Should somalia be a secular country?

[Malachite]

Personally couldn't give a toss about the separation of state and religion what I do care about is the separation of politics and religion

[SiennaEarth]

Too bad all your opinions mean nothing.

[Malachite]

Says the self-proclaimed hardcore hijabless "salafi"....I think your opinion matters the least

[Typhoon]

In principle we the Eaglehawk movement have no problem with secularism, if you mean American secularism rather than soviet, chinese, Turkish kemalist or French secularism

There is only one condition that god fearing conservative patriotic Eaglehawk members require and that is, the judiciary should be absolutely independent and it should have full authority in matters of government oversight. No legislation can be passed nor can any cultural or moral view be promoted by the government without the consent of the judiciary

The judiciary should have full access to all the state organs and documents and the judiciary should be immune from prosecution or any undue influence from government or outside forces beyond the Islamic tradition and they should have similar privileges as military courts

The government should collect taxes on behave of the judiciary from the citizens

The judiciary should be equal in power to the executive and legislative branch combined.

The government should relinquish any claim to sovereignty and acknowledge that allah is malik al mulk and Al-Ḥakam and that, the will of allah overrides the people and international obligations

The government should affirm their position as Stewart rather than sovereign authority

No policy can be formulated without respecting the views of the judiciary and consulting them throughout the whole process of policy making

The chairmanship of parliament committees should be appointed by the judiciary for they are impartial in matter of political discussions
The government should affirm that neither, the people, land nor the state authority are sovereign

The government should never ever intervene in the affairs of religion nor tax religious institution or legislate against or for particular religious trend

The judiciary shall accept no foreign or domestic regulations that contradicts the principles of ahlu Sunnah wal jamaaca
If the government accepted the mentioned conditions then I have no problem with their secular governance
In matters of war, the judiciary shall have oversight and veto about military doctrine and the judiciary shal should formulate all military ethical procedures

The judiciary should not interfere in matter of strategy or governance of the military

The state media and public schools the property of the judiciary (the judiciary shall outsource the management of these institutions to technocrats but these organisations should not be part of the government bureaucracy)

This is my secularism which will guard us from the malicious encroachment of seasonal ideologies that constantly revolutionize society.

There is a difference between secularism and liberalism most of you think the two are the same

[Kaafiye]

It's a little obvious why Mclovin, KTS, and Abdi Johnson would support a secular state, but since these people aren't even Muslim....then their opinions shouldn't even matter at all.

I vote for an Islamic model that governs Somalia. Of course I wouldn't want it to be anything like Taliban-run Afghanistan or Al-Shabab run Somalia....but we would want there to be a strong Islamic influence in the country. And for Islam to be the official state religion of Somalia (which it already is )

[mclovin]

In principle we the Eaglehawk movement have no problem with secularism, if you mean American secularism rather than soviet, chinese, Turkish kemalist or French secularism

There is only one condition that god fearing conservative patriotic Eaglehawk members require and that is, the judiciary should be absolutely independent and it should have full authority in matters of government oversight. No legislation can be passed nor can any cultural or moral view be promoted by the government without the consent of the judiciary

The judiciary should have full access to all the state organs and documents and the judiciary should be immune from prosecution or any undue influence from government or outside forces beyond the Islamic tradition and they should have similar privileges as military courts

The government should collect taxes on behave of the judiciary from the citizens

The judiciary should be equal in power to the executive and legislative branch combined.

The government should relinquish any claim to sovereignty and acknowledge that allah is malik al mulk and Al-Ḥakam and that, the will of allah overrides the people and international obligations

The government should affirm their position as Stewart rather than sovereign authority

No policy can be formulated without respecting the views of the judiciary and consulting them throughout the whole process of policy making

The chairmanship of parliament committees should be appointed by the judiciary for they are impartial in matter of political discussions
The government should affirm that neither, the people, land nor the state authority are sovereign

The government should never ever intervene in the affairs of religion nor tax religious institution or legislate against or for particular religious trend

The judiciary shall accept no foreign or domestic regulations that contradicts the principles of ahlu Sunnah wal jamaaca
If the government accepted the mentioned conditions then I have no problem with their secular governance
In matters of war, the judiciary shall have oversight and veto about military doctrine and the judiciary shal should formulate all military ethical procedures

The judiciary should not interfere in matter of strategy or governance of the military

The state media and public schools the property of the judiciary (the judiciary shall outsource the management of these institutions to technocrats but these organisations should not be part of the government bureaucracy)

This is my secularism which will guard us from the malicious encroachment of seasonal ideologies that constantly revolutionize society.

There is a difference between secularism and liberalism most of you think the two are the same

Although i agree that secularism is not the same as liberalism, What you just described is not secularism. In a secular state, the government would not recognize Allah as malik ul mulk, nor Jesus as the lord and savior, nor Brahman as the center of all being. The government would impartial to all faiths, religion, and creeds. This "judiciary" you speak of would end up being the de-facto supreme branch of the government. Any attempt to separate it from the government would be purely for semantics and not in functionality. So, your positions are inherently against the idea secularism and trending more toward Islamic theocracy.

As far as my vision of a secular state, the government should not enforce religion, nor should it restrict it. People should be free to follow the religious values dedicated by their respective faiths, but never should religious values be forced upon someone, even if they themselves are a member of that religion. People should be free to enter and leave what religion they choose without fear or persecution. People should be able to freely access any information not relating to national security, even if it contradicts and even criticizes a religion but, this information should not be forced on anyone.

Lakum deenukum wa liya deen. Even though, i don't believe in the quran there is at least some wisdom in it.

[mclovin]

It's a little obvious why Mclovin, KTS, and Abdi Johnson would support a secular state, but since these people aren't even Muslim....then their opinions shouldn't even matter at all.

I vote for an Islamic model that governs Somalia. Of course I wouldn't want it to be anything like Taliban-run Afghanistan or Al-Shabab run Somalia....but we would want there to be a strong Islamic influence in the country. And for Islam to be the official state religion of Somalia (which it already is )

I'm still not sure what your views on sharia actually are. You said that you don't want an state like what the taliban or al-shabab implemented, yet you want islam to have a strong influence in the society. What would be included in your ideal somalia? Would hudud punishments still be carried out? Would there be a constitution? Which school of fiqh would you prefer and why? Finally, how would it be different from the Taliban or Al-Shabab when they were heads of state and what caused them to deviate from the ideal islamic state?