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By the way if you want to blame anyone i suggest you start with the parents of these children.

Methylamine wrote:Kaafiye,

I have to disagree with you sxb. While the adoption of AA culture is one of the signs that our community is disintegrating, it doesn't explain the disturbingly high violent crime rate among Somalis. I grew up with Habeshas and West Africans, and despite adopting AA culture (and some even engaging in drug dealing), their rates of violent crime are very low. I even knew some white washed Somalis who hung out with cadaans, and they're facing similar problems as their "madowbized" Somali counterparts. The only culture that's leading Somalis to slaughter one another is Somali culture. The culture of living in public housing/cheating the welfare system so you can save up to build a mansion in your native tuulo. The culture of not taking an active role in the upbringing of your children. The culture of denying there's a gang problem in the Somali community. The culture of hiding killers from the authorities. That is what's leading Somali youth to slaughter each other, not AA culture; because if that was the case you'd see other communities in the news as often as the Somali community. On my phone so excuse the typos

Jaidi,
You coming to the iftar on campus tonight?

Fair enough. We can agree to disagree. And yes, the adoption of AA culture is a sign that the Somali community in Canada is slowly falling apart. But I've said before on this thread, and on other threads, that the West Africans are far surpassing us in achievement...while we Somalis are being left behind. To me, it appears that these West Africans have a strong sense of self, an intact family union, and a strong culture which resists the degeneracy you see here in North America. We Somalis need to adopt the same mindset and resist our community from going down this dangerous path.

Kaafiye wrote:

Methylamine wrote:Kaafiye,

I have to disagree with you sxb. While the adoption of AA culture is one of the signs that our community is disintegrating, it doesn't explain the disturbingly high violent crime rate among Somalis. I grew up with Habeshas and West Africans, and despite adopting AA culture (and some even engaging in drug dealing), their rates of violent crime are very low. I even knew some white washed Somalis who hung out with cadaans, and they're facing similar problems as their "madowbized" Somali counterparts. The only culture that's leading Somalis to slaughter one another is Somali culture. The culture of living in public housing/cheating the welfare system so you can save up to build a mansion in your native tuulo. The culture of not taking an active role in the upbringing of your children. The culture of denying there's a gang problem in the Somali community. The culture of hiding killers from the authorities. That is what's leading Somali youth to slaughter each other, not AA culture; because if that was the case you'd see other communities in the news as often as the Somali community. On my phone so excuse the typos

Jaidi,
You coming to the iftar on campus tonight?

Fair enough. We can agree to disagree. And yes, the adoption of AA culture is a sign that the Somali community in Canada is slowly falling apart. But I've said before on this thread, and on other threads, that the West Africans are far surpassing us in achievement...while we Somalis are being left behind. To me, it appears that these West Africans have a strong sense of self, an intact family union, and a strong culture which resists the degeneracy you see here in North America. We Somalis need to adopt the same mindset and resist our community from going down this dangerous path.

Kaafiye.

Sheekadaadu Yuhuuda ka dambeysey ma taagna ee waxay mareysaa...Adoonta ka dambeysey. ..

Why did the chicken cross the road"
because there was an African American in the bush.

Here is a picture of 2 of the victims killed in Toronto:

Kaafiye wrote:Here is a picture of 2 of the victims killed in Toronto:

Walaahi the guy on the left looks like ina Koodbur from the mouth.

Waa naxay noh.
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AUN.

Jaidi wrote:

Yuvun wrote:Sad. I'm very thankful for my parents, there was a lot of times where I was close to falling with the wrong people but my parents always kept me in line. They didn't like me hanging around with any Somalis whose parents they didn't know, thought it was being too strict but all those Somalis I used to hang around half are criminals and half are unemployed ex-criminals now studying the deen.

Haha, guessing you've run into a lot that fit that description?

Your comments have been on point btw, the vast majority of new immigrant groups (Africans/Asians/Turks/Arabs etc) adopt AA-mannerisms/clothing, it's what has been in for the past 20 years. Alone it doesn't really tell us much because the other communities haven't been affected with criminality and under-performing in education to the extent we have. This is uncomfortable reality for a lot of Somalis to swallow because we always love having someone to look down on but we have to face the reality that currently we are some of the lowest of immigrants to these countries. We are the poster children for all these right-wing parties when they suggest Westerners to stop allowing so much immigration, low education/low employment rates/high-criminality aren't the best of combinations.

Somalis mix up beatings/anger with discipline, the vast majority of east Asians rarely get beatings yet they're highly disciplined. Why? Because of their parents involvement in their lives (they sit down with them, take them to the library, plan shit like musical lessons etc). Ask the majority of African-Americans whether they get beatings and what would they tell you? Yes, they did. As much as SomalIs love to join in with conversations (that east Asians/Nigerians/Indians etc have) about how if they don't study Sciences they'll get disowned, that's not the case for the vast majority of Somalis. The vast majority of Somali parents are happy if their kids aren't doing criminal shit and working at the local retail store. It always makes me cringe when Somalis try and paint ourselves like that, there are obviously a lot of us who value education but ignoring the reality of the vast majority of Somalis isn't going to get us anywhere. We have to face the facts, no matter how uncomfortable.

Yuvun wrote:

Jaidi wrote:

Yuvun wrote:Sad. I'm very thankful for my parents, there was a lot of times where I was close to falling with the wrong people but my parents always kept me in line. They didn't like me hanging around with any Somalis whose parents they didn't know, thought it was being too strict but all those Somalis I used to hang around half are criminals and half are unemployed ex-criminals now studying the deen.

Haha, guessing you've run into a lot that fit that description?

Your comments have been on point btw, the vast majority of new immigrant groups (Africans/Asians/Turks/Arabs etc) adopt AA-mannerisms/clothing, it's what has been in for the past 20 years. Alone it doesn't really tell us much because the other communities haven't been affected with criminality and under-performing in education to the extent we have. This is uncomfortable reality for a lot of Somalis to swallow because we always love having someone to look down on but we have to face the reality that currently we are some of the lowest of immigrants to these countries. We are the poster children for all these right-wing parties when they suggest Westerners to stop allowing so much immigration, low education/low employment rates/high-criminality aren't the best of combinations.

Somalis mix up beatings/anger with discipline, the vast majority of east Asians rarely get beatings yet they're highly disciplined. Why? Because of their parents involvement in their lives (they sit down with them, take them to the library, plan shit like musical lessons etc). Ask the majority of African-Americans whether they get beatings and what would they tell you? Yes, they did. As much as SomalIs love to join in with conversations (that east Asians/Nigerians/Indians etc have) about how if they don't study Sciences they'll get disowned, that's not the case for the vast majority of Somalis. The vast majority of Somali parents are happy if their kids aren't doing criminal shit and working at the local retail store. It always makes me cringe when Somalis try and paint ourselves like that, there are obviously a lot of us who value education but ignoring the reality of the vast majority of Somalis isn't going to get us anywhere. We have to face the facts, no matter how uncomfortable.

Yes definitely have met many who fit that description.

Great post, agree with all of it. It's really a low bar that is set when not being a criminal is a positive achievement for young men. The sooner the denial about the state of the community is ended, the better.

Yuvun wrote:

Jaidi wrote:

Yuvun wrote:Sad. I'm very thankful for my parents, there was a lot of times where I was close to falling with the wrong people but my parents always kept me in line. They didn't like me hanging around with any Somalis whose parents they didn't know, thought it was being too strict but all those Somalis I used to hang around half are criminals and half are unemployed ex-criminals now studying the deen.

Haha, guessing you've run into a lot that fit that description?

Your comments have been on point btw, the vast majority of new immigrant groups (Africans/Asians/Turks/Arabs etc) adopt AA-mannerisms/clothing, it's what has been in for the past 20 years. Alone it doesn't really tell us much because the other communities haven't been affected with criminality and under-performing in education to the extent we have. This is uncomfortable reality for a lot of Somalis to swallow because we always love having someone to look down on but we have to face the reality that currently we are some of the lowest of immigrants to these countries. We are the poster children for all these right-wing parties when they suggest Westerners to stop allowing so much immigration, low education/low employment rates/high-criminality aren't the best of combinations.

Somalis mix up beatings/anger with discipline, the vast majority of east Asians rarely get beatings yet they're highly disciplined. Why? Because of their parents involvement in their lives (they sit down with them, take them to the library, plan shit like musical lessons etc). Ask the majority of African-Americans whether they get beatings and what would they tell you? Yes, they did. As much as SomalIs love to join in with conversations (that east Asians/Nigerians/Indians etc have) about how if they don't study Sciences they'll get disowned, that's not the case for the vast majority of Somalis. The vast majority of Somali parents are happy if their kids aren't doing criminal shit and working at the local retail store. It always makes me cringe when Somalis try and paint ourselves like that, there are obviously a lot of us who value education but ignoring the reality of the vast majority of Somalis isn't going to get us anywhere. We have to face the facts, no matter how uncomfortable.

Well then since that's the case, then I guess a remedy would be to encourage young Somali boys to get involved in the skilled trades, working in factories, and working in blue-collar jobs which are not as "glamorous"....but they pay a good living and it can set the foundation for a future Somali middle-class. There's no shame in having Somalis work as janitors, delivery-men, and assembly-line workers. So long as they have the right values, then the next generation of Somali kids would be poised to take advantage of the opportunities which their parents never had.

Here in Canada, we see thousands of Pakistani and Korean taxi drivers, clerks, and delivery men working long hours so they could provide for their children, who go on to study medicine or engineering. The Somalis who AREN'T successful in university would be well to learn from their example. There's no shame in an honest day's work. Not everyone is meant to be a doctor or lawyer.

Somalis have some of the worst work ethic I've ever seen, both back home and abroad (much worse back home, tho). We hate the idea of working for someone. Why do you think driving a taxi is so popular?

We can't be naive and blame others for our problems. Yes, many somalis in the west have adopted AA culture but is it at the crux of our issues? How can this be when we can't even get along back home (or on the Web). There's a bigger problem at play here, and blaming others won't get us anywhere . In the somali regions we blame colonialism, Xabashis, Kenyans etc. Fair enough, wey naga tashadeen. But if our failure is continued in some of the best countries to live in ( Canada, America, Scandanavia) we should really ponder on what the root problems are.

Ilaahi wuxu yidhi 'If you are grateful, I will surely increase you [in favor]; but if you deny, indeed, My punishment is severe.' "(Surah Ibrahim)

Maybe we're feeling ilaahi punishment for not being grateful for all the bounties Allah has given us, back home & abroad

Intii geeriyodey Ilaahi ha unaxariisto

Kaafiye wrote:Well then since that's the case, then I guess a remedy would be to encourage young Somali boys to get involved in the skilled trades, working in factories, and working in blue-collar jobs which are not as "glamorous"....but they pay a good living and it can set the foundation for a future Somali middle-class. There's no shame in having Somalis work as janitors, delivery-men, and assembly-line workers. So long as they have the right values, then the next generation of Somali kids would be poised to take advantage of the opportunities which their parents never had.

Here in Canada, we see thousands of Pakistani and Korean taxi drivers, clerks, and delivery men working long hours so they could provide for their children, who go on to study medicine or engineering. The Somalis who AREN'T successful in university would be well to learn from their example. There's no shame in an honest day's work. Not everyone is meant to be a doctor or lawyer.

I agree, it just saddens me that it's going to take the next generation to achieve this when we could've achieved this in the first generation if the men manned up and took proper care of their kids and took whatever jobs they could and showed their sacrifice to instill some motivation for their kids, instead of showing them a life of benefits and chatting in local cafes.

Another problem we run into is these next-generation Somalis are even worse, they lack dhaqan and are identity-crisis having motherfuckers. At least with the older generation, you could have a conversation with them, try and talk to them and encourage them to be more involved with their children. But, this current batch that are western-raised lowlives aren't going to be too fond of that and will just disrespect any effort on your part. I fear they may head the same way that Pakistanis/Caribbean British did, these groups are three-generations deep right now and are still full of problems whereas the other group that came with them (Indians) are enjoying very high social mobility. These three groups are important case-study in the importance of right values, they all came here in the 1950s when the British government wanted more manual labor to help recover from damage of war yet only one of these groups really progressed (Indians).

Also, a lot of the current Somali organizations are just pathetic. They're idiotically focused on bullshit like Qabilnimo, everyone knows that qabil is bullshit you dumbasses, you're not saying anything new. How many of them actually try and combat these actual practical issues that are facing us? It's always Qabilnimo or some shit like FGM which is important but come on, a lot of these groups do nothing but recite the same old tired line that everyone is aware of.

The elephants in the room:

a) Too many kids.
b) A culture of entitlement
c) Poor people who wants to lead the lifestyles of the wealthy (we share this with many other communities)

yeah i know it is ramadan but what is their qabil? no one mentioned that yet after 6 pages of blaming their death on AA culture, single moms, ghetto hoods, truck-driver dads and mansion building back home.

Methylamine wrote:Kaafiye,

I have to disagree with you sxb. While the adoption of AA culture is one of the signs that our community is disintegrating, it doesn't explain the disturbingly high violent crime rate among Somalis.

Yes it does since there is no high epidemic of young somalis killing eachother elsewhere Outside of america(not Talking about somalia btw) We can concluded that its a North American problem and where african american gang Hip hop culture is prevelant. I dont think however that its the only factor driving these somali youth in north America to kill eachother

I grew up with Habeshas and West Africans, and despite adopting AA culture (and some even engaging in drug dealing), their rates of violent crime are very low. I even knew some white washed Somalis who hung out with cadaans, and they're facing similar problems as their "madowbized" Somali counterparts.

You grew up with habeshis and didn't see it? Well isnt that convincing Proof Even tho you will the same gang violence killings by Habeshas
http://www.cbc.ca/m/news/canada/ottawa/ ... -1.2945023

Let us take it that these Habeshas dont have the baggage of civil war and welfare etc etc!
So invalid Statement! as for west africans They never identify with african americans and think They are adoons that is the difference vs somalis They actually think They are adoons you can see many threads and topic about it on this forum! Its a difference between admiting dress wear or listening to music as entertainment and actually Taking in ideologies and identifying with it!

Pluss these west africans didn't flee war most Even come from rich Middle class families so very invalid!

Unless you can give me examples of somalis who act like european cadaans yet go an a shoting spree be sure to do so until Then i will dismiss that Statement!

The only culture that's leading Somalis to slaughter one another is Somali culture. The culture of living in public housing/cheating the welfare system so you can save up to build a mansion in your native tuulo. The culture of not taking an active role in the upbringing of your children.

I can tell ur just like the cultural marxist SJW i see on Twitter and tumblr that blame culture for everything soo much that you cannot differentiate between culture and social issues!

What you described there is what is called social economic problems not culture cuz for it to be culture it has to be accepted and promoted!

But Even with that as i see somali problems on a global outlook interlinked, this particular somali youth killings are limited to mostly in north America.

Somali parents are very much actively involved in they're kids life especially in somali culture. The difference is that They have lack of knowledge on how the western world works and how it influences their kids! But how does somali culture tho promote unemployment?

I think you all should read this article

http://www.theeastafrican.co.ke/magazin ... index.html

Professor Farida Fozdar, who has spent much of the past decade studying discrimination at Murdoch University’s Centre for Social and Community Research, says when it comes to jobs, African Muslims face the “double jeopardy” of being both racially and religiously different. Fozdar describes meeting experienced African doctors who have literally begged hospitals to take them on as unpaid interns. “For these professional, accomplished people, there are huge issues of self-esteem and dignity among their families – and they can’t even get volunteer work! Honestly, the media keeps perpetuating this myth that refugees are here to bludge from the government, but it’s so patently untrue.”

Pretty much read the rest of this article if you too narrow minded to have an inkling of understanding for this issue

The culture of denying there's a gang problem in the Somali community. The culture of hiding killers from the authorities. That is what's leading Somali youth to slaughter each other, not AA culture; because if that was the case you'd see other communities in the news as often as the Somali community. On my phone so excuse the typos

The culture of denying? You do not realize how complex social economic issues are in the first place? See now ur spouting bunch of invalid cultural marxist rethoric and showcasing them as facts. The only thing you is rely on pseudo facts instead and lay that as a bases to attack somali culture!

You should take the time to actually research things instead of making somali culture some sort of scapegoat. They tiressly do infact debate this and come together about this and no denying of its existence!



What is fueling the canadian killings is high unemployment rate Even highly educated somalis have a hard time getting a job! No hope for the youth

The somali community does not foster/hide criminal so there is no basis for such a Statement!

You do see other communities like i showed you from jamaicans and ethiopians do the very much same thing! So its not a somali exclusively thing you cultural marxist are trying to make this!

You know what you dont see somalis Outside of north America having this killing epidemic on display Even tho the social economic problems are the same everywhere.

So in conclusion what is leading somalis in north America is indeed AA gange culture

Exhibit A


And the fact that unemployment and living in bad neighborhoods is also a factor

Exhibit B

Conservative commentators continue to portray African communities — particularly Somalis and Sudanese — as breeding grounds for gang members, dole bludgers and worse. But what few people have yet broached are the obvious links between fathers who struggle to find work and children for whom ‘job satisfaction’ is a concept from another planet.

“If we’re losing the fathers, we will lose their sons,” warns Horn-Afrik’s coordinator, Omar Farah. “They will drop out of school, live on the dole, and some will go into crime. If your husband is unemployed, your father is depressed, your parents are talking about going back to Africa — how can you expect that family to be striving to adopt Western values?”

Guess what neither of Those factors have anything to do with somali culture!

It is easy to have a Myopic view and outlook on things and explain things by the finger pointing instead of actively doing research and relying statistics reports as facts and not ur biases pre assumption & misconceptions!

If anyone want to Solve this problem you do so by solid reasearch & truth and not by the same hysteria and hype i see bunch teenage drama girls spout on Twitter and in they're woke of teenage crises foster to become cultural marxist blaming every problem They have on either somali culture or the white man! zero person blamed the AAs for this problem and They are not responsible for youth identifying with AA Hip Hop gangster mentality!

The responsibility lies with us not somali culture or AAs or Cadaan man, but rather to be understanding and Truthful about our social economic problems so we can be better position to Solve it on our own accord

If we actually endorsed and promoted somali culture deen Dhaqan we could steer the kids away from gang life and into healthy self sufficient thinking and betterment . As an Expert of somali history and culture trust me! I have seen it for Myself. Somali culture is something to be embraced! Too bad many in the disapora take distance from it and ponder to either african american ideologies or viewing themselves from the eyes of the cadaan man!

Neither will Solve it only examplifie it and actualize the problem & identify with the problem as a discourse.
Which is bad!

Promote somali culture & strengthen somali identity and fix the social economic problems is all you need to do! It is more complex than its sounds btw