Peace down south means war up north.

[Teeri]

Teeri:

Dont federations have one head that acts as the top dowg who represents
them?

If so does it really make any difference because at the end of the day someone
has to act as the head of the combined states to voice their needs and wants to
the rest of the world.

Zingi, what is wrong with somali federation states choosing their leader, just like the malaysians, even some states in malaysia have their own sultans, but one over all leader is in my opinion that thing that elimniates the cuqdad, we know somalis like to boast we are self ruled etc.......

if any state wishes to break out, let them.. if the somalilands want to break out let them, why not?

this somaliland region is very dry, its so dry the Absames left it to seek green lands in todays Ogadenia, we know this, when my ancestors came to Jubbas and the NFD, they named areas like Garrisa and Hargesa yare in the Absame lands of the south,, yet both areas were in waaqoyi, the point is these idoors are very proud of this dry land, they are happy, fighting for it is not even worth it. somalia will not gain anything, economically and it will bitter hate for future wars,

about the sea access to gulf of eden, we demand somalilands independce is on the condition that dhulbahante and warsanglis lands remains with us, its better that idoors dont claim dhulbahante lands, because they are surrounded by darood lands, if they dont solve this issue, this could create the seed for future conflict. Majertein for example might watch dhulbahante on their own, but trust me if Ogadenia becomes independent tomorrow, the first thing they will do is do something about their dhulo cousins. so its better for the mostly idoor populated regions to became somaliland. infact, i would even advice them to leave awdal alone, because awadal could tomorrow bring instability, for gadabursi wishes to decide his future himself just like the idoor.

we can also create something similar to an economic union, we get the several states to join a somali economic union, like Europe, what we could not achieve by war can be achieved by economic means. you will see the idoors apply for membership to join our union.... we need to turn peroblems into advanatges.

like the example of Canada....... the British side populated by english, irish scotish etc, is autonomous from the french side, the only thing they came together is when deciding war, but what most people dont know is there are actual islands of the Canadian coast owned by France, yet they trade and no visa is required when traveling between them and Canada proper, its been like this since 1763.

create an economic union were any group can leave at anytime, the idoors low population, lack of rivers, dry lands etc will make them seek membership because of the big population, better division of labour, one language, culture , religion, resources of the south and the center, ports and other infrastructures etc

if i was Siyad barre in the 70s, i would have advocated this policy..... allow every somali ego group to know he is not being kept by force, no excuse of darood ruling them etc, and rather then trying to get into a destructive 4 year war with Ogadens as he tried giving Afmadow and kismayo to MR, i would have given them some lands in shabbele hoose, rich green lands, rather then losing everything on that war and being kicked back to gedo.

[The_Emperior5]

Teeri Somaliland borders are indisputable any one who tries to undermine it will get a bullet through his head ask your Majeerteen cousins

but we can be friends the absames are the coolest of the darods we can deal with Barre ilyaas is a good supporter of us and we support the people of nfd the same with farah Macalin the NFD Somalis are good

And teeri we are not interested with federations or anything close to that you're majeerteen cousins are interested in that our mission is clear and simple full separation an independent republic Somalia is macasalama but we can work together as two brotherly nations and that's indeed the future the same with Djibouti.

Teeri my Clan lives in the Jigjiga zone mainly harta sheikh and cariray and my other cousins live in other parts of that region if Ogadeniya becomes independent i wish them also to be part of that new republic that is about to be born , thats why i also support the seccesion of Ogadeniya from Ethiopia we support it 100%

[zingii]

Teeri:

i do understand your point but i think u missunderstood the point i was trying to make.
lets say we chose the path of federalism and each state ellected their leader. How would
the top seat (presidency seat) be decided on?

Because the whole issue is about the top seat and not of state level.

[The_Emperior5]

Teeri:

i do understand your point but i think u missunderstood the point i was trying to make.
lets say we chose the path of federalism and each state ellected their leader. How would
the top seat (presidency seat) be decided on?

Because the whole issue is about the top seat and not of state level.

4.5 system is perfect

Hawiye president darod prime minister
darod president hawiye prime minister
and digil and xururufle speaker of parliament

and have you're federalism it can work

[Turbulence]

The Somaliland Myth is falling apart

They were saying that for 20 years

Yes no Recognition in twenty years

[Teeri]

Teeri Somaliland borders are indisputable any one who tries to undermine it will get a bullet through his head ask your Majeerteen cousins

but we can be friends the absames are the coolest of the darods we can deal with Barre ilyaas is a good supporter of us and we support the people of nfd the same with farah Macalin the NFD Somalis are good

And teeri we are not interested with federations or anything close to that you're majeerteen cousins are interested in that our mission is clear and simple full separation an independent republic Somalia is macasalama but we can work together as two brotherly nations and that's indeed the future the same with Djibouti.

Teeri my Clan lives in the Jigjiga zone mainly harta sheikh and cariray and my other cousins live in other parts of that region if Ogadeniya becomes independent i wish them also to be part of that new republic that is about to be born , thats why i also support the seccesion of Ogadeniya from Ethiopia we support it 100%

No hate, i admire Idoor unity.............. and please Emperior, dont say you Mj cousins, it offends me greatly.

if Idoor want independce, then good for them, no one can stop the most united group in somalia,its a fact. i just dont understand why somalis want to keep idoors in somalia, yet you keep running away from them

But my only condition is Dhulbahante, its wise for idoor to solve it now then face problems latter, because speaking as an Ogaden, we would not sit still and watch our brothers face the world on their own.

you need to understand the psychology of daroods,

MR is on his own, so is Mj,

the psychology of Ogaden is like this: Absame iyo Adherkood, after that is filled, Dhulbahante is the closest group to them on the face of the earth, then maybe other smaller daroods.

to be honest Marehan is close to ogaden too, but lately he has been acting like a little drink brother who abuses himself with cocaine and the family have given up on him till he sobers up, he seems to be listening to us in gedo with the currant affairs in jubbaland lately. there is still love somewhere in there

I actually think an idoor land independt is a good think, they will became free from ethiopian influence and there coould be good economic ties with the rest of somalia, like belgium and holland, they really hated each other, but economics brought them together.

please dont offend us by calling MJs my cousins,

[Teeri]

Teeri:

i do understand your point but i think u missunderstood the point i was trying to make.
lets say we chose the path of federalism and each state ellected their leader. How would
the top seat (presidency seat) be decided on?

Because the whole issue is about the top seat and not of state level.

firstly idoors dont want us, that is a fact, so would u rather shed muslim bloodd, destroy, borrow heavily and leave future cuqdad seeds? or let them take their own country minus dhulbahante lands.

secondly, federalsm is for the rest of us who want to be in somalia, like jubbas, punt, muduq etc,

also why not have like a NATO system where we defended ourselves like the EU but make our own decisions in matters of economic and political factors?

we will be independt, our own leaders, currency to give every somali the real idea that he is in charge of his own affairs, and those who can not suvvie will even wnat to join other states when they taste the reality of self rulership....... but our borders will be open for economic markets, visa etc.

we dont need to force evevryone to stay together, that is a shit paradigm, the swiz have been leaving like this since 14 hundreds, any canton can leave and declare indepence but they dont do it because its suicide economically......infact some cantons are quite new that broke from france and germany to join switzerland and some are even Italian speaking........ yet Europe is more united.

we need to stop forcing people who dont need to be with us.

[samatar133]

midnimda somaliland waa muqaddas cidkasta oo doqonnimo la timaadana xabad baa futada laga galinayaa. as for dhulbahante waa dad somalilander ah oo iyagu doortay somalilandernimda, hadii ay nacaanna xaq bay u leeyihiin inay tagaan meeshay rabaan. Arimaha somaliland looma ogola inay dadka ehtiopianka ahi ka hadlaan, ethiopia for ethiopians and somaliland for somalilander end of the story.

[The_Emperior5]

Teeri Somaliland borders are indisputable any one who tries to undermine it will get a bullet through his head ask your Majeerteen cousins

but we can be friends the absames are the coolest of the darods we can deal with Barre ilyaas is a good supporter of us and we support the people of nfd the same with farah Macalin the NFD Somalis are good

And teeri we are not interested with federations or anything close to that you're majeerteen cousins are interested in that our mission is clear and simple full separation an independent republic Somalia is macasalama but we can work together as two brotherly nations and that's indeed the future the same with Djibouti.

Teeri my Clan lives in the Jigjiga zone mainly harta sheikh and cariray and my other cousins live in other parts of that region if Ogadeniya becomes independent i wish them also to be part of that new republic that is about to be born , thats why i also support the seccesion of Ogadeniya from Ethiopia we support it 100%

No hate, i admire Idoor unity.............. and please Emperior, dont say you Mj cousins, it offends me greatly.

if Idoor want independce, then good for them, no one can stop the most united group in somalia,its a fact. i just dont understand why somalis want to keep idoors in somalia, yet you keep running away from them

But my only condition is Dhulbahante, its wise for idoor to solve it now then face problems latter, because speaking as an Ogaden, we would not sit still and watch our brothers face the world on their own.

you need to understand the psychology of daroods,

MR is on his own, so is Mj,

the psychology of Ogaden is like this: Absame iyo Adherkood, after that is filled, Dhulbahante is the closest group to them on the face of the earth, then maybe other smaller daroods.

to be honest Marehan is close to ogaden too, but lately he has been acting like a little drink brother who abuses himself with cocaine and the family have given up on him till he sobers up, he seems to be listening to us in gedo with the currant affairs in jubbaland lately. there is still love somewhere in there

I actually think an idoor land independt is a good think, they will became free from ethiopian influence and there coould be good economic ties with the rest of somalia, like belgium and holland, they really hated each other, but economics brought them together.

please dont offend us by calling MJs my cousins,

Cool don't worry about the Dhulbahante we consider them family there is an ssc party with in Somaliland now and days ask sahan galbeed he is the official Representative for the ssc party in the usa

i dont understand either why they feel so attached to us the koonfurians but they will get over it and yes u are right with a recognized Somaliland there will be no influence from Ethiopia in Somaliland , you know what is at stake.

[damu]

how is the south who needs UGANDA, BURUNDI, KENYA, ETHIOPIA to free themselves exactly going to take on the north?


"peace down south means war up north"
so if & i mean if the south achieves peace after 21 years of civil war their first order of business would be war against the north no wonder the south is messed up !!

[anonymousfaarax]

Teeri:

Dont federations have one head that acts as the top dowg who represents
them?

If so does it really make any difference because at the end of the day someone
has to act as the head of the combined states to voice their needs and wants to
the rest of the world.

Zingi, what is wrong with somali federation states choosing their leader, just like the malaysians, even some states in malaysia have their own sultans, but one over all leader is in my opinion that thing that elimniates the cuqdad, we know somalis like to boast we are self ruled etc.......

if any state wishes to break out, let them.. if the somalilands want to break out let them, why not?

this somaliland region is very dry, its so dry the Absames left it to seek green lands in todays Ogadenia, we know this, when my ancestors came to Jubbas and the NFD, they named areas like Garrisa and Hargesa yare in the Absame lands of the south,, yet both areas were in waaqoyi, the point is these idoors are very proud of this dry land, they are happy, fighting for it is not even worth it. somalia will not gain anything, economically and it will bitter hate for future wars,

about the sea access to gulf of eden, we demand somalilands independce is on the condition that dhulbahante and warsanglis lands remains with us, its better that idoors dont claim dhulbahante lands, because they are surrounded by darood lands, if they dont solve this issue, this could create the seed for future conflict. Majertein for example might watch dhulbahante on their own, but trust me if Ogadenia becomes independent tomorrow, the first thing they will do is do something about their dhulo cousins. so its better for the mostly idoor populated regions to became somaliland. infact, i would even advice them to leave awdal alone, because awadal could tomorrow bring instability, for gadabursi wishes to decide his future himself just like the idoor.

we can also create something similar to an economic union, we get the several states to join a somali economic union, like Europe, what we could not achieve by war can be achieved by economic means. you will see the idoors apply for membership to join our union.... we need to turn peroblems into advanatges.

like the example of Canada....... the British side populated by english, irish scotish etc, is autonomous from the french side, the only thing they came together is when deciding war, but what most people dont know is there are actual islands of the Canadian coast owned by France, yet they trade and no visa is required when traveling between them and Canada proper, its been like this since 1763.

create an economic union were any group can leave at anytime, the idoors low population, lack of rivers, dry lands etc will make them seek membership because of the big population, better division of labour, one language, culture , religion, resources of the south and the center, ports and other infrastructures etc

if i was Siyad barre in the 70s, i would have advocated this policy..... allow every somali ego group to know he is not being kept by force, no excuse of darood ruling them etc, and rather then trying to get into a destructive 4 year war with Ogadens as he tried giving Afmadow and kismayo to MR, i would have given them some lands in shabbele hoose, rich green lands, rather then losing everything on that war and being kicked back to gedo.

The system you propose sounds interesting. The question about how the leader (president/PM) is chosen is still outstanding though. However, there does seem something off about what you said. You recognise that Somalis need each other and need to work together for their commen good and interest, yet you still dont see all somali people as YOUR OWN people and this is a SERIOUS problem that undermines all that have said. Untill Somalis realise that (a) they are all brothers, (b) that their strength lies in their unity, cooperation and mutual respect and lastly (c) that there is a greater picture to consider (as Ogadenians of all people should know), they will not be able to secure any of their interests.

We need a workable formula for the unity, cooperation and mutual respect of all Somalis - we simply have no other choice because we do not live in a vacuum void of any external forces.

[anonymousfaarax]

Wars are mostly if not all are waged because of disagreements.

This is unlikely the case perhaps fighting over borders is something that i can understand but a full scale war i doubt it

The picture the writer paints says if i further try to highlight it:

the north doesn't want anything to do with the south (government wise) and yell "we aint comming back", whereby
the rest yell "you aint going no where".

Now as you can see the two believes contradict each other which will create animosity between the two thus enabling
arms conflict to take place.

This scenario is highly unlikely and the reason the author of this article reached this wrong conclusion is because the observations, projections and information he imput into the writing of this article are inaccurate as much as they are simplistic. To have a war, you need two [united] opposing forces who are willing and able to wage a war. This author has lumped 'the south' together as though it is one entity.

Runtaa fiican. Koonfurta Somalia wakhtigan, ama wakhti dhow, diyaar uma aha dagaal. Dowlad dhulka koonfurta u dhan na ma jirto, dhibaato Somaliland ay shacabka koonfurta ku haysona ma jirto. Hadii ay koonfur nabad hesho, Ilaahay ha siiyee, ilama aha inay kadib dagaal kale Somaliland (oo intaas nabad ahayd) ku bilaabi doonaan [ama karaan]. Waxa uga muhiimsan, ugana gudboon, inay dhulkooda dib u habeeyaan, dhaqaala dhisaan, shacabkana la daryeeltiro. Taasi ha ahaatee, waynu ognahay in siyaasiyiintu markastaba ayna samaynin waxa dalka iyo shacabkaba u fiican oo ay ayagu qorshe gaar ah lahaan karaan. Puntland siyaasiyiinteedu inkastoo ay beryo hore Somaliland dagaal ku qaadeen, madaxweynaha iminka haysta [faroole] wuxuu gartay inayna dan ugu jirin inuu dagaal xoogan ku qaado Somaliland. Lakiin si uu u 'cadeeyo', the perception being that as Puntland president should hold this view, in uu Somaliland ka soo horjeedo, xoogaa dhaqdhaqaaq iyo 'af-ka-hadal' wuu sameeya. Faroole wuu ogyahay, sida uu Silaanyo u ogyahay, in hadii uu dagaal xoogan ku qadoo kuwa kale, ay ayaguna sidaas oo kale uun yeeli lahaayeen. Sidaas oo kale, silaanyo wuu garanayaa in ayna dan ugu jirin inuu dagaal ku qaadin Puntland. There is now an unspoken de-facto border between labadan maamul - taasi way bedelmi kartaa hadii faroole iyo silaanyo ama ay meesha ka baxaan ama ay doorasho soo dhowaato. The extent to which there might be a war is greatly exxagerated.

The dirty love triangle that is Somaliland-SSC-Puntland is, though a different story, a story of a fight for hegemony in SSC and this is a moro likely conflict compared to a 'north v.s. south' war. However, even the likelihood for this as a full-scale, all out war is unlikely; reason being that as this SSC issue has evolved and unfolded, it is clear that Puntland-SSC-Somaliland realise, albeit bit-by-bit, that war and perpetual instability is not in their interests. Hence the 'de-facto' border.