Somalia and Somaliland talks fails and collapses,.THANK GOD!

[Khalid Ali]

I always wonder in 1960 the union went real fast like with in seconds why is it taking years to get to reach a final settlement , i mean if we could unite that fast if one sides lets go our separate ways, why do have to go to Turkey London Abu dhabi. Come lets sign the separation papers in hargeisa or mogadishu like we did in 1960.
The southerners there is no way they can revive a new union , but they can prolong the process of reaching a settlement. Which is bad for the overall future relationship between Somalia and Somaliland. Any way when and if the talks fail those who initiated these talks from the beginning, the ball will be in their court and they will be the one that have to answer when the talks collapse.

[sahal80]

I always wonder in 1960 the union went real fast like with in seconds why is it taking years to get to reach a final settlement , i mean if we could unite that fast if one sides lets go our separate ways, why do have to go to Turkey London Abu dhabi. Come lets sign the separation papers in hargeisa or mogadishu like we did in 1960.
The southerners there is no way they can revive a new union , but they can prolong the process of reaching a settlement. Which is bad for the overall future relationship between Somalia and Somaliland. Any way when and if the talks fail those who initiated these talks from the beginning, the ball will be in their court and they will be the one that have to answer when the talks collapse.

Things like the airspace are imposing themselves on all and its some thing that is out of the equation and the process that are going on. Now besides its being too early, each side has his own read lines, however, this file is local, unlike of the new deal its owned by the somali govt but because of somaliland being able to make some troubles for the world filights the somali govt is looking for to reach some deal with somaliland that won't reach its read lines.

Just like with the former jubaland, they want to overcome these troubles. The question is can they force somaliland through a diplomatic pressures? This is what the situation is about.

[Somali-Transporter]

I always wonder in 1960 the union went real fast like with in seconds why is it taking years to get to reach a final settlement , i mean if we could unite that fast if one sides lets go our separate ways, why do have to go to Turkey London Abu dhabi. Come lets sign the separation papers in hargeisa or mogadishu like we did in 1960.
The southerners there is no way they can revive a new union , but they can prolong the process of reaching a settlement. Which is bad for the overall future relationship between Somalia and Somaliland. Any way when and if the talks fail those who initiated these talks from the beginning, the ball will be in their court and they will be the one that have to answer when the talks collapse.

Things like the airspace are imposing themselves on all and its some thing that is out of the equation and the process that are going on. Now besides its being too early, each side has his own read lines, however, this file is local, unlike of the new deal its owned by the somali govt but because of somaliland being able to make some troubles for the world filights the somali govt is looking for to reach some deal with somaliland that won't reach its read lines.

Just like with the former jubaland, they want to overcome these troubles. The question is can they force somaliland through a diplomatic pressures? This is what the situation is about.

They should not Waste time on Somaliland which only owns 25% of the so called Somaliland.. they should tell them direct we can not accept this and if they deny it.. Just train and arm maakhir, khatummo, and awdal from djiibouti..

Work with Abdi illey to push from Jiijiga and also tell them to arrest those WHO flee...

Military action is the only solution... they will never let go this cursed flag and i respect that so let them fight for it..

Darood and Gudabiirsi must fight for there lands and they also want to fight for there lands.. if it is what it takes

[Khalid Ali]

inadeer sahal the airspace deal was atleast one of the most practical solutions the 2 sides agreed on, neither side has made a claim that the airspace deal is null and void Somaliland raised some concerns because the SFG in xamar didn't notify them about the airspace re integration into Somalia and Somaliland. They said that both sides should be present at the ceremony but the SFG went on its own with out the consent of SL. Now this could be just a symbolic gesture in which the 2 sides differed. How ever where to go from here is very critical. What Somalia and Somaliland dialogue lack is trust real honesty on both sides what they want to achieve from these talks, we can fly to turkey every few months but if we are not politically honest these talks will not go any where and they are destine to collapse. As for diplomatic pressure in what exactly on the Airspace u mean, they cant impose diplomatic pressure on SL because it has to come from a point of strength ofcourse they have some cards the SFG since they are the international recognized goverment for Somalia. But what will they do lobby to downgrade Somaliland status with in the new deal. Perhaps convince neighboring countries to stop their flights to Somaliland. Limit Somaliland students scholarships that kind of diplomatic pressure will not be affective because it will not hit Somaliland effectually it will just worsen the relations and create more hostilities. They can do a few things with the airspace but that it self could cause some problems for the UN and other humanitarian flights the Europeans do not want that , which will result to SL banning all UN flights coming to SL the Europeans want to avoid that . Somaliland and Somalia dialogue are much more difficult much more painful much more sensitive much more controversial than that of the Jubbaland , Jubbaland accepts to be part of Somalia and was under the hegonomy of a Foreign country , than there is allot to discuss, and than there is allot of room to discuss with in the framework of Somalia and Somalias constitution. The Somaliland case is much more difficult and i can understand the goverment in Somalia and what they worry about but from a political point of view regarding these talks it seems we have reached a dead lock and only i believe our friends in the international community can mediate between us to solve this we are unable to come to an agreement.

[sahal80]

inadeer sahal the airspace deal was atleast one of the most practical solutions the 2 sides agreed on, neither side has made a claim that the airspace deal is null and void Somaliland raised some concerns because the SFG in xamar didn't notify them about the airspace re integration into Somalia and Somaliland. They said that both sides should be present at the ceremony but the SFG went on its own with out the consent of SL. Now this could be just a symbolic gesture in which the 2 sides differed. How ever where to go from here is very critical. What Somalia and Somaliland dialogue lack is trust real honesty on both sides what they want to achieve from these talks, we can fly to turkey every few months but if we are not politically honest these talks will not go any where and they are destine to collapse. As for diplomatic pressure in what exactly on the Airspace u mean, they cant impose diplomatic pressure on SL because it has to come from a point of strength ofcourse they have some cards the SFG since they are the international recognized goverment for Somalia. But what will they do lobby to downgrade Somaliland status with in the new deal. Perhaps convince neighboring countries to stop their flights to Somaliland. Limit Somaliland students scholarships that kind of diplomatic pressure will not be affective because it will not hit Somaliland effectually it will just worsen the relations and create more hostilities. They can do a few things with the airspace but that it self could cause some problems for the UN and other humanitarian flights the Europeans do not want that , which will result to SL banning all UN flights coming to SL the Europeans want to avoid that . Somaliland and Somalia dialogue are much more difficult much more painful much more sensitive much more controversial than that of the Jubbaland , Jubbaland accepts to be part of Somalia and was under the hegonomy of a Foreign country , than there is allot to discuss, and than there is allot of room to discuss with in the framework of Somalia and Somalias constitution. The Somaliland case is much more difficult and i can understand the goverment in Somalia and what they worry about but from a political point of view regarding these talks it seems we have reached a dead lock and only i believe our friends in the international community can mediate between us to solve this we are unable to come to an agreement.

In my opinion, locally, somaliland file was easier than the jubaland file wich had connections with some contries besides its economical dimensions with the oil companies such us the french total oil until the govt has done a big structural change politically and economically with soma OiL&GAS replacing these companies. Secondly, somaliland was and is the last issue for this govt.

There is no foreing interests in somaliland or a country that is lobbying for somaliland even ethiopia sees somaliland the same way as the somali govt and was talking about nowadays of its borders with somaliland not being a save, who knows what could be the next besides the somali govt is backed by djibouti the ethiopias economical ally. here, somaliland may not be save from the UN and other foreing diplomatic pressures and we know the new american positions wich has ended their dual track policy towards somalia.

As for what you said about the two sides should be honest, allow me to disagree this because in the politics things are different, its about putting the other side in a weak position and spreading propaganda againist the other. I guess this is why hassan sheekh was saying he is expecting a unity withing this year!

Yes the somali govt will be too under pressure because of the UN flights not getting access to somaliland however, I guess it will depend on each sides prossure. The somali govt can say "we are one recognized nation" therefore no division but we can agree on a compromise below than that.

[Khalid Ali]

inadeer sahal the airspace deal was atleast one of the most practical solutions the 2 sides agreed on, neither side has made a claim that the airspace deal is null and void Somaliland raised some concerns because the SFG in xamar didn't notify them about the airspace re integration into Somalia and Somaliland. They said that both sides should be present at the ceremony but the SFG went on its own with out the consent of SL. Now this could be just a symbolic gesture in which the 2 sides differed. How ever where to go from here is very critical. What Somalia and Somaliland dialogue lack is trust real honesty on both sides what they want to achieve from these talks, we can fly to turkey every few months but if we are not politically honest these talks will not go any where and they are destine to collapse. As for diplomatic pressure in what exactly on the Airspace u mean, they cant impose diplomatic pressure on SL because it has to come from a point of strength ofcourse they have some cards the SFG since they are the international recognized goverment for Somalia. But what will they do lobby to downgrade Somaliland status with in the new deal. Perhaps convince neighboring countries to stop their flights to Somaliland. Limit Somaliland students scholarships that kind of diplomatic pressure will not be affective because it will not hit Somaliland effectually it will just worsen the relations and create more hostilities. They can do a few things with the airspace but that it self could cause some problems for the UN and other humanitarian flights the Europeans do not want that , which will result to SL banning all UN flights coming to SL the Europeans want to avoid that . Somaliland and Somalia dialogue are much more difficult much more painful much more sensitive much more controversial than that of the Jubbaland , Jubbaland accepts to be part of Somalia and was under the hegonomy of a Foreign country , than there is allot to discuss, and than there is allot of room to discuss with in the framework of Somalia and Somalias constitution. The Somaliland case is much more difficult and i can understand the goverment in Somalia and what they worry about but from a political point of view regarding these talks it seems we have reached a dead lock and only i believe our friends in the international community can mediate between us to solve this we are unable to come to an agreement.

In my opinion, locally, somaliland file was easier than the jubaland file wich had connections with some contries besides its economical dimensions with the oil companies such us the french total oil until the govt has done a big structural change politically and economically with soma OiL&GAS replacing these companies. Secondly, somaliland was and is the last issue for this govt.

There is no foreing interests in somaliland or a country that is lobbying for somaliland even ethiopia sees somaliland the same way as the somali govt and was talking about nowadays of its borders with somaliland not being a save, who knows what could be the next besides the somali govt is backed by djibouti the ethiopias economical ally. here, somaliland may not be save from the UN and other foreing diplomatic pressures and we know the new american positions wich has ended their dual track policy towards somalia.

As for what you said about the two sides should be honest, allow me to disagree this because in the politics things are different, its about putting the other side in a weak position and spreading propaganda againist the other. I guess this is why hassan sheekh was saying he is expecting a unity withing this year!

Yes the somali govt will be too under pressure because of the UN flights not getting access to somaliland however, I guess it will depend on each sides prossure. The somali govt can say "we are one recognized nation" therefore no division but we can agree on a compromise below than that.

I think when it comes to resources in the country there are various oil companies interested and have obtained licenses to explore in Somaliland, eventhough they are far apart in which we cannot make a comparison, because there were different interest on both sides. How ever the Jubbaland case was easy thats why the guarantors were Ethiopians despite the Kenyan involvement the foreign foot in it. The goverment stood their ground because they were discussing constitutional frameworks and the structure of a future Somalia, and because Jubbaland was a newly creation. A compromise was easily reached, with Somaliland from a political perspective there isn't much room constitutionally, the 2 sides have adopted separate ways of conducting affairs . Somaliland has a constitution that it needs to uphold which states that Somaliland independence is sacrosanct, this gives them a limited space in where they can discuss issues. Where as Somalia has a constitution in where it says that the Somali republics unity is inviolable and that Somalia indivisible. From pressure the dual track policy was adopted in 2011 before that there was no such thing the dual track policy has made little contribution to Somaliland. So i doubt the US though it recognized the New goverment in Somalia their support is merely diplomatic and political , there is still partly an arms embargo on Somalia. So i doubt that Somalia could use the the united states for diplomatic pressure on Somaliland. As for the Ethiopians they are just presenting themselves as very neutral very pro active towards both Somalia and Somaliland , the Ethiopians dont put all their eggs in one basket. The Ethiopians are being over charged by Djibouti they lose billions every year to Djiboutis leased ports , i dont think they will let their foreign policy be dictated by the Ciise waraabes in Djibouti. The Ethiopians prefer to use Berbera if it was possible to handle big exports and imports technologically. The talks have reached a dead lock and as you say its all about pressure and who has what it takes to sprint an extra mile diplomatically, i dont see a way forward if these talks are not mediated some how.