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eternauta wrote:

Grant wrote:Whatever you want to call them in a religious sense, I am disturbed that his tomb, his thinking, and his accomplishments in the philosophical battle with Christianity in East Africa were so disrespected by the agents of the ICU who held Barawe.

Are you saying the ICU disrespected his tomb in Barawe? Why are you, a deist, disturbed by it?

Eternauta,

You don't have to have any religious grounding at all to recognize disrespect. The dead deserve to lie at peace in the place they were left to rest. That does not change when religius attitudes change.

I feel the same way about the the Taliban and the destruction of the Buddhas of Bamyan. Those were cultural relics, highly significant heritage sites that had nothing whatsoever to do with Islam.

The Wahaabbis are destroying, or have destroyed, all the historic sites in Saudi Arabia. I consider it a great loss, an erasal of history, a denial of what was. It offends nearly all my sensitivities.

Grant wrote:Eternauta,

You don't have to have any religious grounding at all to recognize disrespect. The dead deserve to lie at peace in the place they were left to rest. That does not change when religius attitudes change.

I feel the same way about the the Taliban and the destruction of the Buddhas of Bamyan. Those were cultural relics, highly significant heritage sites that had nothing whatsoever to do with Islam.

The Wahaabbis are destroying, or have destroyed, all the historic sites in Saudi Arabia. I consider it a great loss, an erasal of history, a denial of what was. It offends nearly all my sensitivities.

But Grant, you don't even know where Uways al-Barawe's tomb is located. You have falsely accused the ICU of disrespecting a tomb in Barawe, when they didn't do such a thing. What's your aim of falsely accusing the ICU of such baseless and unfounded accusations?

Grant, AFAIK or as far as everyone knows, the ICU didn't remove a single tomb/grave. If otherwise, prove it. The ICU did forcibly discourage the practice of siyaaro, praying in a mosque where there's a tomb/grave or other bida's associated with Suufis. It seems to me, you have got an obfuscation like the one you got with the Hudud laws of Pakistan.

@ TAM

Shirib wrote:But I thought I once read or heard someone say it was okay to pray at a graveyard because it reminds u of death. Does anyone know if there is any truth to this.

You can not pray in a graveyard.

"Do not sit on graves, and do not pray towards them." (Narrated by Muslim, no. 972; Abu Dawood, no. 3229).

You might be confusing it with this hadith:

"Visit the graves, for they remind you of the Hereafter." (Narrated by Muslim, 976).

Xaaji_Xundjuf wrote:afcourse u pray at some one grave marka la aasayo ayaabaad ku tukkanaysayee
that would be haraam if it was realy haraam

2 weeks ago adeerkay baan soo aasay waanu ku dull tukkanay

The only prayer done at a graveyard is Janazah, which does not involve kneeling or bowing down. All other prayers are forbidden according to this hadith:

"May Allaah curse the Jews and the Christians, for they have taken the graves of their Prophets as places of worship." (Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 425; Muslim, 531).

Stop believing dead men can help you or protect you, Shirk is the biggest sin a Muslim can commit:

If a wali or Prophet dies, it is not correct, according to shareeah, to ask him to make duaa for you, because he has been cut off from this world. This is a kind of shirk which is not committed by any of the righteous people of this Ummah, the Sahaabah and those who follow them.

Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

"And who is more astray than one who calls on (invokes) besides Allah, such as will not answer him till the Day of Resurrection, and who are (even) unaware of their calls (invocations) to them? And when mankind are gathered (on the Day of Resurrection), they (false deities) will become their enemies and will deny their worshipping"
[al-Ahqaaf 46:5-6]

Repent!

It seems Grant has something in common with John McSenile. At least John McSenile got senator Lieberman.