Somali 16th century tribes

[skywalker25]

You people need to leave the poor girl alone.

Somalis can't accept someone who thinks different. They want the exact same type of people like they are rolling of a manufacturing plant.

Let the girl be

[KnowThySelf23]

Sexism is a western concept not a universal ideology so stop upholding it as some established form of discrimination across the world. In my society, we mainly adhere to Islamic and cultural ideas on gender roles. Women can lead fulfilling lives outside their home but the general concensus among Islamic scholars and our cultural norms is that they are primarily homemakers and mothers. So every time you use the word 'sexist', you are indirectly stating that the Deen is wrong for identifying the diverse roles that males and females have in a household. Now please, think carefully before you type, you speak impulsively.

K...

1) sexism is a world wide concept...the only ones that don't accept it are arabs and africans (not surprising what so ever)

2) your society? which society is that? in every somali household I've been too the women were in charge...in SOMALI culture women are the ones who run the house hold, the children and the men....idk what kind of wahabi country your from but there's certainly nothing somali about degrading women

3) islamic rules does not say that women only cook and clean the kitchen and cannot lead nor think for herself....wtf? don't bring this saudi bulshit to somalia....

4) nobody is saying women cannot be mothers at home....but islam doesn't say that women belong in the kitchen and are responsible for home making...that is a mans responsibility too smh....

5) its easy to speak from a mans point of view and say it is "deen" that women are 2nd to men, or their only house makers and mothers...but if you were in those shoes you wouldn't be advocating for it so much

6) sexism isn't against deen....its very essence is about gender equality...why do you think women should be less then men? theirs nothing islamic about that..

7) i understand your point of view....but i don't agree with it

lets just agree to disagree and move on....

[KnowThySelf23]

You people need to leave the poor girl alone.

Somalis can't accept someone who thinks different. They want the exact same type of people like they are rolling of a manufacturing plant.

Let the girl be

[zumaale]

Sexism is a western concept not a universal ideology so stop upholding it as some established form of discrimination across the world. In my society, we mainly adhere to Islamic and cultural ideas on gender roles. Women can lead fulfilling lives outside their home but the general concensus among Islamic scholars and our cultural norms is that they are primarily homemakers and mothers. So every time you use the word 'sexist', you are indirectly stating that the Deen is wrong for identifying the diverse roles that males and females have in a household. Now please, think carefully before you type, you speak impulsively.

K...

1) sexism is a world wide concept...the only ones that don't accept it are arabs and africans (not surprising what so ever)

2) your society? which society is that? in every somali household I've been too the women were in charge...in SOMALI culture women are the ones who run the house hold, the children and the men....idk what kind of wahabi country your from but there's certainly nothing somali about degrading women

3) islamic rules does not say that women only cook and clean the kitchen and cannot lead nor think for herself....wtf? don't bring this saudi bulshit to somalia....

4) nobody is saying women cannot be mothers at home....but islam doesn't say that women belong in the kitchen and are responsible for home making...that is a mans responsibility too smh....

5) its easy to speak from a mans point of view and say it is "deen" that women are 2nd to men, or their only house makers and mothers...but if you were in those shoes you wouldn't be advocating for it so much

6) sexism isn't against deen....its very essence is about gender equality...why do you think women should be less then men? theirs nothing islamic about that..

7) i understand your point of view....but i don't agree with it

lets just agree to disagree and move on....

Islamic ideas on the role of men and women are different that what the West considers just. The Quran itself highlights that men are the guardians of females.

Men are the maintainers of women because Allah has made some of them to excel others and because they spend out of their property; the good women are therefore obedient, guarding the unseen as Allah has guarded; and (as to) those on whose part you fear desertion [committing a religious sin], admonish them, and leave them alone in the sleeping-places and beat them; then if they obey you, do not seek a way against them; surely Allah is High, Great.
—Qur'an , [Quran 4:34]

Please comment from your own perspective as an atheist that conforms to Western ideas on gender roles and leave Islam to the Muslims. There is no argument in Islam that men are the source of authority in the household.

[KnowThySelf23]

honestly @zu as an Atheist i disagree with all of that...but as a former muslim i respect and understand your point of view....thank you for providing the proof you posted above...to each his own i guess...i was just giving my 2 cents

have a good day...

ps. that still doesn't excuse the insults typhoon was giving me...

[Sophisticate]

^^
No such thing unless you are talking about Puntland or South Central Somalia. Also, the tribe known as Dir live there. "Dir" is a fallacious aggregate that is erroneously applied to people of the north. If you are from the north, you don't call the inhabitants "Dir." Nor have the people that lived there historically identified themselves as such. People use clan names i.e. Gadabursi and Cisse. You are only indicating your bias and misinformation, that's all. They (Ogaden) did not seem to be given mention in Adal. There certainly isn't any remnants of their "mark" on the Sultanate either. End of story.

It seems they weren't lying when they said Gadabursi were the most educated Somali clan.

Dir is a real clan, its the same when an MJ in Puntland has to say Cisman or Cumar maxamud, and say Darod in Jigjiga.

The high per capita PhDs in my family and among my tribe is not indicative of group intelligence and you are making the fatal mistake of attributing years of formal schooling to intelligence, its merely about opportunity and scholarly drive. You can't compare the clan Gadabursi to An MJ subclan, I highly doubt they are even the same in number as Makahil of Gadabursi. You lack knowledge about the Galbeed, as they live mostly in Ethiopia, Djibouti and Awdal, which you know next to nothing about. Also, speak of what you are familiar with. It's funny how you linked Darod in Puntland to the ones in Galbeed. The only ones that so much as live near Gadabursi are Geri kombe. And you tried to inflate your numbers by latching on your MJ subclan to Ogaden, when you're people do not even hail from the west. That's even more sad. Heck let me say that the Issaq from galbeed probably had more involvement in Adal than the Ogaden, and this is merely ascertained by their location. It's obvious none of you ruled the Sultanate of Adal although you are apt to claim it. Stick to your tribal fiefdoms of the moment and try to improve your current circumstances.

[Hyperactive]

waaw somsalis still argue what qabil lives a and b places!

adounki ba rogmanaya , ayagana sidan bey aqligoda o koobmay! Allah ha idin sahlo.

[zumaale]

honestly @zu as an Atheist i disagree with all of that...but as a former muslim i respect and understand your point of view....thank you for providing the proof you posted above...to each his own i guess...i was just giving my 2 cents

have a good day...

ps. that still doesn't excuse the insults typhoon was giving me...

Hence, why I stated that your ideas on sexism on are not universal and are Western in thought. You obviously left the Deen partially because of the restrictions it puts in place on the female sex but please as a person who is outside the fold of Islam think about what you type so as to inadvertently not cause insult. Leave us Muslims to our beliefs even if you do not agree with them as it is no longer your concern.

[KnowThySelf23]

honestly @zu as an Atheist i disagree with all of that...but as a former muslim i respect and understand your point of view....thank you for providing the proof you posted above...to each his own i guess...i was just giving my 2 cents

have a good day...

ps. that still doesn't excuse the insults typhoon was giving me...

Hence, why I stated that your ideas on sexism on are not universal and are Western in thought. You obviously left the Deen partially because of the restrictions it puts in place on the female sex but please as a person who is outside the fold of Islam think about what you type so as to inadvertently not cause insult. Leave us Muslims to our beliefs even if you do not agree with them as it is no longer your concern.

wtf? i was trying to take the high road and you go ahead and take that as an opportunity to take digs at me? wow smh....

you do not know the reason i left islam....i left it because i don't believe in fiction....but you have every right to...

[zumaale]

honestly @zu as an Atheist i disagree with all of that...but as a former muslim i respect and understand your point of view....thank you for providing the proof you posted above...to each his own i guess...i was just giving my 2 cents

have a good day...

ps. that still doesn't excuse the insults typhoon was giving me...

Hence, why I stated that your ideas on sexism on are not universal and are Western in thought. You obviously left the Deen partially because of the restrictions it puts in place on the female sex but please as a person who is outside the fold of Islam think about what you type so as to inadvertently not cause insult. Leave us Muslims to our beliefs even if you do not agree with them as it is no longer your concern.

wtf? i was trying to take the high road and you go ahead and take that as an opportunity to take digs at me? wow smh....

you do not know the reason i left islam....i left it because i don't believe in fiction....but you have every right to...

My arse you were taking the high road, I presented evidence to you from the Quran that clearly showed the disparity in authority that the sexes possess and there was no way you could argue it is not Islamic or criticise it without coming across as an Islam hater so you kept your peace.

From your own words why you left Islam and I correctly stated that you partially left it because as a woman you felt less 'free'.


KnowThySelf23 » Wed Dec 10, 2014 12:15 am

HooBariiska wrote:
^do u mind telling us why u left islam?

i just didn't believe in it, nothing made any sense. and the older i got the more disbelieving i became. i found that religion was limiting me and i..to begin with wasn't a complete saint like most muslims I've met. i didn't pray all the time, but i was still god fearing. i started to look into other religions and the disbelieve grew more and more. if most religions (christianity, Judaism, and islam) pretty much say very similar things, and one of the things they had in common is you either follow this god or go to hell....didn't really sit well with me. i find with the absence of religion i can take what islam taught me throughout the years and implement some of it into my current life, i find i don't have any biases or limits to what i can do with my life. and as a woman i feel more in control and "free"? (if that is the right word to use..not saying muslim women aren't free though). all in all I'm still only learning about myself but for now, I've never been more happy

[KnowThySelf23]

LOOL @zuumale

what is wrong with you? i clearly said that as a former muslim i respect islam and didn't want to argue with you...yet you keep pushing and pushing and pushing....what are you trying to achieve?

about my post, i don't believe in this mysterious sky god that a crazy saudi man made up and tricked a bunch of people into believing by telling them they would burn in hell...you can advocate for your fictional god all you want but leave me out of it...why do you guys obsess over non muslims so much?
and as for the whole "freedom thing" yes that was only the kind version...like i said in my previous post i don't agree with any of it, and that includes the way women are treated in islam...or at least the sick twisted wahabi version that you all subscribe to...

anyways I'm done here, i don't plan on sitting here and watching you justify sexism by giving me quote from a fictional book i don't believe in...

[TheMailMan]

You people need to leave the poor girl alone.

Somalis can't accept someone who thinks different. They want the exact same type of people like they are rolling of a manufacturing plant.

Let the girl be

Thinking different is one thing. No two people in Somalia have the exact same opinions.

But KnowThySelf is promoting deviant and delusional ideas and passing them off as legitimate opinions. They're not. And she really needs to step outside of her Western World bubble and see the world as it is. She's a little too naive. She may have good intentions, but she's far too naive.

[zumaale]

^^
No such thing unless you are talking about Puntland or South Central Somalia. Also, the tribe known as Dir live there. "Dir" is a fallacious aggregate that is erroneously applied to people of the north. If you are from the north, you don't call the inhabitants "Dir." Nor have the people that lived there historically identified themselves as such. People use clan names i.e. Gadabursi and Cisse. You are only indicating your bias and misinformation, that's all. They (Ogaden) did not seem to be given mention in Adal. There certainly isn't any remnants of their "mark" on the Sultanate either. End of story.

It seems they weren't lying when they said Gadabursi were the most educated Somali clan.

Dir is a real clan, its the same when an MJ in Puntland has to say Cisman or Cumar maxamud, and say Darod in Jigjiga.

The high per capita PhDs in my family and among my tribe is not indicative of group intelligence and you are making the fatal mistake of attributing years of formal schooling to intelligence, its merely about opportunity and scholarly drive. You can't compare the clan Gadabursi to An MJ subclan, I highly doubt they are even the same in number as Makahil of Gadabursi. You lack knowledge about the Galbeed, as they live mostly in Ethiopia, Djibouti and Awdal, which you know next to nothing about. Also, speak of what you are familiar with. It's funny how you linked Darod in Puntland to the ones in Galbeed. The only ones that so much as live near Gadabursi are Geri kombe. And you tried to inflate your numbers by latching on your MJ subclan to Ogaden, when you're people do not even hail from the west. That's even more sad. Heck let me say that the Issaq from galbeed probably had more involvement in Adal than the Ogaden, and this is merely ascertained by their location. It's obvious none of you ruled the Sultanate of Adal although you are apt to claim it. Stick to your tribal fiefdoms of the moment and try to improve your current circumstances.

Sophisticate, sis you cannot assume that the clans that inhabit Galbeed today were the only clans that resided there during the existence of the Adal Sultanate. For instance, a subclan called Gurgura that inhabit a territory from Harar to Dire Dawa and are bilingual Oromo/Somali speakers, also inhabited the coastal area that we today associate with the Sultanate of Adal. The Biyomaal themselves departed that same vicinity in the late 18th century after warring with the Ciise and refusing to pay the blood money that the mediating clans imposed on them. Hence, it is a possibility that there are some Darood clans that came under the authority of the Adal Sultanate as the boundaries between clans have historically shifted. The Xarla Koombe Darood, for example, were absorbed into the Ciise after the Ahmed Gurey wars and today are one of the three Ciise So Raac. Even the boundary between the Ciise, Gadabursi and Isaaq has shifted in the last 100 years as attested to the fact that the Isaaq and Ciise no longer meet at the coast as the Gadabursi have caused a wedge between them as illustrated by how Lughaya is now a Gadabursi majority area. Eventhough the Xeebjir that reside there are not pure Samaroon but an adopted clan.

[Jeffo]

KTS aka thread destroyer

[KnowThySelf23]

KTS aka thread destroyer

LOL i swear its never my fault..typhoon started it backed by mailman and zuumali who constantly come for my crown....i was only defending myself...