The only time Somalia was united against the enemy

[Gifted]

Okay, right now jews happen to be quite successful my friend, but what about somalia??? Its a complete and utter disaster and all people can do is dwell in the past instead of tackling the problems that we're being confronted with presently. We would be alot better off if people could just learn to forgive and forget.

[Murax]

[quote="xoogSADE14"][quote="Alchemist"]Maxaa sheekada Maj. Gen. Pres. MSB soo gashay? weren't we discussing warlords and common criminals?[/quote]


Xoog, markaas waa marki aan sheekada ka soo dhex baxay.

[King-of-Awdal]

[quote="Gifted"]Okay, right now jews happen to be quite successful my friend, but what about somalia??? Its a complete and utter disaster and all people can do is dwell in the past instead of tackling the problems that we're being confronted with presently. We would be alot better off if people could just learn to forgive and forget.[/quote]


In order to forgive each other we first must head back to our individuals homes and take a break from looking at each other face to face. Only way i see somalia to ever be in peace again is for every clan to go back to their shithole homes and fix themselves internally first than come back again and talk. As for Isreal yea if success means paranoi i guess ur right.

[Alchemist]

Ok then lets leave it at that..

For everyone of you there is a Abdiwahhab. lol.

[Gifted]

LOL@paranoi.....Well, right now the tigre have done a great job in moving somalis back to their original homes or rather left them displaced as refugees. Somalia is for everyone...how do expect people to just pack their bags and leave thier homes? Look, none of us are living in somalia...we all live comfortable lives..and yet...look all around YOU..people are still bitter and angry. If everyone went back it would be exactly the same if not worse in my opinion...the thing with somalis is that no one wants to be guilty. Yes, Caydiid AUN made some mistakes but so did Siyad Barre AUN and many others....but instead people choose to ignore this....somali fockin mentatility

[King-of-Awdal]

Gifted

Somalia is for all somali but than we all each have our own individual homes where we are the owners and no one can rule us or dictate to us. Me i will never become a mayor of hamar or bossasso because no matter how long i have lived there i will alwayz be an immigrant. In that same sense a none samaroon or essa can never rule Awdal because he will alwayz be an immigrant and that isnt a bad thing but it is reality. Too much hatred has taken place among somali society and i truly believe only way for us to heal that is we must take a break from each other and go our seperate ways for a while so we can experience the pain to be lonely.

[Gifted]

Okay, what about regions that aren't occupied by a single clan then? My family happens to be from galkacyo..both sacads and majeerteens live there..and I'm pretty sure there's many other towns that are like that. People aren't going to be lonely lol...but instead even more paranoid about what their neighbors are planning as they have no relationship with each other. Right now, somalis need each other...we need to comprimise and help each other to make a difference..the last thing we need is to go our seperate ways, because in reality thats whats going on right now...somalis seem to be more capable of having "healthy" relationships with foreign countries than they can with their own people and that says alot.

[Dudaaye]

Islamic Court and Hawiyes keep making the same mistake over and over,
Barre Hiraale is Not The Same As your Warlords

Barre Hiraale was against deployment of African troops in Somalia and The Ethiopians. He refuse to cooperate with the CIA. Hassan Turki was allowed to live peacefully in Ras Kanbooni.

[Somaliweyn]

[quote="Murax"]Xoogsade,

Hadi runta la sheego, this Alchemist kid has spoken out against Caydid (USC) before, laakin in the somalinet qabil superhighway, he got caught up in defending them which is understandable.[/quote]

lool highway,

----

''Just because the warlords you support(ed) looted properties, killed women and children, raped old women doesn't mean the men who rose up to defend their respective clans from the USC's barbaric actions are the same as them.''

First, these warlords were a cause of what the dictator did. At first they were defending their respective clans from the dictators oppressive actions. From there on, they gradually set up their own warlord administrations, some brought peace and stability in the domains they reigned in (M.dheere-Jowhar, Muse-Medina/Bermuda, Qanyare-Dayniile etc), others kept their domains as conflict zones. But eventually, all went the wrong way, became an obstacle to progress, kept their respective clans in timeless anarchy, and eventually paved the way for the Ethiopian occupation.

After all this, their respective clans have denounced them. The majority now despises men like M.dheere, Muuse, Qanyare, Caato etc because they are collaborating with Ethiopia and they have shown that they are an obstacle to progress.

Your group has yet to come to this same conclusion when it comes to men like Ina Biixi, Gen Cumar jaamac, Hiiraale etc....men that in one period in their warlord-career collaborated with the enemy against their own people, and massacred their own civilians.

When all Somali groups reach the same conclusion as us, and come out of the denial phase, is when Somalia can move forward. But as long as we have groups defending A.Yusuf, Hiiraale while our groups denounces men like M.dheere, Indhacadde etc we will move no where.















PS:

Mods: whoever deleted the other thread in which myths were busted, the thread was once moved from general sections..fine with me, but how can it be deleted eventhough it is in the twilight zone (clan sections ) of Somnet. I have my suspicions, and I recommend you guys to leave such topics alone because some kids make a habit of dancing in circles, always re-cycling already busted myths.

[Murax]

lol....


Somaliweyn, you must be a drunkard if you think you've 'busted myths'. The only thing you've done is force yourself to believe your own lies like a bitter pills. Ka bood.


Anyway without sidestepping my prior assertions I'll say it again. Was Barre or was he not staunchly Anti Tigray when plenty of your "Muloduud" leaders you put on par with him were even hosting the puppet regime and conspiring from them in the beginning. When your Muloduud leaders along with AY's clamor for Tigray troops reached a cresendo, and you guys were pushing bills to be signed in Baydhabo and were trying to pressure Barre, he went on the airwaves and called on all former Somali militairy officals to suit up and report for duty, and some old men even went out of their homes in Xamar, and upon being interviewed they praised Barre. If you take a deep breath, let go of your sad case of envy you would admit that Barre said what he said about "using Yahuud" in a fit of rage, after helping the ICU cause, being Anti Xabashi etc. and then getting spurnned just because he wasn't Indacadde's nephew. Infact forget little internet charactes like yourself, guys like Daahir Aweis, Mansur and others went OUT OF THEIR WAY to praise Barre even after the Kismaayo fiasco saying things like "Waa nin qeymo ku fadhiyo" "Waa nin sharaftiis ilaasho" "boos baan u haynaa" and so on and so forth. They sure didn't say the same thing about your Muloduud or other warlords. Even Adanboy, who is pretty much the only respectable representetive of the people fighting in Xamar said that "Barre at his worst, is better than all those warlords at their best". Infact that quote should be written in stone, because frankly, your clan's reputation has actually deteriorated the most in the eyes of Somalis. No matter what you say, when people think about Tigray in Xamar they think about two groups primairly although there are plenty of other small time actors: Muloduud and Majerten. The only sad thing in that is Majerten at least doesn't reside in Xamar, yet that Muloduud clan is destroying their city, clansmen, livelihood etc. for a very meager price. Infact come to think of it, Wallahi I find it very difficult to comprehend how any Muloduud,Hawiye can support this Government.


Btw, when presented with hard questions you have a habit with coming with excrutiatingly long mostly nonsense garbage to sidestep the questions I raised. Please manage to answer them without wasting too much of my time.

[Alchemist]

Luq dont get us wrong sxb, just because we point out some of Sayid Barre's mistakes doesnt mean we put him on the same level as these warlords.. Some of the things he did in the late 80s were wrong, and the killing of the sheiks..

One thing is for sure though and no one can deny Sayid Barre was a patriot.. Everything he did whether good or bad he did it on his own and didnt need a foreign army...That much itself puts him on a level of his own in Somali politcs..

That is why both those who love him or hate him refer to him as the real last president of Somalia..

[Murax]

Alchemist,

I was actually talking about Barre Hiiraale in that post. Whether people hate or love the late MSB aun, the fact is he was a President and Head Of State, so by default he is judged on a much higher level as he was responsible for all Somalis welfare unlike the warlords, faction leaders who only have to answer to their clan. I never got offended when people criticized MSB because he was President who can be liked or disliked. However back to the question, Alchemist do you know Dahir Aweis, Abu Mansur and other ICU praised Barre Hiiraale even after the Kismaayo incident? Do you know Barre was always Anti Xabashi?

[Alchemist]

[quote="Murax"]Alchemist,

I was actually talking about Barre Hiiraale in that post. Whether people hate or love the late MSB aun, the fact is he was a President and Head Of State, so by default he is judged on a much higher level as he was responsible for all Somalis welfare unlike the warlords, faction leaders who only have to answer to their clan. I never got offended when people criticized MSB because he was President who can be liked or disliked. However back to the question, Alchemist do you know Dahir Aweis, Abu Mansur and other ICU praised Barre Hiiraale even after the Kismaayo incident? Do you know Barre was always Anti Xabashi?[/quote]

No i did not know that..

Now let me ask you a honest question.. Lets say that Merahan for whatever reason were to kick out Barre Hirrela out of Kismaayo do you have any doubts that he would use Xabashi help and kill who ever was in his way to get power?

You see warlords are only good to their people as long as it serves their interest.. when Hawiye warlords faught against Sayid Barre they were good for their people one might argue but what happened next?

When Osman Cato faught against Caydid his claim was that caydid didnt really care about the interest of Sacad and Hawiye and some HG business man supported him in that, where is Cato today?

Dabageed the xawadle warlord faught againt HG for his people that is how he gained power and one can argue that he was good for his people because he defended them but when they sided with the ICU who used Ethiopians to crush them down...

Abdullahi Yusuf is good for his people now but remember when he killed a lot of Majerteen because of power..

same with Hirreele you know for sure that a lot of Merahan were with the courts would Hiireela have any problems dealing with them?

For you to believe that Hirreela is different from all those men is crazy..
My point here is not to weigh each warlords against each other because ofcourse some have wronged the nation more than others but my point is to prove that all these warlords are oppurtunistic who would kill their people any time for power..

Somalia needs new leaders..

[Murax]

Alchemist, I see where you're coming from exactly. However keep in mind Dahir Aweis, Abu Mansur and those other members of the ICU wern't Marexaan. Ofcourse it would be foolish for me to expect you to respect Barre because he was 'good for the Marexaan people'. I'm not looking for you to view Barre as a saint or what not but to give him his due. #1, Top ICU officials went out of their way to state their respect for him not out of qabil interest but out of respect. Did they do the same for Maxamed Dheere, Qeybadid etc.? No. Secondly, and I keep mentioning this over and over, Barre's Anti Xabashi stance was well known right up until the ICU fell. Thirdly, Barre having the defense ministry portfolio, did he actively engage in what was going on in Xamar, while some guys who hailed from Muloduud like Salaad Jeele, Maxamed Dheere were at the forefront? No. ALL this being said, I can understand why you wouldn't like Barre, laakin all I'm saying is give the man his due, and realize he's NOT on the Maxamed Dheere's, Qeybadid's level, and anybody who doesn't admit that, really isn't being honest.

[Alchemist]

[quote="Murax"]Alchemist, I see where you're coming from exactly. However keep in mind Dahir Aweis, Abu Mansur and those other members of the ICU wern't Marexaan. Ofcourse it would be foolish for me to expect you to respect Barre because he was 'good for the Marexaan people'. I'm not looking for you to view Barre as a saint or what not but to give him his due. #1, Top ICU officials went out of their way to state their respect for him not out of qabil interest but out of respect. Did they do the same for Maxamed Dheere, Qeybadid etc.? No. Secondly, and I keep mentioning this over and over, Barre's Anti Xabashi stance was well known right up until the ICU fell. Thirdly, Barre having the defense ministry portfolio, did he actively engage in what was going on in Xamar, while some guys who hailed from Muloduud like Salaad Jeele, Maxamed Dheere were at the forefront? No. ALL this being said, I can understand why you wouldn't like Barre, laakin all I'm saying is give the man his due, and realize he's NOT on the Maxamed Dheere's, Qeybadid's level, and anybody who doesn't admit that, really isn't being honest.[/quote]

Your right in that, I can only respect Barre Hiirreela for not leading a army into Xamar.. And to be honest Most Merahan sites i have visited show great remorse for whats taking place in Xamar..

But still i think for Somalia to move from this stage none of these guys should lead the nation.. Maybe barre Hiireele in the future can get into business or something else lol but new leaders should step forward from every qabil..

Each qabil hs to sacrifice for Somalia to move on..