There are +66 major clans in Somalia INSTEAD OF 4!

[dawwa9]

I found this new study published a couple of months ago (Tillmar, December 2009) with 147 Somali male samples

Judge for yourself:

http://download.journals.elsevierhealth ... 000791.pdf


Hawiye, Dir, Isaaq, Darod theory = can not be proven by science

[dawwa9]

12 Y-chromosome STR loci (DYS19, DYS389I, DYS389II, DYS390, DYS391, DYS392, DYS393, DYS437,
DYS438, DYS439, DYS385ab) were typed for 147 males from Somalia. A total of 66 haplotypes were
identified of which 44 were unique. The most common haplotype was found 26 times corresponding to a
population frequency of 17.7%.

[Babygirl-]

these People could be Bantus, Reer-Xamars, Barawanis, other Southerners, Different Reer-Waqoyis, Daroods & Hawiyes. How are all these people suppose to be related ofcourse they will al have different results.

[dawwa9]

Most of them are E1b1b1a1b

They are standard Cushitic Somalis

However their mutations don't correspond to the crazy Somali creationist theory of a handful (Only four LOL!) of men populating all of Somalia.

[dawwa9]

I think this shit is too advanced for you simple folks.

[ultimatenemsis]

Was this test conducted in Sweden?

Cause I know very little Maakhiris live in mainland Europe and few in Sweden. So the samples just might correlate with the balk majority being the past waves of refugees from Xamar and the new wave that settle in Europe.

[dawwa9]

They used Somali male DNA from immigration casework and asked for their consent to participate. Sweden has a diverse Somali population so don't complain they only used Hawiyes or something.

[X.Playa]

Hablogrouop 1 , 2 , 3 ,4 ,5 ??? what the hell is that. I couldn't make head or tail of this. Couldn't even recognize a single HG or sub clad , couldn't even understand the conclusion the entire study is shity, only 5 pages long.

[Cirwaaq]

E1b1b1a1b This is the most common then?

701 AD The first Persian settlement in Zanzibar. The immigrants intermingled with the indigenous population, who had been present from the first century B.C. or even before. Their descendants are known as the Watumbatu and theWapemba. Tumbatu is an islet on the northern tip of Zanzibar where the remains of an ancient Shirazian city have been found. From the 9th to the 15th centuries Pemba - Al Huthera, the Green One - was occupied by Persians who built Mkumbu in the west, a garrison at Pujini in the east and Chwaka in the north.

908 AD The states of Mogadishu and Barava were founded by the seven brothers of El Hasa.

975 AD The state of Kilwa, important for its gold trade, was founded by Hassan bin Ali, a Persian prince who came to East Africa with his six sons and stayed in Zanzibar, Pemba, Mombasa, Kilwa and Comoro. This was considered to be the start of the Zenj Empire: 975 - 1503. It is possible to trace the names of all the Sultans of Kilwa from 900 A.D. onwards, from coins that were minted and used there until the coming of the Europeans. Kilwa’s domain extended to Sofala in the south, from which the gold of Zimbabwe was shipped. The Sultan rule in Kilwa lapsed in the 18th century.

1000 AD Much trade went on at this time between China and East Africa via India, Persia and Arabia.

Chinese ships visited the East African coast regularly from this time and their crews mingled with the inhabitants, leaving descendants. Chinese charts for the Indian Ocean were in use by 1200 A.D. In 1430 a Chinese fleet visited Zanzibar.

All the Coastal settlements will have the highest Hablo diversity in comparison to land locked settlements. The sultans hold ranged from Mozambique to Bender Qasim.

The Omani Sultans used all the ports to export Slaves from central africa as far as Zaire if not further.

[dawwa9]

E1b1b1a1b is 4,000 years old and arose in the Ethiopian highlands.

However most clans only date back to perhaps 1,000 years. Their mutations tells us there are 66 different ''clans'' that arose around ~700 years ago. This conflicts the Somali creationist theory of only four men populating all of Somalia (ridiculous...)

[X.Playa]

dawwa,

nop that particular sub-clad emerged in Egypt its called V12 and its 6000 years ago, no study ever mentioned Ethopia as a soruce.

E1b1b1a(M78) split into 4 groups
* E1b1b1a1 (M78/V12) ---------Horn of Africa
* E1b1b1a2 (M78/V13) ---------Greece-Balkans
* E1b1b1a3 (M78/V22)----------NE Africa
* E1b1b1a4 (M78/V65)----------Libya

Battaglia et al. (2008) describe Egypt as "a hub for the distribution of the various geographically localized M78-related sub-clades" and, based on archaeological data, they propose that the point of origin of E-M78 (as opposed to later dispersals from Egypt) may have been in a refugium which "existed on the border of present-day Sudan and Egypt, near Lake Nubia, until the onset of a humid phase around 8500 BC. The northward-moving rainfall belts during this period could have also spurred a rapid migration of Mesolithic foragers northwards in Africa, the Levant and ultimately onwards to Asia Minor and Europe, where they each eventually differentiated into their regionally distinctive branches". Towards the south, Hassan et al. (2008) also explain evidence that some subclades of E-M78, specifically E-V12 and E-22, "might have been brought to Sudan from North Africa after the progressive desertification of the Sahara around 6,000-8,000 years ago".

E-V12* lineages (not E-V32 or E-M224, so therefore named "E-V12*") are found at especially high levels (44.3%) in Southern Egyptians, but also scattered widely in small amounts in both Northern Africa and Europe, but with very little sign in Western Asia, apart from Turkey[1]. These E-V12* lineages were formerly included (along with many E-V22* lineages[Note 6]) in Cruciani et al.'s original (2004) "delta cluster", which he had defined using DYS profiles. With the discovery of the defining SNP, Cruciani et al. (2007) reported that V-12* was found in its highest concentrations in Egypt, especially Southern Egypt. Hassan et al. (2008) report a significant presence of E-V12* in neighboring Sudan, including 5/33 Copts and 5/39 Nubians. E-V12* made up approximately 20% of the Sudanese E-M78. They propose that the E-V12 and E-V22 sub-clades of E1b1b1a (E-M78) might have been brought to Sudan from their place of origin in North Africa after the progressive desertification of the Sahara around 6,000–8,000 years ago. Sudden climate change might have forced several Neolithic cultures/people to migrate northward to the Mediterranean and southward to the Sahel and the Nile Valley.[8] The E-V12* paragroup is also observed in Europe (e.g. amongst French Basques) and Eastern Anatolia (e.g. Erzurum Turks).[1]

E1b1b1a1b (E-V32)
Cruciani et al. (2007) suggest that this sub-clade of E-V12 originated in North Africa , and then subsequently expanded further south into the Horn of Africa, where it is now prevalent.[Note 8] Before the discovery of V32, Cruciani et al. (2004) referred to the same lineages as the "gamma cluster", which was estimated to have arisen about 8,500 years ago. They stated that "the highest frequencies in the three Cushitic-speaking groups: the Borana from Kenya (71.4%), the Oromo from Ethiopia (32.0%), and the Somali (52.2%). Outside of eastern Africa, it was found only in two subjects from Egypt (3.6%) and in one Arab from Morocco". Sanchez et al. (2005) found it extremely prominent in Somali men and stated that "the male Somali population is a branch of the East African population – closely related to the Oromos in Ethiopia and North Kenya (Boranas)" and that their gamma cluster lineages "probably were introduced into the Somali population 4000–5000 years ago". Hassan et al. (2008) in their study observed this to be the most common of the sub-clades of E-M78 found in Sudan, especially among the Beja, Masalit, and Fur. The Beja, like Somalis and Oromos, speak an Afro-Asiatic language and live along the "corridor" from Egypt to the Horn of Africa. Hassan et al. (2008) interpret this as reinforcing the "strong correlation between linguistic and genetic diversity" and signs of relatedness between the Beja and the peoples of the Horn of Africa such as the Amhara and Oromo. On the other hand, the Masalit and Fur live in Darfur and speak a Nilo-Saharan language. The authors observed in their study that "the Masalit possesses by far the highest frequency of the E-M78 and of the E-V32 haplogroup", which they believe suggests "either a recent bottleneck in the population or a proximity to the origin of the haplogroup."

[dawwa9]

E1b1b1a1 (M78/V12) is from Southern Egypt I know that...

But the downstream clade E1b1b1a1b (V32) migrated back into the Horn with Sudan and Ethiopia as its refugium according to Sanchez et al 2005 study, it was introduced into the Somali population 4000 years ago. So it must come from Ethiopia or it doesn't make any sense at all.

[X.Playa]

There we agree if you put it that way. You were talking about V32, but somalis have both V32 and V12.

[dawwa9]

What do you mean?

E-V12 is the parent, E-V32 is the kid, E-M224 the brother (which Somali don't have that much).

[X.Playa]

These things are very complicated and this my understanding:

M78 which is 18000 years old sub-clad is the parent and it divides into V12, V32, V13 etc, and all these are very recent acnestor some 6000 years or less.