. We come under a different category and have nothing to do with these West Africans or South African Bantus. And we aren't related at all genetically to the Afro-Americans or Jamaicans either. Nothing in common with them except skin-color. That's it.

look walaal. you might be right about Somalis in Africa. I don't live there. but I'm right about Somalis in America. so what does that tell you? It tells me RACE is not real. its not some blood test. Its based on the society you live in. You are right that Somalis in Kenya for example are looked at as a different race than the Bantu. However, that doesn't make it UNIVERSAL. that was my only point. In America and Canada (places I've lived), we are most definitely looked at and treated by whites as no different than African-Americans and Jamicians. particularly when it comes to the police.

and you are wrong about Somalis having "no relation" to the Bantus. we both share a common ancestor 30,000 years ago. you can dismiss that all you want but the reality is they are closer to us GENETICALLY than the Europeans, Asians, and Arabs. Like you estutely pointed out, the only non-cushitic groups more closesly related to us than the bantu GENETICALLY are the berbers, some southern europeans, and some nilotic speakers (like the Masai and Samburu).

so what does this all mean? to me NOTHING. just like the Andamense look black and have asian genetics. some europeans look black but share african genetics. or some africans look black but share europeans genetics. if anything it shows that genetics has little to do with what most people regard as race.

Okay so you agree with me that Somalis are of a different race than the Bantus, especially when viewed within East Africa. Fine, I agree with you and it is 100% true.

But you're talking about America here. The same country which confuses Sikhs with Muslims. There have been stories of Punjabi Sikhs being KILLED because they're confused with being Arab Muslims. Even though the Sikhs were neither Arab nor Muslim, they were still targeted. Does that mean they're the same as the Arabs? Its a bullshit argument. I Dont care what a White Redneck Cop thinks of me. He might incorrectly view me as "Black"....but that doesn't affect how I view myself as a Somali. And I advise ALL my Somali brothers to avoid partaking in Madow culture or associating themselves with these morally corrupt people. It will only bring crime and degeneracy within our lives. We Dont need to get involved with Madow thugs, who get involved in robberies ane homicides at a MUCH HIGHER RATE when compared to other racial groups. We are Somalis. We are not them. We are better than that.

Again with that 30,000 year old ancestor argument! I've already addressed this!

sophisticate wrote: I'm only interested in why you lot are so offended by being called "black."

We understand that it is a social construct imposed on people with the highest concentration of melanin. Once you start including dark asians into the fold it starts to get confusing.

You have the right to accept or reject/resist a label other people attempt to stick on you. To be combatant is a Somali thing. However, the countervailing opinion from outsiders is that you are black. Albeit black is not a culture, ethnicity or phenotype.

People might notice that you look 'distinct' inspite of your dark pigment, and people might attempt to confuse you illustrating that you look 'black', but no you are not, but yes you are. Other people can't tell anyone with a similar hue apart. Bad eyes I guess.

Truthfully if you don't ever want to be called black anymore - increase your numbers and your GDP. When you have power, you have the power to create your own labels and make others use them too.

It also appears as though having panafrican leanings like MaliPrince means you want to copulate with anything African just because they are a part of the E haplogroup. That couldn't be further from the truth. You people seem to have irrational fears of being "wiped out." Get a grip.

For goodness sake. You don't have to ally yourself with other Africans if you don't want to, or denigrate them either. Similarly you don't have to ally yourself with non-Somalis either. To be Somali is to think of yourself as better than all non-Somalis and each other.

you guys are so fukkin wierd here. I don't care whether or not someone calls me black. I just find it IRRATIONAL to fight social classifications that are MADE UP.

just like I'm not gonna trip if I go to Kenya and the bantu say I'm not black, I'm don't get swayed by the white man in America calling me black. to me it doesn't matter either way because race is NOT REAL. its just some shit we make up as humans.