Somalia and Somaliland talks dead lock

[Khalid Ali]

In Post-Morsi Diplomacy, Turkey Hosting Somaliland & Somalia Talks

By Matthew Russell Lee

UNITED NATIONS, July 8 -- With events in Egypt putting Turkish diplomatic forays ever more in question, the country has gone forward with its attempts to mediated between Somalia and Somaliland.

Could this reverse things for Turkey, casting it in the role of Qatar on Darfur or Burkina Faso on Mali?

As Somaliland's Minister of Trade and International Investment, Dr. Mohamed A. Omar and Somalia's Minister of Interior and National Security, Abdikarim H. Guled met, it was Free UN Coalition for Access member Mohamoud Walaaleye who asked, obtained and sent us a document said to be the 1960 (ill-fated) union on Somalia and Somaliland.

We put it online here. But why was the UN seat not called Somali Republic? Here are the Somaliland side's points:

1. SFG should recognize that Somaliland reclaimed their independence

2. As long as discussion continues for two sides Somaliland should be allocated separate seat during international conferences concerned what was used Somalia

3. Somalia should arrest and hand to Somaliland all individuals committed crime against humanity, and given compensation

4. Somaliland should have authority of managing its airspace.

5. Getting investment for Somaliland resources.

Somalia’s five point agenda was:

1. Unity of Somalia should be abiding

2. Permit free movement of people and politicians on each side.

3. Other remaining dialogues be hold inside country

4. To hold future dialogues inside Somaliland or Somalia

5. Design standard procedure abiding for future dialogue

The UN unilaterally transferred Somaliland's airspace to Mogadishu, leading to a cancellation of UN system flights. UN envoy Nicholas Kay has been told that the new UNSOM mission should not open in Somaliland.

Meanwhile, Kay declined to confirm or deny that in Mogadishu UN Mine Action Service boss David Bax shares information with US intelligence. Kay told Inner City Press this is a question for the UN in New York, where UN Peacekeeping under Herve Ladsous refuses to answer Press questions. That is now being fought by the Free UN Coalition for Access. Watch this site.

[Khalid Ali]

I was at the Somali Maqaaxi today and there was this reer burco oday he said adeer i remember in 1960 and we were united in in just half an hour when the SL delegation arrive in Mogadishu. Now it is taking us more than 1 year and a half and counting to officially dissolve the union on the side of the Koonfurians lol

[original dervish]

The Southerners are just stringing s/l along.
Why should they let s/l go......they hold all the cards?

[GAMES]

Original Dervish, Dhulbahante ayaga hadal umaba furna. Waxaa tihiin dadka keliya ee hada 2013 ee Somalia Qabiilkale dhul kaheesto. Marka idunku, dhulkiina soo xoreesta, ee kadib ayaa wax la'idinka weydiin arimaha Somalia.

[Khalid Ali]

Original dervish the koonfurians want union , but they are not getting that, they have no cards ,they have one card they can let the talks fail and let the EU organize new talks with mediation., SL also have that same card. But both sides will agree on certain key issues on new cooperation deals on the airspace dispute something along a joint committee to manage it consisting of both countries. Remember Hassan sheikh government was born because of the Road map and all entities of Somalia agreed to a constitution.He is clearly the government of Somalia and not Somaliland. Technically he is according to the US and EU recognized also the President of Somaliland, but its a technical matters the IC knows this is not the case on the ground. So they organize these talks so that the 2 sides can clarify their future relations. This is a special and separate process and both Somalia and Somaliland do not control these talks in that sense but the IC does and they will be the facilitators in this. So there are equal cards in here.But dont expect any big achievement from these talks aslong as there is no mediation for now its still warming up. although fundamental disputes conflicts have been discussed.

[Khalid Ali]

By the way Original dervish your buddies on the talks

[GAMES]

Khalid Ali, idunku halkaas unbaad fadhineesaan. Ilaa yowmil Qiyaama, meel aad u socotaan majirto, lugta ayaad Xamar uga xirantihiin. Hadii aad jeceshahay ineey Somalia burburto, sidaad idinka aqoonsi ku hasheen, waxaad ogaataa inaad godka Somalia la sii galeysid. Marxalada siyaasadee Somalia hada kajirto waa eey ka bixi doontaa, ee dadkiina soo raaca.

Somalia soo raacaa, ileen waxkaloo idiin furan majirtee. Hawiye iyo Darood midna idinma necba, ee idanka ha isa saarina.

[Khalid Ali]

Khalid Ali, idunku halkaas unbaad fadhineesaan. Ilaa yowmil Qiyaama, meel aad u socotaan majirto, lugta ayaad Xamar uga xirantihiin. Hadii aad jeceshahay ineey Somalia burburto, sidaad idinka aqoonsi ku hasheen, waxaad ogaataa inaad godka Somalia la sii galeysid. Marxalada siyaasadee Somalia hada kajirto waa eey ka bixi doontaa, ee dadkiina soo raaca.

Somalia soo raacaa, ileen waxkaloo idiin furan majirtee. Hawiye iyo Darood midna idinma necba, ee idanka ha isa saarina.

I prefer not to be recognized for ever than ever share country with Somalia , 22 years and counting should be the evidence that we are determined 10 years armed struggle 22 years fighting for our official place on the world stage but our independence is worth allot we have achieved allot stability peace progress , reconstruction democracy economic growth we have shown that we do not need the world approval that we are there and are thriving.. We do not want inay Somalia burburto we want you to be our brothers and live besides us hadaad se diidan dee waxba isu ma nihin , anaguna halkayaganu iska joogayna idinka halkina biyaha ha idink so gasho. Horta qolyihina hawiye maxaad horta nooga bahantihin, sawdiga noogu faana waxanu leenahay webiyaaal khudrad iyo waxyaalo kale oo aan anagu aqoon. anagu intayadanu happy ku nahay idinku laakin mala la aantayada ma nolaan kartan waxba ma noqon kartan lool.

[sahal80]

No unity or independence are there now

Eachgroup has two important points

Somaliland wants to manage its airspace
Somalia wants its politicians to have access to somaliland without control its says free movements but I read a few days ago in kismaayonews they are aiming behind this to have an access to the society and because of this its likely the talks to fail.

I think the somali govt is ready for forming a joint commitee with somaliland to control the airpace togather under one country

I don't know about somaliland if its ready to accept FSG politicians who hail from there to come and stay but it may accept with conditions.

[Khalid Ali]

No unity or independence are there now

Eachgroup has two important points

Somaliland wants to manage its airspace
Somalia wants its politicians to have access to somaliland without control its says free movements but I read a few days ago in kismaayonews they are aiming behind this to have an access to the society and because of this its likely the talks to fail.

I think the somali govt is ready for forming a joint commitee with somaliland to control the airpace togather under one country

I don't know about somaliland if its ready to accept FSG politicians who hail from there to come and stay but it may accept with conditions.

The only way Somaliland could accept SFG politicians in Somaliland is if Somalia agrees with a UN supervised referendum on independence on agreed time in the mean time they can visit the region this is negotiable and can be agreed on. but its unlikely to agree on that., there were no restrictions between the people people of Somalia can visit Somaliland, people of Somaliland can visit Somalia there is freedom of movement only not for the politicians. I believe the airspace can be agreed on these talks nothing else or perhaps they can call upon mediation by a 3rd party in the next talks, and perhaps the support that Somaliland has the full authority to explore its resources. other than that i do not believe anything can be agreed on , Somalia has to abide its constitution for now and it has little room to give into to Somaliland.. And Somaliland has to abide its constitution and it cannot allow SFG somalia politicians on it soil with out serious concessions , that it can present to Somaliland higher parliament.

[AhlulbaytSoldier]

The Five points of Jamhuuriyadda Soomaaliya looks good.
If they give in they will be regarded as qaainul wadan, traitors.

[sahal80]

No unity or independence are there now

Eachgroup has two important points

Somaliland wants to manage its airspace
Somalia wants its politicians to have access to somaliland without control its says free movements but I read a few days ago in kismaayonews they are aiming behind this to have an access to the society and because of this its likely the talks to fail.

I think the somali govt is ready for forming a joint commitee with somaliland to control the airpace togather under one country

I don't know about somaliland if its ready to accept FSG politicians who hail from there to come and stay but it may accept with conditions.

The only way Somaliland could accept SFG politicians in Somaliland is if Somalia agrees with a UN supervised referendum on independence on agreed time in the mean time they can visit the region this is negotiable and can be agreed on. but its unlikely to agree on that., there were no restrictions between the people people of Somalia can visit Somaliland, people of Somaliland can visit Somalia there is freedom of movement only not for the politicians.

So that point is not accepted by somaliland?

I think they will end up to do more talks without saying the talks between the two sides have failed, this if they didn't reach a solution in there.

[Khalid Ali]

This could be agreed on perhaps

Somalia and Somaliland agreed to set up a joint committee to manage the airspace of Somalia and Somaliland defacto state.

Somalia and Somaliland agreed to enhance closer trade relations and cooperation on security matters.

Somalia and Somaliland agreed to allow Somaliland and Somalia politicians to freely travel in between Somalia and Somaliland

Somalia and Somaliland agreed to exchange liaison offices to be opened in hargeisa and Mogadishu

Somalia recognizes Somaliland as separate defacto state

Somalia and Somaliland agreed to continue the talks in the United Kingdom.

Somalia and Somaliland agreed to call upon the international community to set up en expert team of international mediators

[Nomand]

british somaliland is not a single entity, we have awdal state, khatuumo, saylac lughaya state and maakhir.

[samatar133]

I predict this round of talking would end up disappointing. It seems no side is willing to compromise enough
to reach any tangible results regarding independence/reunion issues. Those issues and many other contentious issues will be postponed for later talks. It will be a win for Somaliland if the airspace management depute is solved in the way Somaliland wants and it will be a loss if it allows free movement inside Somaliland for dirta woqooyi without strong conditions such as guaranteed date for referendum. My guess is the airspace dispute and the issue of foreign investment arrangement will be reached an agreement tomorrow but most other issues are likely to be postponed for later talks.