whats wrong with iranians?

[daiman]

I will state my point again. Those Iranians who claim 'ex-muslims' and mock Islam were not the Muslim ones. Yes, they know the Quran and I met some of them who knew the Quran more than I di, but I later find out that they were those other minorites. They hate Islam. I do not believe oppressive regimes can turn someone into ethiest. That is just silly. Islam is a faith. Either you have it ot not have it. We see many Saudis who drink etc and do not like their government, but how many Saudis left the religion? why Iranians leaving the religion is ''epidimic'' and not Saudis? beentas aniga ma dhageysto.

[LiquidHYDROGEN]

Yalaxoow are you saying Jesus (AS) and Musa (AS) are fictional characters?

Not me who said it but other people say that specially Muses never existed . forexample all modern egyptology never found evidance which supports man called Muses who crossed red sea and people called jews or religion called judeism ever existed in ancient Egypty.. and Remember ancient Egyptians lef tons of wall scriptures what explained allmost all things which happen on their time and people who was living in that time....

By telling us this you are implying Moses never existed.
Is this what you're implying?

Yalaxow is a bus-driver. Enough said.

[Substance]

I will state my point again. Those Iranians who claim 'ex-muslims' and mock Islam were not the Muslim ones. Yes, they know the Quran and I met some of them who knew the Quran more than I di, but I later find out that they were those other minorites. They hate Islam. I do not believe oppressive regimes can turn someone into ethiest. That is just silly. Islam is a faith. Either you have it ot not have it. We see many Saudis who drink etc and do not like their government, but how many Saudis left the religion? why Iranians leaving the religion is ''epidimic'' and not Saudis? beentas aniga ma dhageysto.

There are some minorities in Iran who left the deen but most of the Iranians in the diaspora are persians, and not part of this minority group. One could call them hobbymuslims or secular(not all) after the revolution ended they left Iran for various reason, their leader had been dethroned, they disliked the new rulers or simply they didnt want any part of the deen.

[daiman]

Substance, point taking, but there is difference between leaving the religion and nor practising it. The impression I got from this thread is that many people think that those Iranians left the religion because of the Islamic revolitionary and that oppressive regime. I personally believe that cannot never be the case. If you are a believer( practising or not) you are going to be a beliver regardless.

[Substance]

Substance, point taking, but there is difference between leaving the religion and nor practising it. The impression I got from this thread is that many people think that those Iranians left the religion because of the Islamic revolitionary and that oppressive regime. I personally believe that cannot never be the case. If you are a believer( practising or not) you are going to be a beliver regardless.

They were extremly secular tho before the islamic revolution, in that term they could be compared to most european countries. And they were not really believers in Iran and when they left they passed down their secular lifestyle to their children, just imagine what you would have been if not your parents or duqsi had teaches you quran and about Islam. Of course they are other theories but I find this one very rational.

[kadarre]

I guess it has to do with the fact that they are Shia's. Shia doctrine consists out of alot of hogwash. I can understand why alot Iranians would leave it since it's not pure in the first place.

thats just wishful thinking. sunnis are just as bad.

The evidence is there. Shia's have a corrupted view of Islam. Sunnis will deviate but at the end they know they are in the wrong. Shia's however see Islam as false because they have not been thought the correct version from the get go.

[udun]

The consensus within Muslim Ulema is Ayatollah Khomeini hads cleaned the house of Shia. The Iranians you see who are abandoning Islam are Shah supporters, and when Sheikh Kumeini siezed the power of that country, he cleaned the Shia house from those who abandoned Islam.

[udun]

I like to question the people who are declaring Shias out of Islam: In Somalia, we killed each other and hundreds of thousands have died in that conflict; we have allowed over 500,000 Somalis to die in starvation in Bay, Bakool, and Lower Shabeele regions simply because Somalis with the bigger guns did not allow foreign-donated food aid to reach those communities, and it took the US Military and others to force the food-aid to reach those fellow Somalis who were dying in the tens of thousands each week; we the have witnessed rape and looting that took place in Somalia, which is beyond belief; and now the question is, do all of those activities have any justification within Islam? A Somali would commit the most heinous crimes that anyone can commit in Islam, and still would consider himself/herself as Muslim, while calling other Muslims heretics and deviants.

In 1989, Saudi King Fahd Bin-Abdul-Aziz visited Washington D.C. A Muslim group who were collecting donations for a Mosque went to him. He gave them USD 5,000. Another group, who were collecting funds for a heart disease research, went to the Saudi King and asked him for funds. He gave them USD 5,000,000. Jewish groups have exposed the saga and questioned how can he give such a small money to a Mosque building project when he gave millions of US dollars to a research group that he could not validate whether all of the money would even be spent on what the fund collectors were stating. Ladies and Gentelmen, this guy was part of the families who run the whole Wahhabi establishment who call themselves Sunni Muslims.

May Allah destroy today's Shia theocracy today who has caused so much suffering on the Sunni Muslims in Afghanistan in 2001 and in Iraq in 2003-present. May Allah also destroy the imposter Wahhabists and the so-called Muslim Brotherhood who are hell-bent on implementing Dajjals' plan within Muslim Umma. May Allah empower the Hanafi, Shafi'i, Hanbali, anbd Maliki Sunni Muslims. Amen.

[ZubeirAwal]

^ Mosques are everywhere, 5,000 is more then enough for a masjid, why would you want a masjid with diamonds and gold along with huge structures, a mosque is a place of worship, not luxury.

[udun]

^The project needed millions of dollars, not merely $5,000.00. If the Muslims in Arabia knew about it, and they have the means to do something about it, they would never have allowed the so-called King to throw peanuts for Muslims who were implementing Mosque, day-care, and school that can teach young children about the holly Koran and hadiiths, while he gave $5,000,000 USD to non-Muslim group who stated they were conducting research on heart disease. That is the kind of people who is thriving the wheel of the imposter Wahhabists

[ZubeirAwal]

The kingdom of saudi arabia will remain untill a king dies, then a riot or something will erupt and princes will be fighting over who will be the king and then a man from medina will go to makkah and claim he is the mahdi.

[Substance]

I like to question the people who are declaring Shias out of Islam: In Somalia, we killed each other and hundreds of thousands have died in that conflict; we have allowed over 500,000 Somalis to die in starvation in Bay, Bakool, and Lower Shabeele regions simply because Somalis with the bigger guns did not allow foreign-donated food aid to reach those communities, and it took the US Military and others to force the food-aid to reach those fellow Somalis who were dying in the tens of thousands each week; we the have witnessed rape and looting that took place in Somalia, which is beyond belief; and now the question is, do all of those activities have any justification within Islam? A Somali would commit the most heinous crimes that anyone can commit in Islam, and still would consider himself/herself as Muslim, while calling other Muslims heretics and deviants.

1. Those somalis did a horrible crime and its big sin, but the reason people say Shia is not muslims its not because of a crime or sin they made against other people. Its their sin against the Quran and the followers of the prophet saw. I dont expect somalis to understand shiasm but did you know that shias believe that the quran has been alterned and "corrupted" as they claim? And some of them give divine status to Ali(ra)
2. I would not say all shias are not muslim because I fear allah and they do split among themself on different issues but the mainpoint still stands, dont be suprised if someone says shia are not muslim, they have simple studied shiaism and come to that conclusion. You need stop this emotional arguments and adress the real point.
3. Watch this clip about this rafidah.

[udun]

I like to question the people who are declaring Shias out of Islam: In Somalia, we killed each other and hundreds of thousands have died in that conflict; we have allowed over 500,000 Somalis to die in starvation in Bay, Bakool, and Lower Shabeele regions simply because Somalis with the bigger guns did not allow foreign-donated food aid to reach those communities, and it took the US Military and others to force the food-aid to reach those fellow Somalis who were dying in the tens of thousands each week; we the have witnessed rape and looting that took place in Somalia, which is beyond belief; and now the question is, do all of those activities have any justification within Islam? A Somali would commit the most heinous crimes that anyone can commit in Islam, and still would consider himself/herself as Muslim, while calling other Muslims heretics and deviants.

1. Those somalis did a horrible crime and its big sin, but the reason people say Shia is not muslims its not because of a crime or sin they made against other people. Its their sin against the Quran and the followers of the prophet saw. I dont expect somalis to understand shiasm but did you know that shias believe that the quran has been alterned and "corrupted" as they claim? And some of them give divine status to Ali(ra)
2. I would not say all shias are not muslim because I fear allah and they do split among themself on different issues but the mainpoint still stands, dont be suprised if someone says shia are not muslim, they have simple studied shiaism and come to that conclusion. You need stop this emotional arguments and adress the real point.
3. Watch this clip about this rafidah.

For Shia, I follow the views of Islamic scholars in the Sunni Hanafi School of Thought. But it seems you have forgotten that the Sunni Ulema consensus on Wahhabists:

Some Observations about the Salafi/Wahhabi sect
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Many of us who are practising Muslims or otherwise, are familiar with the epithet 'Wahhabi'. The founder of this sect was Muhammad ibn Abdal Wahhab (d. 1206 AH), from the Najd area of 'Saudi' Arabia. He is also known as Shaykh an-Najdi by his opponents and his followers have been labelled as either 'Najdi's' or 'Wahhabi's' by the Ahl al-Sunnah. He claimed to be a Hanbali in Fiqh. It is well known that he fully digested the aqeedah and ideas of Ibn Taymiyya. The scholars of his time warned the Muslims to be on their guard from accepting his 'reformatory' ideas; and this work is still existent among the scholars of the Ahl al-Sunnah even today. The neo- 'Salafi's' of today respect Ibn Abdal Wahhab quite highly by bestowing upon him such great titles like 'Shaykh al-Islam'. I do not want to say much about his movement and activities, but a few quotes from three well known scholars should suffice for now.
(1) The foremost Hanafi scholar of his time, Imam Muhammad Amin ibn Abidin (d. 1252/1836 Rahimahullah) said in his celebrated work Hashiyya radd al-Mukhtar (vol. 3, pg. 309): "In our time Ibn Abdal Wahhab (Najdi) appeared, and attacked the two noble sanctuaries (Makkah and Madinah). He claimed to be a Hanbali, but his thinking was such that only he alone was a Muslim, and everyone else was a polytheist! Under this guise, he said that killing the Ahl as-Sunnah was permissible, until Allah destroyed them (Wahhabi's) in the year 1233 AH by way of the Muslim army."

(2) Shaykh Zayni Dahlan (Rahimahullah) said in his book Futuhat al-Islamiyya (vol. 2, pg. 268): "The sign of the Khawarij (the first deviant sect that appeared in the time of the Companions) concerning the shaving of the head, was not found in the Khawarij of the past, but only in the Najdi's of our time!"

(3) Shaykh al-Islam Hussain Ahmad al-Madani (Rahimahullah) said in his book ash-Shihab as-saqib (pg. 42): "Ibn Abdal Wahhab arose in the beginning of the thirteenth Islamic century in the Najd. His thinking was false, and his beliefs were corruptional; on these grounds he opened the way for killing the Ahl as-Sunnah."

(4) A more contemporary view on the Wahhabite sect has been expressed by Abdal-Hakim Murad in the journal Islamica (pg. 9): "Ibn Abdal Wahhab, however, went far beyond this (i.e; of Ibn Taymiyya). Raised in the wastelands of Najd in Central Arabia, he had little access to mainstream Muslim scholarship (I say: This may be disputed by his supporters). In fact, when his da'wah appeared and became notorious, the scholars and muftis of the day applied to it the famous hadith of Najd: Ibn Umar (Allah be pleased with him) reported the Prophet (Peace be upon him) as saying: "Oh God, bless us in our Syria; O God, bless us in our Yemen." Those present said: "And in our Najd, O Messenger of God!" But he said, "O God, bless us in our Syria; O God, bless us in our Yemen." Those present said, "And in our Najd, O Messenger of God!" Ibn Umar said that he thought that he said on the third occasion: "Earthquakes and dissensions (fitnah) are there, and there shall arise the horn of the devil." (Sahih al-Bukhari). And it is significant that almost uniquely among the lands of Islam, Najd has never produced scholars of any repute.

The Najd-based da'wah of the Wahhabi's, however, began to be heard more loudly following the explosion of Saudi oil wealth. Many, even most, Islamic publishing houses in Cairo and Beirut are now subsidised by Wahhabi organisations, which prevent them from publishing traditional works on Sufism, and remove passages in other works considered unnacceptable to Wahhabist doctrine.

[Thuganomics]

The Najd-based da'wah of the Wahhabi's, however, began to be heard more loudly following the explosion of Saudi oil wealth. Many, even most, Islamic publishing houses in Cairo and Beirut are now subsidised by Wahhabi organisations, which prevent them from publishing traditional works on Sufism, and remove passages in other works considered unnacceptable to Wahhabist doctrine.

[Substance]

For Shia, I follow the views of Islamic scholars in the Sunni Hanafi School of Thought. But it seems you have forgotten that the Sunni Ulema consensus on Wahhabists:

1. How come you follow the Hanafi when the Shafi'i is the one we follow in Somalia?
2. Hanafi is also the most liberal of all the Madhhabs.
3. Allah gave you a brain. Use it. If one calls the Quran for corrupted and Ali(ra) for god then this person is simple not a muslim.
4. Give me the views of Hanafi school so I can read about it.
5. I did not even mention Wahabist, I simply adressed you on the Shia issue.