Taliban, 60 miles from Islamabad

[paidmonk]

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Paki ... 437334.cms

From being a no-show to being within range of several dozen nuclear warheads, the coming months will define the end of the world.

[Twisted_Logic]

Times Of India?

The FATA areas are not too far from Islamabad geographically. The Pakistani State has never controlled it and moved for the first time after 9/11. It is really pathetic how people are grossly exaggerating the situation in Pakistan. Pakistan is a Nuclear State and the 7th most powerful country in the world.

[Primal]

Guess some behind the scenes forces are hell bent on getting Uncle Sum into an attack mode to secure the pakistani Nukes before the taliban peasants get to them.

[Advo]

TwistedLogic, U have a point man

Look at all their major stories, fuking hindus

* It's the terrorism, stupid; not India: US message to Pak
* Aid to Pak an ability to confront Taliban: White House
* Is it Af-Pak? Is it Pak-Af? It's a Fak-Ap!
* Taliban want Sharia law enforced throughout Pakistan
* Democracy is un-Islamic: Swat cleric
* US pledges $7.5bn "down payment" to Pak
* US working to impede Taliban communications: Report
* Pak cleric returns to Lal Masjid, vows to continue campaign
* Suicide car bomber kills 15 in NW Pakistan: Police
* Pak seeks info on Taliban threat to LS polls
* Alarm at LoC but it is jihadis, not Taliban
* Circumcision no longer acid test to identify Indian spies
* Zardari approves Sharia laws for Swat
* Swat deal will increase tensions between US and Pak: Think-tank
* Taliban using mosques as recruitment centres: Media reports

[Xashi]

TwistedLogic, U have a point man

Look at all their major stories, fuking hindus

* It's the terrorism, stupid; not India: US message to Pak
* Aid to Pak an ability to confront Taliban: White House
* Is it Af-Pak? Is it Pak-Af? It's a Fak-Ap!
* Taliban want Sharia law enforced throughout Pakistan
* Democracy is un-Islamic: Swat cleric
* US pledges $7.5bn "down payment" to Pak
* US working to impede Taliban communications: Report
* Pak cleric returns to Lal Masjid, vows to continue campaign
* Suicide car bomber kills 15 in NW Pakistan: Police
* Pak seeks info on Taliban threat to LS polls
* Alarm at LoC but it is jihadis, not Taliban
* Circumcision no longer acid test to identify Indian spies
* Zardari approves Sharia laws for Swat
* Swat deal will increase tensions between US and Pak: Think-tank
* Taliban using mosques as recruitment centres: Media reports

[paidmonk]

I guess TL is a bit worried that Paki soap operas & cricket will be made illegal.

Here's the Al Jazeera source.

http://english.aljazeera.net/news/asia/ ... 85300.html

[Twisted_Logic]

I guess TL is a bit worried that Paki soap operas & cricket will be made illegal.

Here's the Al Jazeera source.

http://english.aljazeera.net/news/asia/ ... 85300.html

The first time the Pakistani State entered SWAT was around 2005. How is that going to change anything, now that the Talibs have taken control? Besides, the talibs are allowed to stay there as part of a peace-deal signed. Once the military left, the talibs started flexing muscles and moving into neighboring regions. They were given an ultimatum to lay down their arms and go back which they were forced to oblige with.

Nothing has really changed.

[Hoowle]

And they're only 60 miles from Islamabad because of the deal the central government reached with them. it goes to show that appeasement doesn't work with fascists whether they're secular (Nazis) or religious persuasion (Islamists). to Islamists any rapprochement is seen as a weakness to be exploited.

[Twisted_Logic]

And they're only 60 miles from Islamabad because of the deal the central government reached with them. it goes to show that appeasement doesn't work with fascists whether they're secular (Nazis) or religious persuasion (Islamists). to Islamists any rapprochement is seen as a weakness to be exploited.

[paidmonk]

Don't forget, guys, this is a home-grown coup. Don't think its an Afghan invasion, there are more Pashto in Pakistan than in Afghanistan - 28 million in Pakistan to be precise - that's a pretty big figure considering they're the most militarized ethnic group outside the official government. This is the height of Pashto power in many centuries, and if the Paki government (thought of as Punjab nationalists) attempt to enter the tribal regions with force, they'll face one of the nastiest civil wars ever recorded.

Lets also not forget that the ISI is sympathetic to Pashto.

[Twisted_Logic]

Don't forget, guys, this is a home-grown coup. Don't think its an Afghan invasion, there are more Pashto in Pakistan than in Afghanistan - 28 million in Pakistan to be precise - that's a pretty big figure considering they're the most militarized ethnic group outside the official government. This is the height of Pashto power in many centuries, and if the Paki government (thought of as Punjab nationalists) attempt to enter the tribal regions with force, they'll face one of the nastiest civil wars ever recorded.

Lets also not forget that the ISI is sympathetic to Pashto.

This is the funniest shyt I have read in awhile. no offense.

In terms of ethnic tension in Pakistan ( which is very rare) the Pashto and the Punjabis are seen as allies undermining the Sindhis and Balochis. The military establishment is seen as a Pashto and Punjabi alliance. Of the 4 military rulers of Pakistan, 2 were Pashto ( Ayub Khan and Yahya Khan) one Mohajir from India ( Pervaiz Musharraf) and One Punjabi ( Zia-ul-Haq).

The Pakistani Intelligence service, the nuclear and strategic command of the Pakistan Military and the Commando Units are predominantly manned by Pastho.

To even say that the Pashto see the Punjabis is a pure non-sense.

[paidmonk]

Pashto are to Pakistan what Ogaden are to Kenya; they get defense positions every now and then and something to keep them happy, but it doesn't change the fact that Pakistan kept Pashto in the dark for so long. Pashto were the only resistance to the British Raj and have been relegated to the same level as Ogaden in Kenya - still formidable, still getting a few bones every now and then, but still kept in the dark for security purposes. Pashto don't like to be second-in-line, and you know it.

But if the Pashto are so happy with their status as little brother in Pakistan, tell me why the NY-Times says otherwise:

After the Taliban consolidated their hold on the Swat district by February 2009, they proceeded with their push further into central Pakistan. On April 6, a Taliban force crossed from Swat into the Buner district to the south, bringing the war to only 100 kilometers north of the capital Islamabad. In two days of fighting 13 people were killed: eight militants, three policemen and two pro-government tribal militiamen. By April 8, the resistance of local security forces was weakening. Gradually the number of Taliban coming in from Swat rose to battalion level and on April 22, the Taliban established effective control of the district, with local police forces withdrawing to their police stations and the militants starting to patrol villages.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/23/world ... ml?_r=2&hp

[Twisted_Logic]

Pashto are to Pakistan what Ogaden are to Kenya; they get defense positions every now and then and something to keep them happy, but it doesn't change the fact that Pakistan kept Pashto in the dark for so long. Pashto were the only resistance to the British Raj and have been relegated to the same level as Ogaden in Kenya - still formidable, still getting a few bones every now and then, but still kept in the dark for security purposes. Pashto don't like to be second-in-line, and you know it.

But if the Pashto are so happy with their status as little brother in Pakistan, tell me why the NY-Times says otherwise:

After the Taliban consolidated their hold on the Swat district by February 2009, they proceeded with their push further into central Pakistan. On April 6, a Taliban force crossed from Swat into the Buner district to the south, bringing the war to only 100 kilometers north of the capital Islamabad. In two days of fighting 13 people were killed: eight militants, three policemen and two pro-government tribal militiamen. By April 8, the resistance of local security forces was weakening. Gradually the number of Taliban coming in from Swat rose to battalion level and on April 22, the Taliban established effective control of the district, with local police forces withdrawing to their police stations and the militants starting to patrol villages.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/23/world ... ml?_r=2&hp

Bro, I gave you some facts. To compare the Pashtos to the Ogadeen is just a pure stupidity. For one, the Ogadeen and the Somalis are the same ethnic group. So there is no comparison here.

Pathans have played a key role in Pakistan's history. The father of the Pakistani Nuclear program is a Pashto, and so have been 2 of Pakistan's Military rulers.

The first 5 military chiefs in Pakistan ( the most powerful post in all of Pakistan) were held by Pashtun. Even now the chief of the general staff in Pakistan Lt Gen Mohammad Mustafa Khan is a Pashto.

I can go on and on here.

The point is that the Pashto are considered as the elites in Pakistan. To call them as second class is just very misinformed.

[paidmonk]

Pashtos are "elite?" If they're elite, then Oromo are the elite of Ethiopia. As I said, Ogaden, a sub-clan of Somalis has held as many defense posts as Pashto in their respective countries (Kenya & Pakistan) and Kenya is 13 years younger than Pakistan.

And if Pashto are elites, how the fuck did the little flower Sindhis get three presidential seats and one being a WOMAN!!

Like I said, Pashto are getting a few bones to play a role in Pakistan, less than 30% of what they're truly worth. By their military and historical significance and the lack of respect they got for that, Pashto are long due for a takeover in Pakistan.

This is the latest, in case you forgot what's going on:

By Bill RoggioApril 24, 2009 12:15 AM

Islamabad officials have moved paramilitary forces to block a potential Taliban advance into the nation's capital as US officials question Pakistan’s ability to stop the creeping insurgency.

Islamabad's deputy commissioner and its senior police official said they are taking steps to counter the Taliban encroachment from the Northwest Frontier Province, Geo News reported. The Pakistan Rangers, a paramilitary force under the command of Pakistan's Interior Ministry, have been deployed to the Margala hills on the northern outskirts of Islamabad. The deputy commissioner said the Taliban will not be able to cross through the Margala hills and into Islamabad.

The move to reinforce Islamabad comes just one day after Maulana Fazlur Rehman, the chief of the Jamiat Ulema-e-Islam Fazl, an Islamist political party, said the Taliban are beginning to move into the districts of Haripur and Mansehra. Haripur directly borders Punjab province and Islamabad, and is close to two sensitive nuclear storage facilities.

In Buner, the Pakistani government suffered another defeat as paramilitary police forces were beaten back by the Taliban's advanced guard. The government sent an estimated 250 Frontier Constabulary officers into Buner in an attempt to secure government offices. The Taliban ambushed a convoy and killed one officer. The paramilitary police were ordered to withdraw from Buner as the Taliban celebrated their latest victory against the security forces.

The Taliban occupied Buner by force on April 10 and took full control of the district eight days later. Government offices, courts, medical clinics, and offices run by non-governmental agencies have been shut down. The Taliban have been patrolling and recruiting new fighters while they loot government offices.

Pakistan's tepid response infuriates US officials

US military and intelligence officials have expressed horror at the speed of the Taliban advance and the lack of a strong response from the Pakistani government and military. The officials spoke on the condition of anonymity due to the sensitivity of the issue.

The Taliban have taken years to consolidate control of the tribal agencies bordering Afghanistan. The battle for Swat lasted almost two years, and ended after the government agreed to implement sharia, or Islamic courts and withdraw its troops from the region. But the blitzkrieg takeover of Buner and the swift redirection of forces into neighboring districts marks a dramatic change in the pace of the conflict.

US officials are shocked that the government and security forces have offered little more than a token resistance to the Taliban.

"The Pakistani Army is sitting on the sidelines as the Taliban march all the way to Islamabad's back door," one intelligence official said. "Why is the government putting inferior troops in the path of the Taliban, only to watch them get chewed up and spit out. Where is the Army? The Army is purposefully sitting on the sidelines, either demoralized by losses or unwilling to fight, while Pakistan is burning."

A military officer said the Pakistani government missed its window of opportunity to contain the Taliban. "The time to stop this madness was five years ago, in Waziristan," the officer said. "Instead, the government caved to the Taliban in North and South Waziristan, and this only emboldened them to conquer more and more territory. Now the Taliban is within reach of the capital, yet the government still seems to have no grasp on the threat."

A senior intelligence official said the lack of response by the Pakistani government and military ensures a bloody fight. "The longer the state has deferred taking the Taliban head on, the stronger the Taliban has gotten," the official said. "Any attempt to put the Taliban genie back in the bottle will result a major bloodbath. Assuming the Pakistanis make an effort to defend themselves, that is."

Some US officials have expressed frustration at Pakistan's shifting of the blame for the Taliban insurgency. Pakistani officials have pointed fingers at Afghanistan and India for fueling the Taliban and have claimed the US is withholding funding and advanced weapons.

A senior military officer said the Pakistani complaints about a lack of advanced weapons systems such as F-16s and attack helicopters was "nonsense."

"The Pakistani Army doesn't need airplanes and night vision goggles to fight the Taliban," the official said. "First and foremost, they need to grow backbones, pick up their weapons, and fight it out. And if they don't do it soon, they might not have a country left to fight for."

[Twisted_Logic]

Pashtos are "elite?" If they're elite, then Oromo are the elite of Ethiopia. As I said, Ogaden, a sub-clan of Somalis has held as many defense posts as Pashto in their respective countries (Kenya & Pakistan) and Kenya is 13 years younger than Pakistan.

And if Pashto are elites, how the fuck did the little flower Sindhis get three presidential seats and one being a WOMAN!!

Like I said, Pashto are getting a few bones to play a role in Pakistan, less than 30% of what they're truly worth. By their military and historical significance and the lack of respect they got for that, Pashto are long due for a takeover in Pakistan.

This is the latest, in case you forgot what's going on:

By Bill RoggioApril 24, 2009 12:15 AM

Islamabad officials have moved paramilitary forces to block a potential Taliban advance into the nation's capital as US officials question Pakistan’s ability to stop the creeping insurgency.

Islamabad's deputy commissioner and its senior police official said they are taking steps to counter the Taliban encroachment from the Northwest Frontier Province, Geo News reported. The Pakistan Rangers, a paramilitary force under the command of Pakistan's Interior Ministry, have been deployed to the Margala hills on the northern outskirts of Islamabad. The deputy commissioner said the Taliban will not be able to cross through the Margala hills and into Islamabad.

The move to reinforce Islamabad comes just one day after Maulana Fazlur Rehman, the chief of the Jamiat Ulema-e-Islam Fazl, an Islamist political party, said the Taliban are beginning to move into the districts of Haripur and Mansehra. Haripur directly borders Punjab province and Islamabad, and is close to two sensitive nuclear storage facilities.

In Buner, the Pakistani government suffered another defeat as paramilitary police forces were beaten back by the Taliban's advanced guard. The government sent an estimated 250 Frontier Constabulary officers into Buner in an attempt to secure government offices. The Taliban ambushed a convoy and killed one officer. The paramilitary police were ordered to withdraw from Buner as the Taliban celebrated their latest victory against the security forces.

The Taliban occupied Buner by force on April 10 and took full control of the district eight days later. Government offices, courts, medical clinics, and offices run by non-governmental agencies have been shut down. The Taliban have been patrolling and recruiting new fighters while they loot government offices.

Pakistan's tepid response infuriates US officials

US military and intelligence officials have expressed horror at the speed of the Taliban advance and the lack of a strong response from the Pakistani government and military. The officials spoke on the condition of anonymity due to the sensitivity of the issue.

The Taliban have taken years to consolidate control of the tribal agencies bordering Afghanistan. The battle for Swat lasted almost two years, and ended after the government agreed to implement sharia, or Islamic courts and withdraw its troops from the region. But the blitzkrieg takeover of Buner and the swift redirection of forces into neighboring districts marks a dramatic change in the pace of the conflict.

US officials are shocked that the government and security forces have offered little more than a token resistance to the Taliban.

"The Pakistani Army is sitting on the sidelines as the Taliban march all the way to Islamabad's back door," one intelligence official said. "Why is the government putting inferior troops in the path of the Taliban, only to watch them get chewed up and spit out. Where is the Army? The Army is purposefully sitting on the sidelines, either demoralized by losses or unwilling to fight, while Pakistan is burning."

A military officer said the Pakistani government missed its window of opportunity to contain the Taliban. "The time to stop this madness was five years ago, in Waziristan," the officer said. "Instead, the government caved to the Taliban in North and South Waziristan, and this only emboldened them to conquer more and more territory. Now the Taliban is within reach of the capital, yet the government still seems to have no grasp on the threat."

A senior intelligence official said the lack of response by the Pakistani government and military ensures a bloody fight. "The longer the state has deferred taking the Taliban head on, the stronger the Taliban has gotten," the official said. "Any attempt to put the Taliban genie back in the bottle will result a major bloodbath. Assuming the Pakistanis make an effort to defend themselves, that is."

Some US officials have expressed frustration at Pakistan's shifting of the blame for the Taliban insurgency. Pakistani officials have pointed fingers at Afghanistan and India for fueling the Taliban and have claimed the US is withholding funding and advanced weapons.

A senior military officer said the Pakistani complaints about a lack of advanced weapons systems such as F-16s and attack helicopters was "nonsense."

"The Pakistani Army doesn't need airplanes and night vision goggles to fight the Taliban," the official said. "First and foremost, they need to grow backbones, pick up their weapons, and fight it out. And if they don't do it soon, they might not have a country left to fight for."

This is what happens when you apply African mindset on other situations.

President has 0 power in Pakistan. That is right ZERO. So far, there have been 2 Sindhi rulers of Pakistan ( Zulfaqar Ali Bhutto and his daughter Benazir Bhutto). They were in office for 4+5=9

There have been 2 Military rulers who were Pashto. They are Gen Ayub Khan and Gen Yahya Khan. They ruled for 11 years+2 years. Add this to the Civilian rulers who were Pashtun, such as Liaquat Ali Khan, Feroz Khan Noon, Muhammad Khan Junejo,= ( 4+1+3=8)

So, 13+8=21 years

Punjabis have ruled for 15 years.

get the math?

So Punjabis have ruled for 15 years, Pashtuns have ruled for 21 years and Sindhis have ruled for 9 years