Somalia& S/land officials fly to Istanbul 5th round of Talks

[mukke]

At the end of the day, it's the people of Somaliland that have to decide if they want to be with Somalia or go there seprateway, not the corrupt parliament in somalia.

[sahal80]

If Somaliland was to breakaway, it would be better for Isaaqs and Hawiye that they take Dhulos and Warsengali with them. More lands for the Isaaq Somaliland and less Darood for the Hawiye Somalia. What interest does Mogadishu have in Daroods being 'returned' to Somalia and Somaliland breaking away. If Somaliland decided to stay eventually, it's a win-win for Hawiye and Isaaq, if Somaliland decided to breakaway it's a win-win for Hawiye and Isaaq.

They said, if somalia was to be divided based on the old colonial borders, this will divide only one clan and will not damage xamar and hargeysa but the xamar political elites want a north-south power-sharing not two countries, this is rejected by the hargeysa politicians who was supporting this in the 60s not nowadays.

Sahal you are xogo ogaal even the SNM wanted a confederate USC and SNM power sharing ,the Somalilanders in the sixties wanted that 2. But today the times have changed entire generations grew up under a Somaliland , Siilaayo and co cannot sell this to the people. The only way they be able to sell this to the Somaliland people this north and south confederation if it concluded with a UN supervised referendum on independence on reasonable period of time. But the Mogadishu Elites do not want to play that card so it remains a very sensitive issue for both sides.

Yeah. Even the ali mahdi who a lot blame him was onto a north-south power sharing. At that time, the USC leadership was not in question as they were considering themselves the majority in somalia. Omar hashi was representing the USC in the djibouti conference and he elected ali mahdi instead of aideed not as AW says he cheated him but bc he was representing the USC itself not the general. The reason was that he considered it a big victory of USC even aideed clan had 5 ministers out of these 13 ministers but they rejected it and now you see they have the same number of the bantu!

SSDF has accepted it and had the minister of planning(abshir haman), abdullahi yusuf was with aideed and was asking him the pm post yet he told him no its belongs to abdirahman tuur!

Another USC conference in our hotel guuleed, they elected ali mahdi as an interim one year president and aideed as the USC leader, the vedio is in kedmedia both of them but aideed has surprised us attacking ali mahdi and all our efforts to save the USC have gone!

Sorry posting this long shyt in your thread


Djibouti Conference (July 15-20, 1991)
 
Xuddunta maqaalka oo runtii ah u kuurgelidda waxyaabaha dhacay ama ka soo baxay shirkan ayaa waxaan isku dayi inaan idiin iftiimiyo qeybta libaax ay ka qaadatay SSDF inuu qabsoomo shirkan, oo caqabada farabadan hortaagnaayeen. Tan ugu xoog badanna ay ahayd mid salka ku haysa sharciyeenta go’aamada ka soo bixi kara shirkani.
 
Marka sharci ahaan loo hadlo, sidee baa dowlad ay u dhisi karaan lixda jabhadood ee meeshaas isugu yimid, mar haddii madaxweynihii dalka Soomaaliya, Maxamed Siyaad Barre, uu dalkii (Gedo) joogo, sheeganaya weli  inuu madaxweyne ka yahay dalka?
 
Waxaa xal u helay caqabaddan jabhadda SSDF, iyada oo ay soo jeedisay talada ah in 21-kii sano ee Xukuumadda Siyaad Barre ayba sharcidarro ahayd – maadaama uu inqilaab dalka ku qabsaday!  Sidaa darteed ayeey yiraahdeen, waxaanu keeni shirka ku-simihii madaxweyne, hayeyna jagadaasi shan cisho (October 15-21, 1969).  Waxa uu ahaa ku-simahaasi (constitutional interm president), mudane Sheekh Mukhtaar Maxamed Xuseen, ahaana Ra’iisal Baarlamaankii 1967-1969.  Wuxuuna ku soo fadhiistay shirkaasi sida in uu yahay madaxweynaha sharciga ee dalka; sidaasna Siyaad Barre looga maarmay.  Ahmiyadda ay lahayd shirkaasi darteed, waxaa xitaa kursigii shir-guddoonka (chairman) lagu soo fadhiisiyey madaxweynihii ugu horreeyey Soomaaliya, mudane Aden Cabdulle Cusmaan. oo runtii markaa xanuunsanaa.
 
Marti sharaf aan innaba caadi ahayn ayaa ka soo qeyb gashay shirkaasi.  Magaalada Djibouti hotel-ladii qol ka bannaanaa ma jirin, meel xitaa ay weriyayaashii seexdaan ayaa la waayey.  Kenya waxa ka yimid wafdi ka kooban 60, Ugandhana 40.  Lix iyo toban dal oo kalena wafuud ayey soo dirsatay, oo ay ka mid yihiin Yemen, Germany, Ethiopia, France, USA, iyo Soviet Union (USSR).  Hay’adaha Caalamiga oo ay ka mid yihiin: OAU, UN, EU, iyo Arab League intaba xaadir ayeey ku ahaayeen shirkan.  Xitaa safiirka Italy u fadhiyey Soomaaliya (hasa yeeshee markan Nairobi deganaa), Mario Sicca, faraha ayuu kula jiray ka mira dhalinta shirkani.
 
Bal aan yara fiirino shirka sidaa loo buun buuniyey waxa ka soo baxay.  Shirka waxa ugu horreyntii laga mamnuucay in ay waaxyaha ama beelaha ay Soomaalida ka kooban tahay oo dhan ay ka soo qeyb galaan.  Tusaale ahaan, waxa madasha shirka laga celiyey odoyaal ka socday beesha Mareexaan, Warsangeli, iyo Dhulbahante, oo markaasi lagu sifeeyey waxay ugu yeereen “haraagii Siyaad Barre”.  Dhinacyadii la heshiisiinayey oo dhan waxa isugu soo dhurteen lix jabhadood (USC, SSDF, SPM, SDM, USF, SDA), oo ay ku jirto jabhaddii Cumar Geelle!
 
Markii gorgortan iyo awood-qeybsiga siyaasadeed loo guda galay, waxaaa durbadiiba is-gaashaan-buursaday afarta jabhadood ee kale ah USC (Hawiye), SDM (Digil Mirifle), SDA (Samaroon), iyo USF (Ciise); taasoo qasab ka dhigtay in labada jabhadood ee siyaasad ahaan aan la istusin, SSDF iyo SPM, ay Daaroodnimo ku xulufoobaan.  Maadaama shaxda miiska la soo dhigay ay noqotay 4 vs 2, waxaa meeshaasi si sahlan u qaatay jagada madaxweynanimo Cali Mahdi Maxamaed (USC).
 
SSDF meeshaa kuma harin e, waxay haddana xusul-duub u gashay sidii ay ku hanan lahayd jagada labaad ee ahaa ra’iisal wasaare; iyo sidii ay u soo xero gashan lahaayeen wasaaradaha muhiimka ah ee ku soo aada beesha Daaroodka.
 
Cali Mahdi oo hantay jagadii madaxweyne waxa uu durbadiiba caddeeyey in Cumar Carte Qaalib, kana soo jeeda beesha Dir, Isaaq, uu u noqon doono Ra’iisal Wasaare.  Waxaa halkaasi cirka isku shareeray hammigii laga lahaa in nabadi ay ka aslaxanto koonfurta Soomaaliya.  Safiirka Talyaaniga ee Soomaaliya, Mario Sicca, ayaa qaaday olole aad u weyn oo uu ku doonayey in nin ka soo jeeda beesha Majeerteen (SSDF) laga dhigo Ra’iisal Wasaaraha dalka.  Isaga oo ku doodayey in jabhadda SNM oo runtii masasha beesha Isaaq aanan shirkaasi joogin.  Nasiib darro se Cali Mahdi iyo dowladda Djiboutiba dhag jalaq uma siin cudurdaarka ay la yimaadeen Safiirka iyo SSDF.
 
Arrintu kud ka guur oo qanjo u guur ayey noqotay markii loo guda galay qeybsiga Golaha Wasiirada.  Waxaa markiiba miiska la soo dhigay 33 wasaaradood oo loo arkay markaa kuwa culus oo aad u muuhiimsan, loona qeybsado si waafaqsan dheelitir-qabiil (clan-balance). Wixii la is jiid jiidaba, illeen waa meel is-xulufeysi aan isla ekeen ay joogaan e, waxaa mar kale gacan sarreeyey USC iyo xulufadeeda.  Waloow guud ahaan in ku dhawaad ah 80 wasaaradood la qeybsaday, aan yara fiirinno, shaxda 33-da wasaaradood ee muhiimka ahaa sida loo qeybsaday :
 
Beelaha

 Tirada Wasaaradaha

Hawiye

13

Daarood

8

Digil Mirifle

6

Isaaq

4

Samaroon

1

Ciise

1

Tirada Guud

33

 
Markii Daaroodkii kale ay wareysteen SSDF waxa ku kallifaya in ay awood-qeybsiga noocaas ay aqbalaan, waxay marmarsiiyo ka dhigteen in dowladdan ay ku meel gaar tahay (labo sano), laakiin ay guulo ka soo hoyeen qeybo kale oo ay ka mid yihiin in shirka isku waafaqay, ayeey yiraahdeen, in dalka lagu dhaqo nidaamka dastuuriga ah ee jiray 1961-1969; iyo weliba in xildhibaanada ay noqonayaan tirade tii 1960s, oo ahayd 123 xildibaan ( 82 koonfur ah iyo 41 waqooyi ah ).  Markii intaa ay ku wargeliyeen beeshii Daarood, ayeey SSDF ugu qeybisay 8-dii wasaaradood, oo ay mooday inay si tacab ah ku soo dhicisay, sidan hoose:
 
Daarood Tirada Wasaaradaha
Majeerteen4
Ogaden2
Dhulbahante1
Warsangeli1
Tirada Guud8
 
Sida ku cad shaxda kore, waxaa cadkii Daarood 50% qaatay Majeerteen.  Bal aan yara fiirinno magacyada Golaha Wasiirrada  iyo Wasaaradaha ay sheegteen in ay xil ka hayeen (adinka oo aan qoslin!) ee sannadkii 1991.
 
Interim President...........................Cali Mahdi Maxamed
(Appointed January 29, 1991, sworn in August 18, 1991)
 
INTERIM GOVERNMENT (Formed October 02, 1991)
Interim Prime Minister......................Cumar Carte Qaalib
 
MINISTERS:
Agriculture..............................Maxamed Sheekh Guuleed
Air and Land Transport......................Cabdi Xasan Cawaale
Animal Husbandry and Range..................Saalim Caliyow Ibrow
Arab and African Cooperation................Xuseen Mahdi Cameey
Commerce................................Maxamed Jaamac Afballaar
Constitution and Unity........................Cabdi Muse Mayow
Defence......................................Musa Islaan Faarax
Education..............................Ibraahin Sheekh Maxamed
Finance........................................Cilmi Faarax Nur
Fisheries.................................Cusmaan Maxamed Faarax
Foreign Affairs............................. Maxamed Cali Xaamud
General Administration...................Xuseen Ceelaabe Faahiye
Government and Parliamentary Relations...Maxamed Salaad Axmed
Health......................................Cabdi Caydiid Xiirey
Higher Education and Research...................Maxamed Axmed
Industry...................................Cabdiraxmaan Ducaale
Information..............................Xuseen Sheekh Axmed
Interior................................Maxamed Qanyare Afrax
Juba Valley Development.................Maxamed Sheekh Xasan
Justice............................................Muumin Cumar
Labour and Social Affairs................Maxamed Xuseen Caddow
Logistics..................................Maxamed Cali Caliyow
Mineral and Water Resources.............Cabdiraxmaan Cusmaan Raage
Marine Transport and Ports..................Maxamed Nur Iley
Petroleum and Electricity...................Bashiir Cali Salaad (Bashiir Bililiqo)
Planning..................................Maxamed Qodax Barre
Post and Telecommunications............Cabdulqaadir Sheekh Cilmi
Public Works and Housing...................Cabdi Cabdulle Boqor (Jini Boqor)
Rehabilitation and Settlement............Maxamed Ibrahim Cigaal
Religious Affairs..............................Cali Nur Sheekh
Rural Development..............................Ismaaciil  Bullaale
Tourism and Wildlife......................Maxamed Cabdi Xasan
Youth and Sports........................Maxamed Xasan Dawaare
 
Minister of State
In the Presidency............Cawad Xaaji Yusuf
In the Prime Minister's Office...................Cabdiraxmaan Cilmi Cigaal
 
Agriculture .........................Cabdullaahi Sheekh Cali
Arab and African Cooperation......................Xuseen Sayid Awoun
Education.............................Cabdi Khalid Sheekh Xasan
Finance and Treasury…….. Maxamed Qasim
Foreign Affairs………………Cabdullahi Sheekh Ismaaciil
Health…………………………Nur Cilmi Cusmaan
Interior………………………..Axmed Xaashi Maxamed
Justice………………………..Cabdullaahi Xaaji Cabdiraxmaan
Land and Air Transport…….Cali Aden Xuseen (Cali Margous)
Planning……………………….Waceys
Rehabilitation and Settlement……Cabdulqaadir Cabdi Maxamed
Supply and Logistics……………….Shariif Zen Abu Imankiyow
Governor, Central Bank…………….Cali Cabdi Camalow
 
Jabhadda SSDF oo runtii ahayd midda ugu da’da weyne kooxaha Soomaaliyeed ee qoriga u qaatay inay la dagaalamaan Xukuumadda Siyaad Barre, waxay sannadkii 1991 kala kulmeen shirkani waa arrin cashar u noqon kartay, hadday baraan dhashoodii iyo taageerayaashoodiiba.  Waxaan maqli jiray Baahiyi waxay kuu geysaa nin kuu daran e, runtii casharka Djbouti lagu soo siiyey 1991 kama aysan faa’iideysan.  Shirkan Djibouti 1991, waxaa saxiixayaashoodii oo dhan (lixda jabhadood) la geeyey Mecca si loogu soo dhaariyo inay ka daacad yihiin heshiiskaasi.  Magacyada saxiixay shirka Djibouti waa kuwan:
 
Jabhadda Saxiixaha Beesha
SSDF/DFSSMuse Islaan FaaraxMajeerteen
USCCumar Xaashi AdenXawaadle/Hawiye
SDMCumar (Maalin) XaamudDigil Mirifle
SPMCabdi MuseAbsame
USFC/raxmaan Ducaale CaliCiise
SDAMax'ed (Dahir) FaaraxSamaroon
 [/im

[Khalid Ali]

I bet cali mahdi wanted the same but he didn't executed it correctly the moment he was selected as president it divided the USC the vision was there perhaps but the Karti wasn't there , lool@ the Ministerial allocation

Cumar xaashi AW hates him hey boycotted the Mahdi

Here is a well drafted power sharing of the SNM and the USC President Ahmed Siilaanyo wrote in 1990

http://wardheer.startlogic.com/Articles ... to_SNM.pdf

[Oxidant]

The Arab league is against somaliland for obvious reasons they want to use Somalis against Ethiopians particularly Egypt and Sacuuudi Arabia. But you are making a grave mistake the United states is not against Somaliland nor is the European Union they have repeatedly they will welcome Somaliland independence if the African union gives its blessing , The US and the Europeans remain very indifferent , what the hell is western Puntland
According to you Ogaden has a case and Somaliland doesnt

Hogwash and wishful thinking by grand delusionist

America or EU never supported or backed Somaliland independence. This never occurred. Since Somaliland miscarriage; Eritrea, Timor, Kosovo, South Sudan and many Balkans states all became nations. Exception for Eritrea, all others were supported and backed by The West. The West are indifferent because they are happy with the status quo; chaotic Somalia is in their best interest for now.

Also the AU is situated in Ethiopia, if there was true political will; Somaliland independence would have occurred.

Ogaden are trying to secede from Ethiopia. Their heritage, culture, religion and history is vastly different from Ethiopia and the average Ethiopian. Their case is much stronger. Somaliland has no case but from tribal hatred. Western Puntland is SSC regions; which align themselves with Puntland and Somalia. They don’t support this tribal entity known as Somaliland.

[Bermooda]

Khalid who do you think has been vetoing the last agreement 2nd Darood can't be bought off like you have said but what people fail to mention is Dir (why cos politically it's actually them who will be the biggest losers even more than the 1st) while the rest some are unionist while others don't care.

[Khalid Ali]

The Arab league is against somaliland for obvious reasons they want to use Somalis against Ethiopians particularly Egypt and Sacuuudi Arabia. But you are making a grave mistake the United states is not against Somaliland nor is the European Union they have repeatedly they will welcome Somaliland independence if the African union gives its blessing , The US and the Europeans remain very indifferent , what the hell is western Puntland
According to you Ogaden has a case and Somaliland doesnt

Hogwash and wishful thinking by grand delusionist

America or EU never supported or backed Somaliland independence. This never occurred. Since Somaliland miscarriage; Eritrea, Timor, Kosovo, South Sudan and many Balkans states all became nations. Exception for Eritrea, all others were supported and backed by The West. The West are indifferent because they are happy with the status quo; chaotic Somalia is in their best interest for now.

Also the AU is situated in Ethiopia, if there was true political will; Somaliland independence would have occurred.

Ogaden are trying to secede from Ethiopia. Their heritage, culture, religion and history is vastly different from Ethiopia and the average Ethiopian. Their case is much stronger. Somaliland has no case but from tribal hatred. Western Puntland is SSC regions; which align themselves with Puntland and Somalia. They don’t support this tribal entity known as Somaliland.

I never said they backed Somaliland independence but they are neutral indifferent they are not against Somaliland independence Somaliland receives aid from many European countries. The Balkans were supported by the European union for political and geopolitical reasons. The African union have made it clear in 2005 that Somaliland case for independence is not one of secession and its a unique case in Africa. Since when did Khatumo or ssc region align themselves with puntland last time i checked Puntland massacred the poor dhulos killing 13 dhulos in taleex. Ethiopia is a Multi Ethnic country if ethnic states can separate from countries the Luos would separate from Kenya and join Uganda The ogaden religion is not different Ethiopia has Muslims oromo muslims amhara muslims the only way ogaden can become independent as if they defeat Ethiopian troops but thats unlikely since the xabashis receive billions of dollars in Military aid a Somali qabiil cannot defeat Ethiopia . Heck the Entire Somali nation Somalia and Somaliland could not free the Somali kilil. Oromos would separate if Ethnic separation was possible.

[Khalid Ali]

Khalid who do you think has been vetoing the last agreement 2nd Darood can't be bought off like you have said but what people fail to mention is Dir (why cos politically it's actually them who will be the biggest losers even more than the 1st) while the rest some are unionist while others don't care.

You make no sense saaxib the incompetent parliament is no problem,the so called darood you speak off is a small minority in the Parliament if the trinity power of iririm is played and money comes to play thats the least of our problems Adeer orod daynille ku noqo siyasada hiiraabkanu weydina eh

[samatar133]

sahal80
where is the source of your article?
All I know is Cumar Carte's government had much more number of minsters than 33 ministers.
Take kale waxaad tidhi Abshir Haabaan was given the minister of planning but according to the article some one else was the mister of planing not him!!
he is not even in the list.

[oxymoron]

Khalid Ali Somalidiid will never become a country. But indeed the wishful thinking is pretty entertaining so please do continue with this for another 20 years.

Just hope Your Habar Cousins don't get tried and make you eat their shit again.

[original dervish]

Khalid......obviously you've given it a lot of thought....twenty-three years is a long time to ponder separation.
Most of your analysis is logical....and you've cited various examples etc.

There is something you haven't considered, although you've come close to mentioning it.
That is the great powers have no interest whatsoever in solving this issue.
They're quite content to outsource these talks to Turkey, but will never be directly involved.

So if your hoping the "Great white fathers" will come to rescue your dream, you'll be disappointed.
PS The southerners have never negotiated anything in good faith...even among themselves.

[Osob101]

I don't understand how this delusional Sahal guy thinks Ali Mahdi is to blame for anything. Ali Mahdi won the presidency and had Aideed swallowed his pride and waited out the Interim Presidency than he would have been guaranteed the Chair but instead he thought why not use force and along bring with him every Yam Yam out there with the exception of Hawadle.

[anzeloti]

Waste of time


Somalia will never recognize the triangle state

[SecretAgent]

I don't understand how this delusional Sahal guy thinks Ali Mahdi is to blame for anything. Ali Mahdi won the presidency and had Aideed swallowed his pride and waited out the Interim Presidency than he would have been guaranteed the Chair but instead he thought why not use force and along bring with him every Yam Yam out there with the exception of Hawadle.

Ali mahdi was a close ally of darods his plan was to bring back sayid barre mjs were behind da abgal vs hg wars

[anzeloti]

Hawaadle and their obsession with Ali Mahdi

[nerdfresh]

Why should Aidid give away the seat to midget Mahdi who only ever seen fighting when he fought for the last cuumbulo bowl? Naa meel naga fadhiiso. We have heard the braying of the donkey (oohinta abgal) for 2 decades. HG has let you taken your leadership roles even when the entire Hawiye sided with HG. Magaaca Hawiye waad baabiiseen. Incompetent. Orod shaqo yeelo dameerad yahay.