Tribal Identity ....

[Ureysoo]

I recently found out that Tribal identities are overrated and those who belong to the same tribe may not necessarily hail from the same bloodline or be closely related than the rest of ppl within the same country. From what I understood, Somalia's “Tribal groups” somehow, thought 2 be an invention of common ancestors to strengthen social bonds and political predisposition, more than its blood relation (specially the extended line of descent – like Darood, Isaaq, Hawiyo and Digil and Marifle) . For instance, Isaaq and Hawiyos are in bondage under “IRIR” which is basically deemed as social/political bond, than its 2 lineages. Given that, a common ancestor or linkage “Irir” was formed, notwithstanding, none of the 2 cited groups can straightforwardly trace their roots 2 that common ascendant.

The next argument is – If it's not in our blood, how can the habitual aggression and close alliance between these groups can be explained. This can also provide a response 2 FAH123's previous Q - “Is Tribalism in our blood”. This is purely an environmental, and social phenomenons, and primarily triggered off by social pressures. The close settlements and mutual interests (be it social, political or economic) between certain groups which supposedly claim association, tend to make them fond of each others cause, and some sort of alliance is formed – this unites them against others. At this stage, some sort of social pressures occurs -- in accordance to the social context and relatedness 2 Somalia's case, could be explained as the “Group Conflict”. For example, Darood v.s Isaaq, Darood v.s Hawiyo conflicts occurred when the mentioned clans competed for the same goal – the members of each group became hostile against the members of the other groups. This can merely lead to what I call “Displacement”, which could be clarified as the aggression towards a substitute target or scapegoat in form of Tribalism. There's nothing wrong with establishing sense of Tribalism, but when it's used 2 advantage certain group and detriment other – it can cause hardship and anarchy.

As I came to think of it, am I really related 2 Beesha-Puntland, or a donkey-riding/road-blockers establishing Hawiyo and Qaad-chewing Qaldaan moron are closer 2 me in terms of bloodline?. I got 2 do an in depth research indeed, and till I reach some sort of conclusion – I'll withdraw my Cyber-Support, Lol.....

[Hyperactive]

i was told the somali trible society nothing to do with bloodline. it's just people get together with common intrests. Theefore they got a name and became a tribe/tribes.

so tribilism is in our head not bloodline.lol

[eyes-only]

As I came to think of it, am I really related 2 Beesha-Puntland, or a donkey-riding/road-blockers establishing Hawiyo and Qaad-chewing Qaldaan moron are closer 2 me in terms of bloodline?. I got 2 do an in depth research indeed, and till I reach some sort of conclusion – I'll withdraw my Cyber-Support, Lol.....

Looking at your last paragraph, I would think you know who you're really related to.


With regards to qabiil, I liked professor Ghandi's conclusion that Somali qabiil is not based on bloodline but is rather coalitions formed to extend common interests. He made quite a lot of sense during a program I watched in Universal tv last year.

In any case, I know who I'm related to and who I'm not. Qabiil doesn't really factor in that since I'm a collage of qabiils

[Ureysoo]

i was told the somali trible society nothing to do with bloodline. it's just people get together with common intrests. Theefore they got a name and became a tribe/tribes.

so tribilism is in our head not bloodline.lol

Lol@ Tribalism is in ur head and not blood. Well, we Somalis tend 2 display some sort of herd-attitude, which is mainly related to Social-Influence. Somalis frequent exercises of social power to change the attitude or behaviour of others in a particular direction has a great impact in uprooting Tribalism. The close social contact they experience within a certain group , whilst excluding others can change one's frame of mind.

Eyes-Only....

Well, apparently I know my bloodline, but the overall Darood, Hawiyo, Isaaq etc, hoax is my main concern. The current situation in Somalia proves this ideology – certain tribes altered their previous political stand, and alliance 2 cater 2 their interests (MR – Cayr collaboration, Sacad – MJ bond). They grew out of the supposed blood-association, and went after their stakes.....

[FAH1223]

lets wait 20 yrs, if theres kids singing their tribal tunes in the west like they do now

somalis are hopeless and the disease must be genetic

[XKeyse_]

So you are sure of your father but your 16th great grandfather wasn't sure about his father? may I aske why you are sure and he is not?

[Voltage]

Based on my research, I would have to say the Marehan bloodline as a social group of same descent is real and not made up. I honestly believe it is one of the few real clans of same descent.

Is there a possibility that somewhere along history, a kid was adopted and has sired descendents today that are Marehan clans? Maybe it is a possibility that I cannot refute or proof but for the most part it is a real social grouping.

As for the reasons you cited for your reeveluation of your qabiil, a lot of those are not features that are unique to Somalis. Look at the Arabs--kins who were the same clan mere couple generations ago used to display the same evolving features that Somali clans show today and seeing as the Arab clan system is the one most closest to our culture, I must conclude that shifting alliances are common starting from division within the same household up to the greater umbrella of the clan when the context is national.

[sadeboi]

So you are sure of your father but your 16th great grandfather wasn't sure about his father? may I aske why you are sure and he is not?

Xkeyse, this is also one thing that astonished me as well. I think it is great if we find remedies for TRIBALISM, the Somali cancer, but denying and fictionalizing ones genealogy will not due. Like you said, she is sure of who her father is and her grandfather, but she has the audacity to belittle all her other grandfathers and say they were simply delusional and making up their family and kinship.

Ureeyoso, just like you I am sure of who my father and grandfather were, and my grandfather knows his grandfather. I am sure I am reer-Abdille Maxamed Siyaad, I am sure I am Reer-Diini, I am sure I am Xusseyn-Yusef, I am sure I am Maxamed-Da'uud, I am sure I am Musse-Warwaajecle, I am sure I am Radimiir-Amaanreer, I am sure I am Isxaaq-Galshiredle, I am sure I am Awsame, I am sure I am Marexaan, I am sure I am SADE, and I am sure I am Darood.

[Ureysoo]

Xplaya

U are being a complete idiot now – the difference between my family-tree and the greater/extended clan-association is – I can straightforwardly trace my roots 2 my relatives and validate my lineage , nevertheless, in the case of the 16 great grandfather and the fabricated clan-relation – there's no sort of substantiation 2 whether they can trace genealogies through their fathers. Refer back 2 IRIR line of descent – If Isaaqs and Hawiyos are related and come under the IRIR ancestor – How come Hawiyos are not related 2 the so called Sheikh Isxaaq, whatsoever?. If this linkage is not invented due 2 some sort of political/social inclination.- can u give us the obvious bloodline structure?.

Voltage....

Again, MR is a different case – the main concern is the GREATER-DAROOD hoax. In some cases, yeah, even the MR bloodline can be questioned since there's some sort of confederacy with some minorities which took place in a point of time. This is ostensibly not exclusive 2 MR, or any other tribe 2 be precise – but certain groups adopt random bloodline structure and try 2 alter it to actually link their group with other groups 2 form a level of relation.

As 4 Arabs – Yeah, a lot of them adopt such approaches, and specially UAE. If u look deeply, into their roots – none of it makes sense, since I stumbled upon a clan called “Menhaali” who are originally from Yemen, and in the same time a great portion of them claims 2 be Omanis....

[XKeyse_]

U are being a complete idiot now – the difference between my family-tree and the greater/extended clan-association is – I can straightforwardly trace my roots 2 my relatives and validate my lineage , nevertheless, in the case of the 16 great grandfather and the fabricated clan-relation – there's no sort of substantiation 2 whether they can trace genealogies through their fathers.


Does this woman make sense?? how, whats the difference between you and them? how can you trace with faith and they can't?

[Ureysoo]

Sadeboi and Xplaya...

This is not something I came up with it, matter of fact, there's a recent study which been carried out on some tribes in Uzbekistan – which are divided into clans and bloodlines, and in the same time, they trace their ancestor to relatives of Ghengis Khan. The study showed the genealogy relatedness via Y chromosome included some and excluded the rest – which apparently clarify the fact there's an equal possibility Somalia's tribes are also divided 2 real and mythical genealogies. Well, surely this exists in every nomadic nation, and the sense of inclining and forming Confederation comes habitual 2 them.

As 4 Xplaya -- the difference is they could have fabricated it, and obviously there's no way it could be found. In my Dad's case - a scientific approach could be adopted 2 validate it. The fact, u couldn't explain the Irir-scandal also proves my ideology....