Should we tolerate the death penalty?

[Basra-]

[union]

Life imprisonment is both a substantial punishment and a great deterrent for violent criminals. You don’t need to kill someone to punish/deter them. This may not satisfy the more vengeful families, who probably want the condemned to be tortured to death, but for everyone else it will be justice.

As for your question, my position has evolved with regarding to establishing free and democratic governments throughout the world. I no longer support violence to accomplish that. We can export our culture and way of governance through other peaceful ways, which I believe will be more effective. Violence should only be used as the last resort to protect freedom against imminent and unstoppable danger.

I have a hard time, telling someone who's lost a loved one, that their justice is seeing someone get 3 meals a day and a roof over their head.

and for your new position, it's a very respectable one.

I think the punitive nature of prison comes not from denying inmates basic necessities that are needed to maintain their existence, like food/shelter/healthcare, but depriving them of their freedom. The freedom to choose what they eat, where they live, what they do, etc. In a society where freedom is valued like oxygen, such a regimented lifestyle would be a punishment rivaling hell. Perhaps that would not be the case in places like Somalia, where three meals a day + shelter would be considered heaven on earth.

Anyway, laws should not be based on the irrational feeling of distraught victim families but the greater good of society. As it stands now, the death penalty is disproportionately imposed on minorities, used irresponsibly by overzealous prosecutors seeking to please a hysterical and vengeful voting public, responsible for the murder of innocent people undoubtedly. We must wash our hands of this barbaric practice.

[gurey25]

How ignorant and inhumane societies of the past dealt with criminals is not a timeless example of the proper way to deal with them. Criminals are human beings as well, entitled to the dignity and rights that are inalienable. I find the current 6 x 8 prison cells to be oppressive and inhumane, the idea of forced labor w/ electric collars is simply ludicrous. That’s definitely unconstitutional as well.

i do not consider the wests treatment of prisoners as the most humane or progressive.
and societies of the past were generally more humane than the west today,
prison was rare in the past, the more primitive a societies was the more humane it was generally.

i am against prisons , i am also against the death penalty except for child rapists and serial killers.
for developing contries prisons are unsustainable and a waste of resources anyway.

there is nothing wrong with forced labor w/ electric collars.
they committed a crime they pay for it with their labour, then they are released.
if combined with job training and rehabilitation it is more effective than prisons.

prisons simply breed more criminals, if you go in for a petty crime you will come out with advanced criminal skills, experienced criminal associates and
there is no real rehabilitation and when you go out, a normal life is almost impossible with ostracism from society.
You have no choice but to revert to crime, and more serious crime.
prison gives you the skills and the contacts to pull off these crimes.

and TV programes are deceptive, most criminals do get away with it.
most crimes are unsolved.

the only ones who get caught are first time offenders who are stupid, generally low IQ idiots and greedy bastards that come back for more after they have committed several crimes and got away with it.


The prison system especially in the US is a criminal breeding program, those who come out are not rehabilitated they come out better at committing crimes.

[union]

How ignorant and inhumane societies of the past dealt with criminals is not a timeless example of the proper way to deal with them. Criminals are human beings as well, entitled to the dignity and rights that are inalienable. I find the current 6 x 8 prison cells to be oppressive and inhumane, the idea of forced labor w/ electric collars is simply ludicrous. That’s definitely unconstitutional as well.

i do not consider the wests treatment of prisoners as the most humane or progressive.
and societies of the past were generally more humane than the west today,
prison was rare in the past, the more primitive a societies was the more humane it was generally.

i am against prisons , i am also against the death penalty except for child rapists and serial killers.
for developing contries prisons are unsustainable and a waste of resources anyway.

there is nothing wrong with forced labor w/ electric collars.
they committed a crime they pay for it with their labour, then they are released.
if combined with job training and rehabilitation it is more effective than prisons.

prisons simply breed more criminals, if you go in for a petty crime you will come out with advanced criminal skills, experienced criminal associates and
there is no real rehabilitation and when you go out, a normal life is almost impossible with ostracism from society.
You have no choice but to revert to crime, and more serious crime.
prison gives you the skills and the contacts to pull off these crimes.

and TV programes are deceptive, most criminals do get away with it.
most crimes are unsolved.

the only ones who get caught are first time offenders who are stupid, generally low IQ idiots and greedy bastards that come back for more after they have committed several crimes and got away with it.


The prison system especially in the US is a criminal breeding program, those who come out are not rehabilitated they come out better at committing crimes.

1.) You are making borderline troll remarks. "the more primitive a societies was the more humane it was generally". You can't be serious? You mean to tell me the ignorant and superstitious societies of the past (some of their elements still linger on) who used to impose the death penalty on people so they could sacrifice them to their many gods were humane??

2.) Again forced labor takes away jobs from other people, this is the problem we're having with China right now, and considering our immense 2 million strong prison population it's not a feasible idea. Stop repeating it, it's a terrible idea!

3.) I agree that our current prison system is not ideal. It must be reformed, we should look toward Scandinavia for a criminal system that is humane and rational, not based on hysteria and vengeful emotions.

[Mondey]

Death penalty is a perfect reward for criminals, rapists and others. it cleans the society from their filth and sets up examples for others not to go astray.
i'm supporting death penalty as long as it's in the following forms:

1- Beheading by sword.
2- stoning.
3- Throwing from high mountain.

i'm against death penalty in all other forms like the rope, electric chair, injections, firing etc.

[gurey25]

How ignorant and inhumane societies of the past dealt with criminals is not a timeless example of the proper way to deal with them. Criminals are human beings as well, entitled to the dignity and rights that are inalienable. I find the current 6 x 8 prison cells to be oppressive and inhumane, the idea of forced labor w/ electric collars is simply ludicrous. That’s definitely unconstitutional as well.

i do not consider the wests treatment of prisoners as the most humane or progressive.
and societies of the past were generally more humane than the west today,
prison was rare in the past, the more primitive a societies was the more humane it was generally.

i am against prisons , i am also against the death penalty except for child rapists and serial killers.
for developing contries prisons are unsustainable and a waste of resources anyway.

there is nothing wrong with forced labor w/ electric collars.
they committed a crime they pay for it with their labour, then they are released.
if combined with job training and rehabilitation it is more effective than prisons.

prisons simply breed more criminals, if you go in for a petty crime you will come out with advanced criminal skills, experienced criminal associates and
there is no real rehabilitation and when you go out, a normal life is almost impossible with ostracism from society.
You have no choice but to revert to crime, and more serious crime.
prison gives you the skills and the contacts to pull off these crimes.

and TV programes are deceptive, most criminals do get away with it.
most crimes are unsolved.

the only ones who get caught are first time offenders who are stupid, generally low IQ idiots and greedy bastards that come back for more after they have committed several crimes and got away with it.


The prison system especially in the US is a criminal breeding program, those who come out are not rehabilitated they come out better at committing crimes.

1.) You are making borderline troll remarks. "the more primitive a societies was the more humane it was generally". You can't be serious? You mean to tell me the ignorant and superstitious societies of the past (some of their elements still linger on) who used to impose the death penalty on people so they could sacrifice them to their many gods were humane??

2.) Again forced labor takes away jobs from other people, this is the problem we're having with China right now, and considering our immense 2 million strong prison population it's not a feasible idea. Stop repeating it, it's a terrible idea!

3.) I agree that our current prison system is not ideal. It must be reformed, we should look toward Scandinavia for a criminal system that is humane and rational, not based on hysteria and vengeful emotions.

1)you did not understand if you try to be objective and look at humanity like an alien outside would , step back and get perspective if you would.
you will see that the more "primitive" a culture is the weaker state structure or absence of one, the more you will see that capital punishment and other extreme forms including imprisonment was rare.
usually exile and ostracism and fines was used.
you should try to be less eurocentric..
The extreme penal code you see in most of the developing world is a leftover of colonialism.
for example every arab has the exact copy of the penal code used by european colonialsts against them to keep them in check.
they use it against their own population because it is too effective.
The Saudis who have not been conquered brought in egyptian lawyers and policemen to train them and get their own copy of extreme authoritarian laws.
If you compare even the oppressive ottoman code with the ones introduced by europeans it compares very well and is allot looser and freer.


2)This is not a valid argument because unemployment is a biproduct of the economic system, during the next cycle you will have a situation in which there are not enough people to do the jobs available.
what happens when mexico continues to develop? mexicans are already staying at home for better jobs and mexicans are leaving the US for mexico.
you already have a shortage of labour, but the economic crash disguises this shortage.
Bringing china into this is also not logical, because the transfer of jobs overseas to china and mexico is a deliberate action of corporation seeking profits.


3)nobody can afford the costs of operating a scandinavian system, even they are having difficulty.

[Cumar-Labasuul]

UK prisons

[union]

Gurrey this back and fourth simply cannot continue as I have little patience for ignorance. You must accept three things, 1) death penalty is inhumane and totally unacceptable, 2) We must reform our prison system to make it more humane, 3) criminals must be treated with dignity and have their rights safeguarded from trespass. If you refuse to accept all three of these points, you are a barbaric savage.

[union]

UK prisons

It looks pretty nice. Although the kid sized bunk beds are questionable.

[ElfRuler]

Why not?

As a capitalistic nation we shouldn't waste tax payers' money on paying for the medical coverage of an aging prison population, and most certainly not those who deserve to die.

[union]

Why not?

As a capitalistic nation we shouldn't waste tax payers' money on paying for the medical coverage of an aging prison population, and most certainly not those who deserve to die.

Why do you say they deserve to die?

[ElfRuler]

Why not?

As a capitalistic nation we shouldn't waste tax payers' money on paying for the medical coverage of an aging prison population, and most certainly not those who deserve to die.

Why do you say they deserve to die?

Because the law of the land has sentenced them to death.

The courts have the ability and the right to sentence a criminal to death depending on the evidence presented against the criminal.

[union]

Why not?

As a capitalistic nation we shouldn't waste tax payers' money on paying for the medical coverage of an aging prison population, and most certainly not those who deserve to die.

Why do you say they deserve to die?

Because the law of the land has sentenced them to death.

The courts have the ability and the right to sentence a criminal to death depending on the evidence presented against the criminal.

Your first post made it sound as if you wanted execute aging prisoners to save money.

[ElfRuler]

Your first post made it sound as if you wanted execute aging prisoners to save money.

That won't be a bad idea either. Call it mercy killing.

[union]

Your first post made it sound as if you wanted execute aging prisoners to save money.

That won't be a bad idea either. Call it mercy killing.