Somali Historians come in including you James Dahl

[XimanJaale]

Now Hawiya are eating eachother.

Why the fock you have to mention qabil in this thread? Typical eydoor

[Warabaha]

Now Hawiya are eating eachother.

Why the fock you have to mention qabil in this thread? Typical eydoor

You Hippocratic animal. No wonder your people eat warabaha

[Bilis]

The urheimat is most likely the Horn of Africa or North East Africa and most linguists including Christopher Ehret believe that the urheimat was HOA/North East Africa. It's only Militarev who believe that the urheimat is in the Levant but his approach to Afro-Asiatic languages have always had a Semitic bias, nonetheless we can all agree that the E1b1b has great affinity to Afro-Asiatic languages.

Alexander Militarev is actually a respected linguist. There are also many other linguists who support a Near East origin for the Afro-Asiatic family; Militarev is just the leading proponent. This as well is more often than not due to actual evidence (both linguistic and archaeological), not bias.

As Václav Blažek observes on the Cushitic substratum in the Modern South Arabian subgroup of Afro-Asiatic's Semitic branch:

"Having identified a Cushitic-like substratum in Modern South Arabian, Militarev (1984, 18-19; cf. also Belova 2003) proposes that Cushites originally lived throughout the Arabian Peninsula; thus they would be the original southern neighbors of the Semites, who then assimilated those Cushites who did not move into Ethiopia. This hypothesis is supported by Anati (1968, 180-84), who analyzed the rock art of Central Arabia. He connected the pictures of the ‘oval-headed’ people depicted with shields with the Arabian ‘Cushites’ from the Old Testament [Genesis 10.6-12; Isaiah 45.14] described also with specific shields [Jeremiah 46.9; Ezekiel 38.5]. The spread of Cushites in Africa is connected with the Rift Valley. In the coastal area of Eritrea and Djibouti, where the Rift enters into the African mainland, three archaic representatives of the North, Central (= Agaw) and Eastern branches of Cushitic appear: Beja, Bilin and Afar-Saho respectively. In this place the disintegration of Cushitic probably began. Ancestors of the Agaw spread in the north of Eritrea and Ethiopia, the Beja also in Sudan between the Nile and the Red Sea. Other East and South Cushitic languages moved southward along the Rift Valley through Ethiopia, Kenya, as far as Central Tanzania."

http://www.phil.muni.cz/jazyk/files/AAm ... nsCORR.pdf

[LiquidHYDROGEN]

The urheimat is most likely the Horn of Africa or North East Africa and most linguists including Christopher Ehret believe that the urheimat was HOA/North East Africa. It's only Militarev who believe that the urheimat is in the Levant but his approach to Afro-Asiatic languages have always had a Semitic bias, nonetheless we can all agree that the E1b1b has great affinity to Afro-Asiatic languages.

Alexander Militarev is actually a respected linguist. There are also many other linguists who support a Near East origin for the Afro-Asiatic family; Militarev is just the leading proponent. This as well is more often than not due to actual evidence (both linguistic and archaeological), not bias.

As Václav Blažek observes on the Cushitic substratum in the Modern South Arabian subgroup of Afro-Asiatic's Semitic branch:

"Having identified a Cushitic-like substratum in Modern South Arabian, Militarev (1984, 18-19; cf. also Belova 2003) proposes that Cushites originally lived throughout the Arabian Peninsula; thus they would be the original southern neighbors of the Semites, who then assimilated those Cushites who did not move into Ethiopia. This hypothesis is supported by Anati (1968, 180-84), who analyzed the rock art of Central Arabia. He connected the pictures of the ‘oval-headed’ people depicted with shields with the Arabian ‘Cushites’ from the Old Testament [Genesis 10.6-12; Isaiah 45.14] described also with specific shields [Jeremiah 46.9; Ezekiel 38.5]. The spread of Cushites in Africa is connected with the Rift Valley. In the coastal area of Eritrea and Djibouti, where the Rift enters into the African mainland, three archaic representatives of the North, Central (= Agaw) and Eastern branches of Cushitic appear: Beja, Bilin and Afar-Saho respectively. In this place the disintegration of Cushitic probably began. Ancestors of the Agaw spread in the north of Eritrea and Ethiopia, the Beja also in Sudan between the Nile and the Red Sea. Other East and South Cushitic languages moved southward along the Rift Valley through Ethiopia, Kenya, as far as Central Tanzania."

http://www.phil.muni.cz/jazyk/files/AAm ... nsCORR.pdf

So our ancestors were right, we do descend from Arabs. Just not semitic ones.

Btw, what do you guys know about T haplogroup?

[Bermooda]

Im so sure that was Ajuuraan empire who had the biggest fleet in Africa and held the Portugese for 20 years off bay even chasing them away from Mombasa and other African cities. Somalis were strong then and extremely organised

They did a huge expedition with the Turks where they took out the Portuguese from the whole of East-Africa but then they came back with reinforcement form India and got their regions back + sacked Baraawe with intention to the same to Mogadishu but aborted after hearing they would face annihilation.

Mind you these times the Portuguese were the superpower of the world. The good times when our people were a vital part of the world economy feared superpower of Africa and built their own navy ships

Now Hawiya are eating eachother.

At least i have a honourable history. Yours started in late 1800 and ever since the Brits left you have been patiently chewing your qaat waiting for your messiah Queen Elizabeth to return

[LiquidHYDROGEN]

Adal sultanate and futuh al xabash was long before your ancestors ever heard of islam. Dont tell me my history you ugandan subject.

[Grant]

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1182106/

Extensive article comparing Ethiopian and Yemeni DNA. See especially the discussion near the end. The area is extensively mixed, with both Semites and Cushites, and others, in there. Movement went both directions across the Bab-al-Mandeb, the Gate of Tears.

[Meyle]

The urheimat is most likely the Horn of Africa or North East Africa and most linguists including Christopher Ehret believe that the urheimat was HOA/North East Africa. It's only Militarev who believe that the urheimat is in the Levant but his approach to Afro-Asiatic languages have always had a Semitic bias, nonetheless we can all agree that the E1b1b has great affinity to Afro-Asiatic languages.

Alexander Militarev is actually a respected linguist. There are also many other linguists who support a Near East origin for the Afro-Asiatic family; Militarev is just the leading proponent. This as well is more often than not due to actual evidence (both linguistic and archaeological), not bias.

As Václav Blažek observes on the Cushitic substratum in the Modern South Arabian subgroup of Afro-Asiatic's Semitic branch:

"Having identified a Cushitic-like substratum in Modern South Arabian, Militarev (1984, 18-19; cf. also Belova 2003) proposes that Cushites originally lived throughout the Arabian Peninsula; thus they would be the original southern neighbors of the Semites, who then assimilated those Cushites who did not move into Ethiopia. This hypothesis is supported by Anati (1968, 180-84), who analyzed the rock art of Central Arabia. He connected the pictures of the ‘oval-headed’ people depicted with shields with the Arabian ‘Cushites’ from the Old Testament [Genesis 10.6-12; Isaiah 45.14] described also with specific shields [Jeremiah 46.9; Ezekiel 38.5]. The spread of Cushites in Africa is connected with the Rift Valley. In the coastal area of Eritrea and Djibouti, where the Rift enters into the African mainland, three archaic representatives of the North, Central (= Agaw) and Eastern branches of Cushitic appear: Beja, Bilin and Afar-Saho respectively. In this place the disintegration of Cushitic probably began. Ancestors of the Agaw spread in the north of Eritrea and Ethiopia, the Beja also in Sudan between the Nile and the Red Sea. Other East and South Cushitic languages moved southward along the Rift Valley through Ethiopia, Kenya, as far as Central Tanzania."

http://www.phil.muni.cz/jazyk/files/AAm ... nsCORR.pdf

I think you misunderstood my statement as well. When reconstructing for instance Ancient Egyptian or even proto Afro-Asiatic he tends to approach the problem from his standpoint and many of his interpretations are marked by this Semitic bias. He's not alone in this, many linguists tend to approach the problem the same way, maybe because Semitic is the most studied of all the languages in that language group. Nonetheless he's a respected linguist (I never said he wasn't).
Some of his colleagues have an interesting hypothesis regarding Cushitic. They believe that Cushitic is a federation of languages, a so called Sprachbund and that the languages that falls under this category are similar because of language contact and geographic proximity. I support this theory and I believe that the Somali language doesn't share origin with Oromo, Afar, Saho etc. I think they have influenced each other over time. Just look at Afar/Saho. Those languages were more like Beja a thousand years ago but today they are not even close.

Both Amharic and Tigray/Tigre have a Cushitic substratum. Agaw serves as a substratum for Amharic while Beja/Afar-Saho serves as a substratum for Tigray/Tigre. It's even believed that Somali has influenced Harari while Oromo has influenced Gurage.

Ge'ez script and south Arabian scripts like the Sabaean script are quite similar. The Arabs during the 6th century understood the Habeshas when they spoke Ge'ez, for instance during the first Muslim migration to Abyssinia. The two parties were speaking in their respective languages and they understood each other perfectly. Just like when the Assyrians seiged Jerusalem during Sennacherib. The native population spoke Hebrew while the occupying forces spoke Akkadian but they understood each other as well despite speaking two different languages.

[gurey25]

so called Sprachbund and that the languages that falls under this category are similar because of language contact and geographic proximity. I support this theory and I believe that the Somali language doesn't share origin with Oromo, Afar, Saho etc. I think they have influenced each other over time. Just look at Afar/Saho. Those languages were more like Beja a thousand years ago but today they are not even close.

a sparchbund with beja and afar/saho yes but not oromo, if af maay is portuguese to italian, oromo is archaic latin to standard somali.
We are clearly close to ormo, linguistically.

The Arabs during the 6th century understood the Habeshas when they spoke Ge'ez, for instance during the first Muslim migration to Abyssinia. The two parties were speaking in their respective languages and they understood each other perfectly. Just like when the Assyrians seiged Jerusalem during Sennacherib.

this is an outrageous statement but i like your dynamic thinking, sometimes the most batshit crazy idea is the right one.
but sadly this is not the case.
Ge'ez may be quite close to ximyarite language of yemen, and its relatives but it is very very far from arabic.
Since the axumites have allot of history with yemen and since there is allot of trade and immigration back and forth between hejaz and yemen, i am guessing that what really happened was that both sides where familiar with either ximyarite or mahri or the the first muslim migrants had someone that spoke ge'ez due to trade.

Just like when the Assyrians seiged Jerusalem during Sennacherib. The native population spoke Hebrew while the occupying forces spoke Akkadian but they understood each other as well despite speaking two different languages.The native population spoke Hebrew while the occupying forces spoke Akkadian but they understood each other as well despite speaking two different languages.

senachribs time was the neo-assyrian period towards the end of it, by that time Aramaic tribes have taken over and have been the ruling class in both babylon and assyria. During Senachribs time Aramaic was displacing akkadian even though both were official languages, the same way middle assyrian which was a dialect of akkadian started replacing akkadian a few hundred years earlier.
Now aramaic was very close to hebrew/canaanite they were almost the same language, they were as close as Castillian Spanish is to Catalan. Aramaic was the international language of trade and diplomacy, and all diplomats and merchants from libya/egypt to the greeks all the way to persia used it, so you can understand how hebrew fell out of favour so quickly and aramaic was the prophet ciisa's first language not hebrew.

[Meyle]

I would say a sprachbund with all those languages. We only share 35-40% of vocabulary with Oromos. Then you have the phonetics and phonotactics that differ. It's only the grammatical structure that's similar but you'll find similarities between Somali and Berber as well.


Yh, Akkadian was replaced but Catalan and Castellano or regular Spanish are quite different. I don't think they understand each other.

Those Semitic languages on the other hand were very close. Akkadian is the language that resembles proto Semitic the most and therefore an individual speaking Hebrew could easily understand Akkadian, while Ge'ez and Classic Arabic share the same roots and that would explain how they could communicate.

[Bermooda]

Adal sultanate and futuh al xabash was long before your ancestors ever heard of islam. Dont tell me my history you ugandan subject.

You must think im some fool war don't claim other peoples history .

The Adal empire was a OG Walashma dynasty (Dir might disagree) who ruled it until my people beesha karanle unseated them with aun Mahfuuz fist and then fully with aun Gurey himself yes i know many claim him but if you knew in what town he was born you wouldn't.

You're lucky i'm even giving you late 1800 but instead should of started in early 1980's SNM ps even if you persist on aun Gurey not being Karanle they were in his elites part of the army

At this moment the companions of the imam screamed out, saying, ‘The infidels have tricked us; they are after the livestock,’ whereupon the imam split his forces into two divisions: one he entrusted to Garad Ahmusa, composed of the Somali spearmen of the Marraihan, the Gorgorah and the Hawiya; around one-thousand of them from among the most famous spearmen. And from the soldiers bearing shields, the same number.

Heck we even were mullahs in Sayyid

To the east lies a row of four tombs. The most northerly is that of one
Soldan Nur of the Habr Yunis tribe; the next two, neither being plastered. and the first with the top left unfinished, are those of Hawiya notables whose names my Somalis did not know. The most southerly tomb is that of a man of the Habr Jaalo tribe. The isolated tomb still farther east is that of ‘AbdullahHasan’s mother. All the tombs are provided with narrow but very massive wooden doors, swinging about vertical extensions from top and base of one side.

Hawiye history is way out of your league son

[Meyle]

When did the Walashma who trace their lineage to Sacad Al Diin, a Banu Hashimi (Qureyshi) become Ogaden?

Secondly the first tribe to join Axmed Gureys war against the Abyssinians is Isaaq (Habar Magaado)


Why would we need to claim history when its out there?




And in your second quote you see the Isaaq sub clans HY and HJ, talk about shooting yourself in the foot

[LiquidHYDROGEN]

Adal sultanate and futuh al xabash was long before your ancestors ever heard of islam. Dont tell me my history you ugandan subject.

You must think im some fool war don't claim other peoples history .

The Adal empire was a OG Walashma dynasty (Dir might disagree) who ruled it until my people beesha karanle unseated them with aun Mahfuuz fist and then fully with aun Gurey himself yes i know many claim him but if you knew in what town he was born you wouldn't.

You're lucky i'm even giving you late 1800 but instead should of started in early 1980's SNM ps even if you persist on aun Gurey not being Karanle they were in his elites part of the army

At this moment the companions of the imam screamed out, saying, ‘The infidels have tricked us; they are after the livestock,’ whereupon the imam split his forces into two divisions: one he entrusted to Garad Ahmusa, composed of the Somali spearmen of the Marraihan, the Gorgorah and the Hawiya; around one-thousand of them from among the most famous spearmen. And from the soldiers bearing shields, the same number.

Heck we even were mullahs in Sayyid

To the east lies a row of four tombs. The most northerly is that of one
Soldan Nur of the Habr Yunis tribe; the next two, neither being plastered. and the first with the top left unfinished, are those of Hawiya notables whose names my Somalis did not know. The most southerly tomb is that of a man of the Habr Jaalo tribe. The isolated tomb still farther east is that of ‘AbdullahHasan’s mother. All the tombs are provided with narrow but very massive wooden doors, swinging about vertical extensions from top and base of one side.

Hawiye history is way out of your league son

Oh Lord. I stopped reading there. Apparently pulling fictional history out of your arses wasn't exclusive to the kacaan gov.

[Bermooda]

[hydrogen]

Liquid, Adal was Walashma but that itself is a misunderstanding of the world 'walasha'. Basically, it was ruled by Arawello's sister who was Hawiye. Instead of being known as queen of Adal, she was known as Walasha, in the 3rd person of sense of her relation to the queen Arawello. Walashma is just a minor error in language.

Aabe Siyaad taught me, AUN.