[POLL]If Somaliland get recognition, how will your attitude be towards them?

[Rambie]

Appeal to ignorance fallacy.



It's not my fault you can't provide a single evidence to back up your weak arguments.
So far I've been slapping you around with hard cold facts.
While all your comebacks were about imaginary battles you
supposedly won in 88, do you know what? I never come across any of your fabricated
battles, I can claim that the Cissa Musa of the Habar Awal
went all the way to Galkaciyo in Mudug and karbashed both the MJ's and the Hawiya
and went back to Berbera, as long as there is no evidence (and am not saying your useless and fake gabays)
It's pure BS, it doesn't change the fact that your whole clan in Sanaag
where terrorized and displaced by 3 sub sub sub clans of the HY Bari

When the regime of Siad Barre collapsed. The HY have already taken over Erigavo, and moved to the east and the south in the district
to take over the previously shared lands with the Harti, your people didn't fight back and leaved silently.

They toke over your lands in central and south of Erigavo district and distributed it among each
other like a candy, the Dhulbahanti couldn't swallow that and where bitching like what they always do.


There is no proof what so over that you killed 200 HY man in Damala-Xagare
By the description, I would say the group didn't surpass 60 people 12 where captured and some
survived, unlike you I try to be fair, don't forget The Warsangali and the Dhulbahanti had to reunite
to fight off a small militia, you didn't even faced them face to face, you attacked from the behind, what a shame.



Anyway after that incident you run back to Lascanood and the HY occupied Jidaili town when the
Warsangali retreated later. At least the Warsangali (who are much smaller to you in numbers like 1:5) had balls, they came to us face to face, and we let them back in in the rain season to graze and water even from our previous side of the town. The chicken Dhulus have asked the Warsans to mediate between them and allow them and their herds to pass safely in south Sanaag. They even asked them the blood money of a Dhulbahanti man who was killed earlier.

The HY chased you out of Sanaag, there is no shame bigger than that!
They had to wait you for 24 days and send you half Dhulu delegates before the Gurrti hold your hand and pull you from Sool to attain the conference!

Even during peace conferences withe the passive HJ (The closest you are to isaaq) you attacked them with 40 men killing two in the process
and taking over 160 head of herds, the HJ responded almost immediately by raiding you back with 30 men
taking 480 camels and putting 4 of your people six feet under.

You dump people tried that again and raided the HJ killing one man, but two HJ women married to Dhulus warned them and
and managed to retrieve them back after you stole them. Funny thing is, the next hour the Dhulus offered 110 camel
and a bride.










Ileen all these years Udun was talking out'f his ass
claiming imaginary and epic battles portraying the Dhulubahanti
as the gods' chosen people while in fact they were the least significant clan in Sanaag
The Warsangali had more say in the wars and Sanaag then your coward, back stabbing clan.


Cry me a river

[Xildiiid]

There's a Somali proverb that goes "Nin geed galay, geed looma galo".

Rambie you can't defeat the Doofaar Ismaciil piglets in a debate because they've mastered the art of deception. They somehow manage to overlook the crucial facts you're posting. The vaccine to their swine flue is to dismantle their lies logically.

Right now I'm busy helping a friend to move so I'm posting from my phone but when I get home later this day, I'll dismantle Qudhun's lies one by one.

I'll say this though, Col. Libaaxo was alive when Qudhun's clan was reintroduced to Sanaag like an extinct specie. He tried to make it seem like they killed Col. Libaaxo when they use to shit themselves everytime they heard his name. Even muj. Axmad Mire, in UK they cross the street just to avoid him. Some of my abtis were part of the 9th division that liberated Ceerigaabo in 1989. They did not take part in the battle of Damalla Xagare because it was a battle between Xaamud Turwaa sub sub sub clan of Muuse Ismaciil (HY) vs Dhulbahante and Warsangeli.

[gegiroor]

@Rambie,

Seriously, what evidence you bring to the table? Some fabricated stories that you guys collected? How is that different than mine?

And how can the civil war between Somalis in Sanaag and in Somalia as a whole have any evidence in cyberspace. I can write a book on what I have known for real, present SNM failures as facts and present it in a book. Would that tbe truth? No, but I would use it like the one that you're using.

Having said that, not knowing what happened in Damala-Xagare in 1991 clearly shows that you're not from Sanaag. If you were HY from Sanaag, you wouldn't dispute it. It was battle that broke the camel's back. HY initially refused any peace terms with Harti, and after they suffered that huge blow, hey started sending one traditional elder after another.

Bersides, I gave you locations, dates, poems and casualties. You're dealing with someone who is from the region and know the facts. You're not!


To sum it up, here are the my points in that useless civil war:

1. Jiidali which you cited in your documentation is still a DH town today as before after SNM attacked it 6-8 times! How are we there if SNM evicted us out?

2. Biyo-Guduud was an Isaaq town in 1988. It is a DH town today after you were evicted and houses destroyed. You attacked in September 2008 in order to settle the town through all SL militia. You have failed it again. We're holding it!

3. How about Masagan? You were evicted from this valley in 1992, we have our Masagan town in there today, and we're holding your farms after you got evicted. Ask your fellow HY what Bah-Cabdalle - a subclan of NA (Naalaye Axmed - DH) did here!

There were other battles that the SNM got decimated - which none of them was cited in the document that Rambie is running with:

1. Darar-weyne - 1989
2. Fadhigaab - 1988 and 1989
3. Erigavo: 1988 - 1989: SNM supporters were evicted and forced to take shelter in the mountains.
4. Bohol: 1988 - 1990: In one battle SNM lost over 100 men. For those who don't know, Bohol is an Isaaq town, and it was turned into DH military base from 1988 until the signing of peace treaty in the 1990s.
5. Dab-xidig: 1990
6. God-caanood: 1989
7. Ceel-Afwein, Yufle, Ban-cadde, Karamaan plains, Shimbiraale, and Goosaweyne: 1988 - 1990. All of these are Isaaq towns. Bancadde and Karamaan plains are shared grazing lands between Isaaq and DH.
8. God-heeli: 1989. SNM suffered the biggest lost in Sool region in this battle.

I give you one thing: You guys are good at propaganda. You wrote your selective stories in a book. We just need to write a book to respond to your gibberish. I definitely have the data and will work on to put it in a book.

As for DH being the smallest clan in Sanaag. First, it is a section of NA (Naalaye Axmed) that settles there; however, when it came down to doing the heavy-lifting against SNM, that section of NA took the brunt of the fighting. Who cares what numbers show later on - even tough I know for a fact Harti is the largest clan in Sanaag. We're still there, we did not lose 1 inch of territory, and SNM has come down to us seeking peace on our own terms!

Moral of the story: Your "supposedly" flamboyant and "feared" SNM fought its last battle in Sanaag in a place called Damala-Xagare in 1991, and suffered the biggest blow. SNM never initiated another conflict against Harti in Sanaag, Sool, and Buuhoodle region. Instead, SNM and Isaaq traditional elders have reached out to Hartis and sought peace. CRY ME A RIVER!!

To Rambie, if you don't know what happened iDamal-Xagare, I have nothing to discuss with you. You're not from Sanaag. It was not a small event! If that event is not captured in your book, you have a hogwash.

I will end it here! At the end of the day, these battles were useless as they were Somali Muslims killing other Somali Muslims, and for that I never take comfort discussing them, for the sake of my aakhira (hereafter).

Nice chatting you.

[gegiroor]

There's a Somali proverb that goes "Nin geed galay, geed looma galo".

Rambie you can't defeat the Doofaar Ismaciil piglets in a debate because they've mastered the art of deception. They somehow manage to overlook the crucial facts you're posting. The vaccine to their swine flue is to dismantle their lies logically.

Right now I'm busy helping a friend to move so I'm posting from my phone but when I get home later this day, I'll dismantle Qudhun's lies one by one.

I'll say this though, Col. Libaaxo was alive when Qudhun's clan was reintroduced to Sanaag like an extinct specie. He tried to make it seem like they killed Col. Libaaxo when they use to shit themselves everytime they heard his name. Even muj. Axmad Mire, in UK they cross the street just to avoid him. Some of my abtis were part of the 9th division that liberated Ceerigaabo in 1989. They did not take part in the battle of Damalla Xagare because it was a battle between Xaamud Turwaa sub sub sub clan of Muuse Ismaciil (HY) vs Dhulbahante and Warsangeli.

Just shut up you cuqdad-ridden kid. At least HY did not come to us and ask us to attack HJ; it was your clan (HJ) who came down to Harti in Sanaag and Eastern Sool, begging us to help you against HY What an embarrassment. On one hand, you were begging us to help you against your fellow Isaaq and then here you're talking. You went to the low of the low when you did come to DH and Warsans to help you against your fellow Isaaqs. WHAT A SHAME!!

Additionally, I've never claimed DH killed Colonel Libaaxo. I said he is not alive today to speak up the facts, so check with Colonel Axmed Mohamed Mire - the main commander of the SNM in Sanaag, and ask him what happened in Damala-Xagare.

Look at this dumb statement:

ome of my abtis were part of the 9th division that liberated Ceerigaabo in 1989. They did not take part in the battle of Damalla Xagare because it was a battle between Xaamud Turwaa sub sub sub clan of Muuse Ismaciil (HY) vs Dhulbahante and Warsangeli.

That is what happens when people tell lies. Reer Caweer, a sub sub clan of Sacad Yoonis - Jibriil Xasan - has lost 38 men in that battle. Majority of the casualties were the rest of HY in Sool and Sanaag. To my knowledge, HJ has suffered over 20 casualties but their contribution was very small compared to the HY. The rest of casualties were HY - mainly Muuse Ismaaciil and some Muuse Care.

FYI, Xaamuud Turwaa, with the below subclans, are the largest among the HY in Sanaag

Maxamud Xaamud
Cabdale Xaamud
Cabdi Xaamud

Anyhow, I still gotta laugh at HJ coming to Harti in Sool and Sanaag and asking them to help them against their fellow Isaaqs (HY) This is the lowest of the low that any Somali clan reach in the 1990s.

Xildiid, did you forget those days when you used to come to us as if you were closer to us than other Isaaqs?

[Bandit]

@gegiroor can you show me the map of sanaag showing where dhulbahante lives and how far isaaq are in Sanaag. I always thought they stopped at Erigavo but they say their just outside las qoray which is hard to believe also how many percent do dhulbahante make up in Sanaag

[Xildiiid]

Gegiroor, you son of Dofaar Ismaaciil,

Like a prostitute you return for more..

I'm going to dismantle your lies one by one.

1. The only HJ sub sub sub clans that fought Habar Yoonis in Sanaag were Udurxmiin and Bah Sambuur. The battle in Ceerigaabo was about HY dominance and if Darood did not have a stake in that war why would they support HJ sub sub sub clans? logically it doesn't make sense..

Secondly, if it was HJ v HY as you suggest.. Would plenty of Biciide soldiers from the Axmad Faarax sub clan fight alongside eastern HY against these two HJ sub sub sub clans and the Darood?

2. You implied that your clan killed Col. Libaaxo and I caught you red handed. Your poor excuse won't change the fact that you're creating fiction. Waxaagu waaba musasal soo noqnoqonaya oo aad u bixisay 'The mother of all battles'.

Now, the irony is that the battles you listed were pre 1990 and you're bragging about what Afweyne's SNA forces did in our towns.

This is straight from the HRW in 1989;

[The] military [are] using weapons like cannon [out of] American Jeeps and heavy guns at the nomadic people.

Between July and the beginning of Decemeber, many villages located in various districts were burned between June and August 1988; Sinaro, Bohol, Fadigab, Garadag, Oog, Godheeli, Kalsheikh, El Afweyne, Dararweyne, Berde Analeh and Gureed. Many people were killed as a result.

In Ceerigaabo,

They (Isaaq) all lived in one part of town and heavily armed pro government militias lived in another part of town. It was the militias that were in control, but they were armed by and worked closely with the military

You're bragging about using the muscle of the SNA, made up by different Somali clans, to settle historical scores. The whole war against Isaaq in the 80's was about Darood settling historical scores.


3. The SNM liberated the Isaaq city Ceerigaabo in November, 1989 and they slaughtered Afweyne's forces. This is what happened to the Doofaar clans who relied on Afweyne.




You were cleansed from Sanaag and reintroduced in 1993 like an extinct specie. You can claim you defeated us but logically it doesn't make sense. If you defeated anyone, how come you were evicted in the first place? Why was the same clan you allegedly defeated facilitating your reintroduction to Sanaag?

4. I'm not Udurxmiin nor am I Bah Sambuur, those two clans sided with the Darood who were fighting HY because they had the same agenda. I'm Solomadow and on my male lineage it's 100% Isaaq. Matter of fact, in contrast to the HY v HJ card you're trying to play.. Except for my father who's half Axmad Faarax, aniga iyo all my paternal grandfathers have HY reer abti.

We do not mix with pigs.

[Rambie]

Add hominem, just when everything else failed kulaha am
not from Sanaag, half of my maternal family are from there.

So I suppose I.M. Lewis is an Isaaq or a Somali?
The book is nuteral and it all about the peace in Somaliland post 1990.


Do you seriously believe your weak ass clan that couldn’t defend itself against the Daravish
And was routinely losing lands to Solomadow and few other HJ sub clans in the last 200 years can
stand against the whole of HY or HJ alone? If it wasn't for Siad Barre or SL, walaahi tolahi iyo billahi the
Dhulbahanti today would have been an endangered species.

You ask questions that are self answered
If the Dhulus and the Wrasans didn’t have a stake in that beef you wouldn’t join
them so maha?

During the Habar-Habar wars, the Gudabursi were neutral and acted as a peace maker between the beefing Isaaq clans, they didn’t join a side against the other in Berbera when Cissa Muse and HY clashed there.


Your asking why the HY send a delegates to the Dhulus to attained Dararwyne (southern, central Sanaag)
when your whole clan was displaced from Sanaag to Laascanood

Your asking why The Central SNM send you peace delegates?
when even before the fall of Siad Barre, you supreme Garad came to usand apologized
for his people wrong doing in hope for peace.


I knew something was fishy when you claimed the Dhulus killed our people in Ceel Afwayne 88
our tribal borders with the Harti was far from that city, the SNA was controlling the city/district pre 88.

Many people do not realize that before the events of 88 the Isaaq didn’t support the SNM
despite human right violations and the economic sanctions against the Isaaq at that time, the SNM were 3,000 fighter max, most of them where fighting in the western fronts Hargiesa, Burco, Berbera, while very few SNM mujahidin were in Sool and Sanaag operating from the mountains, side not, It wasn’t only the inferiority complex Siad Barre had against Isaaq that was the reason for the bombing, it was
Also the fact that Morgan couldn’t take over the city in a dog fight (less than 2500 man) He rathered to bomb the whole city than leaving it intact to the SNM .

Its like saying the Ogaden won against the Isaaq in Hargiesa and takeover the city by displacing them across the borders to Ethiopia, when the truth it was :

The Somali republic + The Somali National Army (2/3 of your whole army was sent to the north to combat Isaaq) + foreign mercenaries + other clans from all over Somalia (Ogaden, majertin, Gudabursi, Hawiya and Midgan) + your weak ass clan that was armed to the teeth in 88 (and still till today)

In Sool and Sanaag, if SNM killed a soldier, the SNA would kill 200 civilian in the next day. Most of the casualties were from random executions, civilians who were forced to wear an SNM uniform and executed publicly.

Since you have the data, I dare you on Somalinet to prove that all these “battles” (mostly executions of nomads) were fought By the armed Dhulbahanti (alone) I bet you can’t all what your gonna find is “SNA soldiers killed SNM terrorist here and there“

It will take me some time to gather info and back up all what I just said, but when I do, you will have to change your nick again Udun, no one will take you seriously anymore. Only in your wildest dreams the Dhulus are equal to HY or HJ

[Rambie]

Erigavo




Ceel Afwayne





The "battles: you supposedly won




Somalia A Government at War With Its Own People

You have been caught red handed GTFOH!

[skywalker25]

Udun is a man with no honour even within his Dhulbahnte community. I remember him claiming that some Garad or other was a bastard who's mother slept with another man. Arguing with someone like that is pointless and you're better of watching paint dry....

[luis1]

SNM guerrillas weakened Siad Barre army,this a fact.

SNM weakened WSLF in Ogaden.

[gegiroor]

Udun is a man with no honour even within his Dhulbahnte community. I remember him claiming that some Garad or other was a bastard who's mother slept with another man. Arguing with someone like that is pointless and you're better of watching paint dry....

Miyaa is lays caayayaa?

Look at this grown man calling me names after I make holes in their nonsense. They attacked you personally when they don't like your message