I Need Answers!!!

[MujahidAishah]

He was jailed then sent aboard as an ambassador then re jailed with carte..

Siyad saw cigaal as a threat because he was the most educated guy in somalia with the most political experience

[26June1960]

You're making it seem like the Mengistu-backed SNM rebels were strong enough to oust the Kacaan out of power. The SNM were the weakest rebel group in Somalia, despite being the most heavily armed from 1981 to 1990. For 9 years, they were in the bushes of Somali Galbeed, doing hit and runs against civilians and soldiers in Waqooyi Galbeed and Togdheer regions of Northern Somalia and then crossing back across the border into Ethiopia. Hawiye (USC), SPM and inter-Daarod rivalry caused the end of the Kacaan.

Don't derail my thread. Go read ur revisionst fairytales. U were Dervishes while we were gaalo-raac, u were Boqors who enslaved Habar-gidir, Ahmed Gurey was Mareexaan, Siyaad Barre waa aabaha Soomaalida and all the rest of ur gacan-kurimis history ee habeenkii la idinku seexiyo. Ur input is not needed here sxb.

Dervishes? Gaalo-raac? Boqors? Ahmed Gurey? I never mentioned any of that. Just telling you, give credit where it's due, Hawiye vs Daarod and inter-Hawiye and inter-Daarod fighting really brought down the Somali Republic to it's knees. Not couple of khat chewing, lice-induced Mengistu lackeys in the bushes of Ethiopia's Somali Region for 9 years.

[CigaalSHiiDaaDCFC]

What's pure

According to him ur tainted lol.

just pulling ur leg bro. to be honest i respect your opinion and of course u can be issaq and believe somaliweyn. but there's nothing for you to be in that group if you arnt pro sland marka stop asking.

[Xildiiid]

JugJug,

Afweyne's regime was responsible for the atrocities committed in SL. The extrajudicial killings, the psychological intimidation, the economic policy with the aim of destroying Isaaq wealth, the use of landmines, the war against the nomads, the destruction of Isaaq society, it all started in 1981. The SNM was created in 1981 as a result of Afweyne's policies.

------------------------------------------------------------

Using military strikes against civilian targets

The Somali military used artillery and aerial bombardment in heavily populated areas in order to retake Burao and Hargeisa, although there were no SNM combatants there.

U.S. Government Accountability Office (GAO), SOMALIA: Observations Regarding the Northern Conflict and Resulting Conditions.

-Under the Geneva convention these types of attacks are indiscriminate and Afweyne, under international law, was obliged to protect civilian lives but he didn't because his goal was to wipe out Isaaq civilians not save them as you can see in the quotation above.

-Here we got another quotation that describes how Afweyne's regime evacuated non Isaaq civilians in order to maximize the death and destruction.

The government used loudspeakers to sort the civilians out into Darood and Isaak. They would shout, ''Who's is from Galkayo? Mogadishu? Las Anod, Garoe?''[Non-Isaak territory]. They appealed to the non-Isaaks to leave so they could burn the town and all those who remained behind. Most of the people from these towns left; the government provided them with transportation.

Human Right Watch - A government at war with its own people.

-----------------------------------------------------------------

Economic punishment and government policies.

-The accounts of an Isaaq businesswoman interviewed by the HRW, who was the manager of Oriental Hotel in Hargeisa and her encounter with Afweyne Barre in Mogadishu after being detained by the NSS simply because her late father's business was profitable.

Eventually, I was taken to see the President. The President started talking politics straight away. He launched into an attack against Isaaks and against me. He had no kind words to say in spite of our ordeal. He commented, ''What you Isaaks deserve is not be detained but shot on the spot after you commit such offenses''. I asked him, ''what have we done?'' I said I was not aware of aything illegal that I had done. He emphasized, again and again, the ''arrogance'' of the Isaaks.

- The quote above reminds me of that humiliation study posted by a former snetter that describes how Afweyne, the former Italian Zaptie not even a real military soldier, felt humiliated at the hands of Isaaq generals trained at the Royal Military Academy of Sandhurst in his early days, which lead to his pathologic hatred for the Isaaq clan. Eventough one can say that all Darood suffer from pathologic hatred because of their inferiority complex nonetheless..

Isaak businessmen, both in the north and in the south, suffered from discriminatory practices. Lines of credit at state banks were severely restricted, which was a major blow to businessmen as there are no private banks in Somalia. No Isaak could participate on equal footing in government tenders. Now could Isaak businessmen obtain loans from banks, unless this was facilitated by a non-Isaak crony of the authority.

Isaaks in Mogadishu were also at a severe disadvantage. She describe the example of Hashi Afboor, who tried to obtain money from his bank account in Mogadishu in 1986. He was told he could withdraw the amount he requested on condition that he gave four non-Isaak men the money with which to start business.

In the marketplace in Hargeisa, women who had sewing machines had to pay 10 shillings a day and 3,000 shilling every six months. Even women selling milk did not escape. They paid 10 shillings for the spot on the ground that each container occupied and 3,000 shillings every six months. Of course, all these regulation affected principally the Isaaks. When the odd non-Isaak was affected, once it was established that they were not Isaaks, he or she would be compensated.

HRW - A government at war with its own people.

--------------------------------
The regime's policies

A confidential report from General Morgan to President Barre leaked to the international press in February 1987 detalied the policies that Morgan had been implementing to ''liquadate'' what he referred to as the ''Isaak problem'' and which he was recommending to the president. Te measures spelled out in the letter included confiscating the property of Isaaks and redistributing their wealth; suspending their business licences; freezing the bank accounts of Isaak businessmen and destroying their businesses by giving opportunities to non-Isaaks; purging Isaaks from all sensitive government positions; accelerating the enrollment of the children of the refugees into local schools in order to ensure a ''balance''; relocating villages, destroying water reservoirs and resettling Ethiopian refugees on Isaak territory.

The government had at its disposal, a formidable array of extra-legal sanctions that it used to wage a more subtle kind of political warfare. A system known as ''Isaak Extermination'' (''Dabar Goynta Isaaka'') was put into effect.

-------------------------------------------
The war against Isaaq nomads

Dabar Goynta Isaaka (''The Isaak Exterminators''), a well-mechanized section of the army which consisted entirely of non Isaaks, widely regarded as one of the most abusive forces engaged in counter-insurgency activities, was responsible for ''dealing'' with the nomads. They, and other branches of the military terrorized the countryside.

In late June or early July 1987, the governor of Las Anod was killed by the SNM. The military demanded that Isaaks civilians living in the region pay 120 camels ''in exchange'', although they had nothing to do with the killing.

Whenever the military suffered a defeat in an encounter with the SNM, they killed some nomads in the area. Then they brought their dead bodies to towns, saying, ''We have killed some Ethiopians - come and see for yourselves''

When confronted by the military, nomads would be extravagantly generous, hoping that would appease their ''guests'' and they would be left in peace. At the end of 1987, some soldiers visited Aw Harrir Nur. He was very hospitable. They repaid him by raping his daughter and ill treating his wife. When he protested, they beat him.

In January 1989, Community Aid Abroad, an Australian agency operating in the Sanaag region reported that:
Widespread massacre occured after 2 soldiers were blown up with a landmine in Elafweyn District. In reprisal the military commander of Sanaag ordered the deaths of 200 nomands. One hundred and three men, women and children were slaughtered the following day.

Nomads arrested in the countryside were brought to Hargeisa to be executed. These poor people would be forced to wear whar the government described as ''SNM uniforms'' and were paraded in the National Theater.

In August 1985, an army truck was blown up on a two mile feeder road that connected the main asphalt road to the military barracks near Arabsiyo. The driver was killed. The army responded with massive retaliation against the residents living within 30 kilometers of the area; many residents were shot, livestock confiscated and many huts butned.

After spending so much money in constructing reservoirs, the owners were often not even allowed to drink from them, never mind their animals. If there were soldiers living in the aream the reservoirs became theirs

HRW - A government at war with its own people.

-------------------------------------
Rape as weapon of war,

Rape by soldiers became common. It was particularly frequent in the countryside. Those who could send a daughter out of the country did so.

Often, when they came to search houses, they raped any attractive woman they saw, saying, ''Instead of giving birth to a ''qurmis'', I will force her to have a pro-government bastard. It's better than what they give birth to anyway''. Isaak men would constantly be told, ''Go and get those prostitutes of yours'' - meaning their sisters and daughters.

They would kick the man out of the house and soldiers forced him to remain outside while the women were raped by other soldiers. Just to humiliate the men, they did no even spare the old women. Sometimes women were gang-raped. This is really what made the SNM expand. So many storekeepers, traders and tea shop owners just locked up and left to join the SNM, feeling that they couldn't just sit around watching this happen to their wives daughters, sisters and the relatives of their friends and neighbors.

HRW - A government at war with its own people.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Destroying the social fabric and basic elements of the society,

It got to a point that the people of the region became invisible, no matter what their qualifications or qualities. They were worse off than foreigners; they became a people with no rights in their own country. Every group was encouraged to watch over the others, as the only way to protect themselves. It destroyed community life. Neighbors became suspicious of each other.

Education deteriorated year after year. After only two hours at schools, the teachers would leave. Those were the conscientious ones. The other simply never turned up. The students could see that both the living confitions and the political situation were getting worse every year. Soldiers came to the schools with the their tanks and fired into the air. Students ran and then they would be arrested and beaten. Those who really could not tolerate the situation left to join the SNM

HRW - A government at war with its own people.

------------------------------------------------------------------

[Bella18]

Bcz u don't sound pure.

What's gotten into you chelski?

Thanks sis, ur support is appreciated. These guys make me feel I left the deen or something. In fact x.playa who actually did leave the deen is never grilled this hard lol.

Waxaas dheg haa uu dhigin walaal, heerkaas ayeey qabyaalada dadka qaarkooda dhigtay.

[CigaalSHiiDaaDCFC]

Bcz u don't sound pure.

What's gotten into you chelski?

Thanks sis, ur support is appreciated. These guys make me feel I left the deen or something. In fact x.playa who actually did leave the deen is never grilled this hard lol.

Waxaas dheg haa uu dhigin walaal, heerkaas ayeey qabyaalada dadka qaarkooda dhigtay.

just pulling ur leg bro. to be honest i respect your opinion and of course u can be issaq and believe somaliweyn.

just bored

[Xildiiid]

You're making it seem like the Mengistu-backed SNM rebels were strong enough to oust the Kacaan out of power. The SNM were the weakest rebel group in Somalia, despite being the most heavily armed from 1981 to 1990. For 9 years, they were in the bushes of Somali Galbeed, doing hit and runs against civilians and soldiers in Waqooyi Galbeed and Togdheer regions of Northern Somalia and then crossing back across the border into Ethiopia. Hawiye (USC), SPM and inter-Daarod rivalry caused the end of the Kacaan.

Don't derail my thread. Go read ur revisionst fairytales. U were Dervishes while we were gaalo-raac, u were Boqors who enslaved Habar-gidir, Ahmed Gurey was Mareexaan, Siyaad Barre waa aabaha Soomaalida and all the rest of ur gacan-kurimis history ee habeenkii la idinku seexiyo. Ur input is not needed here sxb.

Dervishes? Gaalo-raac? Boqors? Ahmed Gurey? I never mentioned any of that. Just telling you, give credit where it's due, Hawiye vs Daarod and inter-Hawiye and inter-Daarod fighting really brought down the Somali Republic to it's knees. Not couple of khat chewing, lice-induced Mengistu lackeys in the bushes of Ethiopia's Somali Region for 9 years.

The SNM fought the 26th and 21st division of the SNA while the USC and SPM terrorized, raped and looted innocent civilians.

We fought an honorable war and we destroyed the Kacaan junta.

Rebel militiamen belonging to the Somali National Movement

Caption: ZEILA, Awdal: Rebel militiamen belonging to the Somali National Movement, fighting the regime of dictator Mohamed Siad Barre,
load an anti-aircraft twins cannon near the town of Zeila, northern Somalia in October 1989
AFP PHOTO ALEXANDER JOE (Photo credit should read ALEXANDER JOE/AFP/Getty Images)

Date created:01 Oct 1989

Certainly, by mid-1989 the SNM felt strong enough to commence a large offensive in the north of Somalia. This was launched in December 1989 and resulted in the capture of 95% of the region two months later. During this time the insurgents were well-equipped, downing two F-6s in December 1989 and an An-26 transport in January, 1990, leaving only one operational aircraft of this type to the SAC, as the third example was not airworthy any more, after being cannibalized for spares and left to rot on Mogadishu Airport....

...Only some six MiG-21s and two Hunters were left in southern Somalia.

We destroyed the Zoomali airforce to the point that Rhodesian mercenaries were hired.

On 27 October 1990 the troops besieged at Berbera attempted a break-out with support of a SAC fighter-detachment – but failed. The fall of Berbera sent shock-waves through the SAC, when a number of officers realized that the times of Barre’s regime were over.

[Jugjugwacwac]

Xildiid, I really appreciate the effort you're putting into convincing me by providing all that information. I agree once hundred percent that the Kacaans response to the SNM's formation in 1981 was barbaric and notjing short of evil. No one can deny that. What I'm asking of you is to show me excatly why we formed the SNM in the first place. You sources are all talking about the evils committed by the regime after their formation.

[Jugjugwacwac]

Xildiid, I really appreciate the effort you're putting into convincing me by providing all that information. I agree once hundred percent that the Kacaans response to the SNM's formation in 1981 was barbaric and nothing short of evil. No one can deny that. What I'm asking of you is to show me excatly why we formed the SNM in the first place. You sources are all talking about the evils committed by the regime after their formation.

[Xildiiid]

Violent and repressive tactics by the Kacaan junta against Isaaq civilians lead to the formation of the SNM. It's stated in the HRW report and also in a book called Understanding Statebuilding: Traditional Governance and the Modern State in Somaliland

You are a disgusting individual because you're trying to blame the SNM for the demise of Zoomalia.

[26June1960]

Xildiid, I really appreciate the effort you're putting into convincing me by providing all that information. I agree once hundred percent that the Kacaans response to the SNM's formation in 1981 was barbaric and notjing short of evil. No one can deny that. What I'm asking of you is to show me excatly why we formed the SNM in the first place. You sources are all talking about the evils committed by the regime after their formation.

If the Kacaan was anti-Isaaq (which I hardly believe it was, not to mention Isaaq held high positions within the Kacaan), then don't you think...maybe, just maybe, the Kacaan would've bombarded Hargeisa anytime from 1969 to 1987? Funny how the Kacaan only bombarded parts of Hargeisa that was under SNM occupation in 1988. Had SNM rebels didn't attack, infiltrate the population and occupy parts of Somalia's second largest city, the government would not have responded the way it had.

[Lancer]

Start off with the HRW Xildiid quoted, it discusses the grievances we held and how the government responded it great details. BTW don't you have relatives or parents who lived during this time? Ask what they or people they know experienced and if you still continue to revere that brutal regime after than god help you.

[Jugjugwacwac]

Violent and repressive tactics by the Kacaan junta against Isaaq civilians lead to the formation of the SNM. It's stated in the HRW report and also in a book called Understanding Statebuilding: Traditional Governance and the Modern State in Somaliland

You are a disgusting individual because you're trying to blame the SNM for the demise of Zoomalia.

I was trying to bite my tongue for a while, but ur nothing but an irrational low-iq emotional mess who has no place engaging in an exchange of ideas. Just as we were getting somewhere u resort to childish ad hominems as if they somehow magically prove you to be right. Foolish.

[Jugjugwacwac]

Start off with the HRW Xildiid quoted, it discusses the grievances we held and how the government responded it great details. BTW don't you have relatives or parents who lived during this time? Ask what they or people they know experienced and if you still continue to revere that brutal regime after than god help you.

Parents and relatives were unable to give me the specifics I'm looking for. I'll read the full HRW report, but the parts quoted by Xildiid are talking about things that happened after the SNM was already created.

[Siciid85]

You're making it seem like the Mengistu-backed SNM rebels were strong enough to oust the Kacaan out of power. The SNM were the weakest rebel group in Somalia, despite being the most heavily armed from 1981 to 1990. For 9 years, they were in the bushes of Somali Galbeed, doing hit and runs against civilians and soldiers in Waqooyi Galbeed and Togdheer regions of Northern Somalia and then crossing back across the border into Ethiopia. Hawiye (USC), SPM and inter-Daarod rivalry caused the end of the Kacaan.

Don't derail my thread. Go read ur revisionst fairytales. U were Dervishes while we were gaalo-raac, u were Boqors who enslaved Habar-gidir, Ahmed Gurey was Mareexaan, Siyaad Barre waa aabaha Soomaalida and all the rest of ur gacan-kurimis history ee habeenkii la idinku seexiyo. Ur input is not needed here sxb.

Dervishes? Gaalo-raac? Boqors? Ahmed Gurey? I never mentioned any of that. Just telling you, give credit where it's due, Hawiye vs Daarod and inter-Hawiye and inter-Daarod fighting really brought down the Somali Republic to it's knees. Not couple of khat chewing, lice-induced Mengistu lackeys in the bushes of Ethiopia's Somali Region for 9 years.

Those khat chewing lice induced are owning you today. How you like them apples?