MAD MAC......Let's Pretend That

[Gedo_Boy]

Ethiopia & Egypt share a border.

Compare their 2 armies & force projection capabilities.


What do you think would happen in a clash?

[Steeler [Crawler2]]

Ethiopia would get squashed like an insect.

[Gedo_Boy]

I was expecting a more detailed analysis

Reasons & such......Military, Hardware, Troops, Special Forces etc.


I know they have (for a 3rd world) a good technical grasp.........there were these Egyptian PhD students I used to know in college..........they were electronics gurus..........in general, they seem to have a lot of educated scientists.

[Gamadid.]

Egyptian Army


---- > By the late 1990s, the Egyptian army had 12 divisions, of which all but one is armored or mechanized.

-----> An estimated 70 percent of Egypt's active tanks are of Western design, including 400 of 512 planned M-1 A-1 Abrams battle tanks (with a "hit/kill ratio" that equals or surpasses any main battle tank armament in the world), equivalent to Israel's Merkava-3.

------> Egypt is also converting M-60 A1 tanks to A3s, has been upgrading Russian T-62s, produces and operates 24 SPH 122mm self-propelled guns, and is in the process of absorbing 600 new YPR-765 armored personnel carriers (APCs) from Holland.


-------> Egyptians have at their disposal vast amounts of anti-tank missiles that proved their effectiveness in the 1991 Gulf War. During 1997 alone, the Egyptian Army received 540 TOW-2 launchers, French Hot-3 missiles, and 1,000 Hellfire-2 laser-guided anti-tank missiles.(21) Both the quality and mobility of the tanks and anti-tank missiles and launchers enhance the offensive capabilities of Egyptian ground forces substantially. The contribution of the United States to this transformation has been overwhelming.


Egypt's air force

-------> 160 F-16 jet fighters, roughly two-thirds' the number of these fighters possessed by Israel. Eight of 21 fighter squadrons are equipped with these planes capable of carrying GBU-15 glide bombs and smart weapons such the AFM-84 Harpoon. Within the next few years, 220 of its 500 fighters will be composed of F-16s, the same planes that are the mainstay of Israeli Air-Force offensive capabilities.


-------> Egyptians have purchased and integrated 36 ultra-advanced AH-64A Apache attack helicopters all of which will be upgraded to the improved D model, equipped with a Long Bow radar that can locate both ground and air targets. Older helicopters such as the SA-342 Gazelle, and the Naval Westland Sea King Mk-47 and SH-2G helicopters make up the rest of the combat squadron.(23) As Sa'id notes, this transformation could have never have taken place without massive U.S. aid and training.



Navy

------> In the 1980s, Egypt's navy began to replace Soviet ships with more modernized Western equipment, including British-made Ramadan-class missile boats and Spanish-made Descubierta-class missile frigates, and attempted to upgrade older vessels with Western radar and electronic warfare systems. The purchase of four new Chinese-made Romeo-class submarines and American supplied state-of-the-art weapons and detection systems, including underwater-to-surface Harpoon missiles was the most successful attempt to alleviate this problem.



Also, in the non-conventional warfare


---> Egypt has chemical warfare plants, is cooperating with North Korea in developing ballistic missiles, and has purchased from it Scud-C missiles with a range of 600 km, placing most of Israel in their reach.(47) Egypt along with Syria has consistently refused to sign the Chemical Weapons Convention as long as Israel refuses to sign the Nuclear Proliferation Treaty.

http://meria.idc.ac.il/journal/2001/issue2/jv5n2a1.html



Ethiopia's military is far from advanced.

[Steeler [Crawler2]]

Allright, more technical info.

The Egyptians are equipped by the US. They have M1 tanks. This is a superb tank that will destroy (quickly) and eastern block tank made and is very surviveable. The Egyptians have F-16 fighters, which are superb, and they have a fair number of them. The Ethiopians have a handful of MIG-29s, but they don't get any training on them, and they have very many either. In any case, the F-16 is a superior air to air fighter. The Egyptians have decent C2, the Ethiopians have poor C2. The Egyptians have a decent logisitcs system, the Ethiopians have a poor logistics system.

You get the idea. The Egyptians are a middle of the road military power, but they are certainly far superior to the Ethiopians.

[Gedo_Boy]

You're right.........it would be a bloodbath.

It seems the Egyptian military is quite formiddable........and they have at least been battle-tested.

Do the Saudis have any significant military? I know the US shoves advanced weaponry down their throat, but can they coordinate/use any of it?

If the TFG ARE going to have foreign peacekeepers, I'm wondering why Egypt doesn't play a bigger role in supplying them.

[Gedo_Boy]

MAD MAC,

Do you think it would seriously irk the Ethiopians if Egyptian peacekeepers entered Somalia?

[Steeler [Crawler2]]

Really the only dispute that Ethiopia and Egypt have is the water usage of the blue nile. And peacekeepers in Somalia would not affect that. So no, I don't think it would be a big issue for them because there isn't much connection there.

As for Saudi Arabia, I am suspect about their proficiency. They have good weapons, but they have a poor work ethic. They don't train all that well. The are OK, and given their weapons technology, they would be formidable for a force like a Somali militia to confront, as long as it wasn't an urban environment.

[Gedo_Boy]

I know their issue is the Nile, but I can't see how they wouldn't be concerned about Somalia's comfortable & cooperative relationship w/ Somalia.

[biko]

i think Ethiopia will not only be concerned if Egypt get involves, but would shake in their boots.
_____________________________________________________________

The true meaning of life is to plant trees, under whose shade you do not expect to sit.

[KUN-DILE]

Gedo Boy
In regards to TFG welcoming Egyptian Peace Keepers, you are talking as if the TFG is soveriegn in its dealings. Instead what you could have said would be whether or not the midget Zenawi who is currently travelling the continent would stop-over at Cairo and ask for it. Which in my book, isn't going to happen.

As for Ethiopian Military power. This is a joke. They have a rusting army. The Eritreans have better trained and maintained army, albet obviously small in size when compared between the two.

I was actually surprised at the ease at which the Ethiopian army routed the ICU. I gave too much credit to the ICU. I mean, the military hardware that the Ethiopian were using was the same hardware that Afwayne used in Hargeisa. Most of which are currently being exported as scrap metal. That is to the extent to which they were destroyed by the SNM.

[Gedo_Boy]

KUN-DILE,

This is not a thread about the SNM, Hargeisa, or Mxmd Siad Barre. Don't make a fool of yourself.


As for Egyptian involvement, why couldn't the TFG ask for Egyptian assistance through peacekeepers?

What could Ethiopia do about it?

[KUN-DILE]

Gedo Boy
Easy boi. I know this isn't about the SNM, but where applicable I can talk about them in context. Mise you don't want to hear about them altogether?


[quote]
As for Egyptian involvement, why couldn't the TFG ask for Egyptian assistance through peacekeepers?

[/quote]
Simple. Egypt is seen as one of those that supported the ICU, in kind or cash.

[quote]
What could Ethiopia do about it?
[/quote]
Zenawi already ruled any arab country out (with the exception of Yemen perhaps), including Sudan.


What you need to know is that there is a great political game that is being played out in the HoA region between the Arabs and the Israelis (Ethiopians)... There were two blocks that were vying for Power in Mogadishu, the Ethiopian supported Block headed by Col. Afbiijo... and the Arab supported block headed by Cabdiqasim.

It is clear that the Ethiopian block have the upper hand now. So, why would Zenawi spoil his party and bring his main rivals to take charge of the nest egg? It doesn't make any political sense.

[biko]

KUN-DILE


the ICU were not beaten easily but were rather sold to somalia's arch enemy for a sit. they were betrayed by a new enemy who's worser than what the SNM and sayid Abdule hassan fought. an enemy without scruples, morals nor decency. an enmy who havent got the guts to fight their own wars and have no problems doing the unthinkable to achieve their goal....

an enemy who treachery is a compliment to them.

[Gedo_Boy]

The SNM spraypainted my parents car in the '80s in Washington DC......
So you could say I know them



But as far as SNM goes, that was Somali politics, everybody lost relatives, many died..........

leave that in the past.