Luq-Ganane come in here...

[Somaliweyn]

You bring in I.M Lewis as evidence? We all know him, and also how reliable are ''elections'' in Africa Is that the only evidence you got, 11.000 people from Garbahareey that moved to Lugh Ganane proves it was owned by them?

Did you know that in Beledweyne, there was once a large HG (mainly Sacad) population? Was above 11.000 yet you don't see them claiming the city.

I can show you historical data of the towns of Lugh Ganane, how the name came in being, how it was a comercial hub and how it was inhabited by Raxanweyn and was owned by them.

Lugh: Emporio commerciale sul Giuba. Memorie e note di Ugo
Ferrandi by Ugo Ferrandi (1903)

Review of it in: The Geographical Journal, Vol. 23, No. 2. (Feb., 1904), p. 248.


There it says:

''As is well known, the place, which has been for some time one of the chief centres of
trade for Southern Somaliland, is placed in a strong position on the neck of land
formed by a circuitous bend of the Jub (here generally known as the Ganana), a
large part of the included space being occupied by native cultivation, though
much of the grain that is sold in the market of Lugh comes from the red or black
soil regions to the east (cf. Journal, xxi. p. 1G8, where further notes by Captain
Ferrandi on the country between Lugh and the coastwill be found). The village of
Lugh (of the types of houses in which a full description is given) does not differ
essentially from other agricultural villages of the Rahanwin, and is smaller in
extent than Bardera, though its commercial importance is greater.''

''In the third chapter notes are given on the natives of this part of Somaliland
(the Rahanwin), who differ essentially from those of the more northern regions.
They belong to a group which is sometimes designated as "Sabb," in contradistinction
to the pure Somalis, who look down upon them as an inferior race.

Also read Mogadishu in the Ninetheenth century, there Lugh and Baardheere are also mentioned.

[Luq_Ganane]

,SomaliWeyn, to say that Marehans have been in Gedo since the beginning of time is silly, lakin to say Marehan entered Bardhere and Luq or any other city they inhabit in Gedo AFTER the civil war is just plain absurd. My maternal Grandfather (Aun) left Mudug when he was very young, but grew up in Bardhere, and my maternal Grandfather's buried in Luq. The first Marehans came to that region 1850 marka yes there were people living in that area before, lakin Elay wasn't there in sizable numbers and the few that lived in Gedo were left alone and we lived in peace. The people we took Gedo from by force, were the Galla, Booraan and several other groups, some of them non-muslim even. All this said, I see that your here trying to pin Somalis ancient nomadic ways against Marehan, for displacement that may or may not have happend GENERATIONS ago. The only "Land grab" Marehan made after the civil war was the Lower jubba region, and Inshallah wer're there to stay too. Marka what exactly is your point in all of this?

[kambuli]

Alla Somaalida Somalinet qabyaalad badanaa.... Bal arka inta ka jawaabtay!

I didn't even have to read the topic...Just the replies....

Somaalida IImaankii baa ka tegey eh, kuligeen Kismayo ayaa inaga badan...

[DawladSade]

kambuli hal beel weeye kuwa soo xoomay sida shinni malab aragtay


Somaliweyn, maybe you dont understand me dude but this issue is so unimportant to me it is not even worthy to debate about, according to what you brought marehan came to luuq in 1974 and i gave you direct evidence of luuq's (not civilian votes) the electoral votes going for the mareehan union in 1956, this is not anything to debate about, luuq is not debateble no more who whines kiddo

[Somaliweyn]

Where did I mentioned 1974? But thanks for reminding me the period when the Land Act etc was designed.

Lets get few facts straight,

- This whole ''Gedo'' province was created during Barre's regime.
- Before that, it was British Jubbaland which comprised Lower Jubba plus Upper Jubba with the river Juba been the border between Italian side and British side.

Garbahareey was a distinctive Marehan deegan, from there on a wave of landexpansion occured with many people from Garbahaarey flocking into Luuq, Baardheere etc.

When Barre came into power, he legitimized this immigration from Garbahareey to Baardheere, by renaming Upper Jubba to Gedo and then incorporating not only Baardheere but even Luuq to this new province.

I am just stating facts, historical facts to be precise.

I suggest you update the history blog and incorporate this dark side too

[1_londoner]

i feel sorry for your topic.

[DawladSade]

[quote="Somaliweyn"]Where did I mentioned 1974? But thanks for reminding me the period when the Land Act etc was designed.

Lets get few facts straight,

- This whole ''Gedo'' province was created during Barre's regime.
- Before that, it was British Jubbaland which comprised Lower Jubba plus Upper Jubba with the river Juba been the border between Italian side and British side.

Garbahareey was a distinctive Marehan deegan, from there on a wave of landexpansion occured with many people from Garbahaarey flocking into Luuq, Baardheere etc.

When Barre came into power, he legitimized this immigration from Garbahareey to Baardheere, by renaming Upper Jubba to Gedo and then incorporating not only Baardheere but even Luuq to this new province.

I am just stating facts, historical facts to be precise.

I suggest you update the history blog and incorporate this dark side too [/quote]

If you checked our blog we would not be having this conversation dude. I told you Luuq iyo waxaas is not debateble and I am only saying that because it is a waste of my time when it has already been talked about and the necessary information brought.

As for the breaking up of Alta Jubba, Siad Barre did it the same reason Nugaal was broken up from Bari (or "Majeerteenya") or Galgaduud was broken up from Mudug or Awdal was broken up from Waqooyi Galbeed..all that was done for administrative purposes so it can be easily and efficiently run. Get out of here with your juvenile arguments.

[Somaliweyn]

''all that was done for administrative purposes so it can be easily and efficiently run''

So its efficient way for the smallest province of Somalia to have the largest population and highest population density? Or the third largest province (Gedo) to be equal or less in population then for an average province like Middle Shebelle?

Lets see what Barre does:

-Mudug becomes two: Galgaduud and Mudug for no apparent reason just to break the unity and potential dominance of one subclan (HG).

-Benadir becomes three regions: Mogadishu (current Benadir), Middle Shebelle and Lower Shebelle, just to break unity and potential dominance of Mudulood subclan.

-Hiiraan becomes smaller in size, with some lands going to Bay and Bakool to make good the loss of Luuq and Baardheere to Gedo.

-Alter Jubba is renamed Gedo just to give Garbahreey folks more ''living space'' while isolating Luuq and Baardheere from the rest of Raxanweyn lands.

The same goes for regions created in the north from nothing (sool etc). But Northern affaires is not my field of expertise so I leave it to Reer Waqooyi folks.

the machiavellian Barre sure knew how to advance own subclan's interest while at the same time undermining the potential dangers coming from other subclans.

Reminds me of what Richard H. Shcultz, Jr wrote in his paper: ''State Disintegration and Ethnic Conflict: A Framework for Analysis (1995)''

''Thus, Siad Barre actually pursued a policy of
undermining the power of certain
clans while promoting that ofhis own
Marehan group and subclans allied
with it (mainly the Ogadeni and, to a
lesser extent, the Dolbuhanta).''

[Warsame101]

DS, why waste time with someone who claims that Bay & Bakool used to be part of the British Jubbaland.

[Advocatar]

exactly.............there's somethings that can be debated and somethings that cant.


and this is one of those.

[DawladSade]

Warsame I didn't even try to debate him. Isagaa ku qasbaye ninyaho.

[SummerRain]

Nac Nac badaana ninaamku.

Discuss problem solving for once!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Somaliweyn]

When they fail to debate historical records they resort to insults and putting words into my mouth: ''1974'' and ''someone who claims that Bay & Bakool used to be part of the British Jubbaland''

There was never a debate, it was you posting fictional history, and then me posting the other side of history then it became suddenly quite. No response but insults and cheap evasion tactics.

Case closed, lets move on shall we..

MODS, you can safely delete the topic now, case is closed

[qardasay]

Only native people (Bon, Ajuraan, Boran, Garre, Dagodiye) can claim Jubbaland. earlier darood immigranta arrived 17th and 18th century the Galjecel arrived in 19th century. Hawiye Stop your Jealousy you have no claim to Jubbland Rahanweyn is not a real Clan its Alliance of People that formed a tribe and daroods are included.