BLACK & WHITE OR SHADES OF GREY?

[Galol]

Few days ago I posted a thread titled `Jelly Principles'. I meant situations like this when you cant decide where you stand on major issues.

I pained over the Iraq war. I knew the war was illegal and wrong yet the removal of an oppressive bully and career torturer like Saddam Hussein was self-evidently a morally justifiable cause. This utilitarian approach apparently comes with focking old age although I dont accept that for a second.

And now with the Wadaads. I know they are crazy and anti-Somali. I know they are oppressive and a danger to our culture. I know they came to power illigitimately through the barrel of the gun. But they DID bring relative peace to our people in Mogadishu and its environs. They did open the ports. They did clean up the streets of Mogadishu. In other words they have re-established a resemblance of nationhood in the areas they control.

So my Principles which normally would have meant complete opposition to Wadaad rule are thus weakened. All of a sudden I wanted a fudge: Wadaads making a deal with the legitimate government and getting diluted and hopefully moderated while not losing their clear achievements. But that aint gonna happen now is it?

So anyone else experiencing similar conflict of principles with pragmatism?

[PragmaticGal]

I think only idiots and Cilmiile see the current situation in black and white.

[hey-loser]

[quote="Galol"] But they DID bring relative peace to our people in Mogadishu and its environs. They did open the ports. They did clean up the streets of Mogadishu. In other words they have re-established a resemblance of nationhood in the areas they control.

[/quote]



There you have it they acieved something the TFG could't acieve

[michael_ital]

Awesome. That's it in a nutshell.

[Galol]

Prag

Are you implying Cilmiile is not an idiot?

Hey-loser

"There you have it they acieved something the TFG could't acieve"

They did. But to be fair the TFG were never given a chance because they didnt have the `gun-power' and A/Yusuf lacked the courage to go to Mogadishu when he had the moral power. If he went straight to Mog after his election in Nairobi I believe he would have been welcomed by people yearning for peace and nationhood. He went to Addis instead.

[PragmaticGal]

Galol,

Maybe an idiot savant.

[Galol]

Prag

Do you think Cilmiile will ditch the God business if he thought it ran against the wider and much more holier Daarood interest?

[Niya]

lol at idiot savant! Far from it, Cilmiile is now my hero
Galol, life is complicated with a lot of shades of grey indeed!
The ICU failed to levarage its initial success, and sense of legitimacy. If the ICU claims a high moral authority and is better than the "so called warlords" then, WHY did it not per-assess the fall-out that can follow its agressive tactics of invading peaceful towns and provoking a neighbouing country?

[Galol]

"If the ICU claims a high moral authority and is better than the "so called warlords" then, WHY did it not per-assess the fall-out that can follow its agressive tactics of invading peaceful towns and provoking a neighbouing country? "

Niya

Good question. Can one of the Islamists answer Niya?

[dhuusa_deer]

This UIC prodding Ethiopia to invading Somalia arguement is total hogwash. What has the UIC done to incite Ethiopia and not other neighbouring countries? Why not Kendya? The only difference between Ethiopia and kenya is not lack of justifiable reasons to invade Somalia but their leadership. Melez has TRACK RECORD of engineering non-existent problems and then, like Don Quixote tilting at the windmills, tries to put out the artificial fires he started.

[Galol]

DD

The UIC did declare Jihad on Ethiopia on numbrer occassions. It did not declare Jihad on Kenya or any other State.

But Ethiopia shouldnt have fallen for the bait. Afterall the UIC is not a governement recognised by Ethiopia so the declaration of war by the former should not be `honoured' by the latter.

[dhuusa_deer]

Galol,

It's my understanding the UIC Jihad declaration was against Ethiopian presense IN Somalia. Not declaration of war against the Ethiopian State per se. If that is accurate, they're justified in doing so. Foolish maybe but justified nonetheless.

[Demure]

[quote="Galol And now with the Wadaads. I know they are crazy and anti-Somali. I know they are oppressive and a danger to our culture. I know they came to power illigitimately through the barrel of the gun. But they DID bring relative peace to our people in Mogadishu and its environs. They did open the ports. They did clean up the streets of Mogadishu. In other words they have re-established a resemblance of nationhood in the areas they control.

So my Principles which normally would have meant complete opposition to Wadaad rule are thus weakened. All of a sudden I wanted a fudge: Wadaads making a deal with the legitimate government and getting diluted and hopefully moderated while not losing their clear achievements. But that aint gonna happen now is it?

So anyone else experiencing similar conflict of principles with pragmatism?[/quote]

That is exactly my sentiments. The wadaads did deliver some semblance of security to people in Mogadishu and seemed to be going forward, I would have liked to have had more time to monitor their path to form a more definate opinion about them. Now the Ethiopian packed TFG will ensure we go back to square one and will cause more division between the Somali people!!

[Galol]

DD

They declared Jihad against Ethiopia for ruling `Somali people' (read Ogaden) and for being `an enemy of Somalia, Somalis and our religion'. There is no doubt they were goading Ethiopia to get into a fight with them.

Demure

Glad to see you agree with me.

[michael_ital]

Galol

I don't recall that. I recall them declaring Jihaad when Ethiopian presence was first detected months ago, back when their procloamtions were deemed ansurd. But now it appears they were right all along.