I might be able to bring her back....

[Jugjugwacwac]

Let me explain why I think this way. Many many Somalis have a liberal outlook that is anithetical to Islam. They wholeheartedly endorse democracy (aspects of it that can't be reconciled with the deen), feminism and western conceptions of freedom and human rights. Now, either they are extremely ignorant of the deen and don't see the contradictions in their beliefs, or they're suffering from extreme cognitive dissonance as they attempt to be true Muslims and true liberals simultaneously, or they just pay lip service to deen just to make life easier for themselves but don't really believe or support the following: that men and women aren't equal, that slavery and concubinage aren't haram, that the Shariah endorses severe corporeal punishment for severe crimes, that the Prophet (PBUH) married Aisha when she was quite young, that the husband may lightly beat his wife in extreme cases, that you need two female witnesses to stand in for one male witness, that a man may marry up to four women, and the list goes on. These things upset them and they just cant accept any of it. And as we all know, if you reject a part of Islam you're no longer a Muslim.

Now that I've reframed the issue, what percent of Somalis do you think have no problems with those aspects of Islam I've stated above?

[ciddhartha]

Let me explain why I think this way. Many many Somalis have a liberal outlook that is anithetical to Islam. They wholeheartedly endorse democracy (aspects of it that can't be reconciled with the deen), feminism and western conceptions of freedom and human rights. Now, either they are extremely ignorant of the deen and don't see the contradictions in their beliefs, or they're suffering from extreme cognitive dissonance as they attempt to be true Muslims and true liberals simultaneously, or they just pay lip service to deen just to make life easier for themselves but don't really believe or support the following: that men and women aren't equal, that slavery and concubinage isnt haram, that the Shariah endorses severe corporeal punishment for severe crimes, that the Prophet (PBUH) married Aisha when she was quite young, that the husband may lightly beat his wife in extreme cases, that you need two female witnesses to stand in for one male witness, that a man may marry up to four women, and the list goes on. These things upset them and they just cant accept any of it. And as we all know, if you reject a part of Islam you're no longer a Muslim.

Now that I've reframed the issue, what percent of Somalis do you think have no problems with those aspects of Islam I've stated above?

YAAAASSSSSS!!

[Jugjugwacwac]

Ciddhartha, I'm actually on the pro-Islam team, but I can see why you'd like my post.

[zumaale]

And let me explain why I think this way. Many many Somalis have a liberal outlook that is anithetical to Islam. They wholeheartedly endorse democracy (aspects of it that can't be reconciled with the deen), feminism and western conceptions of freedom and human rights. Now, either they are extremely ignorant of the deen and don't see the contradictions in their beliefs, or they're suffering from extreme cognitive dissonance as they attempt to be true Muslims and true liberals simultaneously, or they just pay lip service to deen just to make life easier for themselves but don't really believe or support the following: that men and women aren't equal, that slavery and concubinage isnt haram, that the Shariah endorses severe corpeal punishment for severe crimes, that the Prophet (PBUH) married Aisha when she was quite young, that the husband may lightly beat his wife in extreme cases, that you need two female witnesses to stand in for one male witness, that a man may marry up to four women, and the list goes on. These things upset them and they just cant accept any of it.

Now that I've reframed the issue, what percent of Somalis do you think have no problems with those aspects of Islam I've stated above?

Could not have said it better myself.

The ones that adopt 'I will take it or leave it' approach I can understand but the ones that attempt to twist the Deen to suit their narrative are delusional. When they encounter Islamic facts that are not to their liking they argue that it comes down to interpretation of the Deen when certain facts are set in stone. Particularly rulings that have a basis in the Quran or mutawatir hadiths.

The percentage of Somalis that have a problem with he Deen in the West is relatively high I would argue as a result of adherence to 'liberal' values that cannot be reconciled with Islam as practised by the Prophet SAWS and the Sahaba. Furthermore, some women that have grown up in western societies with little tutoring in Islam or have been influenced by feminist ideas find it hard to swallow their 'restricted' role outside the home and the authority that Islam bestows upon men in legal or social matters.

[ciddhartha]

Ciddhartha, I'm actually on the pro-Islam team, but I can see why you'd like my post.

I know, but hey you kept it 100. A lot of people can't admit that.

[Cherine]

PO I agree. You've a way with words plus extensive knowledge on a wide range of topics.

This is not a debate thread guys.

[Jugjugwacwac]

I know, but hey you kept it 100. A lot of people can't admit that.

Thanks, I pride myself on intellectual/ideological congruence or else I'm playing games with myself and everyone who knows me, and most of all Ilaahay.

[Murax]

Islam is a blessing, a Ni'mah. Abu Talib the closest Uncle to the Prophet SAW and the one who supported Him to His last day in Hellfire. Wahshy RA the one who killed the Hamza Bin AbdulMutallib RAW in Jennah. Allah guides whom He wills.

[SummerRain]

Let me explain why I think this way. Many many Somalis have a liberal outlook that is anithetical to Islam. They wholeheartedly endorse democracy (aspects of it that can't be reconciled with the deen), feminism and western conceptions of freedom and human rights. Now, either they are extremely ignorant of the deen and don't see the contradictions in their beliefs, or they're suffering from extreme cognitive dissonance as they attempt to be true Muslims and true liberals simultaneously, or they just pay lip service to deen just to make life easier for themselves but don't really believe or support the following: that men and women aren't equal, that slavery and concubinage isnt haram, that the Shariah endorses severe corporeal punishment for severe crimes, that the Prophet (PBUH) married Aisha when she was quite young, that the husband may lightly beat his wife in extreme cases, that you need two female witnesses to stand in for one male witness, that a man may marry up to four women, and the list goes on. These things upset them and they just cant accept any of it. And as we all know, if you reject a part of Islam you're no longer a Muslim.

Now that I've reframed the issue, what percent of Somalis do you think have no problems with those aspects of Islam I've stated above?

Such a refreshing post!!

I would add that everything in Islam can be up for interpretations expect for the fundamental princples and what is prohibited. You write as if you listened or read too much of Tariq Ramadan.

[Jugjugwacwac]

.

[Jugjugwacwac]

Could not have said it better myself.

The ones that adopt 'I will take it or leave it' approach I can understand but the ones that attempt to twist the Deen to suit their narrative are delusional. When they encounter Islamic facts that are not to their liking they argue that it comes down to interpretation of the Deen when certain facts are set in stone. Particularly rulings that have a basis in the Quran or mutawatir hadiths.

The percentage of Somalis that have a problem with he Deen in the West is relatively high I would argue as a result of adherence to 'liberal' values that cannot be reconciled with Islam as practised by the Prophet SAWS and the Sahaba. Furthermore, some women that have grown up in western societies with little tutoring in Islam or have been influenced by feminist ideas find it hard to swallow their 'restricted' role outside the home and the authority that Islam bestows upon men in legal or social matters.

This is a man who gets it. Hats off to you bro.

[Jugjugwacwac]

Such a refreshing post!!

I would add that everything in Islam can be up for interpretations expect for the fundamental princples and what is prohibited. You write as if you listened or read too much of Tariq Ramadan.

I haven't come across much of his work actually, though I do know he's one of the most well known Muslim public intellectuals.

[TheMailMan]

These people need to get acquainted with some Hamza Yusuf and Mufti Menk.

They only have a problem with Islam because it contradicts THEIR vision of the world. They need to understand that they're not infallible and can be wrong. Everyone knows about how global norms have changed drastically just in the last 100 years.

Western civilization norms don't stand the test of time. But Islamic principles do, and people need to acquaint themselves with Islam and see its beauty. Allah guides whom He wills.

[abdikarim86]

From the way things are progressing I believe
the religion will return to being viewed as a strange thing.

The century of the self beckons .....

[SummerRain]

.